Why Did Axl Fight So Hard For The GNR Name...

[Lines&Noses]

Why Did Axl Fight So Hard For The GNR Name?

To prevent shit or average material like Slash's last album to be credited under the name Guns N' Roses.

True we only got 1 true album since UYI I&II but it's only Very High Quality albums. Very few other bands if not any got this level of quality on each of their albums. Axl is a perfectionist, that's why he kept the name. Period.

Good insight and very true! Axl seems to be a very perceptive person and seeing the band implode,it was a sound legal move to include that he retained the band name if such a breakup occured.The beginning of the end was when Izzy left imo.

Saul is stuck in 1991 with his style and appearance.Axl brought the name in so what is the issue about Him using GNR as his band? It always was

To answer the question so far as I see it Axl kept the name so he could have "control". He originally seemed to have some ideas about going in a more industrial direction but in the end Chi Dem was not so industrial sounding, especially compared to OMG. The best liad pland of mie and men and all that.

I've said previously that while I am happy Axl is still out there performing the classic guns material personally I am disappointed in the new direction the music has taken. If the nu-band had a sound similar to the old band, blues based rock with great guitar riffs then I think you could make a more credible case for him keeping the name.

He could easily realease the Chi Dem material under his own name and if anything sans the baggage people might be more receptive to the new music more willing to listen?

Also what is really stopping him from releasing CDII and or recording with the current line up? I'm not saying they should go and record an album tomorrow but they could be continuiously working on new material which over time you would hope would produce a good album? But although DJ has signalled he is willing there seems to be no coordinated effort to get the current line up to write and record together?

I mean its pretty much three years since the release of Chi Dem?

To add:

Although other bands like Motorhead, Iron Maiden, Megadeth etc have gone through line up changes they have still kept a sound that was close to what the previous incarnation of the band so an evolution rather than revolution in terms of the sound.

I thought Axl was trying something in this vein when he had the nu line up re-record appetite, so they could tune in to the Original Guns sound while inevitibly adding their own dynamic, but it never really worked out like that.

Chi Dem sounds like a lot of different bands Axl is known to like from NIN to Elton John but it doesn't to me ear sound like a GnR record?

[Damn_Smooth]

loser? how about YOU learn to speak coherently before going around labeling others!! what do you speak? it sounds like F'N MORON!!

you all can cover your eyes to the reality all you like! it WON'T change the fact that axl rose has wasted the past 15 F'N YEARS by being a jaded ass! ONE SHITTY ALBUM IN 15 YEARS!! WAKE UP PEOPLE!! please excuse me for not burying my head in the sand and pretending that ALL IS WELL!! more material that sounds like chinese democracy SHOULD be kept buried unless YOU truly desire to see the name SHIT ON even more!!

oh wow!!! another chinese democracy tour with a group of people who aren't slash, duff, and izzy!!! excuse me for not wacking off in excitement!!!

axl rose needs to read this truth since his HANGER-ONS don't have the balls to tell him!!

Are you literally screaming while you type? Because that's how I picture you.

I also see him screaming, but in a high womanlike falsetto. I hear it from my girlfriend all the time.

Yeah, I could never let myself get that upset over a band. I'm a GNR fan past and present and I think it's seriously odd when either side of the fence gets this whacky and worked up.

The whole point of this thread was that I just wish Axl would put out new music. I don't care whether Bucket, Robin, DJ, or Ron plays on the tracks, as longs as we get some cool music with Axl on vocals.

It's unreal how some people dote on the original lineup(s), but paint Axl as this antichrist who must be destroyed. I mean, aren't they fans of his even if he's not playing with Slash anymore and vice versa? Is that impossible for them to do? I just can't wrap my mind around it.

+1 here man, I rag on Slash once in awhile to piss off the SFB's but I really don't have anything but the Superbowl against him. I was never a V.R. fan, but that was because of Weiland. I would really like to get more music out of Axl though, and I don't care who's on the instruments when, or if, it gets here.

Exactly. We can get frustrated with Axl based on the lack of material and fan interaction, but at the end of the day we're still huge fans of his and would probably buy tickets and the next album at the drop of a dime. I certainly would. But resorting to insults, calling him washed up, fat, etc. because he won't reunite with the original lineup is borderline psychotic.

Yeah, the Superbowl was an ebarrassment as a GNR fan, totally agree and I cringed like everyone else. But I'm also talking the people constantly seize every opportunity to diss Slash like they have something to proove by degrading the man.

Neither Axl or Slash deserve that.

You have another excellent point there. Axl and Slash agreed to disagree a long time ago. Both of them have had success without the other, and I see no reason not to be happy for both of them. It is perfectly acceptable to be frustrated with the lack of communication from Axl, but I am happy with the music that he's released so far. If this U.S. tour works out, and they come anywhere near me, I will still be in line to get tickets. Even if there is nothing new that they play. I would do the same if Slash came anywhere near me on his solo tour too, but I've accepted the fact that he isn't coming back to Gn'R.

Edited August 10, 2011 by Damn_Smooth

[Lose Your Illusions]

...Only to release just 1 album in the almost 20 years since he retained the rights to the Guns N' Roses name?

Before I inevitibly get labeled a "hater" by some, I'd like to make it clear that when all is said and done I'm glad Axl continued the GNR legacy after Slash & Duff's departure, and I really dug the music on Chinese Democracy. So there's that.

Anyway, Axl maintains that he took control of the Guns N' Roses name to "salvage" and continue Guns N' Roses, not to end it...But the last time Axl did any real recording was from 1999 through maybe 2002, not counting the rerecording & tinkering that went on through early 2007.

We saw that the majority of Axl's vocals were laid down early on, many from the initial demos (See the TWAT, IRS, & Catcher 1999 demos, as they're the same vocals that are on the album.) That's a long time ago, more than ten years in some cases!

I recently said in another thread that I'd have no problem whatsoever with Axl calling his band Guns N' Roses, as long as they were releasing more new music & earning the name. But they're not doing that.

So here's a question: If Axl won't or can't (we don't know) release the other album that he already has recorded from the Chinese Democracy sessions, does anyone who's actually been around for a while honestly see Axl ever stepping into the studio again with the intention of writing/recording/releasing a new Guns N' Roses album with the current lineup? Keep in mind how difficult it was for him to complete and release CD back when he had a great deal of backing & financial support from the label. After what went down with CD's release, we have no idea where he currently stands with them.

I honestly wouldn't be surprised if whatever else has been recorded during the CD sessions becomes the last official recordings from Guns N' Roses, that is, if they can find a way to get that out, gulp, soon.

He fought for the name to continue GNR simple as that. Do I see another album? Yup. But not till its ready 100 percent.

[Lines&Noses]

THAT'S WHY HE'S NOT TOURING. THAT'S WHY HE'S NOT RELEASING NEW MUSIC. he knows that we now have 14 songs of proof that he WAS NOT the sole creative genius behind GNR's grandeur!!!

Plus, the same way he wasn't the genius behind GnR, so wasn't the rest, just look at their releases and you tell me if that comes close to GnR.

That is the point though I believe they are far better together than apart.

Fair play that Chi Dem is your favourite album, but you must be as frustrated as fans of the classic line up are. You want the same guys who wrote your favourite music to keep writing and performing that type of music. Bus as it is it doesn't look like Bucket, Finck and possibly even Brain are coming back?

At this point the best you can hope for is Chi Dem II with re-recorded or embelishments from the current line up. Given how special Chi Dem is to you (and others) its unlikely that the nu-band are going to be able to give you more of what you even if they wanted to.

[uzi your illusion]

A ton of really cool responses and as it was said earlier, Axl responded to this question in depth during the chats. He felt it was his duty, he came in with it, he was the last one remaining. If you think it would of been better for the overall legacy of the band to of ceased to exist in '93 then that's your cross to bear and not a good enough reason for him to end what he spent his life building, no matter how many share that opinion. Besides the fact that its clear to any fan of this band Axl likes to push his music as far as possible and that takes more then just talent. It takes studio time, producers, band members, record company support, and a ton of money. Now you may say that he made his money and could spend whatever he wanted to record his idea of what an album should be, but if you throw the name GNR on an album it pretty much had a blank check to do whatever he wanted. As an artist and as someone who is infamous for doing what he wants when he wants to do it, why in a million years would he turn down the chance to make his dream record and have it financed by the record company. Because some fans who already harbor a huge grudge against him for "breaking up the band" , don't think it's right that he's the only member? Why would he care what they thought, they would live to tear him apart anyway because in their minds he destroyed their favorite band. If he had called it the Axl Rose Project and released the same album would those people of gave it a honest chance either way? He was responsible for making the band name carry the kind of weight and prestige it did, it's his to do what he wants and even though I would doubt he wanted to release only 1 album thus far, it would be his choice to do so. You ask why he fought so hard to keep it, whereas I couldn't imagine why he would ever let it go.

Edited August 10, 2011 by uzi your illusion

[The Wicked Hand]

Keeping the name just doesnt bother me.

But saying you kept it to keep things rolling along and then sitting on it is whats strange to me. Its either record company problems or Axls mental problems or a combination of both.

In the end imo he wanted the name for business purposes. After all, tis a business at the end of the day. IF he did pull the wont go on stage thing that is extremely shady but i wasnt there, so........ Only those there no the truth.

I hope this us the start of some output and recordings from the band thru the end of the year and into 2012..... But not a big deal really.

[packersnroses]

we need a dexter rant in these new fags.

But this is why Axl never comes on here.

[saber_]

What's your idea then Mindsaber? Why did Axl fight so hard to keep the name and only release one album 14 years later?

Because Axl always wins, baby.

People want to get in a test of wills with Axl. They will lose.

No but seriously- go reread the chats. I think you're mixing up a few things here. Axl didn't "fight so hard to keep the name." He had the name before the UYI tour was done. Duff and Slash willingly signed it over. So on some level, I resent the implication which you and many others often make, which is that Axl had to fight tooth and nail to keep the name. He originated the name along with Izzy, and took official ownership of it after things got big.

What I think you're a bit confused about (no offense meant) is Axl's strong intent when it comes to protecting the name which he owns. Key word: owns. Sorry I couldn't help myself. But seriously- Axl has protected his interests and pursued litigation at times when laws and legalities were violated. That's how I see it anyway.

It's just a name. Just remember who signed it over to Axl. People always seem to forget that. Personally, I dig seein Axl sing and I like the music GnR has created through its various incarnations. And hey, I love listening to all former gnr members' stuff as well. I remember buying Izzy Stradlin and the Ju Ju hounds on release day- i was so fucking excited for that record. I dig some of VR's stuff, although just as with GnR, they tend to have overly polished songs. Just a mild criticism. I like my rock n roll a little raw. It can be deep, complex, and full of aural textures, but I still like it rough around the edges, y'know?

Anyhoo, the name belongs to Axl, because the others signed it over. Bottom line.

[packersnroses]

It's funny, during the 8 years Axl was with the old lineup, when it was a democracy, Guns N' Roses put out 5 studio albums from 87-93. But in the 14 years (from '97 on) that Axl's been completely in charge of GNR, he's only been able to put out 1, with little to no signs of another on the horizon.

From that perspective, it really looks like the "last man standing" gig hasn't gone too well for him.

Well, that's just like, your opinion, man.

Little to no signs of another on the horizon? We all know there's songs in the vault, GNR is going on tour again, and I highly doubt Axl hired DJ for no fucking reason.

Yeah, 14 years. Axl had to basically recreate the band, and from what I know Axl was wanting to release back in 2001.

[sergiodefenders]

1- To gain Money mainly

2- Get better contracts with the promoters

3- To keep his comfortable lyfestyle

4- With no "GNR name", there's no big arenas nor Stadiums and less, "Rock in Rio" ...

5- And because he really thinks that's his baby.

Love Chinese Democracy anyway, but I'll never forget that Axl became GNR in a Gay Parade in 2001/2!!...worst days of Axl career.

Edited August 11, 2011 by sergiodefenders

[Chewbacca]

His own name was part of the band...idk.

[packersnroses]

Why did Axl keep the name after the original GNR split???

I'm talking about Tracci Guns, Ole Biech, Ron Gardner.

[packersnroses]

Why wouldn't he? He was only with them for a few months and they accomplished absolutely nothing. Thanks to the "classic" lineup GNR became big. Nothing has been accomplished before or since.

Obviously I was just joking around as I assume some people/cupcakes on here didnt know there was a GNR before Slash.

Nothing has been accomplished since? :fuckyou:

[FuddMckagan]

An Axl vs Slash thread? Cool, I'll get the swords.

[Guest siliconmessiah]

An Axl vs Slash thread? Cool, I'll get the swords.

It always, always, always, always turns into this.

You could start a thread about anything, and you can be sure of it turning in to an Axl vs. Slash thread.

It´s apparently doomed to be that way. Forevah.

[Apollo]

loser? how about YOU learn to speak coherently before going around labeling others!! what do you speak? it sounds like F'N MORON!!

you all can cover your eyes to the reality all you like! it WON'T change the fact that axl rose has wasted the past 15 F'N YEARS by being a jaded ass! ONE SHITTY ALBUM IN 15 YEARS!! WAKE UP PEOPLE!! please excuse me for not burying my head in the sand and pretending that ALL IS WELL!! more material that sounds like chinese democracy SHOULD be kept buried unless YOU truly desire to see the name SHIT ON even more!!

oh wow!!! another chinese democracy tour with a group of people who aren't slash, duff, and izzy!!! excuse me for not wacking off in excitement!!!

axl rose needs to read this truth since his HANGER-ONS don't have the balls to tell him!!

Are you literally screaming while you type? Because that's how I picture you.

I also see him screaming, but in a high womanlike falsetto. I hear it from my girlfriend all the time.

Yeah, I could never let myself get that upset over a band. I'm a GNR fan past and present and I think it's seriously odd when either side of the fence gets this whacky and worked up.

The whole point of this thread was that I just wish Axl would put out new music. I don't care whether Bucket, Robin, DJ, or Ron plays on the tracks, as longs as we get some cool music with Axl on vocals.

It's unreal how some people dote on the original lineup(s), but paint Axl as this antichrist who must be destroyed. I mean, aren't they fans of his even if he's not playing with Slash anymore and vice versa? Is that impossible for them to do? I just can't wrap my mind around it.

Best post of the week. Thank you.

You just have to laugh at the people who get so worked up.

[moreblack]

if you made it big, that was the line-up. They played a couple shows and it didn't work out to well. Then Slash and Steven (it was Steven?) came in and there was magic.

pretty much you say Black Sabbath, it's the Ozzy lineup people think of. You say Deep Purple, it's MKII, Iron Maiden? Bruce era. There's other albums that came out under the same band's name, but most would tell you "meh".

[Guest Len B'stard]

Why did Axl keep the name after the original GNR split???

I'm talking about Tracci Guns, Ole Biech, Ron Gardner.

Cuz it was a good name? There's a slight difference between retaining the name Guns n Roses when it's nothing but a cool sounding name and retaining rights to the name after the PROPER GnR, i.e. the one everyones heard of, the famous one, the one that did the tours, sold the records and made the name reach the ears of you, me, everyone else, in conjunction was Axl, actually made something of the name.

Bands live and die on and stand on their achievements, the brand Guns n Roses is what was established by the incarnations of the band post Appetite. What you're suggesting in patently ridiculous, it's like saying The Beatles ain't John Lennon, Paul McCartney, Ringo Starr and George Harrison, it's actually John Lennon, Paul McCartney, Pete Best and Stu Sutcliffe, i'm sorry but it just ain't the truth of the matter.

Put simply, a band exists the minute they have recorded output. Otherwise it's like me sitting here going 'yeah man, i'm a writer...cool man, what have you written? Uh, nothing". It's a cheap and obvious play on words with a view to distorting reality but the fact is people ain't thick and no matter what you do or say, when people say Guns n Roses they ain't talking about Ole Gunnar Solsjaer, Ron the Gardener and Tracey Emin, they're talking about THE Guns n Roses, the one that millions of people came to see live, the one that recorded the actual albums thats Guns n Roses stand on and their reputation is built on...not 3 stooges that played with Axl for half an hour in the 80s and then couldn't be bothered anymore.

[moreblack]

they ain't talking about Ole Gunnar Solsjaer, Ron the Gardener and Tracey Emin,

nice.

[Guest Len B'stard]

aka Mr 93rd Minute...what a way to win, i'll never forget that for as long as i live.

[moreblack]

Roths first two solo efforts went multi-platinum & enjoyed critical and fan acclaim. Just sayin.

having an all star band helps. Vai, Sheehan, Bisonette FTW. But with them gone, so did the sales.

[packersnroses]

Why did Axl keep the name after the original GNR split???

I'm talking about Tracci Guns, Ole Biech, Ron Gardner.

Cuz it was a good name? There's a slight difference between retaining the name Guns n Roses when it's nothing but a cool sounding name and retaining rights to the name after the PROPER GnR, i.e. the one everyones heard of, the famous one, the one that did the tours, sold the records and made the name reach the ears of you, me, everyone else, in conjunction was Axl, actually made something of the name.

Bands live and die on and stand on their achievements, the brand Guns n Roses is what was established by the incarnations of the band post Appetite. What you're suggesting in patently ridiculous, it's like saying The Beatles ain't John Lennon, Paul McCartney, Ringo Starr and George Harrison, it's actually John Lennon, Paul McCartney, Pete Best and Stu Sutcliffe, i'm sorry but it just ain't the truth of the matter.

Put simply, a band exists the minute they have recorded output. Otherwise it's like me sitting here going 'yeah man, i'm a writer...cool man, what have you written? Uh, nothing". It's a cheap and obvious play on words with a view to distorting reality but the fact is

people ain't thick and no matter what you do or say, when people say Guns n Roses they ain't talking about Ole Gunnar Solsjaer, Ron the Gardener and Tracey Emin, they're talking about THE Guns n Roses, the one that millions of people came to see live, the one that recorded the actual albums thats Guns n Roses stand on and their reputation is built on...not 3 stooges that played with Axl for half an hour in the 80s and then couldn't be bothered anymore.

Lol I know why he kept the name, I was just joking and making fun of cupcakes.

[Guest Len B'stard]

Oh, right, OK, egg on my face, sorry about that sir!

[Ali]

if you made it big, that was the line-up. They played a couple shows and it didn't work out to well. Then Slash and Steven (it was Steven?) came in and there was magic.

pretty much you say Black Sabbath, it's the Ozzy lineup people think of. You say Deep Purple, it's MKII, Iron Maiden? Bruce era. There's other albums that came out under the same band's name, but most would tell you "meh".

Yeah, I don't know about that. There's a pretty fair contingent of people that prefer Dio to Ozzy in Sabbath. I wouldn't discount the fans of the DiAnno era of Maiden either.

Ali

[Nick85]

Another thought: If Axl found a way to get the next album out before Christmas on the heals of a U.S. tour, and promoted both with a catchy single, a lot of what's gone down post-Chinese Democracy would be forgiven among the bulk of the remaining fanbase.

It seems like a no-brainer, especially when you consider the album is more or less finished. Even so, as fans it's frustrating to think that an ideal situation like that probably just isn't in the cards, based on issues that we know nothing about.