The James Bond Thread: RIP Robbie Coltrane

[Crazyman]

1. Casino Royale
2. On Her Majesty's Secret Service
3. From Russia With Love
4. Goldfinger
5. Skyfall

My top 10 would include both Dalton movies, Goldeneye, The Spy Who Loved Me and...something else. I can't think right now

[Powerage5]

1 hour ago, Wagszilla said:

What's your guys' Top 5 Bonds? 

I'm reserving official judgment until I finish Craig's but I don't think mine will change. 

1. Skyfall
2. Casino Royale
3. On Her Majesty's Secret Service
4. From Russia With Love
5. The Living Daylights

 

I did have SPECTRE in my top 5 initially, but I think I've relegated it out of my top 5 with a year to think on it. Definitely still a top 10 for me though.

[DieselDaisy]

1. From Russia

2. Thunderball

3. Goldfinger

4. OHMSS

5. Casino Royale (just nudging past Goldeneye)

[James Bond]

1. OHMSS

2. From Russia With Love

3. Casino Royale

4. The Living Daylights

5. Skyfall

You could probably interchange Skyfall and Casino Royale but the other three have been set in stone for some time. Honourable mentions to SPECTRE, Octopussy, and Thunderball that just miss the top five. If I could squeeze the first four Connery films, both of Dalton's, and every Craig film save for QOS into a five film ranking I would.

[Powerage5]

1 hour ago, James Bond said:

1. OHMSS

2. From Russia With Love

3. Casino Royale

4. The Living Daylights

5. Skyfall

You could probably interchange Skyfall and Casino Royale but the other three have been set in stone for some time. Honourable mentions to SPECTRE, Octopussy, and Thunderball that just miss the top five. If I could squeeze the first four Connery films, both of Dalton's, and every Craig film save for QOS into a five film ranking I would.

Honestly, I'm not that big on Dr. No. It's better than YOLT or DAF, but it's far from one of my favorites. 

[DieselDaisy]

Script, music, directing, Bond girl alone, OHSS is hands down the greatest Bond. The problem is, and it is a big problem, the lead.

[James Bond]

1 minute ago, DieselDaisy said:

Script, music, directing, Bond girl alone, OHSS is hands down the greatest Bond. The problem is, and it is a big problem, the lead.

I never understood the Lazenby hate. Is he perfect? No, but I've seen worse performances from actual trained actors so to get what we got from Lazenby under the circumstances is an impressive feat in itself. He's flawless in the action scenes (his specialty), Diana's talent helps make up for George's shortcomings in their scenes together, and he handles the end scene extremely well. I'm sure he would have grown into the role nicely.

I'll take that over the later bored Connery and the ever whisper-grunting Brosnan any day (and yes I know Brosnan spoke like that to tone down his Irish accent).

1 hour ago, Powerage5 said:

Honestly, I'm not that big on Dr. No. It's better than YOLT or DAF, but it's far from one of my favorites. 

I don't necessarily disagree, but I feel like it always warrants a mention alongside the big three by virtue of it being the first one (and not totally horrible). It's pretty dated, but iconic in its own right.

[DieselDaisy]

Just now, James Bond said:

I never understood the Lazenby hate. Is he perfect? No, but I've seen worse performances from actual trained actors so to get what we got from Lazenby under the circumstances is an impressive feat in itself. He's flawless in the action scenes (his specialty),

I completely agree - NB I still have it at #4 on my list - but he is competing against Sean Connery as Bond!! When deciding these polls you have to take into consideration the Bond and Connery oozed charisma and basically turned that character into a cinematic icon. Lazenby does an alright job but it is just alright and the quality of the film suffers.

I do think Sean carried those last two (3 if you include NSN) weaker Bonds - even Dr No which is one of the certified 'classics' is a bit creaky in parts when you watch back today, and campy (the fire blowing crocodile thing!) but Connery elevates those films. 

Connery did not have that much experience before Bond - a cameo in The Longest Day!

[Powerage5]

53 minutes ago, James Bond said:

I never understood the Lazenby hate. Is he perfect? No, but I've seen worse performances from actual trained actors so to get what we got from Lazenby under the circumstances is an impressive feat in itself. He's flawless in the action scenes (his specialty), Diana's talent helps make up for George's shortcomings in their scenes together, and he handles the end scene extremely well. I'm sure he would have grown into the role nicely.

I'll take that over the later bored Connery and the ever whisper-grunting Brosnan any day (and yes I know Brosnan spoke like that to tone down his Irish accent).

I don't necessarily disagree, but I feel like it always warrants a mention alongside the big three by virtue of it being the first one (and not totally horrible). It's pretty dated, but iconic in its own right.

Here's the thing with Lazenby for me - he is not perfect, no. But I think he played the role suitably for that film. I don't think I could've believed that the Connery Bond truly fell in love. And man, Lazenby's delivery on the last lines of the film are absolutely heartbreaking. I still say none of the other Bonds could've done that particular scene better. 

 

As for Dr. No, it's not that it's a bad film, but it just doesn't have that Bond feel to me. It feels almost like a predecessor to the rest of the franchise, much in the way that a TV pilot episode rarely has the same feel as the rest of the series. Connery and Wiseman are excellent in it, and Ursula Andress is hot but I don't feel like the film has much else going for it. The plot is paper thin and difficult to follow, no gadgets, no Q (I know Desmond Llewelyn is in it but he's not really Q), no memorable henchmen, etc. It's just very bland all in all. 

[DieselDaisy]

The book Dr No was one of Fleming's campier novels, containing as it does - if I recall - a gigantic squid! That was the novel which instigated the big media backlash against his books I believe: "Sex, Snobbery and Sadism".  His grittier novels (FRWL and Moonraker) were his best.

I must re-read the Bonds when I get the chance.

Edited October 16, 2016 by DieselDaisy

[Georgy Zhukov]

Dr. No stands apart because it had a smaller budget and it wasn't formulated. It was just another spy thriller. What it did introduce was the theme, the girl and the man who made the role iconic. But From Russia With Love was miles ahead.

 

The Living Daylights would definitely be top five for me. The plot what a little more realistic. A top Russian general is trading arms for dope to turn a profit while his state is crumbling around him. Of course they didn't mention the fact the USSR was falling apart at the time. 

 

Spectre has turned into one of my favorites. Three of the Craig films are just top of the line. Only Quantum of Solace doesn't cut it. It was sort of like the bad Connery films when Connery it was only Connery that kept the film watchable. Also,  imaging sleeping with a girl by only saying "I can't seem to find the stationary. Want to help me look?" Bastard.

[Crazyman]

I'll have to re-watch it since I haven't seen it since shortly after it was released, but for me Spectre peaks at the PTS and steadily goes down hill from there.

Not Craig's worst movie (obviously), but not that much higher on my list than QoS if I'm being honest. 

Thunderball or FYEO might close out my top 10, btw. Maybe Dr. No even. 

[Powerage5]

I think we're coming around to another "Rank every Bond film best to worst" discussion. Seems to happen once a year or so  

[DieselDaisy]

Bond lends itself to ranking somehow: favourite film; favourite Bond; favourite Bond girl. It seems to attract people who like to make lists!

[James Bond]

 

21 hours ago, DieselDaisy said:

I completely agree - NB I still have it at #4 on my list - but he is competing against Sean Connery as Bond!! When deciding these polls you have to take into consideration the Bond and Connery oozed charisma and basically turned that character into a cinematic icon. Lazenby does an alright job but it is just alright and the quality of the film suffers.

I do think Sean carried those last two (3 if you include NSN) weaker Bonds - even Dr No which is one of the certified 'classics' is a bit creaky in parts when you watch back today, and campy (the fire blowing crocodile thing!) but Connery elevates those films. 

Connery did not have that much experience before Bond - a cameo in The Longest Day!

I think it's a true testament to the quality of OHMSS as a film that the weakest link - Lazenby - isn't even all that weak. They were smart and surrounded him with a talented cast and Fleming's best novel.

Connery's The Longest Day cameo is funny - one of those retrospective curiosities that gets milked to death. He's in what, ten seconds of the movie? And yet my two-tape VHS version displays his picture loud and proud on the back and lists him as a cast member.  

19 hours ago, Georgy Zhukov said:

The Living Daylights would definitely be top five for me. The plot what a little more realistic. A top Russian general is trading arms for dope to turn a profit while his state is crumbling around him. Of course they didn't mention the fact the USSR was falling apart at the time. 

Spectre has turned into one of my favorites. Three of the Craig films are just top of the line. Only Quantum of Solace doesn't cut it. It was sort of like the bad Connery films when Connery it was only Connery that kept the film watchable. Also,  imaging sleeping with a girl by only saying "I can't seem to find the stationary. Want to help me look?" Bastard.

The first third of The Living Daylights follows the short story pretty closely too. It's amazing that even the tiniest bit of Fleming always translates to a better film even if the rest needs to be expanded or embellished.

Also, Bond is lucky as fuck to have banged Fields.

18 hours ago, Powerage5 said:

I think we're coming around to another "Rank every Bond film best to worst" discussion. Seems to happen once a year or so  

So, uh, when's the Bond sub-forum coming so we can better discuss all the intricacies?

[Powerage5]

I'll get right on that

[Powerage5]

39 minutes ago, Wagszilla said:

My Top 5 Bonds:

1. Casino Royale (2006)
2. GoldenEye
3. Live And Let Die
4. Goldfinger
5. On Her Majesty's Secret Service

I had never seen many of the Connery Bonds before. My general opinion is that Brosnan and Craig were both equally squandered which is a pity.

Desmond Llewelyn is the greatest.

A respectable list. You're one of the few in this thread who rates Goldfinger so highly - a lot of us think it's overrated. 

[ZoSoRose]

My top 10 (it changes)

1. Casino Royale

2. Skyfall

3. Goldfinger

4. Goldeneye

5. License to Kill

6. Dr No

7. On Her Majesty's Secret Service

8. The Spy Who Loved Me

9. The Living Daylights

10. From Russia With Love

Edited October 18, 2016 by ZoSoRose

[Powerage5]

9 minutes ago, Wagszilla said:

I can see that argument. I'd probably agree with a lot of the points.

I just like Goldfinger as a character. Much more interesting to me than most of them.

It's tough ranking the earlier ones. I like a lot of elements of a lot of Bonds even if I don't like the whole thing.

 

 

Goldfinger is an all-time villain for sure. My biggest problem with the film (And I know @James Bond agrees) is that Bond is never at the top of his game in this film. He spends at least half the film as a prisoner. He was captured extraordinarily easily. It has some of his most mysogynistic, cringey moments. 

 

Fuck it, since @ZoSoRose went there, top 10:

1. Skyfall
2. Casino Royale
3. On Her Majesty's Secret Service
4. From Russia With Love
5. The Living Daylights
6. SPECTRE
7. Goldeneye
8. Licence To Kill
9. The Man With The Golden Gun
10. Goldfinger

[ZoSoRose]

6 minutes ago, Powerage5 said:

Goldfinger is an all-time villain for sure. My biggest problem with the film (And I know @James Bond agrees) is that Bond is never at the top of his game in this film. He spends at least half the film as a prisoner. He was captured extraordinarily easily. It has some of his most mysogynistic, cringey moments. 

 

Fuck it, since @ZoSoRose went there, top 10:

1. Skyfall
2. Casino Royale
3. On Her Majesty's Secret Service
4. From Russia With Love
5. The Living Daylights
6. SPECTRE
7. Goldeneye
8. Licence To Kill
9. The Man With The Golden Gun
10. Goldfinger

Fuck yeah The Living Daylights

That should be higher on my list

[Powerage5]

Yes, it should.

 

Here's a good one - rank the first Bond films (Dr. No, LALD, etc...), and the last Bond films (DAF, AVTAK, etc...). Skip OHMSS if you don't want to compare it since it's the only Lazenby film.

 

Firsts
1. Casino Royale
2. On Her Majesty's Secret Service
3. The Living Daylights
4. Goldeneye
5. Live And Let Die
6. Dr. No

 

Lasts
1. SPECTRE (Even though it most likely won't be Craig's last)
2. On Her Majesty's Secret Service
3. Licence To Kill
4. A View To A Kill
5. Diamonds Are Forever
6. Die Another Day

[ZoSoRose]

22 minutes ago, Powerage5 said:

Yes, it should.

 

Here's a good one - rank the first Bond films (Dr. No, LALD, etc...), and the last Bond films (DAF, AVTAK, etc...). Skip OHMSS if you don't want to compare it since it's the only Lazenby film.

 

Firsts
1. Casino Royale
2. On Her Majesty's Secret Service
3. The Living Daylights
4. Goldeneye
5. Live And Let Die
6. Dr. No

 

Lasts
1. SPECTRE (Even though it most likely won't be Craig's last)
2. On Her Majesty's Secret Service
3. Licence To Kill
4. A View To A Kill
5. Diamonds Are Forever
6. Die Another Day

FIRSTS

1. Casino Royale
2. Goldeneye
3. The Living Daylights
4. Dr No
5. Live And Let Die (I still love the campiness)

LASTS

1. License to Kill
2. SPECTRE (Loved it when it came out, but its dropped a lot for me sadly)
3. Die Another Day (I think its a terrible movie but I have fond memories seeing it and its so horrible its fun for me)
4. Diamonds Are Forever
5. A View To A Kill

[DieselDaisy]

Die Another Day simply has to be last, although I'm glad it exists as a ''so bad they're good'' film, to laugh at. Poor old Pierce got dealt shit for scripts after Goldeneye.

[James Bond]

Firsts:

1. OHMSS / Casino Royale

2. The Living Daylights

3. GoldenEye

4. Live and Let Die

5. Dr. No

Lasts:

1. OHMSS / SPECTRE

2. Licence To Kill

3. Die Another Day

4. Diamonds Are Forever

5. A View To A Kill

It's weird seeing Die Another Day have such a high ranking in this context.

I'll take the fun factor over the sheer awfulness of Diamonds (although Connery turns in a better performance than YOLT), and AVTAK is just horrible.

 

[Powerage5]

21 minutes ago, James Bond said:

Firsts:

1. OHMSS / Casino Royale

2. The Living Daylights

3. GoldenEye

4. Live and Let Die

5. Dr. No

Lasts:

1. OHMSS / SPECTRE

2. Licence To Kill

3. Die Another Day

4. Diamonds Are Forever

5. A View To A Kill

It's weird seeing Die Another Day have such a high ranking in this context.

I'll take the fun factor over the sheer awfulness of Diamonds (although Connery turns in a better performance than YOLT), and AVTAK is just horrible.

 

See, I feel the opposite about AVTAK and DAD. To me, AVTAK is immensely fun, even if it does suck. DAD is just painful to watch after the first half hour.