Snowmass Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 The General has paid his dues and is a legendary member of Guns N' Roses. He has been through the good and bad times...he never quit like a little bitch."Legendary" LOL. Yeah- when people think GnR they think of the "legends" like Tommy Stinson et al. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wasted Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 Tommy 4 Prez. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snowmass Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 Tommy 4 Prez.Be better than Obammy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ARX77 Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 Has Tommy paid his dues in the band? He came on board 7 months after Duff left and has been GnR's bassist ever since. He is the only original replacement left (no oxymoron jokes, you know what i mean). Hell, he was even in a band called the Replacements. Are these facts meaningful to you as a modern-day Guns n Roses fan? I would argue that he has paid his dues in full, and thus deserves a certain level of recognition, even from those who would otherwise be critical of newGunz. What do you think?I get what you're saying in regards to Stinson stickin it out longer than the previous replacements. IMO time doesn't equal production. Fact is Stinson has played on 1 album that has very little bass sound at all. Compare that to Duff whose bass sound is prominent on all GnR albums especially AFD and there is no comparison. I know alot don't like to hear this but fact is GnR has been a decent paying gig to Tommy over the years so he's stayed with what help paid his bills. Nothing wrong with that. Unless Axl starts releasing new music and can actually hear Tommy his presence will never be trully meaningfulThe General has paid his dues and is a legendary member of Guns N' Roses. He has been through the good and bad times...he never quit like a little bitch.Reading this I'm thinking to myself. U aren't serious? Legendary? To who? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wasted Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 Tommy 4 Prez.Be better than ObammyI'm surprised Obamma has got caught up in a sex scandal yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Estranged Reality Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 In short, I think the answer is a resounding 'yes,' but I understand the people who feel otherwise and where they're coming from.Let me elaborate:Even though Tommy's been there since shortly after Duff left and stuck with Axl all these years, by the time he joined the band Axl was already the defacto leader. And over the years, the band was largely inactive (at least in the public eye) and has only released one record in the 15 years since Tommy joined. What this means is that all the while he was technically 'in' the band, people began listening more to - and even growing up on - the 'classic' GN'R music and image. No matter what anyone desires or argues for, Slash, Duff and Izzy in particular will forever be recognized as GN'R along with Axl - in the cultural perspective, particularly Slash.Tommy is an awesome guy, made great music with The Replacements and deserves respect. But at the same time, Axl kept such a muzzle on these guys that - this is really the key here, imo - they have no personalities to the average person. People go to see their shows when they tour and the guys are getting paid to put on great performances, they do a killer job, but after the lights go down, they disappear...some of them now have Twitter which is a step forward, but Axl never helped (or allowed?) them to be promoted as 'Guns N' Roses,' so guys like Tommy are hated for basically being team players - he's been there longer than Duff but ask someone on the street and they'll say it's just Axl and some stand-ins. The fact that there were never any true band interviews done, or even a fucking band photo, spells disaster. I open magazines and see short little interviews with guys like Josh Kliffwhateverhisname from RHCP, who replaced another member - these guys were instantly out there promoting themselves as new bandmembers, but you never open Rolling Stone and see an interview with Tommy, you know?So as for the disdain and scorn from old-band fans, Tommy doesn't deserve it, but for a plethora of reasons that's what he gets. Some guys here like Almost Famous have made an effort to shoot the shit with some of the bandmembers (if I'm not mistaken AF went to see some of Tommy's solo shows) and I think that's really cool and a step forward -- but ultimately these guys don't have any strong personality unless you're a die-hard fan on the Internet going out of your way to follow them, and even then you're gonna have a hard time finding them talking freely about the band (how many times has BBF been asked a question about the band's future and said 'That's up to Axl to decide,' etc.?). DJ is probably the most open but most of the time he redirects questions about GN'R toward his own business ventures - there's not much of a sense of a traditional 'band,' which maybe doesn't mean much when it comes time to write the music (I now see GN'R as a collective of talented musicians moreso than the traditional image of a 'band'), but it does pose a problem in the sense that for many people that will keep them from ever recognizing guys like Tommy as true bandmembers - even though he's an awesome player and has been in the group so long. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyler Drama Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 Bumblefoot's got personality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Estranged Reality Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 Bumblefoot's got personality.I know he does, but that's missing the point of my post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyler Drama Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 Bumblefoot's got personality.I know he does, but that's missing the point of my post.Sorry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Estranged Reality Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 Bumblefoot's got personality.I know he does, but that's missing the point of my post.Sorry It's okay; I forgive you.Don't let it happen again though, or you're banned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyler Drama Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 Bumblefoot's got personality.I know he does, but that's missing the point of my post.Sorry It's okay; I forgive you.Don't let it happen again though, or you're banned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Madridista Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 In short, I think the answer is a resounding 'yes,' but I understand the people who feel otherwise and where they're coming from.Let me elaborate:Even though Tommy's been there since shortly after Duff left and stuck with Axl all these years, by the time he joined the band Axl was already the defacto leader. And over the years, the band was largely inactive (at least in the public eye) and has only released one record in the 15 years since Tommy joined. What this means is that all the while he was technically 'in' the band, people began listening more to - and even growing up on - the 'classic' GN'R music and image. No matter what anyone desires or argues for, Slash, Duff and Izzy in particular will forever be recognized as GN'R along with Axl - in the cultural perspective, particularly Slash.Tommy is an awesome guy, made great music with The Replacements and deserves respect. But at the same time, Axl kept such a muzzle on these guys that - this is really the key here, imo - they have no personalities to the average person. People go to see their shows when they tour and the guys are getting paid to put on great performances, they do a killer job, but after the lights go down, they disappear...some of them now have Twitter which is a step forward, but Axl never helped (or allowed?) them to be promoted as 'Guns N' Roses,' so guys like Tommy are hated for basically being team players - he's been there longer than Duff but ask someone on the street and they'll say it's just Axl and some stand-ins. The fact that there were never any true band interviews done, or even a fucking band photo, spells disaster. I open magazines and see short little interviews with guys like Josh Kliffwhateverhisname from RHCP, who replaced another member - these guys were instantly out there promoting themselves as new bandmembers, but you never open Rolling Stone and see an interview with Tommy, you know?So as for the disdain and scorn from old-band fans, Tommy doesn't deserve it, but for a plethora of reasons that's what he gets. Some guys here like Almost Famous have made an effort to shoot the shit with some of the bandmembers (if I'm not mistaken AF went to see some of Tommy's solo shows) and I think that's really cool and a step forward -- but ultimately these guys don't have any strong personality unless you're a die-hard fan on the Internet going out of your way to follow them, and even then you're gonna have a hard time finding them talking freely about the band (how many times has BBF been asked a question about the band's future and said 'That's up to Axl to decide,' etc.?). DJ is probably the most open but most of the time he redirects questions about GN'R toward his own business ventures - there's not much of a sense of a traditional 'band,' which maybe doesn't mean much when it comes time to write the music (I now see GN'R as a collective of talented musicians moreso than the traditional image of a 'band'), but it does pose a problem in the sense that for many people that will keep them from ever recognizing guys like Tommy as true bandmembers - even though he's an awesome player and has been in the group so long.WOW... you hit the nail on the head. One of the best posts I've ever read here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Young_Gun Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 (edited) The General has paid his dues and is a legendary member of Guns N' Roses. He has been through the good and bad times...he never quit like a little bitch.Maybe cause Tommy needs the money and lacks an overall sense of integrity? I'm not comparing him to Slash either but more so Duff. You hate on ex-band members 'quitting' but do not see the other side that maybe Axl's irratic behavior over the years pushed people(not forced) to quit. But Axl is a deity in your eyes.Is Robin a bitch for quitting? Buckethead? Freese? Brain? Tobias? Or do you only reserve that label for members of the classic line up? Edited June 21, 2012 by Young_Gun Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maynard Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 sorry if i sound too aggressive but imo tommy is pathetic. he's been so long in the band and still has no voice and is fine with it. he's there for the money and fun. good for him, but i really prefer artists who care about, well, art. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobbo Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 (edited) I like Tommy. Liked his work prior to being hired by Axl. And to his credit, I also like the fact that he actually seemed like a logical replacement for Duff. Don't get me wrong, I'd rather have Duff back, but at least Tommy and Duff are very similar in terms of their influences and playing compared to all the other nubees.That being said, he hasn't really done anything that has had an impact or significance with Axl and co. The quantity of time he's spent with Axl compared to Duff is irrelevant, as it's all about the end result of the music. One album that flew over most peoples' heads isn't an example of a accomplishment worthy of recognition. Duff accomplished much, more more in his shorter time in gnr than Tommy ever did. Same goes for all the old guys compared to the nu. Sonofabitch really said it best in his post when it comes to that... Edited June 21, 2012 by Bobbo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saber_ Posted June 21, 2012 Author Share Posted June 21, 2012 he's been so long in the band and still has no voice and is fine with it.I personally liked his voice on the backing vocals for WTTJ in recent tours. Gave it a nice new edge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyler Drama Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 he's been so long in the band and still has no voice and is fine with it.I personally liked his voice on the backing vocals for WTTJ in recent tours. Gave it a nice new edge.That's not what he meant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saber_ Posted June 21, 2012 Author Share Posted June 21, 2012 (edited) he's been so long in the band and still has no voice and is fine with it.I personally liked his voice on the backing vocals for WTTJ in recent tours. Gave it a nice new edge.That's not what he meant.I know. I'm fuckin with him. Is my humor really that not funny? *rhetorical question* Edited June 21, 2012 by Popcorn's Snare Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AXL_N_DIZZY Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 Tommy's "paid" his dues in my eyes- but I'm an internet fanboy who loves the current line-up and follows the band religiously. The fact of the matter is though IMHO that none of these guys will be seen as having "paid their dues" by the general public until nu-GN'R produces at least one hit single of at least a "Don't Cry" or even "Yesterdays" quality/impact. To be fair- a properly promoted "Better" single and video back in 06/07 may have gotten them there- but it didn't happen. Hopefully LOTRP/CD II or whatever has a toe-tapper or two in there to help these guys FINALLY establish their own identity with the broader public beyond just "Axl's backing band" or whatever... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Shneck Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 I don't have anything personally against any of the new members except DJ. He has done that to himself though, being a cheesy used car salesman in every interview. Also by showing fans disrespect by messing up in songs so much. If I pay $100 for a ticket you better play your parts right.I think the points that Estranged brought up were very valid. This band has mostly been muzzled and not been allowed to grow by Axl. He really has been the bands worst enemy. In the end I think of it like this. Darryl Jones from the stones and the bass player from Bon Jovi have been with both bands for 20+ years. They tour and play on albums. They are not considered relevant in the scheme of things. I think this is where all the new band members are at. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ben Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 (edited) I don't have anything personally against any of the new members except DJ. He has done that to himself though, being a cheesy used car salesman in every interview. Also by showing fans disrespect by messing up in songs so much. If I pay $100 for a ticket you better play your parts right.I think the points that Estranged brought up were very valid. This band has mostly been muzzled and not been allowed to grow by Axl. He really has been the bands worst enemy. In the end I think of it like this. Darryl Jones from the stones and the bass player from Bon Jovi have been with both bands for 20+ years. They tour and play on albums. They are not considered relevant in the scheme of things. I think this is where all the new band members are at.Yeah you pretty much got it right ulehThe comparison between the "session players" you bought up was a good call. I think at one point though someone like Buckethead or Robin could have 'stood out' based on what they contributed and of course their own profiles outside of GNR, but aside from that it's not going to be the same level as Axl-Slash-Duff, unless Axl did aggressive promotion including his band members. Edited June 21, 2012 by ben Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maynard Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 tommy stimson is the hugh macdonald of gnr. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Shneck Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 (edited) I don't have anything personally against any of the new members except DJ. He has done that to himself though, being a cheesy used car salesman in every interview. Also by showing fans disrespect by messing up in songs so much. If I pay $100 for a ticket you better play your parts right.I think the points that Estranged brought up were very valid. This band has mostly been muzzled and not been allowed to grow by Axl. He really has been the bands worst enemy. In the end I think of it like this. Darryl Jones from the stones and the bass player from Bon Jovi have been with both bands for 20+ years. They tour and play on albums. They are not considered relevant in the scheme of things. I think this is where all the new band members are at.Yeah you pretty much got it right ulehThe comparison between the "session players" you bought up was a good call. I think at one point though someone like Buckethead or Robin could have 'stood out' based on what they contributed and of course their own profiles outside of GNR, but aside from that it's not going to be the same level as Axl-Slash-Duff, unless Axl did aggressive promotion including his band members.I really think given the proper publicity, Robin really could have shined as the lead guitarist in GNR. A shame this band has lost so many good people..... Edited June 21, 2012 by Peter Shneck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Black Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 The General has paid his dues and is a legendary member of Guns N' Roses. He has been through the good and bad times...he never quit like a little bitch.Where else was he going to get a steady job playing music? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Shneck Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 The General has paid his dues and is a legendary member of Guns N' Roses. This is a joke, right? Surely????Tommy is a legendary member? Man there is some messed up sh*t on this forum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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