Discuss your thoughts of the leaked CD tracks ...

[AbominableHoman]

Here's the problem: Axl Rose can't take over Guns N Roses and deliever an album that doesn't resonate well with fans of Appetite and UYI. If he does that, he will severly hurt his legacy and the GNR brand. The bottom line is this: none of these new songs have blown any of us away. None of them have received ubiquitous praise from the forum and from the public. SOFINE, if you think I am wrong fine, but are all of the callers in Boston wrong too? The general consensus is poor, and if I were Axl and TWAT was a big gun I would be very worried. And as a fan, so should you!

Kaneda, find the demo to November Rain....now after you do this like a good little boy, tell me if the demo does the actual studio/live versions one iota of justice. It doesnt. These are pretty good for demos, including Twat. Let's start putting every bands demos on the radio, guess what, people will call in and complain just the same. Relax dude, stop being the critic and wait for the actual album before you open your mouth.

Good job, made Kaneda look like an idiot.

[Funeral]

I looooooooooooove TWAT, i think it's gonna be the 'Estranged' of CD

humm remember the November Rain demo ??? That's all I have to say

No shit! To draw any concrete conclusions from a couple of demos is just silly. You get a feel for the songs, but the finished studio versions are going to sound different; cleaner and crisper.

The funny thing is....to me those three songs we have heard so far, are better than 85% of UYI cd's that were filled with crappy filler songs!

This is a Modern day GNR............ I love the new sound!

[Alan Niveen]

The funny thing is....to me those three songs we have heard so far, are better than 85% of UYI cd's that were filled with crappy filler songs!

Which "crappy filler songs" are you talking about ? My World is the only crappy filler song IMO.

[ralebava]

It's been a few month's but now that there is actually something concrete to discuss instead of mere speculation, I thought I would drop my two cents in about the leaked material. I've listened to the material all day long and here is my initial response:

14 years and the most expensive album ever for this? These songs are good, very different from GNR of old, but nothing earth shattering here or even revolutionary. Let's break them down by song:

I.R.S.: Cool song, but what happened here? It had so much energy before but now it is all gone. I like the way the words make more sense now, but it needs more UMPH to it. When the beginning starts in, I have this image of Pokemon and Barney holding hands running through a field.

T.W.A.T. : Most disappointing of them all. I really expected so much from this song as it has been tauted for such a long time as a hit by those that have heard it, but man, it's a sporadic mess. It's too chaotic, the music is going in 5 different directions at the same time. Too much layering of music ontop of music. Listen to it again, Axl gets so lost in all of the music fighting for attention. Nothing memorable here. After hearing it 10 times, I still can't recall a memorable line or solo worthy of Guns N Roses.

Better: No pun intended, but this is much Better than the other two. It's different, but it works. Axl's voice sounds the best and the refrain at the beginning and middle is very unique and cool. Best track of the three, by far. However, so far from what GNR of old, that this can not be the first single.

After hearing all of the new material numerous times, I hate to say it, but I am worried that Chinese Democracy is not going to live up to expectations, not even close. Nothing so far has even come close to the epics from GNR's hayday. Even songs that weren't singles like Civil War, Locomotive, Breakdown, Dead Horse are better than anything Axl has been able to come up with by himself. While some of us on here will convince ourselves everything Axl does is genius, I am really worried that old GNR fans are going to HATE this new incarnation. Hate is a strong word, but when you replace all the original members of the biggest band of the 80's/90s and make people wait 14 years for a song like TWAT, there are going to be a lot of disappointed people.

My only hope is that Axl has some Jungle, some Paradise City, some ace up his sleeve that he is hiding until the album comes out. But deep down inside I feel this is it, this is the mythical album we've all built up so much and it doesn't come close to my expectations at all.

THE LAST BIGGEST PROBLEM OF THE NEW MATERIAL: GUITAR SOLOS!

To say Slash's absence is killing this new band is an understatement. None of these new solos do anything for me...They just come and go on the songs, but nothing is soulful the way Slash's solos used to be. I am very worried for Axl, very worried.

Man I´ve got a idea. Make that Interscope hire you and you´ll be the GnR frontman.... Man you dont know more about music that Axl... Your point is stupid.

[Martina]

omg

why cant you just enjoy the music?

...

[Nick85]

omg

why cant you just enjoy the music?

...

Because Martina, theres always gonna be some people you just cant please. Kaneda's one of them. I think he'd prefer that they just rerelease Apetite and UYI 1 & 2 cuz that's all he'd seem to be satisfied with.

[Alan Niveen]

Kaneda is just worried about what may happen to Axl, he doesn't want the band to bite the dust like in 2002...

Axl should read Kaneda's posts every night before going to sleep.

[Guest Matt13]

I'm going to chime in here. Kanada was reasonable in his critique so I'm going to try and stay civil. I would have posted this in his thread, but realized I wanted to prove a point. His fair, but mainly negative comments about the new leaks has sparked a GNR bash fest in that thread. Much like the effect the DJ up in Boston is having with the callers who have been chiming in on TWAT. I want to offer and spotlight more of a positive response here in this thread as a refuge for the folks that are loving what they hear in the new demos but don't care to post in Kanada's thread. That said, I request this thread stays put given that argument.

On to the songs and my critique of Kanada's critique:

I could jump on the "they're just demos" bandwagon. It's easy to tell someone to listen to LP tracks of anything off of AFD or UYI then listen to their demos... crap, right? Well, I think these demos are pretty good quality and are decent enough to judge the new material to an extent. However, the first thing I must point to is this:

Radio DJ's... you can't base what some DJ says and what his callers say about TWAT as an argument for a critique. For example, the other station playing IRS in some cagematch has gotten an overwealming positive response for it. Nothing but positive callers, votes for the song, and positive comments from the DJ's at that station.

If you ask me, TWAT is way better than IRS, and both are very strong songs. So why does TWAT get bashed up in Boston? Well, the DJ's, from what I hear, were bashing it from the get-go. Sounds like they got one of those 'cease and desist' letters and are giving Axl and GNR management the finger. In the process, they're trying to bring it down the best they can. By bashing it on the air, it influences the fans dramatically to call in and bash it too just to get on the air. If anyone with positive comments comes on, they're probably screening them out. I'd put my money on that station trying to throw shit back in GNR's face for the threats with the 'cease and desist' letters... no question.

I sent the same tunes to some friends at 98Rock in Baltimore and they won't play them on the air because they got some email from GNR management about not playing any leaked tracks. I asked if they mentioned anything about official releases coming up anytime soon and they did not comment. Anyway, those folks down there think TWAT and BETTER are unreal, in a GOOD way. Better than much of the old GNR material, and leaps and bounds better than anything on the radio today. One guy down there told me music like that might help save their station. Let's face it, any kind of radio is fighthing satellite radio now and they're hoping for some good shit to play to get listeners back on the airwaves.

Furthermore, of the people I've introduced the songs too (an entire baseball team at practices), young and old, they're blown away too by the songs. The first time I put the disk I made in our practice facilities sound system while we were working out, the younger guys were like: "Man, who the hell is this? This sounds awesome!". Us older guys who easily recognize Axl's voice made bets with the younger guys as to who it was... eventually one of them figured it out. Since I've played the songs for them over and over, they keep telling me how great they are and are asking me about GNR and what's going on. It's pretty exciting to say the least. Not a single person I've talked to outside of this forum thinks any of the new stuff sucks.

Therefore, I'm afraid the people on here who don't like the songs either are refusing to like them because they're so stuck in the past or have some sort of personal vendetta against Axl (makes you wonder why some of them are even here if that's the case), or they're just not a fan of this more modern sound. Some people ask about guitar solo's in these songs and I wonder if they're deaf. TWAT, for one, has AMAZING, blusey solos at the end of the song that last for damned near 2 minutes long.

So once again, that's my two cents on this subject. In my book, TWAT is the best of the lot and just simply genious. I think it's my favorite ballad of any GNR song, ever. Better than November Rain, Estranged, Breakdown, you name it. Better is hot on its heels and IRS is pretty good, but no epic.

Mark my words, there will be AT LEAST 5 top 10 singles on this album and that's a modest estimate at best. I wouldn't be surprised if 10 singles make the top 10. I'm not saying that because I'm a huge fan, I'm saying that because when I turn on the radio I hear nothing but shit. The Blues, Maddy, TWAT, Better and IRS are all realistic top 10 songs compared to the competiton out there. No doubt about it. And that's only a fraction of what's going to be on the album.

Take that to the bank.

[F*ck Fear]

I'm going to type this next comment in caps lock so those who scan pages can read this as well.

IF YOU WERE EXPECTING SOMETHING REVOLUTIONARY,YOU ARE A FUCKING IDIOT!

[kaddisonmoore]

I.R.S.: Cool song, but what happened here? It had so much energy before but now it is all gone. I like the way the words make more sense now, but it needs more UMPH to it. When the beginning starts in, I have this image of Pokemon and Barney holding hands running through a field.

lol

i agree about the solos too but they arnt terrible

[shades]

First let me say,

I hope the majority of the songs on the new CD are more like IRS than T.W.A.T. and Better.

IRS is a good tune, and a good quality recording will make it even better.

And no song is "leaked" unless somebody wants it "leaked".

So my guess is somebody is testing the waters.

Which might explain the diversity of the three.

T.W.A.T. being the epic all over the place Ballad/instrumental.

IRS being the catchy vintage Axl riff

And better being the new techno sound we have heard is coming from him.

( hopefully he will shelve the techno stuff)

All in all, I cant wait to hear more, something is finally happening.

And just having IRS and The Blues will make it better than most of the shit coming out these days.

JMO

Edited February 21, 2006 by shades

[Zeppelin]

I'm going to type this next comment in caps lock so those who scan pages can read this as well.

IF YOU WERE EXPECTING SOMETHING REVOLUTIONARY,YOU ARE A FUCKING IDIOT!

That's why Kaneda is a retard. He never even expected to hear anything from the band he claims to be "not real". Now, we hear a few demos, and he automatically has the amazing opinion of every other hack on this board, believing that they might actually exist now? Gimme a fucking break. Take a hike, Kaneda. Everyone else has made the same points you have about the demos, and people support your opinion like it's candy-flavoured shit from your ass. Pathetic really. You actually comment positive on a few demos from a band you thought would never be heard from again. Yeah, really good. Dumbass.

[Alan Niveen]

Time will tell who was right and who was wrong.

[SlashisGOD]

Good to hear from you again Kaneda. I agree with the solos being boring and monotone. Where is Slash when you need him?

Better is definately the strongest track, just by hearing 2 minutes of it you can tell it is.

TWAT is better than IRS, but not by much. Cool lyrics, but nothing memorable music wise

IRS is well, let's face it, boring. Hip hop beats in GnR don't work. Fuckin' disgrace.

But I still have high hopes that the album will contain mostly great songs. After all, we do have The Blues and Madagascar.

[*ParadiseCityGirl*]

kaneda I agree with you on alot of things (ie the solos, TWAT being too much etc.) But I also disagree on some things.

First of all, IRS is not as bad of a song as how you put it IMO. I think it's a very balanced and thought out song. The lyrics are good, and that hard rock sound is mixed with some slower relaxed music so it all evens out. And that high pitched scream he does toward the end is AMAZINg!!

Kaneda you are right, they are only demos. So TWAT hopefully will change a bit and be straightened out if it's put on CD. I was thinking the exact same thing as you as far as the 'layering too much music' thing goes.

I think Better is absoulutley perfect.

EDIT: I still think we need SLASH back!!!!!!!!!!!!

Edited February 21, 2006 by *ParadiseCityGirl*

[Sergito]

i agree with you about the solos kaneda. people are worried about bucket not being on the album and that hurting the solos on CD but come on they are just heartless shredding and tapping. sure it sounds cool but it is gutless and emotionless. axl writes and sings lyrics that are designed for a bluesly rock guitar player not a shredder.

One of the best posts I've ever seen... That's what I wanted to say..... yesterday I was listenging to UYI's and I realized that The mix between Axl's voice and Slash's and Izzy's style was perfect ( Axl & Blues)...., but then I was listening to TWAT and specially IRS and I percieved that the mix wasn't good enough... and it was because Bucket didn't left the feel on the songs...

It's sad.. but I think there is a big misconception about a good guitar player... I'm aware that slash maybe can't shred like bucket... but you know what?'? the guy puts something on songs that makes them very special...

Anyway I have faith on robin finck, and I think that he can do the Job... he seems to be a very emotional guy, and I'm pretty confident about he will do the job..

Finally I wanted to conclude this post saying that maybe Axl was made to sing songs like the ones he used to sing and not the new ones.... Maybe the old mix was the perfect one..

[SlashisGOD]

i agree with you about the solos kaneda. people are worried about bucket not being on the album and that hurting the solos on CD but come on they are just heartless shredding and tapping. sure it sounds cool but it is gutless and emotionless. axl writes and sings lyrics that are designed for a bluesly rock guitar player not a shredder.

One of the best posts I've ever seen... That's what I wanted to say..... yesterday I was listenging to UYI's and I realized that The mix between Axl's voice and Slash's and Izzy's style was perfect ( Axl & Blues)...., but then I was listening to TWAT and specially IRS and I percieved that the mix wasn't good enough... and it was because Bucket didn't left the feel on the songs...

It's sad.. but I think there is a big misconception about a good guitar player... I'm aware that slash maybe can't shred like bucket... but you know what?'? the guy puts something on songs that makes them very special...

Anyway I have faith on robin finck, and I think that he can do the Job... he seems to be a very emotional guy, and I'm pretty confident about he will do the job..

Finally I wanted to conclude this post saying that maybe Axl was made to sing songs like the ones he used to sing and not the new ones.... Maybe the old mix was the perfect one..

You're right. The old style was perfect. It didn't need to be changed one bit.

Hell, some of my favorite GnR songs were the ones that weren't big hits, i.e. Bad Apples, Don't Damn Me, Breakdown, Locomotive, etc. As far as guitarists go, for this band, there is no one but Slash. I know it's been said before a million times, but Slash is just THE perfect guitar player for GnR. His soulful solos and emotional riffs just gave GnR something extra special that all the bands of the time lacked. Sure Buckethead can shred like a mother, but beyond that, he can't do much. Slash can pull off a shred fest (PC), he can play with soul (November Rain), and he can throw some punk in there too (Garden of Eden.)

The Izzy/Slash combination was just magical. Those guys could write the greatest song of all time together.

I am going to buy the album no matter what regardless of my complaints and worries, but I will always, as many will do as well, long for hearing Slash on a GnR record. If some of the rumors are true, and Slash and Izzy rejoin, then I can't help but KNOW that GnR will never be half assed, boring, or monotone.

I do feel that Fortus is the guy Axl needs to play lead and not Finck. If you can't have Slash, then use Richard. He is a lot better than Finck, who you never know if he is going to fuck up a part or hit it dead on. Richard will hit it right all the time.

Just my two cents.

Edited February 21, 2006 by SlashisGOD

[GooseKiller]

but are all of the callers in Boston wrong too? The general consensus is poor

Wow...the callers to 1 radio station, that overplays the songs, are not happy with it. So what. Most people seem to like it, even the people who are starting to realize its not the 80's anymore.

[LiveWire315]

Fact: guitar solos don't equal great music, and the lack of them certainly doesn't qualify the music as bad either. This is a NEW BAND. Expect large differences. Personally, I've heard twat and irs, and I think they're magnificent, each one. the vocals on twat need to be turned up a little though, but i mean come on, give it a chance.

[Nick85]

but are all of the callers in Boston wrong too? The general consensus is poor

Wow...the callers to 1 radio station, that overplays the songs, are not happy with it. So what. Most people seem to like it, even the people who are starting to realize its not the 80's anymore.

exactly

[vince41090]

To say Slash's absence is killing this new band is an understatement. None of these new solos do anything for me...

And Slash's solos in Velvet Revolver do?

[germanrose]

Well to throw in my 2 cents:

I like all three songs. They are different to everything else which is out there right now, and if i imagine that they will all be more "powerful" and better mixed on the cd, i really like one song better than the whole velvet revolver album, and i don`t think contraband is bad.

BUT: first i agree, you can not replace Slash, never ever....listen to old stuff, for example November rain, for all of you who play guitar too, probably the cheapest solo technically, but if you listen to hím play it, you`ll recognize he`s unique and one of the greatest players of all times!!

AND: i will buy the album, will go to NOVA ROCK and will listen to his stuff, but i don`t know if you need 14 years to make these songs, and sorry to bring that point up, but this, IS NOT Guns n Roses.... It is great but it IS NOT Guns n Roses......

that`s it and edit: i know these are demos.....so i still hope.....

[Alan Niveen]

The Izzy/Slash combination was just magical. Those guys could write the greatest song of all time together.

I am going to buy the album no matter what regardless of my complaints and worries, but I will always, as many will do as well, long for hearing Slash on a GnR record. If some of the rumors are true, and Slash and Izzy rejoin, then I can't help but KNOW that GnR will never be half assed, boring, or monotone.

I do feel that Fortus is the guy Axl needs to play lead and not Finck. If you can't have Slash, then use Richard. He is a lot better than Finck, who you never know if he is going to fuck up a part or hit it dead on. Richard will hit it right all the time.

I agree. Except for one thing : I can't see either Finck (lack of skill) or Fortus (lack of charisma) as lead guitarists of GN'R.

Edited February 21, 2006 by Alan Niveen

[NiGhTrAiN®]

It's been a few month's but now that there is actually something concrete to discuss instead of mere speculation, I thought I would drop my two cents in about the leaked material. I've listened to the material all day long and here is my initial response:

14 years and the most expensive album ever for this? These songs are good, very different from GNR of old, but nothing earth shattering here or even revolutionary. Let's break them down by song:

I.R.S.: Cool song, but what happened here? It had so much energy before but now it is all gone. I like the way the words make more sense now, but it needs more UMPH to it. When the beginning starts in, I have this image of Pokemon and Barney holding hands running through a field.

T.W.A.T. : Most disappointing of them all. I really expected so much from this song as it has been tauted for such a long time as a hit by those that have heard it, but man, it's a sporadic mess. It's too chaotic, the music is going in 5 different directions at the same time. Too much layering of music ontop of music. Listen to it again, Axl gets so lost in all of the music fighting for attention. Nothing memorable here. After hearing it 10 times, I still can't recall a memorable line or solo worthy of Guns N Roses.

Better: No pun intended, but this is much Better than the other two. It's different, but it works. Axl's voice sounds the best and the refrain at the beginning and middle is very unique and cool. Best track of the three, by far. However, so far from what GNR of old, that this can not be the first single.

After hearing all of the new material numerous times, I hate to say it, but I am worried that Chinese Democracy is not going to live up to expectations, not even close. Nothing so far has even come close to the epics from GNR's hayday. Even songs that weren't singles like Civil War, Locomotive, Breakdown, Dead Horse are better than anything Axl has been able to come up with by himself. While some of us on here will convince ourselves everything Axl does is genius, I am really worried that old GNR fans are going to HATE this new incarnation. Hate is a strong word, but when you replace all the original members of the biggest band of the 80's/90s and make people wait 14 years for a song like TWAT, there are going to be a lot of disappointed people.

My only hope is that Axl has some Jungle, some Paradise City, some ace up his sleeve that he is hiding until the album comes out. But deep down inside I feel this is it, this is the mythical album we've all built up so much and it doesn't come close to my expectations at all.

THE LAST BIGGEST PROBLEM OF THE NEW MATERIAL: GUITAR SOLOS!

To say Slash's absence is killing this new band is an understatement. None of these new solos do anything for me...They just come and go on the songs, but nothing is soulful the way Slash's solos used to be. I am very worried for Axl, very worried.

You see there's gonna be a lot of ppl bitching CD doesn't sound as great as they expected when it's finally released. No matter how great it might be, ppl are gonna complain.Some ppl are just never happy with anything. Truth is, for us real GnR diehard fans, it doesn't matter,really. If Axl recorded the the sound of his fart and released a cd entitled "Axl Rose's farting remixes - No democracy,no right to vote- Just listen up and smell the smoke” we would buy it and smile proudly saying no one else blows wind like he does.Some other ppl will say it is poor musically or that he didn't eat enough cheese the night before so that's why it doesn't sound so great. I mean, wtf is your problem? If you go back and check Perfect Crime or November Rain demos they sound like sh*t. It is hard to believe they turned out to sound so great in the final version and honestly, from the songs we've had opportunity to check out , even being only demo, I thought they rocked. I agree that ppl have different opinions but that sorta makes me understand why Axl has been so reclusive. Songs are great, his voice is perfect , but ppl are always gonna complain. This, me thinks, is one of the reasons he's so compulsively perfectionist and reclusive and is one of the reasons for the delay of the album.

I would be more than happy if all songs were as 'simple' as Better. I don't need any BS, sophistication,complexity or any of that crap that annoying ppl like to expect. I mean, just his voice singing nice lyrics with nice rhymes and a good rhythm guitar and solo accomplishes for a perfect CD for me. What else could I expect when I put a Guns n Roses cd in my car's cd-player and turn up the volume? No more “I'm not happy with the final results.”What else do you want ? Axl wrapped up in ribbons delivered in your house by Fedex?

Give me a fuckin' break. If 13 years is not long enough for you to listen that voice that makes you bang your head and yell “yeeeeeah” frantically, maybe you should check the website www.ineedabiggerdildo.com to help you stop complaining and enjoy the moment for

Edited February 21, 2006 by NiGhTrAiN®

[laz]

if you compare these three demos and todays music you must agree that these songs are not bad.i dont think we should compare these demos with the old guns stuff!!that was very special.