Damn_Smooth Posted July 27, 2013 Share Posted July 27, 2013 What info is that again? Been awhile since I've found the sales info interesting enough to check. Last I checked, it was arguable that both albums sold around 5 million. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselDaisy Posted July 27, 2013 Share Posted July 27, 2013 Slash claims that 1st Snakepit went platinum. It certainly sold quite well and was well received by the press and public at the time (I still have some of the reviews in my possession). It is only really Axl nutters who have ever had a problem with that album. I remember Snakepit playing Donington Monsters of Rock, and only fourth so down the bill, so they must have been doing something right. Beggers and Hangers On and Good To Be Alive also were rotated a lot on shows like Headbangers Ball and Noisy Mothers.1st snakepit album received mixed reviews at best (many, if not most established rock critics thought it either uninspired or cartoonish to the point that it bordered on caricature) and was not certified platinum (Slash may have claimed it went platinum, but he did not mention it in his book- though he did say it turned a profit). This is all verifiable and I thought was fairly well known. I'm not getting into this Axl vs Slash stuff and judging by your "nutter" comment I see that's where you want to take it so I suppose I'll add another to the ignore list. I like discussing these kinds of things and welcome debate, but I'm not getting into insulting people nor will I dignify insults with anything other than an ignore add). Peace. I disagree. I still have my (uk based) press clippings and television coverage of the 1st Snakepit period taped (I have now put it on DVD). I5OCS got excellent reviews - at least in the uk - and extensive television coverage on rock shows. Ain't Life Grand, now that flopped. But the first one did not flop. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bucketslash Posted July 27, 2013 Share Posted July 27, 2013 I think what people have to remember is that without Izzy, GNR suddenly had no glue between Axl and Slash. You can argue that a nice subtle mix of the stuff we've seen since then is possible(IRS, Catcher, OMG and This I love with a bunch of Snakepit and a song or two from Beautiful Disease(Mezz and Put You Back) for a pretty good album, but axl caving would have led to severe drugs and depression, slash would have gone further down the drugs line, duff's pancreas would have exploded anyway, and who knows if anyone would have been there, and Izzy STILL would want nothing to do with GNR, because they were zombies.And the biggest problem that no one sees is that Izzy didn't just play Guitar, he was the part of the band that made everyone a band. Arguably Slash and Duff were the engine, Axl the brain, but at thr root of the lineup, Izzy was the heart, and GNR just couldn't be what we wanted. Gilby was great, but the problem is that Gilby didn't do for the band what Izzy did, and because of that the band was doomed. Again, I want to stress that I love Gilby's playing and think he's a fantastic musician and writer, but it never felt like Gilby carried the weight in decision making Izzy did, and when Paul Tobias came in, it was because he wanted to have someone be as integral as Izzy was in the music, while Slash and Duff saw him as an outsider. That's the real final nail in GNR's "classic" line-up for lack of a better word. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rustycage Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 Um, didn't CD only sell 3 million?Why would contraband need to sell 4 million more? Oh wait. Nevermind. You're a fucking alt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobbo Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 What info is that again? Been awhile since I've found the sales info interesting enough to check. Last I checked, it was arguable that both albums sold around 5 million. No, neither of them sold 5 million.Contraband sold 4, CD sold approx 3.5 million based on all the information we have. I think Bumble even said it sold 3 something million when asked about it in a podcast fairly recently. At least according to some around here.It quickly fell off the charts everywhere after it hit about 3 million, and yet, somehow sold another 1-2 million worldwide right under our noses. Right . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockerRoller Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 I'm pretty sure that Chinese Democracy has outsold everything Slash has been involved in since his departure from GNR combined. hahahahahaha....no just please no stop it hurts..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magisme Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 Um, didn't CD only sell 3 million?Why would contraband need to sell 4 million more? Oh wait. Nevermind. You're a fucking alt.3 million is the US, yes. :rofl-lol: Worst cupcake since warchild. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
downzy Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 (edited) Um, didn't CD only sell 3 million?Why would contraband need to sell 4 million more? Oh wait. Nevermind. You're a fucking alt.3 million is the US, yes. I like discussion and debate, but I won't get into trading insults and I won't dignify them with anything other than adding you to my ignore list- but if you're interested you can find album sales on billboard and perhaps wikipedia- though I'm not sure how recently updated wiki numbers are. Nonetheless, there's no need to start with the insults. Peace. This post is hidden because you have chosen to ignore posts by RustycageAccording to Nielson SoundScan, Chinese Democracy has sold 614k copies as of April, 2011. It only re-entered the charts at that time because Best Buy started blowing out its excess inventory by pricing the album at $1.99. This move still only managed to sell 3200 copies in the U.S. So unless it's sold 2.68 million copies since then (four times the amount it sold between 2008-2011), I don't see your number of 3 million in the U.S. having any ounce of validity. RIAA has bestowed platinum status to the album because it has shipped a million copies, not because it has sold a million copies.What info is that again? Been awhile since I've found the sales info interesting enough to check. Last I checked, it was arguable that both albums sold around 5 million. No, neither of them sold 5 million.Contraband sold 4, CD sold approx 3.5 million based on all the information we have. I think Bumble even said it sold 3 something million when asked about it in a podcast fairly recently. At least according to some around here.It quickly fell off the charts everywhere after it hit about 3 million, and yet, somehow sold another 1-2 million worldwide right under our noses. Right . Those numbers are 4 years old and you're using Contraband worldwide sales and comparing them to CD US sales. Further, you are presuming that CD hasn't accumulated more sales over the past 3-4 years- and indeed it did reenter the charts briefly a year or two ago. See my comment above. It re-entered the charts in April of 2011 to sell a whopping 3200 copies (allowing it to come in at 198). But let's say it's sold 2k a week for the past 2 years (which is a fairly generous assumption on my part, but it's the most the album could sell and stay off the charts, or what you refer to as radar). That would mean it's essentially sold another 200k copies, bringing it nowhere near the numbers you're wishing claiming here. Edited July 28, 2013 by downzy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Manny Manner Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 (edited) Um, didn't CD only sell 3 million?Why would contraband need to sell 4 million more? Oh wait. Nevermind. You're a fucking alt.3 million is the US, yes. I like discussion and debate, but I won't get into trading insults and I won't dignify them with anything other than adding you to my ignore list- but if you're interested you can find album sales on billboard and perhaps wikipedia- though I'm not sure how recently updated wiki numbers are. Nonetheless, there's no need to start with the insults. Peace. This post is hidden because you have chosen to ignore posts by RustycageAccording to Nielson SoundScan, Chinese Democracy has sold 614k copies as of April, 2011. It only re-entered the charts at that time because Best Buy started blowing out its excess inventory by pricing the album at $1.99. This move still only managed to sell 3200 copies in the U.S. So unless it's sold 2.68 million copies since then (four times the amount it sold between 2008-2011), I don't see your number of 3 million in the U.S. having any ounce of validity. RIAA has bestowed platinum status to the album because it has shipped a million copies, not because it has sold a million copies.What info is that again? Been awhile since I've found the sales info interesting enough to check. Last I checked, it was arguable that both albums sold around 5 million. No, neither of them sold 5 million.Contraband sold 4, CD sold approx 3.5 million based on all the information we have. I think Bumble even said it sold 3 something million when asked about it in a podcast fairly recently. At least according to some around here.It quickly fell off the charts everywhere after it hit about 3 million, and yet, somehow sold another 1-2 million worldwide right under our noses. Right . Those numbers are 4 years old and you're using Contraband worldwide sales and comparing them to CD US sales. Further, you are presuming that CD hasn't accumulated more sales over the past 3-4 years- and indeed it did reenter the charts briefly a year or two ago. See my comment above. It re-entered the charts in April of 2011 to sell a whopping 3200 copies (allowing it to come in at 198). But let's say it's sold 2k a week for the past 2 years (which is a fairly generous assumption on my part, but it's the most the album could sell and stay off the charts, or what you refer to as radar). That would mean it's essentially sold another 200k copies, bringing it nowhere near the numbers you're wishing claiming here.With all due respect if that were true- how do you suppose that it has been certified as platinum and or gold in multiple countries by the RIAA?Chinese Democracy was certified Platinum by the RIAA on February 3, 2009, having shipped one million copies in the United States.[3][65]The album secured an IFPI European Platinum Award, having sold more than one million copies in Europe,[66][67] and had sold 2.6 million units worldwide as of February 2009, according to Universal Music.[65] The album also reached triple platinum certification in Canada, as well as platinum certifications in many other countries, including Finland, the Czech Republic, Germany, Ireland, Italy, Norway, Poland, Romania, Switzerland, the United Kingdom, Argentina, Australia, New Zealand, and South Africa.[68] Furthermore, these numbers do not take into account online sales of the album and/or individual sales of songs- that's why when you hear estimates of its world wide sales they vary between 3-7 million. I would venture to say that the most conservative estimate would be 3 million (and as detailed above, CD sold 2.6 million before the band even began touring) and again that would not account for online sales or sales that have occurred during the past 4 1/2 years. I would say somewhere in the neighborhood of 4-5 million is very realistic. Edited July 28, 2013 by Manny Manner Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magisme Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 Platinum in Canada was 100,000 and is now 80,000. You can look up the rest yourself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Manny Manner Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 Regardless, that does not alter the facts detailed above. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magisme Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 Doesn't alter the facts. Completely alters your interpretation of the facts and subsequent unicorn birthed sales numbers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Manny Manner Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 Doesn't alter the facts. Completely alters your interpretation of the facts and subsequent unicorn birthed sales numbersNot at all, because that's all accounted for in the verifiable sales numbers with the linked references provided above- unless you consider the RIAA and Billboard unicorns and again those numbers only take into account the first 3 months following CD's release. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magisme Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 I'm done with you. You're clearly here just to start arguments. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Manny Manner Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 (edited) I'm done with you. You're clearly here just to start arguments.Well actually I do enjoy healthy and civil debate, but I'm just listing facts here. If you're "done with me" that's fine too. I have you on ignore anyway, but I took a chance and opened your replies here. Peace. Edited July 28, 2013 by Manny Manner Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wasted Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 I can buy 1 mil in US and Europe. How have they sold 2. 6 in the rest of the world? Brazil must be big market i guess. Brazil must be big market i guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rustycage Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 In the US, Best Buy only received 1.6 million copies in their deal. 3 million sold in the US? Bull fuckin shit.That guy is an idiot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Damn_Smooth Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 What info is that again? Been awhile since I've found the sales info interesting enough to check. Last I checked, it was arguable that both albums sold around 5 million. No, neither of them sold 5 million.Contraband sold 4, CD sold approx 3.5 million based on all the information we have. I think Bumble even said it sold 3 something million when asked about it in a podcast fairly recently. At least according to some around here.It quickly fell off the charts everywhere after it hit about 3 million, and yet, somehow sold another 1-2 million worldwide right under our noses. Right . So you're saying that Contraband outsold CD by less than ½ million in the US? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobbo Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 What info is that again? Been awhile since I've found the sales info interesting enough to check. Last I checked, it was arguable that both albums sold around 5 million. No, neither of them sold 5 million.Contraband sold 4, CD sold approx 3.5 million based on all the information we have. I think Bumble even said it sold 3 something million when asked about it in a podcast fairly recently. At least according to some around here.It quickly fell off the charts everywhere after it hit about 3 million, and yet, somehow sold another 1-2 million worldwide right under our noses. Right . So you're saying that Contraband outsold CD by less than ½ million in the US?No, those are the worldwide numbers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Damn_Smooth Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 What info is that again? Been awhile since I've found the sales info interesting enough to check. Last I checked, it was arguable that both albums sold around 5 million. No, neither of them sold 5 million.Contraband sold 4, CD sold approx 3.5 million based on all the information we have. I think Bumble even said it sold 3 something million when asked about it in a podcast fairly recently. At least according to some around here.It quickly fell off the charts everywhere after it hit about 3 million, and yet, somehow sold another 1-2 million worldwide right under our noses. Right . So you're saying that Contraband outsold CD by less than ½ million in the US?No, those are the worldwide numbers.And where are we getting CD's numbers from again? Still the forum poster that added up the certifications? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobbo Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 (edited) Based on estimations, how the album quickly fell off the charts, where it was at when it fell off, etc. Seems highly unlikely it got past the 3.5 mark, if it even got there.We've had this discussion, in depth, at least 2-3 times in the past. Edited July 28, 2013 by Bobbo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Damn_Smooth Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 (edited) Yes, but it's never led to anybody being able to say anything as factually as you're doing now. I was wondering if something official hit or if we were still just going by forum poster math as the official numbers for CD. I guess nothing's changed. Edited July 28, 2013 by Damn_Smooth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobbo Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 (edited) Not solely, no. But a lot adds up.We know the album was at about 3 million by the turn of '09. We know it fell off pretty much everywhere nearly right after that. And yet, somehow, people are claiming it sold another 1-2 million worldwide since right under our noses? Highly doubtful. Idk about you, but I've seen many say around 3.5 with a lot of certainty. Some even claim Bumble has stated around" 3 million" to be the actual figure in one of his fairly recent podcasts, for what it's worth. I didn't see the podcast myself, but just throwing that out there for anybody that would wanna comment further. Around 3.5 just makes the most sense, again, from what we have gathered. Edited July 28, 2013 by Bobbo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Damn_Smooth Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 I'm not saying it sold an additional 2 million, but half a million in remainders worldwide isn't that big of a stretch of the imagination. Especially when were dealing with official numbers for one, and forum math for the other. I wouldn't be surprised if it only sold 3 million as well though, half a million really isn't that much, and well within the margin of error for forum math with no official help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobbo Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 I'm not saying it sold an additional 2 million, but half a million in remainders worldwide isn't that big of a stretch of the imagination. Especially when were dealing with official numbers for one, and forum math for the other. I wouldn't be surprised if it only sold 3 million as well though, half a million really isn't that much, and well within the margin of error for forum math with no official help.I'm not saying it sold an additional 2 million, but half a million in remainders worldwide isn't that big of a stretch of the imagination. Especially when were dealing with official numbers for one, and forum math for the other. I wouldn't be surprised if it only sold 3 million as well though, half a million really isn't that much, and well within the margin of error for forum math with no official help.I'm not saying you, in particular, are saying that. I'm just saying the assertion in itself is kinda asinine to me.Like I said, I'm not solely basing this on estimates forum members have laid out. In the beginning of '09, we were given a press release saying 2.6 million worldwide. But that number didn't include itunes sales, so most just usually round up the number to 3 million. Almost right after that, it fell off the charts pretty much everywhere, and never regained enough momentum, to our knowledge, to have sold another million or so. So 3 something million seems to be the most likely number. Bumble, supposedly, supporting that number (or around that number) further comforts my stance on that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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