Is Axl in the midst of another 'kicked dog' phase?

[axlsalinger]

I basically agree with that, but the waters get murky real quick when you get into contracts and lawsuits. Axl can't just release an album without Geffen / Universal's consent, if they own the masters. And for the CD stuff, I would think that they do since they paid for the sessions. I wouldn't be surprised if Best Buy wanted a piece of the pie as well.

So I guess it's possible the label is a problem, but I'd think if Axl and his team walked into a meeting with a group of Universal people, and both sides were willing to negotiate a little bit with some give and take, they could hammer out an agreement. This leads me to believe that Axl's demands are unrealistic and the reason for the delay.

[classicguns4life]

I basically agree with that, but the waters get murky real quick when you get into contracts and lawsuits. Axl can't just release an album without Geffen / Universal's consent, if they own the masters. And for the CD stuff, I would think that they do since they paid for the sessions. I wouldn't be surprised if Best Buy wanted a piece of the pie as well.

So I guess it's possible the label is a problem, but I'd think if Axl and his team walked into a meeting with a group of Universal people, and both sides were willing to negotiate a little bit with some give and take, they could hammer out an agreement. This leads me to believe that Axl's demands are unrealistic and the reason for the delay.

I guess. I still don't get why he couldn't play any of these songs. Thats not illegal right? He used to do that with the other Chinese songs and thats pretty much what kept us going and from the show being total nostalgia. He doesn't even talk about a new album. And he hardly talks at the show period. Just seems like he has absolutely no interest.

[axlsalinger]

Yeah, pretty sure he could play them if he wanted to. Probably doesn't because of all the "downloading motherfuckers".

[Randy Lahey]

I think Axl will take one more kick at the cat.

[wasted]

So does the label look at the next record of material fully of Silkworms, Scraped, maybe more electronica stuff, maybe even more aggressive. Maybe it doesn't have the appeal they want.

As has been said many many times, if Axl wanted to release something, he could do it in a second. Either he's afraid, he doesn't have enough to release, or he just plain doesn't care. But he's at a point in his life and we're at a point in society where you don't need labels to release new stuff. Also as has been said for years, if he really wanted to he could play the fucking stuff live.

I agree in theory. But none of that is true. The label control the releases. Hes under contract to UMG he cant just release GNR material that easily.

I think its more that the culture has deemed it that the old stuff is better than the new. That in GNR case this is true. Certain songs must be played live. More so than other bands imo. Stuff like Easy n Brownstone, Estranged, Live n Let Die, Heavens door play a big part even though they are album tracks.

there is some evidence the label doesnt just jump when Axl says.

[classicguns4life]

Certain songs must be played live. More so than other bands imo. Stuff like Easy n Brownstone, Estranged, Live n Let Die, Heavens door play a big part even though they are album tracks.

Estranged JUST started getting played as of like 2 years ago. I agree, they have a lot of songs that need to be played. But they play 3 hours and can easily be half known half not what you'd expect. The songs they NEED to play:

1. Welcome To The Jungle

2. It's So Easy

3. Nightrain

4. Mr. Brownstone

5. Paradise City

6. Sweet Child O' Mine

7. Rocket Queen (which is debatable, but whatever)

8. Patience

9. Live And Let Die (which is dumb because its a cover, but I'll give it to them)

10. Don't Cry (which also he didn't play for awhile, but was one of the few he didn't play I felt was a "must play")

11. November Rain

12. Civil War (see Don't Cry)

13. Knockin' On Heaven's Door (see Live And Let Die)

14. You Could Be Mine

Thats it. And even some of those could be alternated nightly, but I'll give them that they need to play all of those. Throw in 6 Chinese Democracy songs of his choice (whichever ones he feels like playing that night) and we're up to 20. He has room for like 4 or more new tracks if he wanted. Its just true. And he could take out the covers, Civil War, and Rocket Queen every now and then and have some more room for deeper cuts. I get that people come to the shows to hear certain things, but they also come because they still think Slash is still in the band. Honestly, I don't these people are coming back a second and third time. They go once to see Guns N Roses. I know I did. He can pretty much play whatever he wants, and that includes new material which honestly should have been started to be played in like 2008. There's no excuse.

[wasted]

Certain songs must be played live. More so than other bands imo. Stuff like Easy n Brownstone, Estranged, Live n Let Die, Heavens door play a big part even though they are album tracks.

Estranged JUST started getting played as of like 2 years ago. I agree, they have a lot of songs that need to be played. But they play 3 hours and can easily be half known half not what you'd expect. The songs they NEED to play:

1. Welcome To The Jungle

2. It's So Easy

3. Nightrain

4. Mr. Brownstone

5. Paradise City

6. Sweet Child O' Mine

7. Rocket Queen (which is debatable, but whatever)

8. Patience

9. Live And Let Die (which is dumb because its a cover, but I'll give it to them)

10. Don't Cry (which also he didn't play for awhile, but was one of the few he didn't play I felt was a "must play")

11. November Rain

12. Civil War (see Don't Cry)

13. Knockin' On Heaven's Door (see Live And Let Die)

14. You Could Be Mine

Thats it. And even some of those could be alternated nightly, but I'll give them that they need to play all of those. Throw in 6 Chinese Democracy songs of his choice (whichever ones he feels like playing that night) and we're up to 20. He has room for like 4 or more new tracks if he wanted. Its just true. And he could take out the covers, Civil War, and Rocket Queen every now and then and have some more room for deeper cuts. I get that people come to the shows to hear certain things, but they also come because they still think Slash is still in the band. Honestly, I don't these people are coming back a second and third time. They go once to see Guns N Roses. I know I did. He can pretty much play whatever he wants, and that includes new material which honestly should have been started to be played in like 2008. There's no excuse.

i think they kind of need to play Estranged and Civil War. And 4 chi dem songs at the very least for obvious reasons.

But then anything feom a new record has to be awesome to beat Used to Love Her, Think About You, Out ta Get Me, Yesterdays even seasoned covers like Dead Flowers and Rosie. And people would die to hear Coma or Locomotive. Nice Boys, even Down on the Farm. Not to mention Bad Obsession, DTJ, Perfect Crime, Pretty Tied Up.

So yes new material but it has to be awesome.

And with GNR the album will be scrutinized. I think they could squeeze in a new song. But the album has to have at least 6 if not all great tracks otherwise it will get torn to pieces. With Headlines to match and Axl going out with a fail. Whereas CD in final analysis, is a great solid record, personal taste aside, 14 strong songs.

Throwing out a duffer at this point would be suicidal.

[prettytiedup88]

Don't think he's in that phase at all.

I think what we are seeing now is down time. They've toured this album relentlessly, taken it as far as they can in terms of exposure through playing the songs live and changed as many opinions as possible. This album cycle is now over and I think we are in down time where Axl, Team Brazil and the players in the band need to plot their next move, get inspired and re-energize.

[wasted]

Vitamin Water or Gatorade?

[Tom2112]

Look as much as I liked CD the majority of people didn't like it. CD II will do well among the people who dug CD I and the other fans that will just buy something because that says "Guns N' Roses" besides that the rest of the world does not want a experimental GnR album and it will "fail" if you judge an album by it's sales in 20....13,14,15,16,17...? People want a basic rock record with a few Axl piano ballads. I think Axl has the same idea as he did with AFD, that if he continually tours it, the album will finally break... well that's all well and good, but you need to have a huge single and CD didn't have any singles. Kicked dog? I don't know, but realistically he should be preparing to get back out there, wallowing or, whatever some of you suggest he's doing is not going to do his career and favours. Yes, he can pretty much tour consistently and sell a decent amount of tickets but I don't think that's the motivation for Axl... money never pushed before and I don't see it pushing him now. If it did, CD would be completely different, there would have been a reunion, we all know this to be true

[November_rain]

I think he is just having some off time, resting or whatever and that doesn´t mean that we won´t have any more tours or any more records released in the future. Now the question is : will "soon" be the word? (sorry, couldn´t help the joke lol ).

[classicguns4life]

I think he is just having some off time, resting or whatever and that doesn´t mean that we won´t have any more tours or any more records released in the future. Now the question is : will "soon" be the word? (sorry, couldn´t help the joke lol ).

He had the rest in the 90s. Make up for it now or he'll become a complete relic.

[November_rain]

I think he is just having some off time, resting or whatever and that doesn´t mean that we won´t have any more tours or any more records released in the future. Now the question is : will "soon" be the word? (sorry, couldn´t help the joke lol ).

He had the rest in the 90s. Make up for it now or he'll become a complete relic.

True but the circumstances were completely different in the 90s. He had to deal with the band break up, personal issues...etc.

Edited September 20, 2013 by November_rain

[classicguns4life]

I think he is just having some off time, resting or whatever and that doesn´t mean that we won´t have any more tours or any more records released in the future. Now the question is : will "soon" be the word? (sorry, couldn´t help the joke lol ).

He had the rest in the 90s. Make up for it now or he'll become a complete relic.

True but the circumstances were completely different in the 90s. He had to deal with the band break up, personal issues...etc.

I get it, and I know its not fair, but he's getting older and him taking time off now means he's only gonna be worse when he comes back. He certainly has the right to take a break, but we all know its not gonna be good for him.

[November_rain]

I think he is just having some off time, resting or whatever and that doesn´t mean that we won´t have any more tours or any more records released in the future. Now the question is : will "soon" be the word? (sorry, couldn´t help the joke lol ).

He had the rest in the 90s. Make up for it now or he'll become a complete relic.

True but the circumstances were completely different in the 90s. He had to deal with the band break up, personal issues...etc.

I get it, and I know its not fair, but he's getting older and him taking time off now means he's only gonna be worse when he comes back. He certainly has the right to take a break, but we all know its not gonna be good for him.

It´s obvious he is not in his twenties or thirties but as the proverb says "True old rockers never die".