19AT5

51 minutes ago, Sweersa said:

I know there's a few here who have a similar view on it.

Before GN'R, I liked (and still do, for the most part) Cheap Trick, Rush, Def Leppard, AC/DC, Journey, etc. so in the rock realm, though a but lighter than GN'R. Axl's "raspy" voice was actually an acquired taste for me. I preferred his natural, cleaner singing like in parts of Patience, Civil War, Mr. Brownstone, and a lot of Chinese Democracy, both high and low. I like how in songs like Scraped and Sorry he goes all over the place with his many vocal styles. 

Aaaaah my word! That's interesting, wish I had asked this earlier! This makes a lot more sense now. So I am actually the opposite (though I like all songs you listed there!) I prefer the more heavier side of GNR. It's So Easy (lyrics aside), Out Ta Get Me, You Could Be Mine, Coma, Locomotive, Oh My God etc. I enjoy laid back tracks like Patience too but I really struggled with some of the more grandiose shit like November Rain, Catcher In The Rye and (specifically) This I Love. Though I will admit I really enjoyed the piano only version of NR on the AFD boxset (and surprised myself to boot!) On paper I should like Absurd and I have genuinely given it a chance. But alas... the repetition of that one verse and the whole weird off beat phrasing on some lines just baffles me! 

Hey, music... it's subjective and that's why we love talking about it! 

1 hour ago, Sweersa said:

 

It's not for everyone, it is my favorite album of all time, and the one that got me into GN'R.

Well ya know what... fair fucks to ya. I've never actually encountered anybody who had that experience with the album but I respect that ya dig it. Just out of interest what were ya listening to beforehand and what got ya hooked into the album? Genuine questions here!

1 minute ago, Pele said:

It is astounding.

There is a minuscule body of work over the last three decades, and that body of work includes utter, utter garbage like Silkworms, OMG, Riad, Scraped, If the World, Catcher, Eye on You, Atlas.

Also includes decent but mediocre work like Shacklers, IRS, Prostitute, Chinese Democracy, HardSkool, Perhaps etc.

It's baffling anyone is even contemplating this guy is hoarding epic songs.

Most of the above was written by/with multiple songwriters, most of the music isn't his.  He just adds lyrics (very, very infrequently).

Well ya see... I actually genuinely enjoy Oh My God, believe it or not. I could totally get behind an album in that vein. And that is what I hoped CD would be. If The World I don't mind either. The rest I can live without right enough! Would call out Better as being a belter and though slightly overblown I quite TWAT as well. So there has been some good stuff like! But I get your point.

1 hour ago, Sweersa said:

GN'R is a band that evolves, especially with CD. CD2 will carry on that trend.

Oh please! CD was not an evolution, it was a metamorphosis from a edgy, sleazy, bluesy rock 'n' roll band into... eh, I'm actually not sure how I would describe it. To me it's not the same band. Regardless of what it says on the cover. Had it been a solo album, I might take it more seriously. I don't believe I'm alone in this! 

2 hours ago, agustingloger said:

I'd take ACDC everyday. Power Up and Black ice were really good. I can't think one song of the stones from 2000 - 2021 that i like... But it's personal. I don't care it sounds the same and how Brian sings live. It's exactly what i expect and want to hear from Acdc

Rough Justice from A Bigger Bang was alright. This Place Is Empty (Keef track) from same album was alright too. But to be honest that's been the story with most Stones releases post-Undercover in 1983... decent lead single, okay second single, couple of Keef tracks which range in quality, backed with a lot of tracks where The Stones are trying to be The Stones, if that makes sense.

7 minutes ago, vloors said:

Acdc has two problems which is why every song sounds similar. 1. Brian sounds the exact same on every single song. 2. Angus Young always uses the same 1970 gibson sg tuned the same way every single song. 

I love ACDC esp Bon Era but they cannot compete with The Rolling Stones classic legendary albums they released during that period between late 60s and early 70s. Even comparing their tours Mick still sounds great while Brian struggles and sounds terrible. 

No way they are on the same level in my opinion

I do get your point here. But as a huge DC fan, I am going to say that this run of studio albums is one of the best in hard rock:

Let There Be Rock

Powerage

Highway To Hell 

Back In Black 

For Those About To Rock 

Flick Of The Switch

The last two entires may be slightly controversial but I really like both albums, especially Flick. The lack of variety in Brian's voice though is a valid point. Though I think he has actually sounded better on the last few albums than he did in the 90s. 

1 hour ago, jamillos said:

To me, none of these albums are really comparable with any of the others, since each of them depict the band in a specific development stage, lineup, sound, and era. AfD is the way it was supposed to be in the 80s, UYI is the way it was supposed to be in the 90s etc. So, Appetite is not better or worse than UYI. And to compare these things with a cover album or with Axl's solo from 2000s is downright nonsensical. Each of them is unique, as was each year, and even tour leg. 

We are human. We rank shit by preference through subjective bias! GNR have such a small output that the comparisons become a little tedious but such is life. Now, had they actually bothered their arses to release albums like other bands then fair enough, but...  

10 minutes ago, Tom2112 said:

Agreed a long song doesn't automatically mean great song, that can be said about a few CD songs and a few UYI songs. I think when someones on about a long song they are thinking about NR, Estranged etc. those classic songs that build and build right to the end. Some songs on UYI and CD are long and feel long, CD is less guilty of this (for me) but UYI has a lot of times where I tend to think "they should be wrapping this up right about now", even songs I enjoy like 'Breakdown' and 'Locomotive'.

Yup! Civil War always went on too long for me. I'm a huge Locomotive fan but agreed it goes on too long. I really like that outro though! Totally out of place wae rest of song but I dig it.

10 minutes ago, jackparker123 said:

I'd really like the next song we hear to be a 6-7 minute epic, or longer.

We've not had an original GNR song break the 7 minute barrier since UYI.

You've got 3 over 6 mins on CD?! Length doesn't equate to quality! 

13 hours ago, Sweersa said:

That would be ideal. I liked that album, too. My dad and I saw Rush on that tour. It was very theatrical. 

Oh Jesus yes! Clockwork Angels is a superb album. There are days when I'd say it is possibly my favourite Rush album. It is really heavy and melodic without being (too) cheesy! I quite liked Snakes & Arrows too.

19 hours ago, darkside259 said:

eye on yo is suck an epic one i really don t get why people are not impresed about that song 

Because it's an unfinished demo? Doesn't really do much for me like. 

8 hours ago, DTJ80 said:

On any new album I’d hope that the majority of It would be of a more ‘epic’ style with a couple of straightforward rockers thrown in.

The beauty of differing opinions! I've heard enough of Axl's piano epics to last me a lifetime!!! Give me some heavy brutal sleazy riffage any day over mid tempo, piano led, orchestral soaked, self reflective songs with whinny lyrics about ex-girlfriends from the early 90s! 

1 hour ago, Free Bird said:

I know people who clearly prefer the Illusions over Appetite because they're sounding more mature. UYI were way too big to be ignored. I think there are more Illusion songs getting airplay in our local radio stations than AFD songs.

Guns made themselves vulnerable in different occasions but you can't take away their contribution to music history, which was low in quantity but huge in quality.

To be fair, I'd likely take a 'best of Illusions' playlist over Appetite. On the proviso I don't have to endure the 9 minutes of open ear surgery that is November Rain! 

3 hours ago, Sweersa said:

The intro is awful, I agree with you there. It may have been saved if it had a kickass instrumental behind the autotuned Axls. 

For me... it really is the epitome of the problem with ChiDem: unnecessary intro, ridiculously over layered vocals, some god awful terrible lyrics against some generally decent melody lines, needless mountains of guitar tracks, the odd moment of genuine decent musicality, washed down with a strange mix and production. It actually astounds me it took 13 years to make! And that's what we got. I'd likely have accepted those collection of songs 7 years earlier.

11 minutes ago, Sweersa said:

I'm one of those weirdos who actually really likes Scraped. Anything Bucket and Brain heavy is cool in my book. 

There's an okay song in there. But the intro is actually offensively bad! And the background vocals throughout do hee haw to improve it. Then there is the lyrics! Oh my word, they are bad! Not as bad as Absurd right enough! But other than all that... aye, it's a cracker!!!!!!!

3 hours ago, Sweersa said:

I'm definitely mostly an Axl fan, too. I do like a lot of Slash's work with Velvet Revolver and some of the stuff in his 2010 solo album as well. Maybe he can channel some of that same or better energy and soul into the new GN'R record, on the parts they won't keep Buckethead on  I do like his work on Absurd and Hard Skool, for the latter, I liked Robin's work too. Both are amazing in their own way, IMO.

To be fair, Slash's self titled solo album is actually pretty well written, even if some of the tracks are not to my taste overall. Bizarrely the different singer per track approach kinda seems to work. Or at least it doesn't sound totally odd. If that makes any sense. 

Agreed about Slash on Hard Skool also. He really kicked that up a notch or two in my opinions Absurd is just... well an absolute shocker of a song! It is sheer utter bollocks to these ears. Might be fun in the live arena, but having listened to it again this morning in the shower... I was just like 'nah fuck this shit'. I genuinely think I'd listen to Scraped over that again. And I have zero inkling to hear Scraped either (though I will admit the solo section is quite cool... but I don't listen to songs for guitar solos... generally speaking)!!!! 

41 minutes ago, darkside259 said:

yes don t get me wrong, in terms of music i think the attention goes elsewere like streaming, youtube, songs in movies, just watch the trailer for the new batman one, "something in the way" goes viral those days and happend to be a deep cut nirvana song, a rock club is not a indicator of "mainstream" could be a thing for the rock clubs from you town and maybe idk in... TOLEDO they play locomotive twice a day who knows 

I don't believe I said rock clubs/pubs are an indicator of the mainstream though?! The point I was trying to make is that these are frequented by people of a general like mindedness (i.e. they all like rock/metal music). It is within these establishments, from my experience, one generally hears GNR with relative frequency, though generally the material happens to be from AFD or maybe occasionally UYI. In terms of radio stations here in the UK... GNR wouldn't get a look in on any mainstream radio station. On the rock specific stations they are played more often but again... it's mainly AFD with occasional Lies or UYI tracks. 

1 minute ago, darkside259 said:

nobody give a shit about those rock club´s either 

Better tell the people who attend them then! 

Pre-pandemic there were a number of decent rock drinking venues in Glasgow and Edinburgh. 

24 minutes ago, Chris 55 said:

man, speak for yourself! I love that album! 

I actually don't mind the album, but I was speaking generally. There are a few good covers on it and a few howlers too! But overall I don't mind it, but rarely listen to it. 

To put it a different way... I'm yet to meet anybody who cites the album as their favourite GNR album. 

4 minutes ago, alfierose said:

Honestly I think Axl is semi retired at this point and as he heads through his 60s this is something as a fanbase we need to get to grips with.

It could be argued he's been semi retired for a long time because the down time has always vastly outweighed being on tour or releasing music. It's unlikely to get better as he gets older because that's not really how it works for anyone.

Slash clearly is not which is why he fills his time in between GNR tours with other stuff. So immediately you have a mismatch between the priorities of the main two.

There's still hope for a full album at some point but it's unlikely to be rushed because Axl doesn't work that way and I expect when not on tour he does things as and when he feels like it.

Looking forward realistically I think we might see one solid album (maybe two if we're really lucky and there's as much material as has been rumoured) within the next decade or so to close out the final chapter on this complicated band. Then some touring every couple of years for as long as Axl feels up to it and is having fun.

They'll probably be a few surprises along the way, old footage being released, box sets and special editions which will please some and not others.

There's no question that we are somewhere in the end game now. That's life and nothing lasts forever so I guess go see a show for the fun of it if they come around your way and everything else is a bonus if it happens.

I'm feeling a bit more zen about it all than I was pre pandemic. 

Yeah I can see that argument about semi-retirement. 

4 hours ago, AXL_N_DIZZY said:

Yep. If the truly great rock bands of all-time retired to the same English country estate- Guns would be there. They might be parking cars for the likes of the Stones, Beatles, Zepp, etc.- but they’d be there (1st ballot RNRHOF, the greatest debut hard rock record of all-time, playing stadiums 30+ yrs later).

For a lot of rock fans, the band are just that though... a one album giant. As much as I love the Illusions, they are generally felt to be bloated. Proof is in the pudding... how many bloody threads do you see on the topic of 'should the Illusions have been one album?'. And that's on fan forums!! Go into any rock club any night of the week and you will absolutely hear a banger from AFD. Ya might hear the odd track from the Illusions as well, but let's be honest... nobody gives a shit about The Spaghetti Incident and I've never once heard anything be played from Chinese Democracy in a club or rock bar. I do recall Planet Rock radio in the UK playing TWAT once or twice back around 2008/09. But that's it. GNR did not capitalise on their stellar debut

7 hours ago, allwaystired said:

Haha - you're talking to someone that was a huge fan of Nu-GNR! Still rate those years incredibly highly! 

 

Teenage me zoned out after the 2002 debacle and multiple cancellations of trips to Glasgow to see the band. I didn't have a lot of money, lived several hours away, had to pay for travel and accommodation... and this dick head kept on rescheduling before eventually cancelling. Can't quite remember the time line of events but after I saw the VMA performance, I was absolutely out. Never paid any attention to what was happening until about mid 2007 when I stumbled across the leaks. Interest peaked again around the release of ChiDem but by 2011 and that awful Rio and Bridge School gigs... I was 100% out. When I saw the Appetite For Democracy trailer, I couldn't help but laugh at what the band had become. Was vaguely enough interested that I would've listened to a follow up album but alas that never happened! Saw them in NYC in 2017 as they happened to be there same time and it was great. Interested peaked again. But dropped slightly thereafter as there was nothing new to listen to.

3 minutes ago, allwaystired said:

Oh, there's no way on earth GNR are classed in the same league as bands like the Rolling Stones or AC/DC! No chance. The only place you'd hear that view is on a GNR forum! 

Whether we like it or not, to most people GNR are a top hat, a kilt, a singer who rants and turns up late, a couple of karaoke songs and a cheap option for fancy dress. 

I hate that that's the way it is, but there we go. 

Oh what the fuck maaaaaan... what about nu-Guns, the buckets, the braids, the alien, the consistent and multiple cancellations of a gig in Glasgow that still boils the piss out of teenage me, Sebastian Bach, the ever delays of an album that most people had heard by the time it was released years, and of course the legendary 2002 MTV Video Music Awa... I'll shut the fuck up now and get ma coat!!!! 😁😁😁

Agree with you fully that GNR are nowhere bloody near same level as The Stones or AC/DC. I remember hearing Adler on Eddie Trunk and he said something like... a reunion of the original GNR would be the biggest reunion ever. Somebody then pointed out Led Zeppelin and he didn't seem to grasp that Zep might dwarf GNR in terms of influence and appeal.

1 minute ago, allwaystired said:

Haha! I feel you there. All of my friends that are into music constantly take the piss out of me for my love of GNR. 

They're not exactly thought of very fondly in certain circles! 

 

Yeah I hear you there as well. A lot of my mates are big metal/rock fans and most of them just don't like GNR at all for some reason. When one enquires as to why... it's always one name and one name only... and that name is... of course... Chris F'N Webber! 

13 minutes ago, oneway23 said:

Honestly, there was a time (sorry) where a new record may have had an impact beyond the pre-existing fan bubble, but, in my humble opinion, that time has LONG since gone, hence, why I've been saying I don't expect much more than maybe a couple more singles.

As I always say, happy to be proven wrong.

Looks we are in the same boat then! Budge up now!!  Realistically when do you think that time passed? Had they struck with an album hot on the tails of the first reunion tour, would that have been big news? 

7 minutes ago, oneway23 said:

I know I've mentioned this one on here a bunch, but, look how the public at large reacted to the first Van Halen album with DLR in twenty-eight years!  Killer songs, great performances, and it was basically one single, big articles for a couple of weeks, late night performance, aaaannnd....back to playing in front of the same fanbase  who was already going to see them on their tours.

Yeah but if memory serves me right, a lot of Van Halen fans were disappointed with that album? They also did a lot of press! I'm not a huge VH fan so my opinion on this topic is irrelevant. GNR are already playing stadiums though... apart from people on forums (i.e. their slightly more committed than casual fans like me, to hardcore collectors)... is a new GNR record really going to do anything at this point? Axl chucked away his best years and tried to do it solo under the GNR moniker and largely failed to deliver (though I know there were some seriously shit hot performances in the nu-Guns era). I'm not entirely what motivation they have to release a new album. Personally I don't think it'll happen.