bt88 Posted December 5, 2015 Share Posted December 5, 2015 Keith Law noted that Greinke's delivery and control make him the most likely pitcher to still be effective once his velocity drops. It's not a bad deal but the Dbacks still need more pieces to be contenders. It was interesting to see them snatch him away from the traditional big money teams. Cueto is about to get PAID Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
classicrawker Posted December 5, 2015 Share Posted December 5, 2015 (edited) Salty signs with the Giants so another FA pitcher bites the dust...Damn, Greinke's contract averages out to $34 mill a year....just stunning money being paid out for pitchers these days........George Steinbrenner must be rolling in his grave with the Yankees sitting the signing frenzy out....... Edited December 5, 2015 by classicrawker Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
axlslash Posted December 6, 2015 Share Posted December 6, 2015 Price got PAID. Unbelievably high numbers for such a long contract given his age. Reports are that Greinke is down to the Dodgers and the Giants, and that he'll make a decision as early as this week.Not sure where this leaves my Cubbies. Looks like we'll have to settle for Samardzija, maybe pick up lackey too. Hopefully we can add a big bat and make some moneyball moves to solidify the pen. Definitely still feel good about where we are, but a big name pitcher is now only happening by trade...If you could get Lackey to take 2 years at reasonable money I would jump on him as he is a bulldog and is still pitching well.MLB Trade Rumors picked us to land Lackey a month or so ago, and I feel like that's still likely. I've never loved Samardzija, but it looks like he may come home too. Just hope we make a run at either Gordon or Heyward now that we've saved those Price dollars. You got your man and only had to commit for 2 years nice pickup for the Cubbies....I like the signing. It's a good deal, especially since Lackey only needs to be good enough to justify being a #3 starter. But as a Cub fan? So weird. Like, beyond signing Jim Edmonds weird. Last time I saw Lackey pitch at Wrigley, he was leaving the field to 42k Cub fans (myself including) shouting mocking chants of "Laaaa-ckeeeeey! Laaaaa-ckeeeeeeey!" (a la hockey fans mocking goalies), as the Cubs chased him early and eliminated the Cardinals in the NLDS. His next start are Wriglet Field will be in blue pinstripes. This is fuckin weird. But still a great signing. Sorry we missed out on Price, but this is probably a better deal for us long term anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bran Posted December 6, 2015 Share Posted December 6, 2015 i think lackey is a great signing for the cubs, i know what you mean about it being odd it reminds me of johnny damon kind of like what bob uecker said in major league 2 "its funny how a new uniform changes your feelings about a guy" 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DirtyDeeds Posted December 6, 2015 Author Share Posted December 6, 2015 i think lackey is a great signing for the cubs, i know what you mean about it being odd it reminds me of johnny damon kind of like what bob uecker said in major league 2 "its funny how a new uniform changes your feelings about a guy"I'm guilty of that, too. Curtis Granderson comes to mind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
classicrawker Posted December 7, 2015 Share Posted December 7, 2015 (edited) Dodgers sign Iwakuma and trade for Chapman........I give them credit they are not shy about going all out to win..... Rumours have it the Marlins are shopping SP Jose Fernandez hoping to hook a big fish. Andrew Marchand on ESPN is proposing the Yankees offer behemoth (6'7") OF prospect Aaron Judge, Andrew Miller and some lesser prospects and thinks the Fish might bite. I would hate to see Judge get traded but if they could get Fernandez I would do it in a heart beat........ Edited December 7, 2015 by classicrawker Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ronaldo9 Posted December 7, 2015 Share Posted December 7, 2015 Dodgers sign Iwakuma and trade for Chapman........I give them credit they are not shy about going all out to win......Or not...at least, not yet. https://twitter.com/jaysonst/status/673963104313679872https://twitter.com/m_sheldon/status/673956692258897920Here's hoping for a bidding war of some sort... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apollo Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 Kris Bryant filed a grievance today against the Cubs for their keeping him in the minor leagues solely based on his service time instead of his production level. I know a couple of you ownership guys said I was wrong by thinking the Cubs aren't being fair to Bryant. Apparently Bryant agreed with me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
classicrawker Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 (edited) Nobody disagreed with you, that based on his production he should have started the season with the ML team, but unlike you some of us understood why the Cubs sent him down as it was a smart business decision at the time. Someday maybe you will understand baseball is a business........ And I wish him good luck with his grievance but I doubt he stands a chance as what the Cubs did was not illegal........ Edited December 8, 2015 by classicrawker Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apollo Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 Nobody disagreed with you, that based on his production he should have started the season with the ML team, but unlike you some of us understood why the Cubs sent him down as it was a smart business decision at the time. Someday maybe you will understand baseball is a business........ And I wish him good luck with his grievance but I doubt he stands a chance as what the Cubs did was not illegal........Are you capable of answering without being a smart ass? Or are you just t-rolling me again?It obvious why the Cubs did it. I've never claimed to not understand why. The debate is the outcome of it. A club not putting their best team on the field. A team worrying more about money and contracts than they do about the happiness of their star young player and winning games. You don't think Bryant and his agent are going to remember this come new contract time? You don't think other players look at what the Cubs did and file that info away. But I suppose Bryant and his agent don't understand baseball either. I'm not sure if you are being honest or just t-rolling me. But either way your stance shows that we will never agree on this issue. You are a corporate management guy. I side with the fans and players. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ronaldo9 Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 (edited) So much for a bidding war for Chapman. What an idiot if true. Being investigated for supposedly firing eight gunshots in his garage and choking his girlfriend. Edited December 8, 2015 by ronaldo9 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
classicrawker Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 (edited) Nobody disagreed with you, that based on his production he should have started the season with the ML team, but unlike you some of us understood why the Cubs sent him down as it was a smart business decision at the time. Someday maybe you will understand baseball is a business........ And I wish him good luck with his grievance but I doubt he stands a chance as what the Cubs did was not illegal........Are you capable of answering without being a smart ass? Or are you just t-rolling me again?It obvious why the Cubs did it. I've never claimed to not understand why. The debate is the outcome of it. A club not putting their best team on the field. A team worrying more about money and contracts than they do about the happiness of their star young player and winning games. You don't think Bryant and his agent are going to remember this come new contract time? You don't think other players look at what the Cubs did and file that info away.But I suppose Bryant and his agent don't understand baseball either.I'm not sure if you are being honest or just t-rolling me. But either way your stance shows that we will never agree on this issue. You are a corporate management guy. I side with the fans and players.You're the Tr0ll mate by trying to antagonize me by repeating the "corporate management guy" BS every time you bring this subject up. I never tr0ll you Apollo I just rarely agree with you and you just can't seem to deal with it.I never claimed what the Cubs did was fair only that it was a smart business decision which you seem to have hard time understanding.You are overstating the impact of sending him down as clubs do this type thing all the time as it is part of business... I doubt his teammates or he will care if the Cubs offers him fat contract when he reaches free agency ad players go where the money is.I hope he wins his grievance but since the Cubs did not break any rules I think it is an empty gesture.........And you are right we will once again have to agree to disagree so get over it.....So how about we get back to talking about baseball instead of having petty arguments........ Edited December 8, 2015 by classicrawker Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
axlslash Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 (edited) Kris Bryant filed a grievance today against the Cubs for their keeping him in the minor leagues solely based on his service time instead of his production level.I know a couple of you ownership guys said I was wrong by thinking the Cubs aren't being fair to Bryant. Apparently Bryant agreed with me.I'm one of those people you labeled "management guys," and I'm about to blow your fucking mind, because I am a staunch union supporter, and my dream job is to work for the MLBPA legal team.Under the current rules as written, what the Cubs did is most likely not in violation of the CBA. That said, it's shady and disrespectful to the player, and that sort of chicanery is precisely why Major League Baseball players need a union.Bryant and the MLBPA are not going to win this grievance, in all likelihood. That said, this sort of time of service gamesmanship is the Players Association's #1 priority in the upcoming round of bargaining when the CBA expires next year. This grievance isn't about winning. To quote the Joker, it's about sending a message. This is the MLBPA's new leadership standing up and saying, before bargaining starts, that they are serious about making changes to these rules and that they will fight tooth and nail to get those changes.Basically, Bryant has a legitimate argument that he was done morally wrong, but probably not that the actions violated the CBA (especially in light of the fact that the Cubs had 2 injured big league 3rd Basemen at the time Bryant was called up). But this will send a message and jumpstart the 2016 bargaining process. Edited December 8, 2015 by axlslash Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apollo Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 Nobody disagreed with you, that based on his production he should have started the season with the ML team, but unlike you some of us understood why the Cubs sent him down as it was a smart business decision at the time. Someday maybe you will understand baseball is a business........ And I wish him good luck with his grievance but I doubt he stands a chance as what the Cubs did was not illegal........Are you capable of answering without being a smart ass? Or are you just t-rolling me again?It obvious why the Cubs did it. I've never claimed to not understand why. The debate is the outcome of it. A club not putting their best team on the field. A team worrying more about money and contracts than they do about the happiness of their star young player and winning games. You don't think Bryant and his agent are going to remember this come new contract time? You don't think other players look at what the Cubs did and file that info away.But I suppose Bryant and his agent don't understand baseball either.I'm not sure if you are being honest or just t-rolling me. But either way your stance shows that we will never agree on this issue. You are a corporate management guy. I side with the fans and players. You're the Tr0ll mate by trying to antagonize me by repeating the "corporate management guy" BS every time you bring this subject up. I never tr0ll you Apollo I just rarely agree with you and you just can't seem to deal with it.I never claimed what the Cubs did was fair only that it was a smart business decision which you seem to have hard time understanding.You are overstating the impact of sending him down as clubs do this type thing all the time as it is part of business... I doubt his teammates or he will care if the Cubs offers him fat contract when he reaches free agency ad players go where the money is.I hope he wins his grievance but since the Cubs did not break any rules I think it is an empty gesture.........And you are right we will once again have to agree to disagree so get over it.....So how about we get back to talking about baseball instead of having petty arguments........You admitting that you purposely t-roll me. Or did you forget that?As for this debate. It seems pretty clear cut. You agree with management I agree with the player 2 + 2 = 4Kris Bryant filed a grievance today against the Cubs for their keeping him in the minor leagues solely based on his service time instead of his production level.I know a couple of you ownership guys said I was wrong by thinking the Cubs aren't being fair to Bryant. Apparently Bryant agreed with me.I'm one of those people you labeled "management guys," and I'm about to blow your fucking mind, because I am a staunch union supporter, and my dream job is to work for the MLBPA legal team.Under the current rules as written, what the Cubs did is most likely not in violation of the CBA. That said, it's shady and disrespectful to the player, and that sort of chicanery is precisely why Major League Baseball players need a union.Bryant and the MLBPA are not going to win this grievance, in all likelihood. That said, this sort of time of service gamesmanship is the Players Association's #1 priority in the upcoming round of bargaining when the CBA expires next year. This grievance isn't about winning. To quote the Joker, it's about sending a message. This is the MLBPA's new leadership standing up and saying, before bargaining starts, that they are serious about making changes to these rules and that they will fight tooth and nail to get those changes.Basically, Bryant has a legitimate argument that he was done morally wrong, but probably not that the actions violated the CBA (especially in light of the fact that the Cubs had 2 injured big league 3rd Basemen at the time Bryant was called up). But this will send a message and jumpstart the 2016 bargaining process.Great post. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bran Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 aroldis chapman trade on hold, mlb investigating domestic abuse case. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
axlslash Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 aroldis chapman trade on hold, mlb investigating domestic abuse case.What an idiot. Allegedly choked his girlfriend and fired a gun into his garage multiple times. Not gonna end well for him if true. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
axlslash Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 Sounds like the Cubs sending Javy Baez to Atlanta for Shelby Miller is likely to be done by morning. Buzz is that the Cubs will also make a strong run for Heyward. This could get fun, folks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
classicrawker Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 (edited) you admitting that you purposely t-roll me. Or did you forget that?I haven't forgot you keep accusing me of that but it never happened. You claim I said this on the other forum where I have not posted for over 2 years yet can provide no proof so unless you provide proof it never happened. But if it makes you feel better to feel persecuted please carry on...........As for this debate. It seems pretty clear cut. You agree with management I agree with the player 2 + 2 = 4Nope again you are seeing conspiracies that don't exist. I never said I sided with management. if you beleive that please quote where I said that........you obviously need to beleive that so you can justify your posts. Personally I think he got a raw deal but I understand why managment did it as it was a smart business decision on their part. Does this mean I agree with what the Cubs did?... no, actually it just means I see the business reality of why the Cubs did it but I also see why he is pissed off at what they did as it costs him money down the road ..........I understand the business reality of both sides of the argument as opposed to taking sides.I may rarely agree with you but you seem like a reasonably smart person so you can see the difference yes? of course unless you are tr0lling me just to get a rise out of me? so which is it Apollo?Now it is up to the Players Association to negotiate the next contract with the owners so this can't happen to players in the future becasue what the Cubs did most likley does not violate the current agreement and I doubt he wins his greivance...I am guessing his agent already realizes this but wanted to get things out in the open and get it on the plate for the next players contract with the owners. Edited December 8, 2015 by classicrawker Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
axlslash Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 Cubs brass saying they're "unconcerned" by the grievance. Honestly if you're the MLBPA, I think you hope to lose it. That way, you have a recent, egregious act by a team that was totally within the rules as presently written. That's a way to get other players organized: "if we don't do something about this, it will continue to happen."Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to CBA negotiations, 2016. I am genuinely looking forward to seeing how this works out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
classicrawker Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 (edited) Cubs brass saying they're "unconcerned" by the grievance. Honestly if you're the MLBPA, I think you hope to lose it. That way, you have a recent, egregious act by a team that was totally within the rules as presently written. That's a way to get other players organized: "if we don't do something about this, it will continue to happen."Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to CBA negotiations, 2016. I am genuinely looking forward to seeing how this works out.might also give the MLBPA another bargaining chip when they go back to negotiate the next contract. Maybe they give that up to get something more lucrative for the players. They do this all the time when they negotiate these contracts from what I read. Edited December 8, 2015 by classicrawker Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
axlslash Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 Cubs brass saying they're "unconcerned" by the grievance. Honestly if you're the MLBPA, I think you hope to lose it. That way, you have a recent, egregious act by a team that was totally within the rules as presently written. That's a way to get other players organized: "if we don't do something about this, it will continue to happen."Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to CBA negotiations, 2016. I am genuinely looking forward to seeing how this works out.might also give the MLBPA another bargaining chip when they go back to negotiate the next contract. Maybe they give that up to get something more lucrative for the players. They do this all the time when they negotiate these contracts from what I read.There will be lots of chips to trade here and there, but this is expected to be the union's #1 priority in terms of workrules. The players' declining share of BRR will also be a major talking point, but as affects the players and the game directly, expect time-of-service manipulations to be a make-or-break issue.Nathaniel Grow at FanGraphs wrote a spectacular two-blog breakdown of what the next year will look like in terms of CBA bargaining. Highly recommended for anyone interested in sports administration, labor law, etc.http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/an-early-preview-of-mlbs-2016-cba-negotiations-part-i/http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/an-early-preview-of-mlbs-2016-cba-negotiations-part-ii/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
classicrawker Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 Good stuff Axlslash thanks for sharing. There is an linkto an excellent artile in the one you posted about why the Cubs sent down Bryant to delay his service time accumulation. Here is an excerpt You already know what the reasoning is here, because it’s been discussed ad nauseam this spring. If Bryant is with the Cubs from day one, he’ll vest 2015 as a full season of service time and be eligible for free agency after the 2020 season. If they hold him down in Triple-A so that he misses the first nine Cubs games of the season (which take place over 12 days, due to three scheduled days off), they’ll enjoy Bryant’s services through the 2021 season as well — his age-29 season. It’s a simple decision for the Cubs. Two weeks of Bryant’s age-23 season just won’t be as valuable as six months of his age-29 season. Keeping him down may not be popular, but it’s unquestionably correct.I highlight the last sentence as I agree 100% with the author. It is a shitty thing to do to a player, and may not have been a popular decision, but based on the current rules the Cubs made a smart business decision. You don't have to agree with Managements decision to send him down to see the reality of the situation and why it was done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
axlslash Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 Good stuff Axlslash thanks for sharing. There is an linkto an excellent artile in the one you posted about why the Cubs sent down Bryant to delay his service time accumulation. Here is an excerpt You already know what the reasoning is here, because it’s been discussed ad nauseam this spring. If Bryant is with the Cubs from day one, he’ll vest 2015 as a full season of service time and be eligible for free agency after the 2020 season. If they hold him down in Triple-A so that he misses the first nine Cubs games of the season (which take place over 12 days, due to three scheduled days off), they’ll enjoy Bryant’s services through the 2021 season as well — his age-29 season. It’s a simple decision for the Cubs. Two weeks of Bryant’s age-23 season just won’t be as valuable as six months of his age-29 season. Keeping him down may not be popular, but it’s unquestionably correct.I highlight the last sentence as I agree 100% with the author. It is a shitty thing to do to a player, and may not have been a popular decision, but based on the current rules the Cubs made a smart business decision. You don't have to agree with Managements decision to send him down to see the reality of the situation and why it was done.100% agreed. It's like a massive corporation dodging taxes by abusing loopholes. The rules are stupid for letting it happen, but you are an idiot if those opportunities are available to you and you *don't* take advantage of them. That's exactly why the goal on the Bryant grievance isn't to win under these rules, it's to set the stage for making the rules change. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
axlslash Posted December 9, 2015 Share Posted December 9, 2015 The Cubs hot stove has more or less set itself ablaze the last hour or so. Currently down to Cubs and Mets for Ben Zobrist. Cubs shopping Castro to the Yanks and Baez to the Rays. If they move Castro, Cubs beat reporter thinks they can still make a serious run at Ryan Heyward.Think about that: outfield of Schwarber, Heyward, Soler; infield of Bryant, Russell, Zobrist, Rizzo; Montero your everyday catcher with Ross catching Lester; rotation of Arrieta, Lester, Lackey, Hammel, Hendricks. And that's assuming we don't get a starter in the Castro deal or for Baez, which I assume we will.That lineup is significantly better than last year's, and look what the Cubs did. Holy hell am I excited for this possibility. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
classicrawker Posted December 9, 2015 Share Posted December 9, 2015 The Cubs hot stove has more or less set itself ablaze the last hour or so. Currently down to Cubs and Mets for Ben Zobrist. Cubs shopping Castro to the Yanks and Baez to the Rays. If they move Castro, Cubs beat reporter thinks they can still make a serious run at Ryan Heyward.Think about that: outfield of Schwarber, Heyward, Soler; infield of Bryant, Russell, Zobrist, Rizzo; Montero your everyday catcher with Ross catching Lester; rotation of Arrieta, Lester, Lackey, Hammel, Hendricks. And that's assuming we don't get a starter in the Castro deal or for Baez, which I assume we will.That lineup is significantly better than last year's, and look what the Cubs did. Holy hell am I excited for this possibility.Who are the Cubs interested beck from the Yankees? If you want a starter the only one I see the Yanks giving you is Nova. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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