Blackstar

I think @Voodoochild's theory about how these leaked is the most plausible: not ripped from vinyl, but probably recorded from the soundboard of the studio Axl and Slash went to listen to the mixes back in June.

I think they've all been taken down.

Yes, something like that. I think the guy said that the track he heard didn't have vocals though, just was told by Axl that it was about cigars. But I think it's likely that all the songs in that screenshot with the 2008 CD2 track list have vocals and at the time were at least at an advanced stage of completion (Cuban Skies, Nothing, Tonto, Monstrocity or whatever that was).

No, this rumour came from a troll that likes to make up lists with fake information. Same with what Fortus supposedly said about about Seven being Circus Maximus and D Tune.

I think it's possible that the orchestral "intro" piece was a mashup of Beltrami's work on both tracks. But let's see if he responds about that. I'm very curious.

Not exactly the same, because we had the credits already, and then there was the leak and we had the title of the second track. But if the credits weren't published yet and Monsters was an uncredited hidden track, the surprise factor would be much bigger.

True, but I guess they knew that once the first person received their 7-inch it would be ripped and shared. But until that point it would be a surprise. Imagine if you spinned your record without knowing anything, The (real) General started playing and you're like "Wtf is this, where's the phone clip" and then another track started playing that is the one from the phone clip. And then the tracks get shared and there's speculation what the other song is etc. They probably were thinking it like that and laughing at the potential reactions.

There's no doubt that they were originally - and at least until the time of Axl's chats - two different tracks. The question is if at some point after 2008 they were paired together in some way (not necessarily merged). It's likely that Axl wanted them back to back on an album, but since they're now not being released as part of an album, maybe he wanted to release them as a pair, and maybe the hidden track theory has some merit. * @Mindray11 do you remember if all you heard at that party was what turned out to be Monsters or it was both the (real) General and Monsters?

I thought that the Monsters as a hidden track theory was rather unlikely, but upon further review I think it's quite possible. Maybe, as someone said earlier (sorry for not tagging - I forgot the username) Axl wanted it to be a cool surprise gift for the fans, but the writing credits on SESAC and then the leak ruined it for him, lol.

Although I'm not one to easily jump to conclusions, I would think that this is not up for debate. But here we are, lol. It's beyond me how this can be questioned, but Me and My Elvis being the same song as Soul Monster was considered "fact" (despite the lack of further evidence).

I think it's much more than an educated guess. It's a "If it looks like a duck..." thing. But I edited the title so there's no misunderstanding that Beltrami said it outright.

He remembers working on Monsters. Isn't that enough confirmation?

Credit and many thanks to @D.. for emailing Marco Beltrami and getting this information. Although he doesn't remember the title Monsters had at the time, he clearly remembers working on it and that it was a separate song from The General. So since we know Leave Me Alone was one of the four unreleased songs Beltrami worked on and also that it was the early working title of Soul Monster, and considering that Monsters fits Axl's description of Soul Monster perfectly, it's pretty clear that they're the same song - which, of course, also means that the "Me and My Elvis" instrumental that was found in the locker leaks was not Soul Monster as many people thought. Edit: Here is what we know about the song "Soul Monster":

The school bell and the spelling bother me, too, but not to the point to ruin the song for me. I don't get why it's such a big deal. It's not like there hasn't been cheesy stuff on GN'R songs before. "Cool ranch dressing", for example - I haven't seen many people being so put off by that.

Yes, you're missing something. The instrumental you're referring to is not Soul Monster. * Maybe it would be a good idea if @D.. started a separate thread with the information from Marco Beltrami and his confirmation that Monsters is Soul Monster, because it will be lost in this thread and every couple of pages someone will ask the same questions about Me and My Elvis saying that Monsters doesn't sound like it etc.

Yeah, that was the sexual abuse part he talked publicly about (the context of the story he told has been confirmed from other sources, but not the sexual abuse itself, which would be hard to find evidence for anyway). But he also talked about being physically abused by his stepfather, which was from direct memory and not through regression therapy (there is also a separate sexual abuse claim, not made publicly by Axl but from someone who allegedly Axl had talked to about it, but the source is questionable).

Yeah, but during that time period they were using that specific studio. It's just that Zutaut didn't have everything on those discs.

Oh, I vaguely remembered I had heard this claim before. Supposedly Fortus said it during a chat he did on facebook a couple of months ago, but of course there's no evidence (link, screenshot etc.). It's very unlikely that Fortus would talk so specifically - and even if he was willing to talk about this stuff, he wouldn't remember these working titles. I guess the real source is the same as before

Yeah, some people have said that it's a possibility. Personally I don't think it's likely. Only addressing this (not the two vs. one song debate): This is not Fernando's job. It's the publisher's job, which for Axl is Universal. So if it's a mistake it's on them (I doubt it's a mistake though).

Two more things to be pointed out: 1. Since The General and Monsters share the same credits, and Monsters=Soul Monster, it's safe to say that Soul Monster came from the same Brain+writing partners sessions as The General and Seven. And The General and Soul Monster were not in Village discs in some early form, although according to Brain they were written in late 2000 and the later dates of the mixes in the locker leaks are from late 2001, iirc (so it's likely that Seven isn't there either, although there is this alleged Fortus comment). Which is further evidence that not everything that was worked on during that time period is in the locker leaks. 2. Pele has lost the bet

Yeah, so had I. And some of us had also questioned the forum "fact" that Me and My Elvis was Soul Monster. Thankfully, at least this case is closed now.

Axl talked about singing the bridge of Soul Monster and that's how the fanbase knew about a song with this title. When the Village discs leaked, many fans thought that Me and My Elvis was Soul Monster just because an earlier and longer title of Soul Monster had "Elvis Presley" in it. However, there was never evidence that they were the same song.

The main takeaway from what Marco Beltrami said is that it's now 100% confirmed that Monsters is Soul Monster. As far as the two Vs. one song debate, in addition to what Marco Beltrami confirmed, the two songs were clearly still separated at least at the time of Axl's chats in 2008, as Axl seemed to refer to them as two different songs. The confusion arises 1) from the fact that they have been registered as one song in credits databases and moreover the takedown notices for Monsters said that it was due to illegally uploading The General and 2) from the fact that parts of the orchestral intro can be heard on both songs. Regarding the orchestral piece that was used as intro at concerts, I think it's possible that it was its own thing and a mashup of Beltrami's work on both The General and Leave Me Alone/Soul Monster. And then maybe, at some point after 2008, the two songs were paired together, not necessarily to be made into one song in the form of Rocket Queen, but more like a "suite" of two songs that are linked thematically. I think @WhazUpis on to something about Axl's original idea being to have them back to back on an album. Bach said that Axl told him that The General would be on a post-CD album because it was connected lyrically to other songs that would be on that future album as well. So now, since these songs are not being released as part of an album, Axl probably decided to release them as a song that has a Pt. 1 and Pt. 2.

Awesome, thank you! Besides the four unreleased songs (The General, Leave Me Alone/Soul Monster, Seven and Thyme), Marco Beltrami is credited on CD for orchestral arrangement on Street Of Dreams, TWAT, Madagascar, This I Love and Prostitute (on four of them in addition to Paul Buckmaster). I assume he worked on the songs that made CD at a later time, since from his 2003 interview is evident that the four unreleased songs were his first work with Axl. So maybe the long song he remembers could be just TWAT or Prostitute?