Message to all members

[Zint]

So I take it that the hate list that leeked was legit?

Not necessarily..

Keep in mind,Ron showed up here to shoot down one of the false rumours going around.

[Guest siliconmessiah]

Does this mean it´s now freely ok to discuss the M51-topic again?

[sascha]

Thanks for the update. However, if I feel like discussing something, I will discuss it. If I choose to not discuss it here, that should be out of respect to the people who run this site and not because Axl threatens the very people who spend their time and effort to run a fansite about him. If he has a legal problem with people stealing his private and business correspondence and intellectual property he should drag those responsible to court and have them put to justice. And if he's got an image problem, he should call it by its real name and not try to solve it by shutting up the hardcore fans. Is that the same Axl who wrote an essay about freedom and went to moon and back for his own integrity? The more I hear, the less I listen. Again, thanks for the update. It tells me that the mods do not censor fans, Axl himself does. And it also tells me every single word MSL said was the truth.

[Street_Of_Dreams]

And the Highway to Here Today Gone to Hell begins...

[Ali]

So what MSL had was legit...

Basically yes, but I´m sure, not in every detail. I still believe in Rons words & I have seen, that MSLs perception and acting is somehow, well, twisted.

Based on everything I read about the whole issue at different places, I think he used the facts he got to create his own story.

I think that, yes, MSL had some legitimate info.

But, I do not think that everything he had in terms of that list was accurate in terms of the way he portrayed it in the list. In other words, I think he made the documents sound more provocative then they actually were in the list because he was shopping around the stolen documents for a personal payday (he admitted as much). I also think he more than likely took certain discussions out of context.

I believe he met a poster at GNREvolution and showed that poster some of the documents. That poster reported that, as an example, the alleged e-mail from Beta on how to "trick" Axl was really an e-mail advising Merck on how best to approach Axl on a particular subject.

Ali

[Axl_morris]

Fuckin MSL. All he has done is release nothing and caused friction between this site and the band. This HAS to be the worst offence caused by a member to date and he must be blocked forever.

Also, even with Eric being away, other admins should have locked his thread from the second he put it up. As he had no credible source to what he claimed and proved nothing. And even if some things were to be true, mygnrforum shouldn't promote the stuff he claimed too have being leaked by keeping that thread open for way to long.

[feconroses]

Censor leaked/stolen/private information? Its ok.

Censor the discussion about it its NOT ok.

Maybe there are other gnr boards that are still free and discussion is not censored.

[Nick85]

Ron said no one was asked to remove anything and that all the "credible" GNR sites were taking it down of their own choosing.

Someone just lost a bit of credibility.

[Nick85]

Yeah, can't say I'd blame the mods either. Once lawyers are brought into the picture, your hands are kind of tied.

Sicking lawyers on a fansite to bully the mods into shutting everyone up. One great PR move after another.

[Ali]

Ron said no one was asked to remove anything and that all the "credible" GNR sites were taking it down of their own choosing.

Someone just lost a bit of credibility.

No, I don't think so.

I think Ron was referring to the "youthinkso" post, not the MSL crap.

Ali

[Nick85]

Ron said no one was asked to remove anything and that all the "credible" GNR sites were taking it down of their own choosing.

Someone just lost a bit of credibility.

No, I don't think so.

I think Ron was referring to the "youthinkso" post, not the MSL crap.

Ali

I thought he was referring to everything that was being removed. Keep in mind it was MSL's comments that brought Ron to post on this site in the first place.

[Guest siliconmessiah]

The gnr legal team is way out of line.

The legal team (with Axl in command) does what they are paid to do.

Example: If the internal business e-mails of "McDonalds" came out in the wrong hands. Their legal team would act the same way. That´s why I´m not surprised.

What surprises me is how far my Guns & Fuckin´ Roses have drifted away, and keeps on drifting away with the legacy.

The legacy that could have been built upon great music and anticipation, momentum. The fantastic momentum they had in 2002 (with a fantastic band) and in 2006 (with a fantastic energy)

That got all fucked up and left us with one released album in 2008 and a 10 years tour of the same album, and a completely new band.

There probably was no album-trilogy, we probably won´t get any new music in a good long time.

I don´t know who to blame.

You cannot just blame Axl, but of course he had the biggest part of responsibility and all was laid up for him.

But people left, and things got fucked up over these years....a real shame.

Edited March 3, 2011 by siliconmessiah

[mr-fukaji]

Not to play backseat mod here, but anyone complaining about censorship and complaining that the place is going the way of HTGTH needs to get it into their enormous Mekon like heads that the forum was dealt a real life legal letter from fully grown humans with capable working brains, and was dealt with as such. Had they gone down your bullshit fantasy route of ignoring it and pissing off the entire band and their managment in the process whilst in 'Not Fucking Around One Little Bit' mode, then there'd likely be no forum for you to act like a jackass on.

Best regards.

[Ali]

Ron said no one was asked to remove anything and that all the "credible" GNR sites were taking it down of their own choosing.

Someone just lost a bit of credibility.

No, I don't think so.

I think Ron was referring to the "youthinkso" post, not the MSL crap.

Ali

I thought he was referring to everything that was being removed. Keep in mind it was MSL's comments that brought Ron to post on this site in the first place.

I do not think so. I think it was specifically in reference to the "youthinkso" posts which were made on 02/22, and Ron's tweet was on 02/24.

Ali

[Bards]

The C&D letter is a load of shit. Eric is in no actionable position here. But despite that, it seems to have spooked him. That was the letter's only intent and the only thing it could achieve.

I'm disappointed he decided to bow down and censor the discussion this way. I suspect now that there's been a precedent set, anything Axl doesn't like will be met with a similar response and a similar result.

[Guest siliconmessiah]

The C&D letter is a load of shit. Eric is in no actionable position here. But despite that, it seems to have spooked him. That was the letter's only intent and the only thing it could achieve.

I'm disappointed he decided to bow down and censor the discussion this way. I suspect now that there's been a precedent set, anything Axl doesn't like will be met with a similar response and a similar result.

I am all for free speech, although it demands good moderation because of the random reunion-shit-spreaders that pop-up here each day, posting new threads in the wrong section. And talking shit about the new band.

HOWEVER. If this place becomes a place for censorship and such. People WILL leave and look for other boards, people are not stupid.

Look what happened to HTGTH. It´s nothing like it used to be, people fled when it got rumor-censored...I haven´t been on there in years.

[Martin Riggs]

So I take it that the hate list that leeked was legit?

Not necessarily..

Keep in mind,Ron showed up here to shoot down one of the false rumours going around.

Yeah Ron came here, but don't forget that just because Ron claimed those feelings were untrue...doesn't mean that somebody else in the GNR camp thought he felt that way and sent out emails,etc. talking about it. Ron telling the truth and the emails on tha topic being real aren't mutually exclusive.

[cancerface]

seems extreme. but this is a pretty extreme case... an artist's emails being stolen and hawked off. that's pretty terrible, and i can understand why he'd want the site to keep from spreading it. and i can understand why, even though technically it's censorship whatever, it was still somewhat easier to grant axl his wishes when you consider the specifics of this situation and how completely and thoroughly unlikable msl keeps proving himself to be. just an all around unpleasant presence to have around. in spite of axl's obvious issues, the people who run the site are still fans. just a shitty situation for them to be stuck in. but i can see why they made that call.

even though i think it's silly to try and keep us from talking about the situation. axl wouldn't have the right to keep me and my friends from joking about it on facebook, would he? or on the phone? or in person? and this particular battle seems futile since the public opinion of msl was overwhelmingly negative for lots of reasons -- even to those who were totally into reading those emails. ultimately, i think fans talking about the situation and dissing msl was a separate situation from msl stealing axl's emails and trying to sell them. now it makes it seem like it's axl vs. msl and his fans, instead of axl vs. msl.

but of course, it seems like it's always axl vs. the world. everyone is an enemy.

[Andrew07]

alright so this leads credence to these articles being true, which worries me sorta but bumble contradicted some of them so maybe there not all true? idk what to think now

[Guest siliconmessiah]

That's exactly what lawyers do. Send a letter and scare and threaten you

I find it so ironic that axl had freedom of speech in his lyrics on one in a million yet tries to revoke our freedom of speech

And yes the layered represent the band. So the band cannot distance themselves or play dumb

the hypocrisy is amazing. Again, can't blame the mods

See!

This is what I´m talking about.

Another of those hundreds "newbie-8-times-poster" that comes into threads just shoveling shit on Axl Rose.

I wonder who´s making all those fake-user accounts?

[Nick85]

Ron said no one was asked to remove anything and that all the "credible" GNR sites were taking it down of their own choosing.

Someone just lost a bit of credibility.

No, I don't think so.

I think Ron was referring to the "youthinkso" post, not the MSL crap.

Ali

I thought he was referring to everything that was being removed. Keep in mind it was MSL's comments that brought Ron to post on this site in the first place.

I do not think so. I think it was specifically in reference to the "youthinkso" posts which were made on 02/22, and Ron's tweet was on 02/24.

Ali

If that's the case, then I take back my statement about Ron. I still think it's a horrible PR move to bully a fansite on the part of GNR's legal team.

[therealdoofey]

As someone who used to work in a media related field, I am fairly used to seeing these types of letters from celebrities. The way the band went about it here leads to me to believe whatever MSL had was in fact fake. Otherwise, I'm not sure what legal ground they'd have to stand on telling people they can't print that stuff. If it was fake and he was attempting to slander the band, I don't blame them one bit for telling people not to print it. As you can see, very few media outlets did anyways for this very reason. Metal Sludge I think is the only one that did.

If I were still working in media, I'd have never printed this stuff or put it on my website. There is no way to prove it's real, even MSL can't promise you it's real if he indeed got the info the way he claims. I also laughed at his notion that Classic Rock or any other magazine was willing to pay him money for this. First of all you don't pay someone for information that isn't 100% exclusive. Since he claimed the info was emailed to him, who's to say it wasn't emailed to others out there? And then there's the problem of proving it's legit, which would be impossible.

So I don't blame you for taking it down, Eric. Thats what I'd have done. I also don't blame GNR for being mad. Especially if this guy is a fake or if he was attempting to extort them like he said was. Glad it's over.

[MB.]

As someone who used to work in a media related field, I am fairly used to seeing these types of letters from celebrities. The way the band went about it here leads to me to believe whatever MSL had was in fact fake. Otherwise, I'm not sure what legal ground they'd have to stand on telling people they can't print that stuff. If it was fake and he was attempting to slander the band, I don't blame them one bit for telling people not to print it. As you can see, very few media outlets did anyways for this very reason. Metal Sludge I think is the only one that did.

If I were still working in media, I'd have never printed this stuff or put it on my website. There is no way to prove it's real, even MSL can't promise you it's real if he indeed got the info the way he claims. I also laughed at his notion that Classic Rock or any other magazine was willing to pay him money for this. First of all you don't pay someone for information that isn't 100% exclusive. Since he claimed the info was emailed to him, who's to say it wasn't emailed to others out there? And then there's the problem of proving it's legit, which would be impossible.

So I don't blame you for taking it down, Eric. Thats what I'd have done. I also don't blame GNR for being mad. Especially if this guy is a fake or if he was attempting to extort them like he said was. Glad it's over.

Good post

[Changes]

That's exactly what lawyers do. Send a letter and scare and threaten you

I find it so ironic that axl had freedom of speech in his lyrics on one in a million yet tries to revoke our freedom of speech

And yes the layered represent the band. So the band cannot distance themselves or play dumb

the hypocrisy is amazing. Again, can't blame the mods

Freedom of speech is defined as the right to publicly speak your opinion without government interference. I don't see how the right to discuss an individual's personal correspondence is freedom of speech. In fact, it is completely understandable how he would do anything he could to keep this stolen, private information from the internet. Once it's out there, there is no stopping it no matter what punishment MSL gets; his privacy has already been violated. Even if the documents were never released, you could pretty much read our conversations and get what they were about.

Saw someone else pointing out this thing about Axl being a hypocrite for advocating freedom of speech too. Unbelievable. Concerning about the human rights of the people of China does not mean embracing random people on the internet discussing what you wrote in a private e-mail sent to your closest.

Edited March 3, 2011 by Changes

[axl666]

You can call me a newbie all you want. How does that make my point less valid? I'm not claiming what msl did was not wrong. Hell, personal and private info was stolen. That's pretty low and should be dealt with

but this is an attack on free speech. We are not disseminating the info - merely speculating on it's existence.

It's a chilling effect:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chilling_effect_(law)