What does Axl want from the label and vice-versa?

[maynard]

So, reading through recent discussion, some people were talking about how difficult is to release music in a creative way under a label. I have the impression it's Axl who wouldn't want an "exotic" kind of release. I guess on his mind, songs don't work individually but as a whole.

It's got me thinking, what does Axl want from his label to finally release a new album? Assuming this is the real issue holding back the release of a new album and not Axl refusing/being not capable to release it.

I know what the label has always wanted: Reunion. What I also know is that they've probably given up by now. It's clear it won't happen, it's clear to us, it's gotta be pretty obvious for the people on the business as well. They must be aware this is GNR and that will never change. Or will they simply ignore the last years and keep trying and trying to get a reunion? Even knowing that GNR's current management is completely against a reunion?

Will the label lose money releasing a new album? Have they lost money on the CD release? What reasons would the label have NOT to release a new album besides an impossible reunion? What do they expect from Axl's band?

And... What does Axl want from the label? More money? More promotion? I don't even know what else the label could do besides that... Any ideas?

Why does Axl always mention the "work things out with the label" thing when he talks about future releases? What can they do for him?

[alfierose]

I was pondering this earlier. I saw an old BBF fb message posted somewhere where he says something about waiting to see what the label can offer and whether it is acceptable to Axl. This could have been a year or two ago so I am assuming they haven't offered anything acceptable as yet.

As this is Axl we are talking about I'm not sure I could second guess what constitutes acceptable.

[Rustycage]

I was pondering this earlier. I saw an old BBF fb message posted somewhere where he says something about waiting to see what the label can offer and whether it is acceptable to Axl. This could have been a year or two ago so I am assuming they haven't offered anything acceptable as yet.

As this is Axl we are talking about I'm not sure I could second guess what constitutes acceptable.

BBF's post was about the timeline of a release and their funding and promotion of the release and if Axl accepted their proposal. He did NOT say that they had reached that point.

[alfierose]

I was pondering this earlier. I saw an old BBF fb message posted somewhere where he says something about waiting to see what the label can offer and whether it is acceptable to Axl. This could have been a year or two ago so I am assuming they haven't offered anything acceptable as yet.

As this is Axl we are talking about I'm not sure I could second guess what constitutes acceptable.

BBF's post was about the timeline of a release and their funding and promotion of the release and if Axl accepted their proposal. He did NOT say that they had reached that point.

So they may not have offered anything at this point. I still can't guess at what exactly he would want though.

[Damn_Smooth]

Not sure about the label, but I'm pretty sure that Axl would settle for cake. Lots of cake.

[Rustycage]

According to rumors, the label have washed their hands of Axl and want nothing to do with another one of his albums. Most likely, they have decided to wait out a reunion and all negotiations are moot.

If he only owes them one more album, they would obviously not want to release another weak record and let Axl be a free agent. I assume they'd rather just wait him out. They aren't losing anything in the process.(the best buy deal only helped them break even for the money spent on CD)

Anyways, I can't imagine what Axl wants because I doubt he's going to get it.

[Inprovinoff]

The upcoming Vegas release is going to be from Interscope. If it happens it will prove that there is a working relationship and that the label has not "washed their hands" of GNR. I feel that Axl will get what he desires, or come to an agreement, with how to proceed with releasing a new album and we should hope for that, not wish it failure. Just my .02 cents.

Edited June 12, 2013 by Inprovinoff

[alfierose]

Assuming the label are sitting it out for a reunion...

What would they prefer? A reunion of Axl, Duff, Izzy/Gilby, Matt/Steven or a NuGuns album and tour?

If the former is of limited interest and without Slash the NuGuns option would be more lucrative then by virtue of still being alive Slash is cockblocking Axl's plans. Maybe this accounts for the 'better off removed' sentiments. Not suggesting he wishes him dead, I would hope he isn't that bitter but in this scenario he is the spanner in the works.

P.S I have no idea if a reunion without Slash would be of interest to the label or public. Not sure anyone would get too excited about it.

The upcoming Vegas release is going to be from Interscope. If it happens it will prove that there is a working relationship and that the label has not "washed their hands" of GNR. I feel that Axl will get what he desires, or come to an agreement, with how to proceed with releasing a new album and we should hope for that, not wish it failure. Just my .02 cents.

I hope that is the case. Maybe the DVD is a way of testing the water.

[TombRaider]

why would a reunion involving Slash fail to interest the general public, aka, casual fans?

[Rustycage]

P.S I have no idea if a reunion without Slash would be of interest to the label or public. Not sure anyone would get too excited about it.

Just curious, how old are you? There is at the very least double the interest for a reunion over this version of the band.

[Ali]

So, reading through recent discussion, some people were talking about how difficult is to release music in a creative way under a label. I have the impression it's Axl who wouldn't want an "exotic" kind of release. I guess on his mind, songs don't work individually but as a whole.

It's got me thinking, what does Axl want from his label to finally release a new album? Assuming this is the real issue holding back the release of a new album and not Axl refusing/being not capable to release it.

I know what the label has always wanted: Reunion. What I also know is that they've probably given up by now. It's clear it won't happen, it's clear to us, it's gotta be pretty obvious for the people on the business as well. They must be aware this is GNR and that will never change. Or will they simply ignore the last years and keep trying and trying to get a reunion? Even knowing that GNR's current management is completely against a reunion?

Will the label lose money releasing a new album? Have they lost money on the CD release? What reasons would the label have NOT to release a new album besides an impossible reunion? What do they expect from Axl's band?

And... What does Axl want from the label? More money? More promotion? I don't even know what else the label could do besides that... Any ideas?

Why does Axl always mention the "work things out with the label" thing when he talks about future releases? What can they do for him?

Since Axl has never commented on the idea of releasing songs one at a time, if it was something he would be interested in if he had the opportunity, we have no way of knowing what he thinks of that method of releasing new music. But, it would be completely irrelevant if the label isn't on board.

As far as what he wants, who knows. It may have to do with promotional budgets and plans, he may have other issues he'd like to have resolved before going forward.

Ali

[alfierose]

37

I was just trying to measure whether Slash was the key ingredient to a reunion tour versus backing of the current GnR by the label. I'm sure plenty of people would go see a reunion without Slash but would it be worth more than investing in the current band?

[TombRaider]

@alfierose If you're 37, then you remember how huge the UYI lineup was. Man, you know that if they were to announce a reunion tomorrow, tickets to the shows would sell out in minutes, not only in Europe and South America, but also in the US.

It'd be crazy.

[alfierose]

Even without Slash? Maybe it would. I do remember how big they were but it was largely an Axl/Slash thing to some extent.

Anyway it was just my train of thought going off at a tangent. It tends to do that late at night.

why would a reunion involving Slash fail to interest the general public, aka, casual fans?

I was talking about without Slash.

[TombRaider]

Oh, I see. No, I think you'd need Slash for a reunion to work. He's a huge part of the classic sound.

[alfierose]

Oh, I see. No, I think you'd need Slash for a reunion to work. He's a huge part of the classic sound.

That was my point. What would the label prefer, a reunion minus Slash or NuGuns? If it's the latter then it is Slash that preventing Axl's plans, assuming he has any and assuming the label are indeed waiting out for a reunion. Hence the Axl>Slash animosity.

I think maybe I'm talking in scribble. Time for bed probably :-P

[Rustycage]

Yea, I misunderstood too.

Without Slash involved, it's not even a reunion.

[Apollo]

According to rumors, the label have washed their hands of Axl and want nothing to do with another one of his albums. Most likely, they have decided to wait out a reunion and all negotiations are moot.

If he only owes them one more album, they would obviously not want to release another weak record and let Axl be a free agent. I assume they'd rather just wait him out. They aren't losing anything in the process.(the best buy deal only helped them break even for the money spent on CD)

Anyways, I can't imagine what Axl wants because I doubt he's going to get it.

But if that was the case - if the label was holding Axl hostage - he could sue and win pretty easily. I don't think you can legally prevent somebody from working/making a living like that. There are anti-trust laws that might come into play, or maybe it would be called something else.

If Axl is under contract to a lable for one more album.........and the label refuses to "accept" an album because of non-music related reasons, like in this case because they are trying to dictate who Axl has in his band - that lawsuit would be pretty easy to win. Especially if Axl had one comment from anybody involved in the label that mentioned a no album/reunion threat. One email that mentioned it and the case is over.

I truly believe that if this was the label's fault, we'd hear about it. Axl would write a long rambling non-sensical letter. Beta or one of the kids would make a public statement about it. "We turned in 15 songs to the label and they rejected them all. We feel really strong about these songs and think they represent GnR quite well. But the label rejected them." But all we've heard is "label issues" meaning that Axl isn't agreeing to the label's terms. Which sucks for you and me. It would be a awesome if for once Axl/Beta and the kids put the fans ahead of lawsuits, money, pride, etc.

And as much as Axl loves to sue people, don't you think he would sue the label if it was preventing him from releasing music??????

I would bet money that this has WAY more to do with Axl than it does with the label.

[maynard]

Do you guys think the label still considers that a reunion could happen? Even after all these years and with TB in charge?

[TombRaider]

@Groghan Oh, absolutely. Chances are, it has way more to do with Axl than with anyone else.

...

EDIT:

@maynard Hard to say. I bet there are people in the business that advocate a UYI lineup reunion, not because of sentimental reasons, though that may be part of it, but mostly because of money. Axl is sitting on a goldmine, Slash is sitting on a goldmine. It'd only take a couple of phone calls to make it happen. But Slash said it's not about money. But yeah, I believe the label sorta hopes it'll eventually happen.

Edited June 13, 2013 by TombRaider

[Apollo]

Do you guys think the label still considers that a reunion could happen? Even after all these years and with TB in charge?

I'm sure they "hope" one will happen.

But they can't delay the release of a GnR album for that reason. If they did that, Axl - who loves to sue people - would sue them in a heartbeat. And would no doubt win.

[TombRaider]

If the label were delaying a release, we'd probably hear about it. Axl and his management are most likely the ones keeping music from being released.

Edited June 13, 2013 by TombRaider

[Bobbo]

I don't think that's necessarily the scenario. My guess would be that Axl wants a significant amount of more funding for whatever than the label is willing to give for the current outfit at this point. But personally, I don't think Axl has the drive to try anymore regardless.

[Rustycage]

According to rumors, the label have washed their hands of Axl and want nothing to do with another one of his albums. Most likely, they have decided to wait out a reunion and all negotiations are moot.

If he only owes them one more album, they would obviously not want to release another weak record and let Axl be a free agent. I assume they'd rather just wait him out. They aren't losing anything in the process.(the best buy deal only helped them break even for the money spent on CD)

Anyways, I can't imagine what Axl wants because I doubt he's going to get it.

But if that was the case - if the label was holding Axl hostage - he could sue and win pretty easily. I don't think you can legally prevent somebody from working/making a living like that. There are anti-trust laws that might come into play, or maybe it would be called something else.

If Axl is under contract to a lable for one more album.........and the label refuses to "accept" an album because of non-music related reasons, like in this case because they are trying to dictate who Axl has in his band - that lawsuit would be pretty easy to win. Especially if Axl had one comment from anybody involved in the label that mentioned a no album/reunion threat. One email that mentioned it and the case is over.

I truly believe that if this was the label's fault, we'd hear about it. Axl would write a long rambling non-sensical letter. Beta or one of the kids would make a public statement about it. "We turned in 15 songs to the label and they rejected them all. We feel really strong about these songs and think they represent GnR quite well. But the label rejected them." But all we've heard is "label issues" meaning that Axl isn't agreeing to the label's terms. Which sucks for you and me. It would be a awesome if for once Axl/Beta and the kids put the fans ahead of lawsuits, money, pride, etc.

And as much as Axl loves to sue people, don't you think he would sue the label if it was preventing him from releasing music??????

I would bet money that this has WAY more to do with Axl than it does with the label.

The label didn't have to accept, what they considered to be, a subpar version of CD. They can refuse to release what they consider to be crap if they feel it is crap. I think even Axl knows that suing the label would be the nail in his proverbial coffin.

[axlsalinger]

There have been many cases where a record label refuses to release an album, and demands a ridiculous amount of money from the artist to get it back. Hell it happened with Duff's 2nd solo record.

It's a great question. I just wonder if Axl is demanding unlimited studio time and/or a huge advance, like he got away with in the old days. Or has he just completely given up? I really try hard, but struggle, to come up with any other plausible explanation.