Will You Burn Copies Of 'Chinese Democracy' For Friends?

[tat2d1]

umm...well...currently in Canada its not illegal to dl music or movies. as long as you buy blanks and i NEVER said i wouldnt NOT buy the album...ill just have no problem dl'ing the first leaked copy either. it just sucks they compress all the music on cd's..and makes the quality just terrible

would you buy a tv that says its a 32" tv but they compress it, 'but all the picture is still there?'

Isn't there some sort of blank media tax that goes to record companies up in Canada? That's probably why it's legal, because the labels are still making money off of the media tax. Maybe instead of trying to fight it here in the states (and losing BIG TIME), they should pass a media tax that the labels profit from.

[KBear]

Wow, this thread. I'll throw out my thoughts on points that have been raised, in random order.

First of all, the idea that fans need to promote the album because Axl won't is pretty flawed. There may not be a lot of promoting going on right now but you can bet that will ramp up real fast when the time comes. We are already seeing the start of that with the Harley ad and the band's website (mediocre as it is).

To me it's pretty obvious that burning a CD is stealing. It's hard to fathom people arguing otherwise. You guys are just rationalizing.

It never fails to amaze me how people can complain about the price of a CD. Is this expensive for Christ's sake: I mean, how poor are you?

New CDs come out at $9.99. Search for Meatloaf's new album on Amazon - you'll find it at $9.72. I don't know where you guys are getting $15 from. I mean sure, some albums cost that much. Some cost even more. But you can get lots of stuff for under $15, in fact I'd wager the vast majority of albums are under that price. Someone mentioned large retailers drive up the price of albums. I don't know what large retailers are in your neighborhood but in mine the cheapest stuff is at large retailers (except for HMV who are usually a rip off). Then you have to consider inflation. This doesn't seem to affect album prices too much, another plus for the record buying consumer.

$10 for Chinese Democracy - people actually want to argue this is a rip off.

Now compare this to videogames, which are like $50 or $60. You honestly want to argue albums are too expensive? And an album will bring years of enjoyment. Once you beat a videogame most of the time it will quicky become obsolete. Another comparison: going to one hour and a half movie costs about the same as buying an album. Which is the better value?

But frankly I just don't buy the argument that the record companies make a big fat profit on each CD. The CD media themselves are dirt cheap, but guess what? The companies need to manufacture the CDs, maintain or pay for the use of the pressing plants and hire employees to do that job; there are distribution costs; costs for album artwork and mixing/mastering services; some money flows through to the artist; marketing costs for the album, fixed overhead costs, etc. I actually wonder how they keep the price so low. And yes, some money has to go towards profit. This is capitalism after all, or would you prefer to live in a shitty Communist state? I know I wouldn't.

Now I don't want to defend record companies too much since they've done enough shitty things. But stealing an album doesn't help anyone but yourself. It certainly doesn't help the band so please don't try to make it sound all righteous. And having an album is not a right. Same as it's not your right to own a book that you want so you have your friend buy it and go to the school library and photocopy it for you.

And as for the idea that filesharing will help bring on better music. Well, music downloading has been around for years now and mainstream rock has never been in worse shape. I seem to remember it doing just fine in the 60's, 70's, 80's, and even part of the 90's. So this argument simply doesn't fly. I will agree that the ease of hearing new music is increased so it can help a person discover new bands. But maybe this supposed threat to the record companies makes them less interested in taking risks...so they do the safe thing and promote the same shitty boy bands and bubble gum pop/rock bands. Back in the day you knew people would buy albums from popular bands, so you had to take risks on talent. Score a big band and you'd ensure you got a big chunk of the pie. A band was an investment that could pay off big time. Just a theory but I think it makes sense.

Edited October 21, 2006 by KBear

[FunkyMonk]

$10 for Chinese Democracy - people actually want to argue this is a rip off.

Now compare this to videogames, which are like $50 or $60. You honestly want to argue albums are too expensive? And an album will bring years of enjoyment. Once you beat a videogame most of the time it will quicky become obsolete. Another comparison: going to one hour and a half movie costs about the same as buying an album. Which is the better value?

which is why i burn all my ps2 games from the video store

i will only burn cd to share the music with my friends

[Lukinx]

K-Bear, if you read the discussion properly you see that it has gone beyond "Chinese Democracy" since we´re talking in general terms about filesharing and copying music to friends/other people. So if one CD is 9$ that means two CD:s is 18$ and so on. Then we have concerts and merch to add to that, which isn´t cheap either. How can you support every band you like if supporting only comes down to always paying money? There is just no possible way no matter how deep your pockets are. Isn´t it better that you pay what you can when you can and that you´re still able to listen to the music you like (free or not). Since everyone doesnt like the same artists no artist will be left in a dark corner with no one paying for his/her/their music. The major labels and other corporate organisations like to paint up a black and white truth but there are ways to look at this than either if its wrong or right (black and white). Do you understand what I mean? Isnt it better than music is played, appreciated and heard? I can´t belive any artist would rather get paid than not get heard at all.

Edited October 21, 2006 by Lukinx

[Blunoze]

So for all those that think downloading is illegal or morally wrong, I trust you havent downloaded any of the illegal GNR demo's loitering around the internet and wouldnt dare download them? Of course you havent.

I like GNR, but to say I am not gonna burn a copy for my family or friends because it is ripping the band/record label off is taking it much too far. You guys need to seriously get out more.

Do you not think record companies and Rock Stars make enough already? You honestly believe it is a crime to rip them off by burning? WAKE UP, it is you getting ripped off you fuckin mugs.

[lawrence]

i think we all know how much a blank cd costs' its pennys

so the record companys must be raking it in$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

[dobadog]

In my circle of friends i am the only one who likes Guns N'Roses. So no i will not be burning them copies. When i say "only one who likes Guns N'Roses" it's not like they dislike Guns N'Roses, they just don't like them enough to buy their albums. They do kinda of like Paradise City and Sweet Child O'Mine, and thats where they draw the line

[triplea]

I'm gonna buy it, then rip it onto the computer, burn a copy to have in mye car and at work. Then maybe send a few songs to friends on MSN messenger to make them like it and buy the album.

[dobadog]

I'm gonna buy it, then rip it onto the computer, burn a copy to have in mye car and at work. Then maybe send a few songs to friends on MSN messenger to make them like it and buy the album.

I'll burn a copy for the car too. I used to have a habit of detroying my original cd's in the car. Now i simply back my cd's up and play the back up's. I'll rip a copy to the computer

Edited October 21, 2006 by dobadog

[lawrence]

I'm gonna buy it, then rip it onto the computer, burn a copy to have in mye car and at work. Then maybe send a few songs to friends on MSN messenger to make them like it and buy the album.

why would they go & buy it if you gave them a free version

[Lukinx]

I'm gonna buy it, then rip it onto the computer, burn a copy to have in mye car and at work. Then maybe send a few songs to friends on MSN messenger to make them like it and buy the album.

why would they go & buy it if you gave them a free version

Maybe because if they like would want to have the insert and official disc? I know I would.

[KBear]

K-Bear, if you read the discussion properly you see that it has gone beyond "Chinese Democracy" since we´re talking in general terms about filesharing and copying music to friends/other people. So if one CD is 9$ that means two CD:s is 18$ and so on. Then we have concerts and merch to add to that, which isn´t cheap either. How can you support every band you like if supporting only comes down to always paying money? There is just no possible way no matter how deep your pockets are. Isn´t it better that you pay what you can when you can and that you´re still able to listen to the music you like (free or not). Since everyone doesnt like the same artists no artist will be left in a dark corner with no one paying for his/her/their music. The major labels and other corporate organisations like to paint up a black and white truth but there are ways to look at this than either if its wrong or right (black and white). Do you understand what I mean? Isnt it better than music is played, appreciated and heard? I can´t belive any artist would rather get paid than not get heard at all.

I read the entire thread. That is why my post wasn't just limited to Chi Dem. So I'm not sure what you mean.

Look, you buy what you can afford. That goes for everything, not just music. If you really love music then you will allocate more of your disposable income to that. If you aren't a huge music fan (a casual one, like most people) then you will only buy a few albums each year. So it really won't add up as much as you say, although those people will spend money on other stuff. If you have no disposable income to buy music then you've got bigger problems.

FYI, I'm holding off on buying a whole bunch of CDs I want because now I have more important things to buy. When I save up a bit I will get them. People choose not to go to a concert they would love to attend when they don't have enough money to do it. These sorts of decisions happen everyday. It's called life.

We all have personal limits to what we can spend. It's not an excuse to steal. Music is a luxury, not a need. Food is a need and as such a lot of people would argue that it's a right for everyone to be able to eat. But that doesn't mean stealing food from your local grocery store is acceptable. I don't think it's hard to understand. Once you allow stealing some things then you are on a very slippery slope.

Besides, people can hear music without actually owning a CD. That argument is flawed. Music is played on the radio, it's up on YouTube, it's played on music TV, etc. You can record stuff like that.

I think we just have to agree to disagree. It really isn't a huge deal for me if people burn it. I just wanted to add my views to the thread. Sure those views are opposite of what yours are, but I am not the type of person who tells others what they have to do. We make our own decisions.

So for all those that think downloading is illegal or morally wrong, I trust you havent downloaded any of the illegal GNR demo's loitering around the internet and wouldnt dare download them? Of course you havent.

Completely different. First of all, those are not studio quality tracks. Those do not make up the entire album. It isn't taking sales away from the album. And the band almost surely leaked the tracks themselves. They wanted us to hear them. I mean, the tracks leaked and then all of a sudden GN'R plays them live. How convenient.

I will always download bootlegs and demos but by the same token when GN'R puts out an official product I will always buy it.

[cufc1990]

Well I know what im getting all my freinds for xmas this year ORIGINAL cpies of CD :xmasssanta:

[Dory]

If I ever meet someone who copies CD for their friends I will be tempted to punch them in the face.

Buy them copies for all means, let them listen to it on your mp3, but don't burn it

[Lukinx]

If I ever meet someone who copies CD for their friends I will be tempted to punch them in the face.

Buy them copies for all means, let them listen to it on your mp3, but don't burn it

But really, what´s it to you if a friend who isn´t gonna buy the record anyway gets a burned copy of it? No one loses anything (since he wasnt gonna buy it anyway) and your friend may always change his mind about buying a copy for himself if he starts to like the music more by actually having a greater chance at listening to it. If EVERYONE in the world burn copies, sure then we could here Axl scream out "Houston, we have a problem" but since that scenario is totally absurd we don´t need to worry about it.

Edited October 22, 2006 by Lukinx

[d4mo]

Not a chance. They need to buy like everyone else should

[Spuffy78]

Let's face it there will be dickheads who will download it. However, this CD has been in the works and so many people have been waiting for it. It'll sell out in a half a hour I can gurantee it. Even the Axl, hater's will buy it.

[thewisegod]

I download most my music. Gotta admit it. I'll also consider downloading this album. It is obvious why: get it for no money, or get it for real money?

I got much better things to spend my money on. I'm buying loadsa music gear at the moment, helping me make my own music. I also gotta save up a shitload for christmas.

If I download it, will I feel guilty? nope.

I saw the great guys live, they already got some of my cash.

Oooh! Another point: Slash admits that he stole Led Zeppelin tapes as a kid. (yes, i know hes not been in the band for a decade, but thats besides the point )

Let the death threats start now

[Lukinx]

Let's face it there will be dickheads who will download it. However, this CD has been in the works and so many people have been waiting for it. It'll sell out in a half a hour I can gurantee it. Even the Axl, hater's will buy it.

Let´s face it. Enjoying filesharing does not make you a dickhead. Most of you "download bad, Axl good"-people enjoyed the leaks as much as the rest of us and for all we know that may put sales down for the upcoming release of Chinese Democracy, especially with the new rumours flying around that the "Better"-version we heard in the Harley Davidson-commercial was the real studio version which sounds almost exactly like the demo we had for a long time now. People may easily misstake a bad demo (not saying the leaks are bad but speaking in general terms) as proof for a bad upcoming album. Hence a demo-leak for a band like GN´R and with an album that has been in the making for so long and that is very important for the future career of GN´R can be more devestating than someone downloading a finnished and released product (especially if this person isnt gonna buy the album either way). So, if we are dickheads you better look in the mirror too, you might get a surprise when you see a ballsack where your chin used to be.

Edited October 22, 2006 by Lukinx

[grubby]

No burning CD for friends here. I want my copy and my friends can go buy a copy themselves. please don't burn CD.

[jacque|ine]

Hell no!!! I'm not their mother. They can either go and buy the album (which I highly doubt) or download it from the internet. I'll buy at least 2 copies and burn one to have it on my comp.

I've sent though "Better" and "TWAT" to some of my friends who like Gn'R to make them see that Gn'R still exists... Then I told one of my friend "I hope it's not necessary to tell you that you'll have to buy the album when it hits the stores. This IS the long awaited album". He then replied "What was internet made for?". But I won't burn CD's for anybody.

Btw, I had to convince a guy last week that he downloaded the leaks, not the official album. It was kinda funny but sad though.

[DaneisKing1389]

I will in fact buy the cd just because it's GN'R and I always support the bands that I like. But prices of cds need to drop. I think they should be between $4.99 and $7.99. The bands still make profit because the cds only cost like $1.25 to make. And at $13.99, more people download than buy. If all cd's went to reasonable prices, I'd go buy the ones I downloaded.

Edited October 22, 2006 by DaneisKing1389

[flabby phallus]

I won't burning this cd for anyone. All I care about is getting it for myself. Axl can worry about getting it to everyone else. I'm only responsible for buying my copy.

That.

[G n F n R]

Fuck no. My friends have known I'm a diehard Guns N' Roses fan since 2002. Let them buy it or download it themselves.

[FunkyMonk]

jeez why are all you guys such scrooges? surely you cant all care about the whole 'illegal' thing?

friends should share. that includes music....or at least it does with my friends and i. or do you all care about lining axls pockets more than you care about your friends? if your friends arnt going to buy CD...surely you should burn it for them so they can enjoy the music, Gnr should be about the music...not the money.

Edited October 23, 2006 by FunkyMonk