American Pie

[username]

There are a few tracks you don't listen to often for some reason. But when you hear them, every time, you're amazed at how insanely good they are. One of those tracks for me is Don McLean's American Pie. Obviously it's about Buddy Holly, but it's really about so much more. It's about music and culture changing. But there's a lot of theories about what other big events in music and history he's referencing in this song.

The whole thing is about how music was changing. While the kind was looking down the jester stole his thorny crown is said to be about Dylan taking Elvis' spot as the kids' number one musical hero. Lots of things about the 60's (woodstock, the generation lost in space) and the hippie movement eventually dying out. The girl who sang the blues (and turned away is probably Janis Joplin. Loads of Stones references too, about Jack Flash and the devil, the infamous hells angels concert that also marked an end to the hippie movement. Then there's the reference to Manson's helter skelter. And a lot of Beatles references (the marching band)

I love this song because you can research into every single line in it and find it has a deeper meaning. Any other theories on what Don McLean is referencing and trying to say with this?

I felt this song deserved an admiration thread.

Edit:

This link has many amazing explanations. Just click a line in the song and some background info pops up.

http://rock.rapgenius.com/Don-mclean-american-pie-lyrics

Edited April 27, 2014 by username

[Lithium]

I prefer Madonna's version.

[DR DOOM]

I prefer Madonna's version.

[Thin White Duke]

I prefer Madonna's version.

I don't, because she is too manly for such a beutiful song.

I haven't heard the song in a long time but man it still has the potential to make me shiver every now and then, despite being so hackneyed. One of the best and more powerful lyrics in music history too.

[dalsh327]

Don said the song is a mix of history, imagination and starts with the plane crash, ends in the early 70s.

He wrote and performed it in Philadelphia, opening for Laura Nyro. A few months later, he recorded it in one day, doing 24 takes, with slight changes to the song, but nothing major where anything was revealed. James Taylor, JT's brother, Carly Simon and Pete Seeger sing at the end of the song.

He owns the "American Pie" name, which meant the movie producers had to ask him for permission.

The parts of the song that people have yet to figure out are:

-10 years we've been on our own

-the girl who sang the blues

-the father, son and the holy ghost

The song is pretty upbeat, but it's taking you on a downhill journey - that "bad news on the doorstep" may have meant Buddy Holly, it may have meant his father who passed a few years later, Kennedy's assassination, as much as the daily news of people dying in the Vietnam War as well as Dr King and Bobby Kennedy's assassinations.

When people have asked him what it's about? "It means i never have to work again".

Edited April 27, 2014 by dalsh327

[SunnyDRE]

Karaoke ruined this song for me.

[bran]

still a great song.

[Thin White Duke]

The parts of the song that people have yet to figure out are:

-10 years we've been on our own

-the girl who sang the blues

-the father, son and the holy ghost

-"10 years we've been on our own" could be related to Don's father's death. He died in 1961 and Don made the song in 1971. It also could be a rounded figure of the time that had passed since the death of Holly and company?

-"The girl who sang the blues", I thought it was clear he meant Janis Joplin. "...And I asked her for some happy news but she just smiled and turned away", a metaphor of how she was one of the new hopes or talents in the music scene but she then died.

-"The father, the song and the Holy Ghost", Valens, Big Bopper and Holly. "The Holy Ghost" seems pretty likely to mean Buddy, doesn't it?

[username]

The parts of the song that people have yet to figure out are:

-10 years we've been on our own

-the girl who sang the blues

-the father, son and the holy ghost

-"10 years we've been on our own" could be related to Don's father's death. He died in 1961 and Don made the song in 1971. It also could be a rounded figure of the time that had passed since the death of Holly and company?

-"The girl who sang the blues", I thought it was clear he meant Janis Joplin. "...And I asked her for some happy news but she just smiled and turned away", a metaphor of how she was one of the new hopes or talents in the music scene but she then died.

-"The father, the song and the Holy Ghost", Valens, Big Bopper and Holly. "The Holy Ghost" seems pretty likely to mean Buddy, doesn't it?

Alternate explanations:

- 10 years: "When this song came out in 1971 it was roughly a decade after the deaths of Buddy Holly, Ritchie Valens and The Big Bopper. To McLean, musicians have been recovering and moving on since then."

- girl who sang the blues: "This is a reference to Joni Mitchell’s album called Blue, in which she plays a song called River, and the piano on that song is what is being played here in the background of the lyric.". But in this one I can't place the "turned away" bit. Maybe it's a mixture of both?

- father son and holy ghost: "He is not talking about the Father, Son, & The Holy Spirit. He is talking about John F. Kennedy, Martin Luther King Jr, and Robert Kennedy, who all died, Hence, Caught a Train for the Coast."

or: "In 1966, on the cover of the April 8 edition of Time Magazine, the question is asked, “Is God Dead?” The article explored the growing atheism in America"

or: "This verse can also refer to the California Zen movement that drew people away from the conventional religions and encouraged them to explore their inner selves through meditation. (“But not a word was spoken”)"

Just goes to show how much you can still debate about this song.

Edited April 28, 2014 by username

[Guest Len B'stard]

I never really concentrated to work out all the things it's about but i love it as a song, it's deliciously wistful. I mean i know the references to The Bopper and Buddy and the crash obviously but I mean all the rest. It's especially effective because I have a great love for those that were taken in the crash, most especially Buddy.

Edited April 28, 2014 by sugaraylen

[GivenToFly]

I think people try to hard to find specific references. I think writers are in general more vague and write things that apply to wider contexts than people give them credit for. It's always 'what is it about?' or 'who is it about?' when it could be about a number of people or a number of things or just a state of mind or "random rhyming nonsense" (Freddy Mercury on Bohemian Rhapsody).

I don't think every lyric in this song is a reference to a specific event.

[username]

I think people try to hard to find specific references. I think writers are in general more vague and write things that apply to wider contexts than people give them credit for. It's always 'what is it about?' or 'who is it about?' when it could be about a number of people or a number of things or just a state of mind or "random rhyming nonsense" (Freddy Mercury on Bohemian Rhapsody).

I don't think every lyric in this song is a reference to a specific event.

I think you're absolutely right in general and very wrong in this specific case.

[dalsh327]

I think it's possible he heard "River" when he wrote "American Pie", but "Blue" wasn't out yet when he was performing the song. The girl who sang the blues might be someone from his hometown or another performer.

Freddie wrote "Bohemian Rhapsody" over 5 years so a lot of thought went into what he was writing. I think people now see it as his "coming out" song, and even Brian May and Mary Austin think that's what he was saying, but doing it in an operatic, over the top fashion.

Mercury didn't want to get into what the song was about any more than he did about his sexuality. He was very guarded about his private life.

Edited April 28, 2014 by dalsh327

[GivenToFly]

I think people try to hard to find specific references. I think writers are in general more vague and write things that apply to wider contexts than people give them credit for. It's always 'what is it about?' or 'who is it about?' when it could be about a number of people or a number of things or just a state of mind or "random rhyming nonsense" (Freddy Mercury on Bohemian Rhapsody).

I don't think every lyric in this song is a reference to a specific event.

I think you're absolutely right in general and very wrong in this specific case.

There's definitely imagery and there are a lot of references, but some people stretch it too far. For example, from the website you linked in the first post, I seriously doubt the line "But that’s not how it used to be" referes to The Times They Are-A Changing. Or "The birds flew off with a fallout shelter" to Gimme Shelter. They refer to broad changes in society and there will be a lot of songs from the era that talk about those topics, doens't mean American Pie refers directly to them. Or "A generation lost in space" referring to the space race, that's just absurd.

[dalsh327]

I think people try to hard to find specific references. I think writers are in general more vague and write things that apply to wider contexts than people give them credit for. It's always 'what is it about?' or 'who is it about?' when it could be about a number of people or a number of things or just a state of mind or "random rhyming nonsense" (Freddy Mercury on Bohemian Rhapsody).

I don't think every lyric in this song is a reference to a specific event.

I think you're absolutely right in general and very wrong in this specific case.

There's definitely imagery and there are a lot of references, but some people stretch it too far. For example, from the website you linked in the first post, I seriously doubt the line "But that’s not how it used to be" referes to The Times They Are-A Changing. Or "The birds flew off with a fallout shelter" to Gimme Shelter. They refer to broad changes in society and there will be a lot of songs from the era that talk about those topics, doens't mean American Pie refers directly to them. Or "A generation lost in space" referring to the space race, that's just absurd.

I also think sometimes people look deeper into songs and the songwriter wasn't really doing anything more than making the words fit. When someone wants a song to be ambiguous, they're writing it for a group of people to enjoy.

This song was for the Baby Boomers who grew up in his era and a lot of references they all identified with.

[Zint]

Every time this tune comes on the radio I listen.
I still enjoy it, the lyrics are inspired and well delivered.

[Thin White Duke]

I think people try to hard to find specific references. I think writers are in general more vague and write things that apply to wider contexts than people give them credit for. It's always 'what is it about?' or 'who is it about?' when it could be about a number of people or a number of things or just a state of mind or "random rhyming nonsense" (Freddy Mercury on Bohemian Rhapsody).

I don't think every lyric in this song is a reference to a specific event.

I think you're absolutely right in general and very wrong in this specific case.

There's definitely imagery and there are a lot of references, but some people stretch it too far. For example, from the website you linked in the first post, I seriously doubt the line "But that’s not how it used to be" referes to The Times They Are-A Changing. Or "The birds flew off with a fallout shelter" to Gimme Shelter. They refer to broad changes in society and there will be a lot of songs from the era that talk about those topics, doens't mean American Pie refers directly to them. Or "A generation lost in space" referring to the space race, that's just absurd.

GivenTo Fly, I also think you're totally right about people looking for meanings in songs and trying to find out what the author means and all that when they didn't want to mean anything specific but this song is the exception. Some of the references and the overall "meaning" of the song are pretty clear. Though I also think now we are trying to find the meaning of every single word in the song and most likely McLean wasn't that paranoid.

That said, "The birds flew off with a fallout shelter" doesn't refere to that in my opinion, it referes to The Byrds (the band) falling from grace after being caught with marijuana ("The birds flew off with a fallout shelter, Eight miles high and falling fast It landed foul on the grass). And I don't think "a generation lost in space" refers to the space race per se; the line before that one refers to Woodstock ("and there we were all in one place, a generation lost in space")... so, "lost in space" could be a metaphor of the drug abuse hidden in the apparent reference to the space race generation.

@username Only Don knows what he wanted to say if he really wanted to say something, so I accept any other interpretation... except the one about "the father, the son and the Holy ghost", that Holy Ghost is Buddy yes or yes.

Edited April 28, 2014 by Thin White Duke

[Zint]

A generation lost in space can also refer to the 60's t.v. show Lost In Space, pop culture in the 60's was huge and basically it was the first generation completely addicted television.