foghat43 Posted March 30, 2014 Share Posted March 30, 2014 http://listverse.com/2014/03/28/10-total-tyrants-from-the-history-of-rock-n-roll/The chief architect of Guns N’ Roses’ devolution from big band to bad joke, William Bruce Rose is well known among fans as the kind of guy who would, for example, show up on stage an hour late, throw a tantrum, walk off after three songs, return an hour later under the threat of litigation, and then play the rest of the set to a largely emptied arena.Rose became an impossible headache as soon as the band hit it big. His antics included forcing the release of “One In a Million” (causing the whole band to take flak for his bigoted lyrics), challenging other musicians to fights via the press, announcing the band’s drug problems from the stage in LA (a move Duff McKagan said dissolved the band’s camaraderie instantly and permanently), hiring backup musicians without telling anyone, and stopping shows to bore the audience for minutes on end with tedious rants about contractual disputes.Furious at his bandmates’ failure to jump to his defense every time he did something ridiculous, he finally moved to take sole ownership of the band’s name by refusing to take the stage one night until documents were signed. Desperate to prevent Rose from inciting yet another riot, the band signed. Within three years, he succeeded in alienating his entire band and replaced them with session musicians. He got the full control he wanted and only had to turn Guns N’ Roses into a soulless revival act to do it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandallFlagg Posted March 30, 2014 Share Posted March 30, 2014 Given the lack of respect and (not wholly undeserved but grossly disproportioned) abysmal tirade he usually cops from the greater public, 9 isn't too bad for Axl. I just knew Waters would be up there, another brilliant specimen but also prone to Captain Ahab syndrome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dalsh327 Posted March 30, 2014 Share Posted March 30, 2014 Interesting list. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DR DOOM Posted March 30, 2014 Share Posted March 30, 2014 Given the lack of respect and (not wholly undeserved but grossly disproportioned) abysmal tirade he usually cops from the greater public, 9 isn't too bad for Axl. I just knew Waters would be up there, another brilliant specimen but also prone to Captain Ahab syndrome.At least Roger has admitted he was horrible back then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandallFlagg Posted March 30, 2014 Share Posted March 30, 2014 Well, Roger explains his feelings to the media thus the fans can get what was going through his head back then, it's a mystery how much of the blame Axl carries or concedes... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DR DOOM Posted March 30, 2014 Share Posted March 30, 2014 I saw The Wall live in 11 and he made mention of his old (young) grumpy, fucked up self when he dueted with him on Mother (via video) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naupis Posted March 30, 2014 Share Posted March 30, 2014 Part of what makes people hate Axl is that you watch him now and are left thinking to yourself that "you blew up one of the best bands in the world for this?"People would be more understanding I think if Guns had done anything after Axl ran everyone off, but all he does is tour Slash/Duff's material so you are just left with an empty feeling that his whole power play was a big waste. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Facekicker Posted March 30, 2014 Share Posted March 30, 2014 Good description of the Dublin show. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DR DOOM Posted March 30, 2014 Share Posted March 30, 2014 (edited) Part of what makes people hate Axl is that you watch him now and are left thinking to yourself that "you blew up one of the best bands in the world for this?"People would be more understanding I think if Guns had done anything after Axl ran everyone off, but all he does is tour Slash/Duff's material so you are just left with an empty feeling that his whole power play was a big waste.In my experience, that's Joe Six Pack's take on it.He fucked up a great band to do nothing with the name (except tarnish it) Edited March 30, 2014 by DR DOOM 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Drama Posted March 30, 2014 Share Posted March 30, 2014 I agree that he was (is) a giant wanker but the rants were boring? Fuck no! Well except when he ripped into the other guys for being on drugs and when he used to rip into Izzy he left. He can go fuck himself for all that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wasted Posted March 30, 2014 Share Posted March 30, 2014 Nice to see Axl getting some publicity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhazUp Posted March 30, 2014 Share Posted March 30, 2014 (edited) Part of what makes people hate Axl is that you watch him now and are left thinking to yourself that "you blew up one of the best bands in the world for this?"People would be more understanding I think if Guns had done anything after Axl ran everyone off, but all he does is tour Slash/Duff's material so you are just left with an empty feeling that his whole power play was a big waste.Yeah, if he actually tried to build a legacy around the new guys then I think he would be at least a little less critisized by the public.Or even better if the did the whole Chinese Democracy thing as a solo project instead of pretending like he was GNR all by himself then the public would be a lot more accomidating Edited March 30, 2014 by WhazUp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yesterdays-Civil-War Posted March 30, 2014 Share Posted March 30, 2014 Don't necessarily share all of the snippet's view of Axl. I didn't find nor do I find "One in a Million" a bigoted song, and I believe just Axl got flak for it. If memory serves me correct Slash has been both ok and not ok with the song. The rants didn't bore the audience so much so that they might have just confused an audience or two. (e.g. People probably looking around and asking "who the fuck is Warren Beatty?") I enjoy the rants and wish he would do some from time to time, unlike those who find them "juvenile" or whatever.And the signing the band name over thing...that's been covered in countless threads before. Once again, if memory serves me correct, the documents giving him the name and the rights were signed when they weren't on tour. From what I've seen there's also been differing opinions on the meaning of the "under duress" and "extenuating circumstances" jargon.Good description of the Dublin show.Didn't they throw bottles at him?That's just kinda adding insult to injury. The guy is late for whatever reason; people throw shit and then start booing when he walks off stage. I'm baffled as to what they expected would happen.Of course, by three songs in their hissy fits are over and they are screaming along with the other ten thousand people in the arena. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandallFlagg Posted March 30, 2014 Share Posted March 30, 2014 He might've been a right mard arse statue at that Dublin show cause they took offense at his dithering to get on stage but he gave one hell of a vocal performance even for his reputation that year, not fleeing around like a madman does wonders for his breath, maybe people need to chuck a few things to get the rasp back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DR DOOM Posted March 30, 2014 Share Posted March 30, 2014 Umm, who doesn't know who Warren Beatty is? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dalsh327 Posted March 30, 2014 Share Posted March 30, 2014 Well, Roger explains his feelings to the media thus the fans can get what was going through his head back then, it's a mystery how much of the blame Axl carries or concedes...It took a divorce and therapy to figure out his issues. Somehow, his adversary went from David Gilmour to Bar Rafaeli... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amir Posted March 30, 2014 Share Posted March 30, 2014 Had a mate who saw The Fall last May. Even though he was a fan and he'd heard beforehand about all the gimmicks and pranks Mark would play, he still left the show disappointed and vowed never to see them again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselDaisy Posted March 30, 2014 Share Posted March 30, 2014 Surprised Gene $immon$ never made the list. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yesterdays-Civil-War Posted March 30, 2014 Share Posted March 30, 2014 Surprised Gene $immon$ never made the list.Yeah, because not wanting your bandmates to be drunken idiots and licensing your brand makes you a tyrant...It's really Paul who has been running things, and I don't find him all that tyrannical either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
classicguns4life Posted March 30, 2014 Share Posted March 30, 2014 Surprised Gene $immon$ never made the list.Yeah, because not wanting your bandmates to be drunken idiots and licensing your brand makes you a tyrant...It's really Paul who has been running things, and I don't find him all that tyrannical either.Agreed. They may be dicks, but they aren't tyrants. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Facekicker Posted March 30, 2014 Share Posted March 30, 2014 During the making of Trout Mask Replica, Beefheart would communicate his ideas to the band entirely by humming, whistling, or playing harmonica, but would “get ridiculously upset, screaming ‘that’s not it, man, what the f—k are you doing?’ ” when the band tried to interpret them. They were shut away in a remote house, rehearsing the record for 14 hours a day with barely any food. This isolation, coupled with the musicians’ tender ages and worship of Beefheart, led the band’s perspective to become so warped that they believed the abuse to be their own fault. French went on to describe lasting trauma from these experiences, saying they “made us all dysfunctional in society, in different ways.”Holy shit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselDaisy Posted March 30, 2014 Share Posted March 30, 2014 Surprised Gene $immon$ never made the list.Yeah, because not wanting your bandmates to be drunken idiots and licensing your brand makes you a tyrant...It's really Paul who has been running things, and I don't find him all that tyrannical either.I do not know. Turning a hard rock band into a marketing exercise for everything from, coffins to condoms strikes me as quite tyrannical as does, recording and releasing a 'reunion' studio album that does not even include those reunited members, as well as, sticking two scabs in their make-up. Look at Gene on the Snyder interview in the late 70s. He is a total dick whereas Ace is the soul of the party. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandallFlagg Posted March 30, 2014 Share Posted March 30, 2014 That Beefheart stuff is like how the legend of Axl Rose is to the general public lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yesterdays-Civil-War Posted March 30, 2014 Share Posted March 30, 2014 Surprised Gene $immon$ never made the list.Yeah, because not wanting your bandmates to be drunken idiots and licensing your brand makes you a tyrant...It's really Paul who has been running things, and I don't find him all that tyrannical either.I do not know. Turning a hard rock band into a marketing exercise for everything from, coffins to condoms strikes me as quite tyrannical as does, recording and releasing a 'reunion' studio album that does not even include those reunited members, as well as, sticking two scabs in their make-up. Look at Gene on the Snyder interview in the late 70s. He is a total dick whereas Ace is the soul of the party.Ace and Peter wanted equal splits on everything. Peter was fired, and Ace quit a long time before 1998 (Psycho Circus), the glory day of KISS being a 4 way split was looooong gone.They were fuck ups, plain and simple. They were invited to come back, as hired hands and to do a reunion on tour but never to be invited back to be full partners in the band. They kept wanting to renegotiate their contracts and both of them came to Paul and Gene with sub-par songs for the album, according to Paul, Gene, and their producer at the time. They also kept missing rehearsals and scheduled workouts (both of which were in their contracts) and both of their playing skills had sunken to a club level. Because of how much of a headache they were to deal with, Gene and Paul got Kevin Valentine to do the drums, and various guitarists for Ace. The record company had a deal with KISS, which has only been Paul and Gene since 1981.Calling Thayer and Singer scabs is another thing that irks me, however I do agree with the sentiment of it being wrong that they are in Ace and Peter's makeup. I find it disrespectful, however, Gene and Paul own those personas legally; they can do whatever they want. I would rather them not, but that doesn't make them tyrants. Gene and Paul are not headaches to work with as musicians; if you're sober, punctual, and dedicated, you'll have no problem. Ace and Peter were both alpha-male chest beaters with major insecurities about themselves and fought their battles with cocaine and alcohol. When there is a cancer in your system, you cut it the fuck out.(This is all coming from a major KISS fan, and a fan of Ace and Peter's work as musicians).Gene Simmons and Paul Stanley are dicks, but make no mistake, they aren't tyrannical. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DR DOOM Posted March 31, 2014 Share Posted March 31, 2014 I don't believe that stuff about Peter and Ace not being able to play anymore shit, even with Ace being a drunk.KISS were at club level themselves before they got their "credibility" back with Ace and Peter returning.As for Psycho Circus, I forget if it's Ace or Peter who said that they were paid to not play on it - and I think it took a tantrum from Ace to get the 4 of them to play on Into The Void.Anyway, what a shit album that turned out to be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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