Dave Abbruzzese says he bowed out of NuGnR "for the sake of Axl's ability to continue to be a creative force"

[evilfacelessturtle]

20 hours ago, Rovim said:

you don't get it. Izzy's influence in rooted in the chuck berry rock n' roll/bluesy thing and it's all there, the songs are there, the way Izzy paints a picture with his music it's all there, his slice of Gn'R is there as well. it's kinda like saying all the old blues records sounds the same, every chuck berry riff sounds the same, etc.

it could take a while to get it cause it's not as polished as Gn'R or has any of the other band members, but the foundation is there and I think the music is great. Izzy already did his job in the studio, creating a wonderful catalog of 11 albums of quality shit imo, but it's old school stuff, it's not as hard rock or as modern as Slash, it's way more rootsy rock n' roll and that's not for everyone. Slash is more mainstream with riffs that grabs you and very unique leads and his big sound. Izzy is not that.

edit: and it's not like there aren't cool Izzy riffs in his solo recrords that also grab you, but it's more of a Stonesy kind of a thing, more about the song and the vibe only Izzy can create. If you're not into that, and you just want the more Gn'R thing when Izzy was a part of a band in his younger days, you won't find that here where he's just doing his own thing, and has the freedom to just express himself in a more exact way.

No, I get that just fine. I explicitly said "I'm not asking for rock riffs, just anything musically interesting and unique."

Bluesy old school RNR can be unique and interesting, just look at the Stones. Izzy's had a good voice and his tone and style all fits the vibe just fine. The only thing missing is the songwriting. He doesn't have anything even as good as the deeper Stones cuts, never mind a Gimme Shelter.

But yeah, it's true that a lot of old school blues rock stuff is unoriginal and repetitive or derivative. Which is another discussion entirely, but a strange point to make when defending Izzy's songwriting ability.

[evilfacelessturtle]

20 hours ago, Rovim said:

and in many cases I'd say that's true, but it doesn't need anything else. it has its own function when I listen to his solo records, but I agree, so many ideas would probably turn into huge tunes with Axl, Slash, and Duff input or with the Gn'R polish there was a lot of potential there.

it's kinda what they did with half of Appetite. relied on Izzy's brilliance to lay the foundation for their sound.

Izzy didn't get any credit on WTTJ. Is that missing the foundation of what makes GNR GNR?

19 hours ago, Rovim said:

I get what you're saying, it depends on what elements in Gn'R's music you find more relatable and in what quantity. I think for some people some elements of the music are essential for their enjoyment and what is similar with Axl and Slash is that their music is more polished and bigger sounding compared to Izzy's. Duff's music is also more polished.

not for everyone, but I like that at least one of them went with the more rough approach cause personally I like the musical outcome, without the rough approach it would be less Izzy and more in line with how Gn'R used to do things and I think a lot of people want that.

Maybe this can help you understand that my point has nothing to do with how built up or stripped down an arrangement is. Take a song that was an album outtake, a stripped down recording with just acoustic guitars and a singer.

The riff here is a unique finger picked arpeggio including a compound chord, and in the chorus he uses a couple augmented chords and open notes as well.

Whereas Izzy pretty much just strums chords in common patterns like the I-IV-V in Shuffle It All. 

Again, if you like that, more power to you. But it's not remarkable or original songwriting.

Edited April 11 by evilfacelessturtle

[Tom2112]

3 hours ago, evilfacelessturtle said:

I mean we can get into music theory if you want to. Slash's ideas are absolutely more original. Never mind riffs like Anastasia which are unlike anything anyone else has ever written, there is also a very diverse array of styles he's capable of, from sweet acoustic ballads (Something About Your Love) to funk-rock (Been There lately) to grand epics (Wicked Stone) to heavy metal (Beneath the Savage Sun) to creepy, grinding doom grunge (Lower) and much more.

Again, I'm not trying to make this about popularity. But with all the people singing Izzy's praises any time the reunion is brought up, it's awfully strange that those same people are apparently not listening to Izzy's solo music.

Anastasia.... I mean have you heard of deep purple, neo classical and then of course all the classical music all those were influenced by?? It's a different type of song for Slash though.

There's some variety for sure! And I get where you're coming from with the Izzy stuff! There is this idea that he was the the only writer in the room, he was a big part but those songs he wrote were heavily modded, so Izzy should be given loads of credit but Slash can write a song as can Axl and the others so this idea that people have that they can't write without izzy is a little bit of a stretch. He brings a certain simplicity / authenticity that might get lost by the others sometimes though.

[evilfacelessturtle]

20 hours ago, Tom2112 said:

Anastasia.... I mean have you heard of deep purple, neo classical and then of course all the classical music all those were influenced by?? It's a different type of song for Slash though.

There's some variety for sure! And I get where you're coming from with the Izzy stuff! There is this idea that he was the the only writer in the room, he was a big part but those songs he wrote were heavily modded, so Izzy should be given loads of credit but Slash can write a song as can Axl and the others so this idea that people have that they can't write without izzy is a little bit of a stretch. He brings a certain simplicity / authenticity that might get lost by the others sometimes though.

I'm a huge fan of Deep Purple. I haven't heard any other song that sounds like Anastasia. Yes, it takes elements of classical music, but it's not copying any classical song that I know of. Slash himself discredited that rumor about it being based on a Bach tune, and I could never hear any similarity.

That's a fair point, what Izzy brings is maybe a counterweight to Axl's desire to go bigger and more complex, to where the song can't breathe.

It's funny, I actually think Slash learned a bit from him in terms of writing rhythm parts. Because if you listen to the albums where he also played the rhythm guitar as well, you can hear him doing things Izzy would have done. Hard and Fast has some Izzy style shit behind the solo:

Not as Izzy-ish, but No More Heroes needs more attention for the great rhythm work behind the solo: