enough!! there has to a reason

[magisme]

I wasn't posting in 2010, but I was lurking and watching videos. My opinion at the time was that the setlist sucked, Axl didn't look very good, he'd lost a lot of his mobility, but he sounded pretty great, and that made the other stuff not quite as important.

[Nosaj Thing]

I wasn't posting in 2010, but I was lurking and watching videos. My opinion at the time was that the setlist sucked, Axl didn't look very good, he'd lost a lot of his mobility, but he sounded pretty great, and that made the other stuff not quite as important.

I think he looked decent for a 48 year old. He lost considerable weight during the tour.

[Thin White Duke]

Did nodules make him fat and out of shape too?

Why do you care if he is fat? Pavarotti was fat. We are talking about the voice here not how he used to be on stage or if he can run across the stage as he used to do.

The emphasis should be on the out of shape. The point is that he doesn't give a shit. There's no great mystery to be unraveled here. He's lazy as fuck.

See? Now I can see your argument much clearer than with that (millions of times repeated, therefore getting-boring) taunt.

That said, if he didn't have any problem with his voice, even not giving a fuck, he would have it relatively easy to sing SLIGHTLY better. At least that's what I think with my non existant knowledge of this matter.

[magisme]

Did nodules make him fat and out of shape too?

Why do you care if he is fat? Pavarotti was fat. We are talking about the voice here not how he used to be on stage or if he can run across the stage as he used to do.

The emphasis should be on the out of shape. The point is that he doesn't give a shit. There's no great mystery to be unraveled here. He's lazy as fuck.

See? Now I can see your argument much clearer than with that (millions of times repeated, therefore getting-boring) taunt.

Lighten the fuck up.

[Thin White Duke]

Pavarotti was not a physical performer. Axl is. He's a rock musician who knows people expect him to engage physically on stage, so being out of shape is certainly something that would hinder the inherent quality of his stage performance when he's running about or even just snake-dancing.

And I 100% agree. But, again, we are discussing ONLY his vocal skills here. Not the fact that he needs a better shape to be a rock star and act like one.

I was here in 2010 as a lurker and I remember very few people complaining but most of them (and this forum had more traffic back then) were praising Axl's voice.

I'm not saying everybody was complainin, am I? I'm saying there still were people focusing on that fact.

Edited March 29, 2014 by Thin White Duke

[tkarmy]

Pavarotti was not a physical performer. Axl is. He's a rock musician who knows people expect him to engage physically on stage, so being out of shape is certainly something that would hinder the inherent quality of his stage performance when he's running about or even just snake-dancing.

Am I calling him fat? Nope. Just saying if he shows up looking puffy and his voice isn't very good, of course people are going to immediately notice that. I think to some people it may also be indicative of a lack of concern for his health. If he's letting himself go physically, then perhaps he's letting himself go in other areas as well (i.e. vocally). I think if he showed up like he did in 2006, even if his voice sucked, people would be less critical, because at least he'd appear to care and be trying. Again, I'm not saying he owes us anything or that he doesn't have the right to do whatever the fuck he wants with his physical appearance. But when you're charging fans money for a performance, they likewise gain the right to criticize aspects of that performance.

So if there is a medical issue with his throat... which quite likely there is (Im a vocalist and don't use anywhere the rasp that Axl use to use and have 10 yearsof vocal training and I have had vocal damage with with 1/4 the abuse) what exactly do you want? A 53 year old to look 8-23 years younger?

People who have made their lives out of performing just don't wake up and decide to sing poorly. Actually it probably feels like torture for Axl not to give a full on rasp.

The thousands of fans screaming over the camera photo videos seem pretty happy with what is happening... might be time to step away from the keyboard or maybe just keep "gnr you tube 88" on your google copy and paste

[Thin White Duke]

Did nodules make him fat and out of shape too?

Why do you care if he is fat? Pavarotti was fat. We are talking about the voice here not how he used to be on stage or if he can run across the stage as he used to do.

The emphasis should be on the out of shape. The point is that he doesn't give a shit. There's no great mystery to be unraveled here. He's lazy as fuck.

See? Now I can see your argument much clearer than with that (millions of times repeated, therefore getting-boring) taunt.

Lighten the fuck up.

[tkarmy]

Did nodules make him fat and out of shape too?

Why do you care if he is fat? Pavarotti was fat. We are talking about the voice here not how he used to be on stage or if he can run across the stage as he used to do.

The emphasis should be on the out of shape. The point is that he doesn't give a shit. There's no great mystery to be unraveled here. He's lazy as fuck.

See? Now I can see your argument much clearer than with that (millions of times repeated, therefore getting-boring) taunt.

Lighten the fuck up.

lol

[magisme]

[Thin White Duke]

[Nosaj Thing]

I was here in 2010 as a lurker and I remember very few people complaining but most of them (and this forum had more traffic back then) were praising Axl's voice.

I'm not saying everybody was complainin, am I? I'm saying there still were people focusing on that fact.

Never said you did. People complained about the braids in 2006. Buckethead and Finck in 2002, etc. The thing is, back then you could sense the positivity around here. Now you see even the greatest Axl supporters turning their backs and scratching their heads.

[NachoLZ]

I'm not saying everybody was complainin, am I? I'm saying there still were people focusing on that fact.</blockquote>Never said you did. People complained about the braids in 2006. Buckethead and Finck in 2002, etc. The thing is, back then you could sense the positivity around here. Now you see even the greatest Axl supporters turning their backs and scratching their heads.

Its too obvious and there are no more excuses.

[D-GenerationX]

The thousands of fans screaming over the camera photo videos seem pretty happy with what is happening... might be time to step away from the keyboard or maybe just keep "gnr you tube 88" on your google copy and paste

I try and have this conversation with Jarmo, but he ducks it. Perhaps I'll have better luck with you.

Do you honestly think this is an answer to the question about his voice? I'm serious. You see this as the answer to that question?

Because its not. Its 2 different conversations.

1) Does he sound good, yes or no?

2) Was the crowd digging it, yes or no?

But your answer to #2 can't be your answer to #1. It makes no sense.

If someone says the voice sounds shaky to them, they are not making any statement about the fans : good, bad, or indifferent. So for you to come back puffing out your chest about the crowd...its meaningless. No one ever introduced the premise that the crowd was down on it. They are commenting on the quality of his voice, as they hear it.

Do you see what I'm saying?

[GUNNER PT]

I'm getting a little tired of talking about this in other threads...

Did nodules make him fat and out of shape too?

I know my english sucks but, tell me which part don't you understand ... maybe I can try to explain better:

Don't you think that it's more likely that, due to another health problem, he may need to take some medicines (such as corticosteroids) which makes him gain some more weight, beside of affecting his vocal cords?

Axl is not fat ... he is swollen. Maybe just fluid retention due to some medication.

I don't know if he has some physical problem (leg, back, or whatever) which requires cortisone use, affecting his weight and his vocal cords.

I don't know if he has vocal cord problems requiring him to take cortisone, affecting his weight.

I don't know if the problems he have are the cause or the consequence of other stuff.

Whatever it is, something is wrong with his health ...it seems quite obvious ... anyone can see (unless you don't want to).

Then sing with a normal voice, but sing well. Or at least explain what's going on and perhaps people wouldn't be so rude. It's not really that complicated, is it?

^^^^ This is a good point.

Edited March 29, 2014 by GUNNER PT

[magisme]

Did nodules make him fat and out of shape too?

I know my english sucks but, tell me which part don't you understand ... maybe I can try to explain better:

Don't you think that it's more likely that, due to another health problem, he may need to take some medicines (such as corticosteroids) which makes him gain some more weight, beside of affecting his vocal cords?

I wasn't responding to you. I was responding to OP.

[GUNNER PT]

I know .... but i was responding to your question. Can I?

If you have a nodule ... and you have to take some medicins like cortisone or whatever, you will be "fat" due to liquid retention. If you ask me if someone who's fat can also be in shape ... uh, well ... maybe ... but that's not easy ...

[magisme]

I know .... but i was responding to your question. Can I?

If you have a nodule ... and you have to take some medicins like cortisone or whatever, you will be "fat" due to liquid retention. If you ask me if someone who's fat can also be in shape ... uh, well ... maybe ... but that's not easy ...

Yes, you can. I thought you were implying that I was responding to you and had misunderstood what you wrote.

Maybe you're right? I don't know enough about how that would work - what surgeries he'd have, what meds he'd be on, what side effects the meds would have, all that.. It just sounds like searching for an excuse to me.

[Yesterdays-Civil-War]

I don't understand why the only option to some people here is to love Axl and everything about his band or GTFO.

Why can't we be allowed to criticize or critique him? Not everyone who disagrees with you is a cupcake or a hater.

[GUNNER PT]

I know .... but i was responding to your question. Can I?

If you have a nodule ... and you have to take some medicins like cortisone or whatever, you will be "fat" due to liquid retention. If you ask me if someone who's fat can also be in shape ... uh, well ... maybe ... but that's not easy ...

Yes, you can. I thought you were implying that I was responding to you and had misunderstood what you wrote.

Maybe you're right? I don't know enough about how that would work - what surgeries he'd have, what meds he'd be on, what side effects the meds would have, all that.. It just sounds like searching for an excuse to me.

I don't know if it is an excuse ... He didn't said nothing about it ... we are just trying to understand why this is happening .... we are speculating, of course.

I agree with this:

Thin White Duke, on 29 Mar 2014 - 3:45 PM, said:

Then sing with a normal voice, but sing well. Or at least explain what's going on and perhaps people wouldn't be so rude. It's not really that complicated, is it?

But if one day Axl try to explain something about this .... then it will sound like an excuse to everybody. Maybe that's why he keeps his mouth shut.

[Thin White Duke]

I was here in 2010 as a lurker and I remember very few people complaining but most of them (and this forum had more traffic back then) were praising Axl's voice.

I'm not saying everybody was complainin, am I? I'm saying there still were people focusing on that fact.

Never said you did. People complained about the braids in 2006. Buckethead and Finck in 2002, etc. The thing is, back then you could sense the positivity around here. Now you see even the greatest Axl supporters turning their backs and scratching their heads.

Back then...before people like you joined the forum, you mean? You say it was better back then but yet you decided to join now. Admit you enjoy the bashing.

I understand your point though and it's obvious there are more reasons to be upset nowadays. Honestly, if he has some helath problem, whatever, it would be easier to explain what is happening. And I'm sure people would still go to their shows, but he wouldn't need to try to impersonate all Axl because people would be aware of his limitations.

But if one day Axl try to explain something about this .... then it will sound like an excuse to everybody. Maybe that's why he keeps his mouth shut.

Well, it depends on how you say it. If you give a proper explanation, or a medical statement or something reliable, I'm sure some people would think it's an excuse, but most people are not that evil to not understand. I don't know. Maybe you have a point. Maybe it's too late and he should have been more open years ago.

[Apollo]

oh fuck off you haters....

I know as a performer I give my best every chance I get. Axl doesn't wake up and think "oh man, I'm going to really piss off those message board haters today and have no rasp in my voice... especially at a charity show Neil Young is putting on... that will teach them"

If Axl could he would.... there is a reason. It might do him good to do what Tom Keifer did and just do an interview and let people know what is going on... but I'm going to stop hating and accept that for whatever reason Axl can't do what he use to. There is no reason to think he would just be trying to 'fuck with the fans'...

Oh, fuck off you blind mediocre follower.

Like I said before in another thread, alright, let's assume for a second that he's deliberately choosing to sing with clean weak vocals or that he's trying to save his voice. Now, take a second and explain to me (in other words, come up with yet another lame excuse) as to why he's completely out of shape? And I'm not talkin' about Axl being fat. If you saw the last performances you could've perceived he's out of breath every 5 seconds, he can't hit longer notes because he desperately needs air. He couldn't even finish November Rain outro the other day.

Well ok, then why don't you continue to visit a message board of a band that the singer obviously hates you and sings in way that annoys you JUST TO PISS YOU OFF.... seriously dude, if you hate it that much go on a fucking hike or ride your bike to a lake or something. I can seriously think of a million better things to do than go to a message board and bitch about I no longer like or respect and get annoyed watching new clips of them perform.

Axl doesn't hate you and is not trying to spite you. Why don't you take off your shirt and give us a photo hot shot and see how you like being critequed

get a life

Maybe you should follow your own advice?

If a few posts from random strangers on a rock n roll message board make you so angry and bitter.....seriously dude, why don't you go on a hike or ride your bike to a lake or something. You say you can seriously think of a million better things to do than go to a message board and bitch......yet, here you are.

Not trying to be rude. But at least the posters are talking about the TOPIC. The band that this forum is dedicated to. You, on the other hand, are just insulting people who aren't in the band that the forum is devoted to.

And your shirt comment is ludicrous. Apples to oranges. I can't sing anywhere like Axl Rose can. But I bet you I can do my job 10000 times better than he can. The point you are missing is that if we had a hundred million dollars in the bank, millions of fans, and Axl's vocal talent......would we just go on cruise control, or would we put in the work during the off season to assure that we were in tip-top performance shape? Axl clearly doesn't. I'd like to think that I would. And if I didn't care enough to do so - then I wouldn't tour. If people are going to pay $150 a ticket to come watch me, and some people were going to travel and pay thousands of dollars to see my concerts...I'd make damn sure I was in top shape and gave them a top performance every time.

[GUNNER PT]

Maybe it's too late and he should have been more open years ago.

I have to agree with this.

[Thin White Duke]

I don't understand why the only option to some people here is to love Axl and everything about his band or GTFO.

Why can't we be allowed to criticize or critique him? Not everyone who disagrees with you is a cupcake or a hater.

I criticize and disagree with Axl and this band 90% of the time. I just think we can find better arguments than the typical "boo, he is fat" and things like that. Productive discussion, that is.

[magisme]

He needs a doctor's note.

Edited March 29, 2014 by magisme

[Thin White Duke]

Groghan joined the discussion... I gotta leave. Quickly.