With "The General" seemingly close....

[Seb91]

3 hours ago, RONIN said:

Exactly. I'm stunned by how mediocre this material is. Just the Crash Diet demo alone kills this stuff. There's a reason he was able to hire A-list players initially for CD (based on his previous reputation) but was unable to retain them.  Can you imagine Jimmy Iovine or one of those Interscope execs asking to listen to some of these demos and then that "macdaddy" song is played for them? He punk'd these execs plain and simple. Axl had the worst case of writer's block and was collecting huge multi-million dollar advances - not to mention getting unlimited time in state of the art recording studios with the best instruments on earth at his disposal, and whatever blank check perks the record label had been bankrolling for a decade before they cut him off the tab in 2004. These leaks actually complete some missing pieces of the story. That there was very likely only enough juice in 14 years for 1 solid album. Maybe we're both wrong and Soul Monster, Thyme, Oklahoma, The General, etc are classics. Personally, I'm skeptical...

DJ was hired out of desperation because Axl no longer had the credibility to hire A-listers for his touring band. He didn't want to collab on material with either DJ or Bumble because their writing contributions were subpar - they themselves have said that material went nowhere. Axl blew it by losing all that A-list talent from the 90's/early 00's. Once you get into a studio with guys like Bucket and Freese and you can't produce the goods, they're out the door and that's what happened. How many amazing players left the band or did not want to stick around after a couple auditions? This all really challenges the "Axl is Guns N' Roses" myth. He's a vital part of the band but not the maestro he thinks he is (imho).

That would have been a cool way to break it up IF any of these leaks had been worthy of release (jury is still out). I'd lean towards the experimental purely for Sorry and If the World (my favorite tracks from CD) even if the more traditional track listing is probably more consistent. But really, I feel like calling these tracks "experimental" might be a bit overstated. I don't really think Axl was pushing the envelope that far in any of the CD tracks. It seems like standard GnR fare to my ears with a late 90s/early 00's influence. I suppose the industrial elements and hip hop beats could throw an AFD/Lies fan for a loop but most of us who enjoyed UYI were already primed for them pushing their sound further into different styles. I wish Axl had left My World as an instrumental bonus track without the cheesy vocals - if you strip the vocals out retroactively, UYI 2 nicely segues into CD.

My own perfect CD tracklist would be:

1. Oh My God, 2 Shackler's, 3. If The World, 4.Catcher in the Rye (May), 5. The Blues, 6.Better, 7.There was a Time, 8. Sorry, 9. Prostitute. Bonus track: This I Love 

I think you're right, if Axl had released a double album with tracks like these leaks, he would have been clobbered and rightfully so. Atlas or whichever song has the "how to be a man" lyrics is simply dreadful. I don't think any of these tracks can be salvaged except "Nothing" so I'm not too torn up that they never were properly released. In fact, going by the mistakes they made on UYI with too much filler material released, for me, I'm glad only the strongest CD material made the cut. They could have probably cut more tracks from the final tracklisting for an even stronger album given that a lot of this stuff had already leaked anyway.  Riad, Scraped, etc are b-sides that shouldn't have been on the album. Maybe all these leaks could have been released on a CD boxset, that would have nicely closed the book on that whole era while keeping expectations in check. I think unfortunately for many of us, a lot of these unreleased tracks have been built up in our minds for so many years, that at this point you expect nothing short of exceptional material. The standards are raised so high because of Axl's excellent track record in the past.

I actually like that they are putting singles out with this material - a perfect strategy. If this stuff was released in an album, it would just tarnish the brand. Released as a throwaway single without much fanfare seems like the correct way to go here.

On a final note....these Village leaks give me the impression that Axl was more interested in playing around with pro-tools and creating soundcapes/textures, than actually putting together a finished song. It seems like a lot of random experimentation without purpose or focus. It's like he's trying to do the Trent Reznor thing but cannot find a creative muse so all this stuff just meanders and feels half baked. I guess it also explains Axl's interest in film scores- he prefers making instrumental music.

 

I think in terms of new material in the NuGuns era. I'm a fan of Ron's solo output and love his work on the Sons of Apollo records so there would definitely have been some music with potential there I feel. Evidently it wasn't enough to excite Axl but had he wanted to cement the band and put out a record it could have worked - a few poppy rock songs courtesy of DJ, a few proggy songs from Bumble and some punk/indie based songs from Tommy. Heck, the guy wouldn't have needed to actually do anything other than write vocal melodies and lyrics over the top. I think losing Bucket was a big blow for Axl.  It's odd in how the leaked Better video Bucket's treated as though he's still a member of the band and there's live footage featuring him from the previous tour. 

I think really the best thing Axl could have done is move away from the Chinese era after the 2010 tour. It finally came out, a lot of people were underwhelmed and he had a new lineup by then anyway. I think it would have been better to have just hit a studio and put out something from the lineup he actually had and moved on. That's the funny thing about the NuGuns era - the main players never got to play a lot of their songs live. Robin's This I Love solo is epic but he'd left by the time it had actually come out. Same for Bucket's parts. 

Edited August 15, 2023 by BassistSeb