Why do some praise RiR3?

[Martin Riggs]

Axl sounded like shit. that kills the whole concert/tour

Yeah, I'd agree on most songs. A few of the new ones weren't bad though.

I heard this the other day.......and Axl sounds like shit...

Is this normal?

[Chinese Destruction]

Also seeing Axl play guitar on madagascar was awesome!!

Eh, playing? What exactly did his “playing” on “Madagascar” at Rio 2001 enhance? Did his guitar even make a sound? To me it made him look incredibly awkward and I sort of cringed to be honest.

I think that Axl believed if he marketed Guns as something radically different (with Axl doing guitars the odd time, a guy raised by chickens wearing a KFC bucket doing leads, a goth guy complimenting the nun chunks guy, a tranny like stripper doings synths.) he could legitimize the project as “new” Guns N' Roses.

However as history has proven the people just wanted continuity with the new guys rather than something to distinguish them.

[Jakey Styley]

Most RNFNR GNR show there ever was.

[James Bond]

Someone may have mentioned this (just skimmed through the replies) but you can hardly blame what the mix sounded like on the band. It's not a great quality bootleg by any means (never with impressed with the Rio mixes - nothing like the Rock am Ring mixes which are close to perfect). To start making criticisms because of how the bass was too muddy or other related points is hardly justifiable from a bootleg since the mix and sound live would have been much different and way better.

I also disagree with you saying the band isn't tight. The horrible mix aside, they certainly ARE tight - quite a musically advanced line-up. The only quite obviously off spot is the intro to You Could Be Mine which is a mess. Other than that, for the second show out, it's pretty damn good. A more accurate depiction of what this era sounded like in terms of tightness would be to listen to a bootleg from 2002. I strongly recommend Boston 2002 - perfect quality soundboard and Axl sounds pretty decent, even without the rasp. Shows like this prove that this era of the band was indeed very tight.

As for Axl's voice at Rio, yes, it's pretty bad. Some songs it's alright (like The Blues, Madagascar, etc...) but other songs make it very clear as to where the "mickey mouse" descriptions of his voice from this era came from. The opening Jungle scream is amazing though. One of the best.

[moreblack]

Brain sped everything up

[Stro]

And he was actually slightly off time, too. If you try to sync up 2002 versions with any other era, you'll notice the drums will be synced up, then slightly off for a few beats, then synced, then off for pretty much everything. The band was awesome anyway. And Axl was from time to time as well.

[Olorin]

Brain spoke about that gig in an interview he gave when CD came out. He said they struggled to hear cause the noise of the audience was like a jet engine, and was coming through the monitors on stage via Axls mike. What was it, 250,000 people or something?

Edited January 18, 2011 by Olorin

[James Bond]

And he was actually slightly off time, too. If you try to sync up 2002 versions with any other era, you'll notice the drums will be synced up, then slightly off for a few beats, then synced, then off for pretty much everything. The band was awesome anyway. And Axl was from time to time as well.

That's going to happen when trying to sync of a live performance from ANY band to any past recording of it. The songs aren't always played at consistent tempos unless the band is playing to a click track. The only songs the current line-up plays to a click are the Chinese Democracy ones because the triggered samples and backing vocals absolutely must be on time or it will sound like a complete mess. Anyone who isn't a musician or isn't familiar with recording may not see this but it's the nature of the beast in a live performance.

On a song like Jungle, take note of multiple performances. The tempo of that changes almost every night. Generally a band plays faster live because of the energy. Sometimes that song was dreadfully slow on the Illusion tour while others they rocked right through it. Same goes for now. I feel like it's been sped up in more recent performances, which is awesome. Early in the tour it seemed just a bit slow.

Point is - saying that the 2002 songs don't "sync up" with another era is NOT a fair argument to say they aren't tight. Playing them a bit faster doesn't necessarily go hand in hand with not being tight.

Take a live recording of Jungle from ANY era (original band, Illusions, 2002 or now) and try to sync it up to the studio version. It certainly won't be right on the whole time.

[Dean]

Axl sounded like shit. that kills the whole concert/tour

Yeah, I'd agree on most songs. A few of the new ones weren't bad though.

I heard this the other day.......and Axl sounds like shit...

Is this normal?

Something about that performence that I love, I think it's pretty decent myself.

Back on topic, I didn't really like RIR III that much, although I did like the version of Knockin' On Heavens Door and Madagascar. Everything else was below average, probably the worst Welcome to the Jungle I've heard live.

[Steamboat]

The NuGNR 1.0 KOHD was the best one ever, buckethead's solo is amazing and the vocal stuff Axl did at the Leeds 2002 performance were really awesome.

Rock in Rio 3 was still awesome as fuck though. I noticed Paradise City being a bit of a mess (the intro solos and stuff were off I think) but that's it.

[Stro]

And he was actually slightly off time, too. If you try to sync up 2002 versions with any other era, you'll notice the drums will be synced up, then slightly off for a few beats, then synced, then off for pretty much everything. The band was awesome anyway. And Axl was from time to time as well.

That's going to happen when trying to sync of a live performance from ANY band to any past recording of it. The songs aren't always played at consistent tempos unless the band is playing to a click track. The only songs the current line-up plays to a click are the Chinese Democracy ones because the triggered samples and backing vocals absolutely must be on time or it will sound like a complete mess. Anyone who isn't a musician or isn't familiar with recording may not see this but it's the nature of the beast in a live performance.

On a song like Jungle, take note of multiple performances. The tempo of that changes almost every night. Generally a band plays faster live because of the energy. Sometimes that song was dreadfully slow on the Illusion tour while others they rocked right through it. Same goes for now. I feel like it's been sped up in more recent performances, which is awesome. Early in the tour it seemed just a bit slow.

Point is - saying that the 2002 songs don't "sync up" with another era is NOT a fair argument to say they aren't tight. Playing them a bit faster doesn't necessarily go hand in hand with not being tight.

Take a live recording of Jungle from ANY era (original band, Illusions, 2002 or now) and try to sync it up to the studio version. It certainly won't be right on the whole time.

I'm not saying the band wasn't tight at all. I'm just saying Brain's drumming doesn't match up with other eras, even from multiple 2002 shows where everything else matches up perfectly, but the drums are occasionally slightly fast. You don't really notice it unless you try to match songs up. It isn't something you can hear without something to compare it to besides noticing that everything is slightly faster.

[James Bond]

And he was actually slightly off time, too. If you try to sync up 2002 versions with any other era, you'll notice the drums will be synced up, then slightly off for a few beats, then synced, then off for pretty much everything. The band was awesome anyway. And Axl was from time to time as well.

That's going to happen when trying to sync of a live performance from ANY band to any past recording of it. The songs aren't always played at consistent tempos unless the band is playing to a click track. The only songs the current line-up plays to a click are the Chinese Democracy ones because the triggered samples and backing vocals absolutely must be on time or it will sound like a complete mess. Anyone who isn't a musician or isn't familiar with recording may not see this but it's the nature of the beast in a live performance.

On a song like Jungle, take note of multiple performances. The tempo of that changes almost every night. Generally a band plays faster live because of the energy. Sometimes that song was dreadfully slow on the Illusion tour while others they rocked right through it. Same goes for now. I feel like it's been sped up in more recent performances, which is awesome. Early in the tour it seemed just a bit slow.

Point is - saying that the 2002 songs don't "sync up" with another era is NOT a fair argument to say they aren't tight. Playing them a bit faster doesn't necessarily go hand in hand with not being tight.

Take a live recording of Jungle from ANY era (original band, Illusions, 2002 or now) and try to sync it up to the studio version. It certainly won't be right on the whole time.

I'm not saying the band wasn't tight at all. I'm just saying Brain's drumming doesn't match up with other eras, even from multiple 2002 shows where everything else matches up perfectly, but the drums are occasionally slightly fast. You don't really notice it unless you try to match songs up. It isn't something you can hear without something to compare it to besides noticing that everything is slightly faster.

Perhaps I'm misinterpreting what you mean by "matching the songs up" since I was assuming you meant playing two versions (ie. a 2002 version and a 1992 version) at the same time. I'm not disagreeing that Brain may have sped up throughout the duration of the song, but provided the band follows, they are still together as a unit. The tightness goes being staying exact to the tempo the whole time. My point was simply if you take ANY performance from any band and try to sync it up with another, unless it was with a click it'll never match up exactly.

Sometimes he and other drummers who speed up may actually help bring the songs up to tempo. For example, Robin always seemed to start Sweet Child slow (especially in 2002) but Brian's build-up to the guitars entering seemed to help it out, otherwise the song would just drag. As a guitarist myself, I can say that it's not uncommon for that to happen when free timing an intro like that. Slash even started it slow sometimes and thus Matt would help speed things up. If we stuck just to that tempo set by the guitars, everything would be dragging.

[duffsixx]

Axl sounded like shit. that kills the whole concert/tour

Yeah, I'd agree on most songs. A few of the new ones weren't bad though.

I heard this the other day.......and Axl sounds like shit...

Is this normal?

Something about that performence that I love, I think it's pretty decent myself.

Back on topic, I didn't really like RIR III that much, although I did like the version of Knockin' On Heavens Door and Madagascar. Everything else was below average, probably the worst Welcome to the Jungle I've heard live.

now the worst i have ever heared was 2002 live at the MTV awards

[Martin Riggs]

Axl sounded like shit. that kills the whole concert/tour

Yeah, I'd agree on most songs. A few of the new ones weren't bad though.

I heard this the other day.......and Axl sounds like shit...

Is this normal?

Something about that performence that I love, I think it's pretty decent myself.

Back on topic, I didn't really like RIR III that much, although I did like the version of Knockin' On Heavens Door and Madagascar. Everything else was below average, probably the worst Welcome to the Jungle I've heard live.

I like the performance in terms of production quality (can't beat pro shot) but Axl doesn't sound very good on it. At least not consistent at all.

[duffsixx]

Axl sounded like shit. that kills the whole concert/tour

Yeah, I'd agree on most songs. A few of the new ones weren't bad though.

I heard this the other day.......and Axl sounds like shit...

Is this normal?

Something about that performence that I love, I think it's pretty decent myself.

Back on topic, I didn't really like RIR III that much, although I did like the version of Knockin' On Heavens Door and Madagascar. Everything else was below average, probably the worst Welcome to the Jungle I've heard live.

I like the performance in terms of production quality (can't beat pro shot) but Axl doesn't sound very good on it. At least not consistent at all.

hands down bewst version of this i love was live in Toronto acc amazing best concert i ever been too

[GeorgeGlass]

I've never gotten the love of it...

The band (IMO) compared to the '90s and 2006-present sounded very sloppy..and not in a good way. The sound mix at RiR3 was way too muddled and sludgy, way too bass heavy, Axl didn't sound or look his best. I guess for sentimental reasons (it being the return of Axl and the first show of 'new' Guns) I can understand the good feelings toward it...But from a purely objective, technical standpoint...It was a very low point in Guns' history.

That isn't a knock at Axl or the band in general. They rock now, they're tight, the mix is great, the guitars and bass all sound tight and the way they should now, and they've gotten better and better since 2006. But as far as Rock in Rio 3--It was their first show, and Axl's first full show in seven years. It's understandable that there would be some foibles. But to hail it as some great concert, even with the nostalgia of it being 10 years ago now, is kind of silly IMO.

If you thought that show in '01 was the low point, just move one year ahead to '02 - THAT was the low point. Not only did he sound horrible, he looked horrible as well. I would take that RIR3 show over ANY '02 show.

[saint_seiya]

[Freddie Mercury's Ghost]

At Rock in Rio 2001 Axl was still taking chances

This.

His physical performance at Rio III was *awesome*. He was really putting himself out there, dancing all over like a maniac. I feel bad that the sound mix sucked, because his vocals in Vegas a few weeks before were pretty good. No rasp, but he was on-key.

2002 I try to forget even happened, but he looked ridiculous and sounded even worse than in 2001.

2006 was Axl learning to not go out-of-breath by reserving his stage movement. He didn't have to do that in the 90's, but since he's older, it's a necessity.

2009-2010 was the first time I've heard Axl feel comfortable enough with his voice to improvise and change octives in stride. He hadn't done that consistently since the 90's.

Somebody mentioned the Columbus 2002 version of "Madagascar" as being "special". I think that was the one where he went improvised at the end. In 2002 he was struggling to hit the notes, let alone improvise, so that was indeed "special".

[Jackie Moon]

its simple.

RIR is the new bands Ritz 88.

not that tight, not that fluid, but fucking awesome nonetheless. slashs guitar became unplugged during out ta get me (i think), someone grabbed the neck of his guitar at one point. nobody cares. the show doesn't have to be perfect.

likewise in RiRIII. axl sounds questionable, robin looks like, well, something rude. but bucket. omf. bucket.

i started watching that video as a sliashite in 2008. it only took 1:30 to turn me into a full blown buckette.

Edited January 19, 2011 by Jackie Moon

[D..]

its simple.

RIR is the new bands Ritz 88.

No way, the Ritz 88 is maybe a tired Guns N' Roses after so much touring, but they don't try to overdo it, it's Guns N' Roses in its truest, finest and rawest form, you feel all these guys know each other very well, there is a real interaction between them, it feels natural, and you see how talented they are because even if they are tired as shit, they play the fuck out of every song, it's unbelievable how good the songs sound like, musically and vocally.

In Rock in Rio 2001, the show is totally overdone (the funniest part is when Bucket mask lightens himself with blue eyes, I'm cracked up everytime I see it), they should be in top form but Axl looks out of breathe and tired but it's only his second show! There's barely any alchemy between the members, Axl sounds like he's only been working on Street of Dreams for weeks (let's be honest, he sounds perfect on the Blues, but on any other song, he has a higher pitch because he tries to keep the voice he perfected for SOD on other songs, and it just doesn't work, except when songs are delibaretly sung low, like it's so Easy and Brownstone which are okay), every guy seems to be playing for himself, especially buckethead, like I've read so many times on the forums, it looks like GNR is a "circus". It's very true imo, until 2006 when it's a real come back for GNR.

However I love RIR 2001 for a very special reason: when Axl introduces Beta... it's magic. It's like the conclusion to the 92 Chicago show when he says how he was abused being a child, that he can't fake it anymore, that his life is falling apart, and in 2001 with his comeback, it's at the same time a happy ending because he found a mother and a family, and at the same time, it's a sad comeback for GNR fans, because the Axl Rose that is playing that night, is not the Axl Rose from the 90's. It's like a totally different person, and if we feel it's good for him, it's not good for the music, especially that night. He doesn't move the same, doesn't sound the same, seems to have lost a lot of his self confidence on stage, has a hard time through his rants where he's often out of breathe, it's obvious he hasn't been playing live for a long time...

And of course there are all of those new songs performed live which is the main interest of the show for me. All in all it's a very interesting show and unmissable to understand the complete story of GNR, it's very important chapter, and it's amazing to see what's been accomplished between 2001 and now, and how Axl finally made both ends meet.

Edited January 19, 2011 by D..

[Martin Riggs]

its simple.

RIR is the new bands Ritz 88.

not that tight, not that fluid, but fucking awesome nonetheless. slashs guitar became unplugged during out ta get me (i think), someone grabbed the neck of his guitar at one point. nobody cares. the show doesn't have to be perfect.

likewise in RiRIII. axl sounds questionable, robin looks like, well, something rude. but bucket. omf. bucket.

i started watching that video as a sliashite in 2008. it only took 1:30 to turn me into a full blown buckette.

To be accurate, it's more like the complete OPPOSITE of Ritz 88.

RITZ was a young band with energy and determination just playing rock n roll but with undertones of potential greatness to come that couldn't be denied...

RIO was a comeback gig that didn't sound that good with a bunch of different guys just seeing if this could possibly work....which it didn't.

PS: that solo wasn't that impressive.

\\\\