Meet Stalin's granddaughter

[Strange Broue]

3 hours ago, Georgy Zhukov said:

You are the one talking about alternate history. 50 million is a gross exaggeration. The figure was closer to 20 million, most of which is through starvation, horrible living conditions in the work camps. The executions do not even amount to the numbers by the Nazis whether they were done by the SS Einsatzgruppen or the gas chambers. This doesn't count the 27 million Soviets who died as a result of war. 

 

And please, Stalin was no friend or mentor to Mao. Stalin suppored Chiang Kai-Shek's Nationalist Government over the Communists. Mao was simply the opportunist who took over any land the Nationalists were pushed out. Stalin didn't want Mao interfering with his affairs in Mongolia and Siaking. Stalin had to give up the latter but Mongolia remains an independent state thanks to Mao backing off. 

you should check out eastern european historian's books as sources not only brittish books

I count people who died in the war too, because they were people too

50 million is much closer to the reality and besides that this whole Number of xy million thing is not really the point....  there's still plenty amount of documents that is sitting somewhere on an archive waiting to be finally get researched and published....

I never said that Stalin was his mentor, but if we are talking about dictators, then it's obvious that Mao was his "pupil" in terms of methods...

[Strange Broue]

1 hour ago, Georgy Zhukov said:

They didn't trade it on the world market, for arms. The Soviet industry built their own arms. The food went to areas more important like the cities, mismanagement did leave to millions starving in Ukraine and the Caucuses, which in the 1930's resulted to about 5 million people. The 20 million happened in a span of 30 years. It was horrifying, but that was how the system worked. Do I say I agree with it? No. But Stalin's crash industrialization is what made them ready to take on Nazi Germany. The best part is, that after Nazi Germany was defeated, Stalin was easy to deal with. Poland, Romania, Hungary, Czechoslovakia and East Germany would be under Communist rule in change for not helping out the Communists in the Greek Civil War and ensuring DeGaulle the French Communists will not interfere with him taking power in France. Woe to the people living under Communism, but that is Realpolik for you. 

 

Now I am a Bernie supporter, but Bernie isn't a Communist. He is a Socialist, or a Democratic Socialist. I do not expect a Trump supporter to know the difference. 

[Georgy Zhukov]

Sulk all you want. If the democracies didn't do anything about Hitler in the 1930's, it was up to them to help Stalin take care of it. 

18 minutes ago, Strange Broue said:

you should check out eastern european historian's books as sources not only brittish books

I count people who died in the war too, because they were people too

50 million is much closer to the reality and besides that this whole Number of xy million thing is not really the point....  there's still plenty amount of documents that is sitting somewhere on an archive waiting to be finally get researched and published....

I never said that Stalin was his mentor, but if we are talking about dictators, then it's obvious that Mao was his "pupil" in terms of methods...

Yeah, that is what revisionists dream of, some non existance document that will give the true numbers. Oh wait, they do exist! The numbers have been released years ago. There you have it. NKVD has claimed about 799,000 executions but everyone wants that number to be higher. It may well be. But it seems 20 million is the agreed number, not counting the war which added another 27 million, much of that being from Nazi occupation and famine and also NKVD punishing collaborators, including deporting entire populations of ethnic groups such as the Crimean Tartars, the Kalmyks and the Chechens, to far away states such as Uzbekistan. A bout a quarter of them died as a result. Those deportations were largely thanks to Beria. Some members of those groups, a small minority have collaborated with the Nazis. Despite the fact that many Tartars, Kalmyks and Chechens fought with distinction, many were Heros of the Soviet Union, Beria decided to punish the whole population. That was the reason why so many died. It took it to the extremes. They forced them to move thousands of miles with no regard to living conditions, many died from exposure, disease and hunger. Dumping them in lands they are unfamiliar with, it lead to the deaths of thousands. Yes I can say the number is close to 20 million. 

 

Mao was even more ruthless than Stalin. His methods are more aligned with Hitler controlled people by having others denounce their neighbors. The Chinese secret police acted more like the Gestapo in that regard. Mao nearly destoryed China, his successors have saved it from destruction. Stalin nearly destroyed the Soviet Union with his death.  Fortunately for the Soviet Union, Krushchev denounced Stalin and had Beria tried and executed. Zhukov arressted him himself and called it the hightlight of his career. There wasn't a Red Army soldier who didn't want to put a bullet in that man's head. The deportees have slowly been brought back, though you can imagine the bitterness. At first, few believed it was Stalin who did it! 

Edited March 21, 2016 by Georgy Zhukov

[Strange Broue]

You should go somewhere to teach, not here and not me... thanks
revisionism? are you out of your mind?

I just posted an article about Stalin's granddaughter and you turned this thread to a history class when you try to lecture others

 

/care and /thread for me

[Len Cnut]

11 hours ago, Jackie Moon said:

she should do porn, major win for the 50's

She could do a scene with Montana Fisburne!  She could bowl up and be like 'pink pill or brown pill?'

[wasted]

Words are never enough just cheap tarnished glitter

[Axl owns dexter]

Wow what a tool this guy LARPing as Zhukov is. All those millions that died were just an unfortunate circumstance. Hey they beat Hitler, that's all that matters! 

[paranoyd androyd]

Fascism and Communism are the same thing

[Georgy Zhukov]

On 3/21/2016 at 6:44 AM, Axl owns dexter said:

Wow what a tool this guy LARPing as Zhukov is. All those millions that died were just an unfortunate circumstance. Hey they beat Hitler, that's all that matters! 

 

I don't expect you to understand anything. Stalinist policies were brutal and it cost the lives of millions. But it was never state santioned murder on the scale of the Nazis. There was never the assembly line of murder in camps such as Auschwitz and Treblinka. If any good came out of Stalin's policies it meant the end of that slaughter. That is a fact. 

[Axl owns dexter]

8 hours ago, Georgy Zhukov said:

 

I don't expect you to understand anything. Stalinist policies were brutal and it cost the lives of millions. But it was never state santioned murder on the scale of the Nazis. There was never the assembly line of murder in camps such as Auschwitz and Treblinka. If any good came out of Stalin's policies it meant the end of that slaughter. That is a fact. 

Oh great, instead of a gassing, you were left to starve to death or just shot. How humane! Yes, the Bolsheviks pre-Stalin may have been even worse. But he still kept the GULAG system going. Mass murder is mass murder.

[Georgy Zhukov]

As as horrible at this was, it doesn't compare to state sanctioned murder. Most of the 12 million or so deaths that occurred under the Nazi rule were between 1942 and 1944. The world has never seen mass murder so efficiently. Himmler himself was hoping to starve tens millions more. Instead of deporting mass populations to the east where most were left to fend for themselves because of incompetent administration doesn't compare deporting them to camps where the unskilled which included children, most of the women and elderly where gassed at a rate of 2500 and hour. The gas chambers were the "solution" to the problems caused by the mass shootings of Jews in Ukraine, Belorussia and Western Russia because it had such a demoralizing affected on the SS Einsatzgruppen killing squads.   

 

Stalin was evil, but unfortunately he was necessary evil. Britain and France were unwilling to stop Hitler from invading countries in the 1930's and when the war came they were too weak to stop him taking over most of Europe. When he finally invaded the Soviet Union, the tide turned. 70% to 80% of German losses were on the Eastern Front. True the Lend Lease supplies, especially trucks help the Soviets drive the Germans all the way to Berlin, but they paid for it in 8 million lives. By the time the Allies Invaded Normandy the Red Army broke the backs of the German army almost a year earlier at Kursk. We owe a quite a lot to Stalin but I say we owe a lot more to the Red Army, its leaders and their citizens, many who were rewarded and honored, many went honored until after Stalin's death. 

[Axl owns dexter]

On 3/25/2016 at 8:57 AM, Georgy Zhukov said:

As as horrible at this was, it doesn't compare to state sanctioned murder. Most of the 12 million or so deaths that occurred under the Nazi rule were between 1942 and 1944. The world has never seen mass murder so efficiently. Himmler himself was hoping to starve tens millions more. Instead of deporting mass populations to the east where most were left to fend for themselves because of incompetent administration doesn't compare deporting them to camps where the unskilled which included children, most of the women and elderly where gassed at a rate of 2500 and hour. The gas chambers were the "solution" to the problems caused by the mass shootings of Jews in Ukraine, Belorussia and Western Russia because it had such a demoralizing affected on the SS Einsatzgruppen killing squads.   

 

Stalin was evil, but unfortunately he was necessary evil. Britain and France were unwilling to stop Hitler from invading countries in the 1930's and when the war came they were too weak to stop him taking over most of Europe. When he finally invaded the Soviet Union, the tide turned. 70% to 80% of German losses were on the Eastern Front. True the Lend Lease supplies, especially trucks help the Soviets drive the Germans all the way to Berlin, but they paid for it in 8 million lives. By the time the Allies Invaded Normandy the Red Army broke the backs of the German army almost a year earlier at Kursk. We owe a quite a lot to Stalin but I say we owe a lot more to the Red Army, its leaders and their citizens, many who were rewarded and honored, many went honored until after Stalin's death. 

This is absolutely disgusting. I owe nothing to Stalin or any of the leaders of the Soviet Union of that era and before. To sweep away the millions of slavs who were murdered by those beasts as some type of necessary evil is absolutely vile and pisses on their memory.

[Georgy Zhukov]

Okay if it weren't for the Soviet Union, millions more Slavs and Jews would have died. The Nazis were going to starve millions and the rest were to be used as slave labor.