HOF lineup why didn't slash ever stand up to axl

[Raz0r]

Fight or flight, and Slash chose flight.

But I've had the same thought, all the beefs Slash and Duff made public, the coming on stage late, not liking new members, etc, could have been resolved by talking shit out.

Duff mentioned million times in his book how much he hated Axl going on stage late, but doesn't mention once talking to him about it. I wonder if Axl even knew it bothered him so much.

Slash complained about the late starts, and the hiring of Paul Huge, than he talks about how Axl had a dinner with him to discuss the future of the band and to try and get Slash and himself on the same page, and Slash admittedly doesn't bring any of it up. Seriously, what better opportunity is there than that, "you want me on the same page, can Huge, show up to practice, show to gigs on time, and I'm all in"

Not to be to hard on Slash, he doesn't like confrontation, power to him, to each his own, but fuck, if they could have just communicated with each other a little better.

As for Duff, I think he was just a guy that bottled up his emotions and delt with his shit on his own.

[sweetness]

Pretty sure saying "Fuck this, I'm out" was the ultimate way of standing up to the little red headed spaz

[spIdeZ]

Slash did stand up to Axl. Slash is the only reason why the UYI tour even happened. Without Slash forcing Axl to actually work and make money, Axl's career would have been over after AFD.

[wasted]

supposedly Slash didn't make much money from the UYI tour, late fees and epic parties kind of ate into their share.

[dalsh327]

10 years of working together, and they didn't mesh anymore. Slash was just more reserved in how he handled things, I just think once they refused to do each others songs and they were putting the songs down, that was pretty much it, and Paul's presence wasn't helping. They were also doing their own things.

[wasted]

Huge seemed to be brought in to work with Axl on his songs. Slash seemed at that point to need to be constantly on the move, a quick record and back on the road. hanging in a studio re-doing solos for Axl's next project probably would have killed him.

[Robert G Durant]

Slash stood up to him, but on all the wrong stuff. They got back from the UYI tours feeling sick of Axl bossing them around. Axl wanted to write and record as a band, but everyone was mad at him for being a dick on tour and refused, wasting studio time. Since no one was communicating, Axl assumed the problem was writer's block and brought in Paul Huge to be an impartial party to give them some basic riffs to write around. Everyone assumed Axl was trying to replace Slash and withdrew even further. Slash showed up with the Snakepit album completely written and said "this is the next GnR record or I walk". Axl told him no because he felt they needed to all collaborate on songwriting, and Slash quit.

Matt assumed Slash had been fired, and refused to work until Axl re-hired Slash, so Axl fired Matt for not working. Gilby decided to quit showing up to the studio until he heard they would actually be recording and one day his paychecks stopped showing up, so he assumed he was fired. Duff stayed in for years, until he finally got tired of waiting for the drama to be sorted and quit to relaunch his solo career.

Slash should never have signed away his share of the band name, but try telling a junkie not to sell his possessions for quick cash.

[Intercourse]

Slash stood up to him, but on all the wrong stuff. They got back from the UYI tours feeling sick of Axl bossing them around. Axl wanted to write and record as a band, but everyone was mad at him for being a dick on tour and refused, wasting studio time. Since no one was communicating, Axl assumed the problem was writer's block and brought in Paul Huge to be an impartial party to give them some basic riffs to write around. Everyone assumed Axl was trying to replace Slash and withdrew even further. Slash showed up with the Snakepit album completely written and said "this is the next GnR record or I walk". Axl told him no because he felt they needed to all collaborate on songwriting, and Slash quit.

Matt assumed Slash had been fired, and refused to work until Axl re-hired Slash, so Axl fired Matt for not working. Gilby decided to quit showing up to the studio until he heard they would actually be recording and one day his paychecks stopped showing up, so he assumed he was fired. Duff stayed in for years, until he finally got tired of waiting for the drama to be sorted and quit to relaunch his solo career.

Slash should never have signed away his share of the band name, but try telling a junkie not to sell his possessions for quick cash.

this is probably the fairest summation in a while.

[Intercourse]

Slash was rich, drug addled and hugely popular...plus very, very young.

Not the best combo of influences to carry and be expected to manage a complex situation like the one at hand at the time.

A decent band manager should have sorted this out, that's what managers are for.

I think the problem was that GNR's manager was an Axl yes man who spotted a chance for Axl and more importantly himself to take total control of the biggest band (money juggernaut) in the world.

It looks to me like the manager drove the split rather than worked to reunite the various factions. It should have never been a situation where Axl moved about shadowed by the band manager while a pivotal guy like Slash was left to fester.

[kanudo19]

seriously...why not

i can't think of one time when he did

yes axl will freak out but who cares stand up to him and the band doesn't break up

it just seems that the entire origin of the problem stems from slashs and duff's for that matter as well to completly shy away and pussy out of confrontations

because slash's ego was so big from playing with all the huge names in the biz that he didnt gave a fuck about gnr by the end of the illusions tour. Only when he noticed that he needed gnr in order to remain "big", that he decided to try and revert things. When he realized he couldnt, he had to go around saving face and making axl look like the bad guy.

Why ? cuz he knows axl so well that he knew he'd never fight back publicly

[magisme]

This thread isn't far removed from fan fiction.

[Damn_Smooth]

This thread forum isn't far removed from fan fiction.

Fixed that for you.

Edited May 15, 2014 by Damn_Smooth

[combos]

I'm sure he stood up to Axl plenty of times. They're both very confrontational men. The only difference is, Slash is passive aggressive.

[dalsh327]

Slash was rich, drug addled and hugely popular...plus very, very young.

Not the best combo of influences to carry and be expected to manage a complex situation like the one at hand at the time.

A decent band manager should have sorted this out, that's what managers are for.

I think the problem was that GNR's manager was an Axl yes man who spotted a chance for Axl and more importantly himself to take total control of the biggest band (money juggernaut) in the world.

It looks to me like the manager drove the split rather than worked to reunite the various factions. It should have never been a situation where Axl moved about shadowed by the band manager while a pivotal guy like Slash was left to fester.

Bands aren't complex if everyone has a common goal and in it to have fun, which they were. It's when the money came in after they got off the road for Appetite and wanting to do things big that made it complicated.

Money magnifies your personality more than it changes you. The people around you change more.

Axl wanted someone in his corner, which Alan Niven didn't seem to be. Why pick a security head though?

[Guns n' Swedes]

I read Slash's and Duff's books. My impression is that a lot of these things are Slash's and Duff's fault. Even more than I thought. They were drunk and drugged out so many times and they even blamed some of those things on Axl. There are not many examples of them ever dealing with anything with Axl. No wonder Axl felt that he needs to be in control of the band, when all the other guys were just drinking and drugging themselves.

Axl gets so much blame for things, but the truth is that the other guys left instead of staying and fighting. Slash handled these things in a rather childish way I think, based on the stories in his book.

[alfierose]

I'm sure he stood up to Axl plenty of times. They're both very confrontational men. The only difference is, Slash is passive aggressive.

I've noticed when it comes to personal stuff he very rarely states what he means in a way that isn't open to interpretation ( I know Axl does this too but his way is more of an eccentric vain). Compare Slash's and Duff's recent mothers day tweets and you'll see what I mean.

I think they both probably confused the hell out of each other then paranoia and others with agendas filled in the gaps.

[Nosaj Thing]

Because Axl is an unreasonable person. I bet Slash and Axl have had countless arguments during the UYI tour. What about those 4 hour phone calls almost everyday trying to reach a compromise? What about those issues with Slash and Duff at A&M Studios?

The main problem is that Axl doesn't like to be confronted, he has forced himself in a dream world where nobody questions what he wants to do or how he wants to do it and look at him now. One mediocre album in 20 years and a band filled with replacements of the members that were in his original vision after real Guns N' Roses broke up. What happened? Where are those songs and records and albums and members that would make each and every Guns N' Roses fan forget about the old line-up?

Axl is also known for blaming others when things are his own fault. He praised Izzy then Izzy left. He started to talk shit about him, dedicated Double Talkin' Jive to him during almost the entire UYI tour like a butthurt 10 year old. He told everyone who wanted Izzy: "FUCK IZZY, GILBY CLARKE!" (which you can hear in bootlegs like Argentina, 1993) then fired Gilby and talked shit about him. He praised Matt Sorum for his work in the UYIs, then fired Matt and talked shit about him.

He praised Slash, thanked him for his guitar melodies on Estranged in the UYI booklet, then said that he should have left after Lies. Called Slash a cancer that better removed but... what happened Axl? You remove a cancer, you don't wait until the cancer walks away. Why you didn't tell Slash to leave Guns? Why did you try so hard to get Slash back in the band after he left? Why did you want Slash for 2 or 3 Chinese Democracy songs? It looks like you loved to have the cancer in your system.

He praised Buckethead, then Buckethead left because the band was inactive and he went to talk shit about him, blaming him for the cancellation of RIR 2004. Reducing his royalties to a ridiculous percentage. Stating that Buckethead was very difficult to work as he didn't want to move forward with recordings. Really funny because according to Buckethead, he left because of the same thing.

Question is, when is it going to be his own fault? How do you deal with a person like that?

At this point, I couldn't be happier things happened this way. I would have loved if Axl would have done something else with the name but in the end, whatever has happened with Guns after all the "drug addicts uncompromising scumbags" quit, it is 100% Axl fault. Just because Axl keeps using the same, old, boring, overused, overexaggerated, ridiculous statement using words like "expense" "lied to" "misguided" "deluded" doesn't mean that he's telling the truth.

[maynard]

Because Axl is an unreasonable person. I bet Slash and Axl have had countless arguments during the UYI tour. What about those 4 hour phone calls almost everyday trying to reach a compromise? What about those issues with Slash and Duff at A&M Studios?

The main problem is that Axl doesn't like to be confronted, he has forced himself in a dream world where nobody questions what he wants to do or how he wants to do it and look at him now. One mediocre album in 20 years and a band filled with replacements of the members that were in his original vision after real Guns N' Roses broke up. What happened? Where are those songs and records and albums and members that would make each and every Guns N' Roses fan forget about the old line-up?

Axl is also known for blaming others when things are his own fault. He praised Izzy then Izzy left. He started to talk shit about him, dedicated Double Talkin' Jive to him during almost the entire UYI tour like a butthurt 10 year old. He told everyone who wanted Izzy: "FUCK IZZY, GILBY CLARKE!" (which you can hear in bootlegs like Argentina, 1993) then fired Gilby and talked shit about him. He praised Matt Sorum for his work in the UYIs, then fired Matt and talked shit about him.

He praised Slash, thanked him for his guitar melodies on Estranged in the UYI booklet, then said that he should have left after Lies. Called Slash a cancer that better removed but... what happened Axl? You remove a cancer, you don't wait until the cancer walks away. Why you didn't tell Slash to leave Guns? Why did you try so hard to get Slash back in the band after he left? Why did you want Slash for 2 or 3 Chinese Democracy songs? It looks like you loved to have the cancer in your system.

He praised Buckethead, then Buckethead left because the band was inactive and he went to talk shit about him, blaming him for the cancellation of RIR 2004. Reducing his royalties to a ridiculous percentage. Stating that Buckethead was very difficult to work as he didn't want to move forward with recordings. Really funny because according to Buckethead, he left because of the same thing.

Question is, when is it going to be his own fault? How do you deal with a person like that?

At this point, I couldn't be happier things happened this way. I would have loved if Axl would have done something else with the name but in the end, whatever has happened with Guns after all the "drug addicts uncompromising scumbags" quit, it is 100% Axl fault. Just because Axl keeps using the same, old, boring, overused, overexaggerated, ridiculous statement using words like "expense" "lied to" "misguided" "deluded" doesn't mean that he's telling the truth.

mygnrforum.com index page should contain this message. after reading this, the person could enter the forum. Bravo!

[phaeryen]

He went on tour, with a band that carried his name, behind a mediocre album, instead of confronting Axl.

You can easily imagine a younger Axl, fuming with rage through the nose and his ears, watching the Snakepit thing happen while he was 'forced' to just wait & witness it.

Axl was big on the media game in the nineties, mind you.

[wasted]

I guess the people is pretty homogenous or everyonw just wants everything the same. god help us if GNR has more than one line up and doesn't release a record per quarter. back to australia, it's americas fault. hos before bros yo.

[DR DOOM]

Because Axl is an unreasonable person. I bet Slash and Axl have had countless arguments during the UYI tour. What about those 4 hour phone calls almost everyday trying to reach a compromise? What about those issues with Slash and Duff at A&M Studios?

The main problem is that Axl doesn't like to be confronted, he has forced himself in a dream world where nobody questions what he wants to do or how he wants to do it and look at him now. One mediocre album in 20 years and a band filled with replacements of the members that were in his original vision after real Guns N' Roses broke up. What happened? Where are those songs and records and albums and members that would make each and every Guns N' Roses fan forget about the old line-up?

Axl is also known for blaming others when things are his own fault. He praised Izzy then Izzy left. He started to talk shit about him, dedicated Double Talkin' Jive to him during almost the entire UYI tour like a butthurt 10 year old. He told everyone who wanted Izzy: "FUCK IZZY, GILBY CLARKE!" (which you can hear in bootlegs like Argentina, 1993) then fired Gilby and talked shit about him. He praised Matt Sorum for his work in the UYIs, then fired Matt and talked shit about him.

He praised Slash, thanked him for his guitar melodies on Estranged in the UYI booklet, then said that he should have left after Lies. Called Slash a cancer that better removed but... what happened Axl? You remove a cancer, you don't wait until the cancer walks away. Why you didn't tell Slash to leave Guns? Why did you try so hard to get Slash back in the band after he left? Why did you want Slash for 2 or 3 Chinese Democracy songs? It looks like you loved to have the cancer in your system.

He praised Buckethead, then Buckethead left because the band was inactive and he went to talk shit about him, blaming him for the cancellation of RIR 2004. Reducing his royalties to a ridiculous percentage. Stating that Buckethead was very difficult to work as he didn't want to move forward with recordings. Really funny because according to Buckethead, he left because of the same thing.

Question is, when is it going to be his own fault? How do you deal with a person like that?

At this point, I couldn't be happier things happened this way. I would have loved if Axl would have done something else with the name but in the end, whatever has happened with Guns after all the "drug addicts uncompromising scumbags" quit, it is 100% Axl fault. Just because Axl keeps using the same, old, boring, overused, overexaggerated, ridiculous statement using words like "expense" "lied to" "misguided" "deluded" doesn't mean that he's telling the truth.

Salsh sell soul to debil for play guitar, Axel bless by Jesus and try to fight Salsh.

He ask Salsh "plees no don attak me an rek GNR" but Salsh no listen.

Salsh leaf Axel and Axel cry, then Dizze play rok guitaring and make Axel look deep into his eyes- Dizee say he neva leave Axel.

Axel cry long and make album of rocker but Salsh and Stana get industree stop Axel relese albun too and now Axel sad.

[Patience 4 Axl]

Because Axl is an unreasonable person. I bet Slash and Axl have had countless arguments during the UYI tour. What about those 4 hour phone calls almost everyday trying to reach a compromise? What about those issues with Slash and Duff at A&M Studios?

The main problem is that Axl doesn't like to be confronted, he has forced himself in a dream world where nobody questions what he wants to do or how he wants to do it and look at him now. One mediocre album in 20 years and a band filled with replacements of the members that were in his original vision after real Guns N' Roses broke up. What happened? Where are those songs and records and albums and members that would make each and every Guns N' Roses fan forget about the old line-up?

Axl is also known for blaming others when things are his own fault. He praised Izzy then Izzy left. He started to talk shit about him, dedicated Double Talkin' Jive to him during almost the entire UYI tour like a butthurt 10 year old. He told everyone who wanted Izzy: "FUCK IZZY, GILBY CLARKE!" (which you can hear in bootlegs like Argentina, 1993) then fired Gilby and talked shit about him. He praised Matt Sorum for his work in the UYIs, then fired Matt and talked shit about him.

He praised Slash, thanked him for his guitar melodies on Estranged in the UYI booklet, then said that he should have left after Lies. Called Slash a cancer that better removed but... what happened Axl? You remove a cancer, you don't wait until the cancer walks away. Why you didn't tell Slash to leave Guns? Why did you try so hard to get Slash back in the band after he left? Why did you want Slash for 2 or 3 Chinese Democracy songs? It looks like you loved to have the cancer in your system.

He praised Buckethead, then Buckethead left because the band was inactive and he went to talk shit about him, blaming him for the cancellation of RIR 2004. Reducing his royalties to a ridiculous percentage. Stating that Buckethead was very difficult to work as he didn't want to move forward with recordings. Really funny because according to Buckethead, he left because of the same thing.

Question is, when is it going to be his own fault? How do you deal with a person like that?

At this point, I couldn't be happier things happened this way. I would have loved if Axl would have done something else with the name but in the end, whatever has happened with Guns after all the "drug addicts uncompromising scumbags" quit, it is 100% Axl fault. Just because Axl keeps using the same, old, boring, overused, overexaggerated, ridiculous statement using words like "expense" "lied to" "misguided" "deluded" doesn't mean that he's telling the truth.

Indeed.

He did the same thing the first time Finck left as well. It's a pattern that some people choose to ignore. They call Slash a pussy for finally walking away from the crazy, but you don't hear them saying the same about Izzy, Duff, Bucket, Robin. Selective reasoning is selective.

[ThinkAboutYou]

Because Axl is an unreasonable person. I bet Slash and Axl have had countless arguments during the UYI tour. What about those 4 hour phone calls almost everyday trying to reach a compromise? What about those issues with Slash and Duff at A&M Studios?

The main problem is that Axl doesn't like to be confronted, he has forced himself in a dream world where nobody questions what he wants to do or how he wants to do it and look at him now. One mediocre album in 20 years and a band filled with replacements of the members that were in his original vision after real Guns N' Roses broke up. What happened? Where are those songs and records and albums and members that would make each and every Guns N' Roses fan forget about the old line-up?

Axl is also known for blaming others when things are his own fault. He praised Izzy then Izzy left. He started to talk shit about him, dedicated Double Talkin' Jive to him during almost the entire UYI tour like a butthurt 10 year old. He told everyone who wanted Izzy: "FUCK IZZY, GILBY CLARKE!" (which you can hear in bootlegs like Argentina, 1993) then fired Gilby and talked shit about him. He praised Matt Sorum for his work in the UYIs, then fired Matt and talked shit about him.

He praised Slash, thanked him for his guitar melodies on Estranged in the UYI booklet, then said that he should have left after Lies. Called Slash a cancer that better removed but... what happened Axl? You remove a cancer, you don't wait until the cancer walks away. Why you didn't tell Slash to leave Guns? Why did you try so hard to get Slash back in the band after he left? Why did you want Slash for 2 or 3 Chinese Democracy songs? It looks like you loved to have the cancer in your system.

He praised Buckethead, then Buckethead left because the band was inactive and he went to talk shit about him, blaming him for the cancellation of RIR 2004. Reducing his royalties to a ridiculous percentage. Stating that Buckethead was very difficult to work as he didn't want to move forward with recordings. Really funny because according to Buckethead, he left because of the same thing.

Question is, when is it going to be his own fault? How do you deal with a person like that?

At this point, I couldn't be happier things happened this way. I would have loved if Axl would have done something else with the name but in the end, whatever has happened with Guns after all the "drug addicts uncompromising scumbags" quit, it is 100% Axl fault. Just because Axl keeps using the same, old, boring, overused, overexaggerated, ridiculous statement using words like "expense" "lied to" "misguided" "deluded" doesn't mean that he's telling the truth.

I don't believe everything is 100% Axl's fault but you bring up a few good points

[Babooshka]

Some people thrive of confrontation, consciously and unconsciously creating combative/dysfunctional situations for themselves. Others don't. I'm sure Slash and everyone involved with GNR tried to counter Axl's ways. But at the end of the day, having to spend your energy fighting someone, over things that should already be a matter of basic courtesy and mutual respect, (Axl being late, not turning up for rehearsals/recording, forcing friends on to them, downgrading their position in the band), can take a toll on anyone. When dealing with that type of personalty, after a time, all you can do is remove yourself from their presence and get on with your life.

Edited May 18, 2014 by Babooshka

[Damn_Smooth]

Because Axl is an unreasonable person. I bet Slash and Axl have had countless arguments during the UYI tour. What about those 4 hour phone calls almost everyday trying to reach a compromise? What about those issues with Slash and Duff at A&M Studios?

The main problem is that Axl doesn't like to be confronted, he has forced himself in a dream world where nobody questions what he wants to do or how he wants to do it and look at him now. One mediocre album in 20 years and a band filled with replacements of the members that were in his original vision after real Guns N' Roses broke up. What happened? Where are those songs and records and albums and members that would make each and every Guns N' Roses fan forget about the old line-up?

Axl is also known for blaming others when things are his own fault. He praised Izzy then Izzy left. He started to talk shit about him, dedicated Double Talkin' Jive to him during almost the entire UYI tour like a butthurt 10 year old. He told everyone who wanted Izzy: "FUCK IZZY, GILBY CLARKE!" (which you can hear in bootlegs like Argentina, 1993) then fired Gilby and talked shit about him. He praised Matt Sorum for his work in the UYIs, then fired Matt and talked shit about him.

He praised Slash, thanked him for his guitar melodies on Estranged in the UYI booklet, then said that he should have left after Lies. Called Slash a cancer that better removed but... what happened Axl? You remove a cancer, you don't wait until the cancer walks away. Why you didn't tell Slash to leave Guns? Why did you try so hard to get Slash back in the band after he left? Why did you want Slash for 2 or 3 Chinese Democracy songs? It looks like you loved to have the cancer in your system.

He praised Buckethead, then Buckethead left because the band was inactive and he went to talk shit about him, blaming him for the cancellation of RIR 2004. Reducing his royalties to a ridiculous percentage. Stating that Buckethead was very difficult to work as he didn't want to move forward with recordings. Really funny because according to Buckethead, he left because of the same thing.

Question is, when is it going to be his own fault? How do you deal with a person like that?

At this point, I couldn't be happier things happened this way. I would have loved if Axl would have done something else with the name but in the end, whatever has happened with Guns after all the "drug addicts uncompromising scumbags" quit, it is 100% Axl fault. Just because Axl keeps using the same, old, boring, overused, overexaggerated, ridiculous statement using words like "expense" "lied to" "misguided" "deluded" doesn't mean that he's telling the truth.

Indeed.

He did the same thing the first time Finck left as well. It's a pattern that some people choose to ignore. They call Slash a pussy for finally walking away from the crazy, but you don't hear them saying the same about Izzy, Duff, Bucket, Robin. Selective reasoning is selective.

Izzy, Duff and Bucket were also pussies for walking away. Robin did me a huge personal favor, so I can't bring myself to acknowledge that he's a pussy. In fact, if he'd come back and take DJ someplace where I don't have to pay attention to him either, Robin would be my favorite guitarist of all time.