What was the original idea for Adler in the NITL tour?

[RONIN]

9 hours ago, Order of Nine said:

And exactly why I think Frank is the closet thing to what was on appetite.

Sorum came in and thry could have played the same way to a metronome.

Brain was my favorite but Frank had more similarities to Steve then any replacement has had

Brain is my favorite as well, but I disagree with you on the Frank/Adler similarities. (I don't hate Frank like some others here - he's more interesting as a player than Sorum imho)

IMHO, Frank has no feel w/ GnR material - Steven does. Big difference. Brain also has tons of feel. Brain is loose and limber like Adler - they both have a similar explosive energy to their playing. Frank seems more plodding like Sorum when compared to Brain and Adler. The similarity between Adler and Frank (to a lesser extent) is that they both lack the precision of Sorum, Freese, and Brain.

When I hear Frank w/ GnR, I sometimes think "WTF did I just hear - that doesn't work at all. Why did he do that?". 

With Adler, I sometimes think "WTF - that shouldn't work...but it just...does? It sounds... perfect?". 

[RONIN]

On 4/14/2018 at 6:58 PM, Order of Nine said:

That's a great point that I haven't seen given any attention.Steven has not progressed as a musician that I have seen. 

Neither have Slash and Axl. 

None of the GnR guys have really progressed much from 1991. Slash is still out there playing his cock rock and the last time Axl put out music, his muse was still Stephanie Seymour and Elton John balladry. 

A perfect summation of Axl's evolution as a musician imho:

Like Xanadu, Chinese Democracy is a monument to man's might, but where Kane sought to bring the world underneath his roof, Axl labored to create an ideal version of his inner world, working endlessly on a set of songs about his heartbreak, persecution, and paranoia, topics well mined on the Illusions. Using the pompous ten-minute epics "Estranged" and "November Rain" as his foundation, Axl strips away all remnants of the old, snake-dancing GNR, shedding the black humor and blues, replacing any good times with vindictive spleen in the vein of "You Could Be Mine." All this melodrama and malevolence feels familiar and, surprisingly, so does much of Chinese Democracy, even for those listeners who didn't hear the portions of the record as leaked demos and live tracks. Despite a few surface flourishes -- all the endless, evident hours spent on Pro Tools, a hip-hop loop here, a Spanish six-string there, absurd elastic guitar effects -- this is an album unconcerned with the future of rock & roll. One listen and it's abundantly clear that Axl spent the decade-plus in the studio not reinventing but refining, obsessing over a handful of tracks, and spending an inordinate amount of time chasing the sound in his head -- that's it, no more, no less.

https://www.allmusic.com/album/chinese-democracy-mw0000802741

Edited April 16, 2018 by RONIN

[Italian girl]

13 hours ago, Order of Nine said:

I don't understand all the hate with Frank's drumming. It seems to me as soon as DJ and bumble left that he gets alot of the hate now.

 

this

[Stress Fracture]

Sounds like the same situation with the Smashing Pumpkins reunion. Adler/D’arcy were invited to be involved with the tour. Their drug frazzled minds led them to believe this meant they’d be back in the band full time rather than the guest appearances that were actually being offered.

Edited April 16, 2018 by Stress Fracture

[Sydney Fan]

3 hours ago, Italian girl said:

this

Simple. When i saw guns here in oz at the sydney show during estranged i wanted to hold up a sign and in bold write "FRANK SLOW THE FUCK DOWN". i prefer sorums drumming because he can keep time better.

[Order of Nine]

6 hours ago, RONIN said:

Brain is my favorite as well, but I disagree with you on the Frank/Adler similarities. (I don't hate Frank like some others here - he's more interesting as a player than Sorum imho)

IMHO, Frank has no feel w/ GnR material - Steven does. Big difference. Brain also has tons of feel. Brain is loose and limber like Adler - they both have a similar explosive energy to their playing. Frank seems more plodding like Sorum when compared to Brain and Adler. The similarity between Adler and Frank (to a lesser extent) is that they both lack the precision of Sorum, Freese, and Brain.

When I hear Frank w/ GnR, I sometimes think "WTF did I just hear - that doesn't work at all. Why did he do that?". 

With Adler, I sometimes think "WTF - that shouldn't work...but it just...does? It sounds... perfect?". 

The feel is obviously subjective. 

Imho I think Frank is a target cause he's not shielded by DJ and Bumble anymore. 

 

I just think your used to hearing his imperfections on Appetite and have grown accustomed to them. He is up and down constantly. 

Edited April 16, 2018 by Order of Nine

[Order of Nine]

6 hours ago, RONIN said:

Neither have Slash and Axl. 

None of the GnR guys have really progressed much from 1991. Slash is still out there playing his cock rock and the last time Axl put out music, his muse was still Stephanie Seymour and Elton John balladry. 

A perfect summation of Axl's evolution as a musician imho:

Like Xanadu, Chinese Democracy is a monument to man's might, but where Kane sought to bring the world underneath his roof, Axl labored to create an ideal version of his inner world, working endlessly on a set of songs about his heartbreak, persecution, and paranoia, topics well mined on the Illusions. Using the pompous ten-minute epics "Estranged" and "November Rain" as his foundation, Axl strips away all remnants of the old, snake-dancing GNR, shedding the black humor and blues, replacing any good times with vindictive spleen in the vein of "You Could Be Mine." All this melodrama and malevolence feels familiar and, surprisingly, so does much of Chinese Democracy, even for those listeners who didn't hear the portions of the record as leaked demos and live tracks. Despite a few surface flourishes -- all the endless, evident hours spent on Pro Tools, a hip-hop loop here, a Spanish six-string there, absurd elastic guitar effects -- this is an album unconcerned with the future of rock & roll. One listen and it's abundantly clear that Axl spent the decade-plus in the studio not reinventing but refining, obsessing over a handful of tracks, and spending an inordinate amount of time chasing the sound in his head -- that's it, no more, no less.

https://www.allmusic.com/album/chinese-democracy-mw0000802741

Slash has progressed with his technically speaking to a certain degree. He has worked on some alternate picking. 

Has he made huge strides? Imho not really. It's noticeable when he improves over his blues jams/godfather/Johnny b good/DTJ solo spots. 

How many singers have progressed as they get older? That's not even a realistic outlook to have. Our bodies change, voices change, age eventually takes and influence over anyone's vocal cords and physical condition.

39 minutes ago, Order of Nine said:

Slash has progressed with his technically speaking to a certain degree. He has worked on some alternate picking. 

Has he made huge strides? Imho not really. It's noticeable when he improves over his blues jams/godfather/Johnny b good/DTJ solo spots. 

How many singers have progressed as they get older? That's not even a realistic outlook to have. Our bodies change, voices change, age eventually takes and influence over anyone's vocal cords and physical condition.

As far as Slash's song/riff writing. It's never been better then on Appetite. 

From Axl, I think his newer material holds it's on to the back catalog. He was clearly the songwriter along with Izzy in the band, slash parts were most always an added addition after the fact.

Edited April 16, 2018 by Order of Nine

[YourMother'sDruthers]

How funny would it have been if they just had Adler stand next to Frank and just come out strictly on cowbell for the cowbell parts on songs like nighttrain. 😂

[Eric Cantona]

On 26.4.2018 at 3:38 AM, YourMother'sDruthers said:

How funny would it have been if they just had Adler stand next to Frank and just come out strictly on cowbell for the cowbell parts on songs like nighttrain. 😂

Kind of like Matt in the Hall of Fame performance  

[RazorGunner]

On 4/16/2018 at 7:58 AM, Order of Nine said:

Slash has progressed with his technically speaking to a certain degree. He has worked on some alternate picking. 

Has he made huge strides? Imho not really. It's noticeable when he improves over his blues jams/godfather/Johnny b good/DTJ solo spots. 

How many singers have progressed as they get older? That's not even a realistic outlook to have. Our bodies change, voices change, age eventually takes and influence over anyone's vocal cords and physical condition.

As far as Slash's song/riff writing. It's never been better then on Appetite. 

From Axl, I think his newer material holds it's on to the back catalog. He was clearly the songwriter along with Izzy in the band, slash parts were most always an added addition after the fact.

 

Slash is far and away a better technical player now than he was in the 90's and it's very obvious to anyone familiar with guitar (and people with ears  )

I was not really keeping up with his albums and work during the 2000s and was truly impressed when I saw the first few GNR performances in 2016. 

Axl is more consistent now with vocals than he was in the 90's, when it was hit and miss at times- he is more in control, So I'd say that was an improvement. 

[Order of Nine]

32 minutes ago, RazorGunner said:

 

Slash is far and away a better technical player now than he was in the 90's and it's very obvious to anyone familiar with guitar (and people with ears  )

I was not really keeping up with his albums and work during the 2000s and was truly impressed when I saw the first few GNR performances in 2016. 

Axl is more consistent now with vocals than he was in the 90's, when it was hit and miss at times- he is more in control, So I'd say that was an improvement. 

Yeah Axl has definitely improved, he used to blow his voice out alot back in the day and yes he's definitely more consistent in recent years. 

Ive always wished slash would do a jam type album, not necessarily all instrumentals but also possibly some extended guitar solos and improvs like he does live. I'm in the minority on this forum with not caring for any of his vocalists he's had to the point where I can sit down and listen to more then a couple songs at a time. 

[Nikki_Sixx]

On 15-4-2018 at 5:48 AM, LikeADog93 said:

Estranged isn't advanced from a technical drumming standpoint, the advanced part is learning the arrangement. If Steven did his homework and learned the arrangement of Estranged he would nail it. Same with November Rain, not a difficult drum part, just a long song with a number of transitions. We'll never get to hear it, but how Steven would approach those songs would be very interesting to hear.

You do realise that Adler wasn't out of the band 'till June/July '90  ?  That means he was still the drummer for all the rehearsals, demos, pre-production (and had probably even started the actual recording) for 99% of the UYI material ?  I bet he was playing 'Estranged' and 'November Rain' in (at least) rehearsal WAY before Sorum was even in the picture.