DurhamGirl

Huge respect for Alan talking openly about a very difficult subject that very often gets brushed under the carpet...

I have just watched an interesting interview with Alan Niven which has left me wondering how much influence did he have on  the success of Guns n Roses and why did Axl eventually sack him?  Anyone have any ideas?

On 11/02/2020 at 4:26 PM, jafeijo said:

This cover introduced me to the great artist that Todd Rundgren is. The original song is so great.

Wow fabulous music by Todd Rundgren, just bought some...

12 minutes ago, money honey said:

 

Think of how many photos there must be of Axl - millions. Statistically I'm sure there's some kind of correlation between the number of bad photos and the number of good ones. He has so many amazing ones - it's inevitable that there would be bad ones too. His good ones are sooooo good... we should just show people one of those every time we're sent a 'fat Axl' meme. 

*Takes opportunity to gratuitously post one of my favourites*

Oh my gosh I have gone all hot...

On 09/02/2020 at 11:24 PM, RONIN said:

Going by all the interviews, rumors, and behind the scenes chatter that found its way onto this forum over the past 17 years - here's my impression of nuGnR dynamics w/ Tommy:

*Axl recruits Tommy as a replacement for Duff - he has the same punk background but with more indie cred than Duff which was a perfect hire in Axl's mind. Axl in the 90's was a slave of trends and trying to align himself with every hip band's talent that he could poach. Tommy is thrilled to get a high paying steady gig as he was apparently working as a telemarketer to make ends meet. It's a perfect fit.

*Axl and Tommy grow very close during the early years of nu-guns (97-2003). Tommy ( a domineering force like Axl), assumes the #2 position and leads the band as Axl is usually MIA. Tommy also becomes tight with Axl lackey Del James during this time. He has no issues with Freese, Pittman, Dizzy, or Finck as none of them challenged his dominance in band politics. Dizzy and Pitman were sycophants, Freese was a paycheck gunner who had no intention of sticking around long-term, and Finck's loyalties were more with NIN than GnR. Paul Huge on the other hand may have had friction with Tommy - lack of talent + serious entitlement issues would have put him on a collision course with the 2nd biggest ego in the band. 

*Enter Buckethead, Axl's new muse. Bucket was serious about the job in a way that none of the others were - he was here to stay and assume the position Slash had held with Axl. He wasn't there to collect a paycheck or play band politics. Soon enough, Axl, who recognizes how much of a talent Bucket is, starts to shape the creative decisions of the band around him in a semi-collaborative way - a courtesy likely not extended to the others. Buckethead is getting more attention and face time with the boss than the others who have to jockey for attention. This annoys Del James and Tommy who resent Bucket's talent, commitment, and dedication. Naturally, they bully and alienate him from the band. Tommy also behaves like an ass with Bucket's friend, Brain - the band's new drummer.

Bucket's immense talent and taking over lead guitar duties creates a rift with Finck. Finck was used to being the solo lead guitarist of the band. Hence you get the clusterfuck of the '02 nu guns shows where Bucket, a virtuoso, is playing second fiddle to a b-list talent like Finck.  Del James, Finck, and Tommy essentially drive Buckethead out of the band. The final straw comes with Axl missing the album release date and the disastrous 2002 tour - Bucket has had enough. Axl throws Buckethead under the bus in a press release in 2003 which effectively ends any chance of Bucket's return to GnR. To this day Buckethead does not speak of GnR/Axl publicly and dislikes being asked about his time in the band.

*After a 3 year lull where they've been working as a 2-guitar band, enter Ron Thal. Even though he doesn't enjoy the vaunted position Buckethead had with Axl, he's still perceived as a threat by Tommy, Finck, and Fortus and is given a hostile welcome. Thal's talent, like Bucket, far exceeded what they brought to the table and hence he was the odd man out. 

By 2009-2014, there's a general cooling off in Tommy's relationship with Axl. They weren't as tight as they used to be in the early days. The realization that the nu band was in a death spiral and that they had missed their moment is the vibe I get from his post-CD interviews. GnR was a paycheck gig for him from the start but he was no longer invested in the band. Needless to say, the redhead himself had stopped giving a shit by that point.

Excerpt from a Thal interview:

Does that play a part anymore, after seven years? Like Tommy would go, “pfff, you're a kid!”.

- I've always just felt like me in the band. But now I think that the other guys in the band feel like I'm actually part of the band and not the outsider-new-guy. Whether they would admit it or not, or agree or not, you know, I wasn't made. I was Morrie in “Goodfellas”. They were all made. I could have been as nice as possible and gone along with the business - but I was never gonna be made. I think now, at this point, I'm more accepted. I don't think I'll ever fully be accepted, honestly.

Really?

- I don't think so. The way I came into the thing, the way I was brought into it, and the things that transpired in the beginning - and even previous relationships that I inherited - everything about it... If I'm gonna be completely honest - and maybe it's not them, maybe it's me, maybe it's how I feel about it, and maybe it's just me passing that onto them and saying this is how they feel - but in my opinion, my thought is that, I don't know if I'll ever fully be part of it. I don't think I'm a guy they're gonna call and say, “hey, you wanna hang out?”, or “hey, I'm working on my solo stuff - you wanna lay a track?”, or “hey, I'm going out to dinner - you wanna join?”, or “hey, I'm coming to town, let's get together!”. I don't think I'm ever gonna be the first guy in the band that they call. And you know what? Maybe it's because I've been such a pain in the ass in the band! Maybe if it was the other way around, I wouldn't call me either. Because I haven't been the easiest.

In what way?

- Well, when I first joined the band, they did not want me in the band. And it's not me - they just didn't want a third guitar player. ‘Cause at the time they had worked it out for two guitar players. Then suddenly the old manager at the time hits them up one day, and the tour was, like, two weeks away. He said, “your new guitar player is coming down”. And they're like, “what the hell - who the fuck is this?”, and I showed up, and they wouldn't even look at me. For that first tour, you know, I was treated like shit. Like absolute shit. They wouldn't really talk to me. If I spoke, they'd roll their eyes and walk out of the room. I was made to feel as unwelcome as possible. Until, finally, I had to get a little violent. And then they started realizing that I'm not gonna leave. They're gonna get hurt.

In what way?

- Physically.

Really?

- Yeah. Then they realized that they couldn't bully me, and that I was gonna fight at a level they weren't prepared for. And then they started loosening up how nasty they were. It was about three years before they would really start warming up and start talking to me. Even about things back then. ‘Cause I didn't know why they were so cold to me, and I realized that they would have treated anybody that way. It was a set of circumstances, a lack of communication from the management that was there at the time, that set it up so it was almost like a stranger thrown into a crowded cage.

https://htgth.com/news/shownews.php?newsid=2302

Being 'new' to the GnR saga I was'nt aware of this...what a load of wankers, I wonder how the situation impacted on axl, but then it is what he wanted when he had Duff and Slash sigh over the band to him.  Little did he know.  So was GnR almost defunct by 2014?

8 hours ago, Murielweathers@gmail.com said:

He seems to be. I mean, this is what he wanted, right? He has always wanted the band back together, as much as it could be, and to continue Guns N Roses.  Whether he wants new music out remains to be seen.

Has Axl always wanted to the band back together?  I was'nt aware of this...

6 hours ago, guitarpatch said:

I love how we talk about this vault like it’s this mythological object that’s under lock and key. We’re talking about a few hard drives and DAT tapes here that’s probably backed up on some server. 

Anyways, I’m sure there is a ton of stuff we haven’t heard that’s in various forms of completion. I find the posthumous talk is a bit too much. I don’t feel things are that dire. Nor should it be the focal point of discussion. 

They probably have stuff that can be ready for release in short order. Whether that’s a single, ep length, or album is another thing. It seems like they don’t want to release it for the sake of releasing something. It feels that there needs to be a purpose behind it and for it be worth their time/energy to let go (the same can be said for UMG). It takes two to tangle there. 

The focus for this band is obviously currently cashing in on touring revenue. It won’t last forever. We’ll see once things dwindle, how these guys look at the long term function of the band. If they release anything, it will be most likely that it’s time for them to do so strategically to set something up. Whether that’s a tour, to fulfill record contracts, try and get synch deals or other endeavors. 

Hearing new material is not lost. The thought of GNR and new material being some cultural revolution in music has most likely passed. The more those expectations dwindle, the more the reality of the situation reveals itself. 

Agree...

Poor Axl, everybody has a bad photo of themselves somewhere and would hate for it to become public!

I am just going through some old GnR clips and came across one where Axl is singing a song 'Dust In The Wind', he is playing the piano and Slash is sat next to him playing guitar.  Does anybody know the history of this song and when they played it? 

3 hours ago, Liva said:

I was pretty clear in the fact that I was speculating in all this, so yes I pulled these numbers and scenarios "outta my arse" just like others put all the blame on Axl or pull their own theories outta their arse's...fact is no one knows for a fact a damn thing, its all just their own speculation, so what makes your theory or someone else's any more credible or reasonable?  The only fact that we can all agree on is there has been no new music released under the GNR name since CD in 2008.  The old 1986 cuts released in their box set were not CD era songs and probably have different ownership/rules governing how they were released.  Axl released a loony tunes song, not under the GNR name, so its clear he is ok in releasing things and not the hermit/hoarder you make him out to be.

If it is a legal issue, you keep your mouth shut, dont do interviews and get it sorted with the lawyers.  The last thing you want is someone slipping up in an interview and those words being twisted around by the record label and used against GNR.  There is a reason you have a "right to remain silent, anything you say can and will be used against you."  You let the lawyer do your arguing, you dont say dumb shit to reporters and be at the mercy of the reporter changing around what you said (happens all the time) and that snippet coming back to screw your argument against the label.

Fortus has no ambition...do you know that?  He told you that personally?  He was in the Dead Daisies and left them when it came time to pick a band.  Could have been for the payday, sure...but maybe he see's the future brighter with GNR if they can release whatever they may or may have music wise.

Again...we are all just speculating and making stuff up...can we agree on that?

I found this post helpful in my understanding of the present situation, thankyou.

Maybe they think that 'mystique' helps fuel fan curiosity helping to keep the show on the road... 

Gosh he was so beautiful and so cool, I wish I had been around at the time to see them live.  

Happy Birthday mate:)

I am a new fan of GNR after watching footage from the 87-93 era but that was nearly thirty years ago so bound to be many changes, especially for Axl with his mental health issues.  I just wonder what the young Axl would have thought of the present situation.  Although I have to say his tenatiousness in keeping GNR going all this time through all the insults and negativity is supremely impressive..  If it had not been for Axl then GNR would not be around today  so as a consequence I have great respect and admiration for him and love his baddass attitude which  allows him to do what he believes in no matter what. 

It is so easy to misunderstand people especially when most of what we know is from the media which has its own agendas'.

I am from England too:)

The picture above of Axl and Slash is just lovely to see, it does seem they have managed to work through their problems and found that special chemistry again.   I am so pleased for them.

I am a new fan based on a friends 87-93 recordings, the current situation is just so sad.  Surely Duff and Slash and everyone else involved can hear the deterioration in Axl's voice, why on earth does nobody say anything...it makes me wonder at Axl's mental health.