Paul Stanley going to HOF vs Axl not going

[niceguy]

Paul Stanley is rightfully critical of KISS's upcoming HOF induction. But there's a very interesting quote:

"I'm going because there are fans who it means something to."

Axl said the same critical things about the HOF, so I thought it would be interesting to discuss here.

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It's taken 14 years, but pyro-glam rockers Kiss are finally being inducted into the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame. After being passed over for so long, it was already a major story that the New York quartet (born of equal parts ambition, determination and desperation) had finally made the cut.

But since the four original members -- singer-guitarist Paul Stanley, singer-bassist Gene Simmons, guitarist Ace Frehley and drummer Peter Criss -- haven't been shy about expressing how they think the induction and celebratory performance should be handled, Kiss' Hall of Fame entrance has become one of the most talked-about rock stories this spring.

Stanley, who co-founded the band 40 years ago with Simmons, sat down with Billboard to discuss the buzz surrounding the induction, which he believes is the Rock Hall's "worst nightmare."

"The Rock and Roll Hall of Fame is not the hall of fame of the people, or of other bands," he said. "It's a small group of people who decide who they want in their little club and who they don't. The fact that they would only induct the four original members -- and when I asked about that it they said it was a non-starter -- is interesting. Because they're pencil pushers and I play a guitar. So for them to tell me what is a non-starter is arrogance."

He added, "I don't know if I was inducted or indicted. But I really don't care. I'm going because there are fans who it means something to."

[Nosaj Thing]

Cool.

[ZoSoRose]

The KISS situation is a massive cluster fuck of back and forths. At least with GNR there wasn't any petty bullshit (except from Steven but you can take him as seriously as a sandwich). Axl clearly wasn't comfortable and didn't really criticize anyone. Same with Izzy. Then, the ceremony ended up being great with a performance of those who wanted to attend.

With KISS they have been saying awful things about one another (specifically Gene and Paul), plus Gene and Paul are insisting on taking Tommy, Eric, and Bruce which is fine but hypocritical considering they are completely shafting Vinnie (even though he is batshit nuts), and now they are all going to show up without a performance. Its fake and shitty

GNR's went better

[Obsession Of Vanity]

lol KISS.

[EvH]

The Hall of Fame sucks more than Ashba's Patience solo.

[MrPoe]

I don't think they're "shafting" Vinnie...it's just that no one knows his current whereabouts.

In Axl's case, he simply didn't want to share a stage with the old band. It would constitute a reunion under the RRHOF's terms rather than his own.

[gunsfanoldie]

He was at a loss either way. Either he goes, as Paul is doing it, "for the fans" but refuses them the performance, as Paul is doing. In that case, people would be pissed that Axl is actually showing up and being a dick.

Or Axl doesn't go as a way of protesting that the HOF just wants a reunion. And he's a dick that way because he's still robbing the world of a reunion. Either way, he's being a dick, just as Paul is being a dick for not allowing a KISS reunion. Their both doing it for the same reason though, and its that they both can't admit that people actually care more about their original bands than their current ones.

[Apollo]

lol KISS.

I'm not a Kiss fan at all. I don't own any of their catalog, and only have one song of theirs on my Ipod - and that's just because it's sooo bad that it is good as a joke song.

But why would you say lol Kiss? They have been around for 40 years, have sold over 100 million albums, and have had years where they were the number one selling tour. Very few bands reach their level of success.

[Damn_Smooth]

lol KISS.

I'm not a Kiss fan at all. I don't own any of their catalog, and only have one song of theirs on my Ipod - and that's just because it's sooo bad that it is good as a joke song.

But why would you say lol Kiss? They have been around for 40 years, have sold over 100 million albums, and have had years where they were the number one selling tour. Very few bands reach their level of success.

What does that matter? Do you like things solely because other people do? Are you not allowed to dislike things because other people like them?

[Apollo]

lol KISS.

I'm not a Kiss fan at all. I don't own any of their catalog, and only have one song of theirs on my Ipod - and that's just because it's sooo bad that it is good as a joke song.

But why would you say lol Kiss? They have been around for 40 years, have sold over 100 million albums, and have had years where they were the number one selling tour. Very few bands reach their level of success.

What does that matter? Do you like things solely because other people do? Are you not allowed to dislike things because other people like them?

I swear you try and find any reason to argue with me.

I asked the guy a simple question. I don't like Kiss, maybe you missed that part of my five sentence post.

I'm not here to fight and argue with people. I'm here to chat with other music fans.

I'm curious as to why he wrote his statement, so I asked him. I didn't insult him, I'm engaging him in conversation. Everything doesn't have to turn into a big fight and insult fest.

It's OK, Damn Smooth. Sometimes it's OK for people to just chat about things without it turning ugly. Life is good, DS. It's OK to enjoy it and not always be on edge.

[maynard]

Couldn't care less about HoF. But I also believe a reunion with old bandmates never killed anyone.

[Damn_Smooth]

lol KISS.

I'm not a Kiss fan at all. I don't own any of their catalog, and only have one song of theirs on my Ipod - and that's just because it's sooo bad that it is good as a joke song.

But why would you say lol Kiss? They have been around for 40 years, have sold over 100 million albums, and have had years where they were the number one selling tour. Very few bands reach their level of success.

What does that matter? Do you like things solely because other people do? Are you not allowed to dislike things because other people like them?

I swear you try and find any reason to argue with me.

I asked the guy a simple question. I don't like Kiss, maybe you missed that part of my five sentence post.

I'm not here to fight and argue with people. I'm here to chat with other music fans.

I'm curious as to why he wrote his statement, so I asked him. I didn't insult him, I'm engaging him in conversation. Everything doesn't have to turn into a big fight and insult fest.

It's OK, Damn Smooth. Sometimes it's OK for people to just chat about things without it turning ugly. Life is good, DS. It's OK to enjoy it and not always be on edge.

So I asked you 3 simple questions and I'm the one trying to argue? I didn't insult you, I'm engaging in conversation.

[Apollo]

lol KISS.

I'm not a Kiss fan at all. I don't own any of their catalog, and only have one song of theirs on my Ipod - and that's just because it's sooo bad that it is good as a joke song.

But why would you say lol Kiss? They have been around for 40 years, have sold over 100 million albums, and have had years where they were the number one selling tour. Very few bands reach their level of success.

What does that matter? Do you like things solely because other people do? Are you not allowed to dislike things because other people like them?

I swear you try and find any reason to argue with me.

I asked the guy a simple question. I don't like Kiss, maybe you missed that part of my five sentence post.

I'm not here to fight and argue with people. I'm here to chat with other music fans.

I'm curious as to why he wrote his statement, so I asked him. I didn't insult him, I'm engaging him in conversation. Everything doesn't have to turn into a big fight and insult fest.

It's OK, Damn Smooth. Sometimes it's OK for people to just chat about things without it turning ugly. Life is good, DS. It's OK to enjoy it and not always be on edge.

So I asked you 3 simple questions and I'm the one trying to argue? I didn't insult you, I'm engaging in conversation.

Ya, your three questions were asked because you wanted to engage in conversation. Look dude, we've already went over this. I'm not going to be baited by your remarks like other people are. I'll gladly chat with you, because at times you are pretty funny. But I've got no interest in your usual weird thing of wanting to fight with people. So please, again, save that crap for other people.

"""What does that matter?""" Usually when somebody says "lol" and then a name of somebody they are doing it to imply they think that entity is a joke and only worth a laugh. I was asking him to expand on why he thought that way. I don't like Kiss, own zero of their albums. But they have been putting out albums for 40 years and have sold over 100 million records. I personally don't like the band, but to imply they are a joke is pretty ridiculous. I was curious as to why the guy thought that way.

"""Do you like things solely because other people do?""" Nope. Why would I? Who does that? My tastes are all personal preferences. Hopefully all people go that route and don't like things just because they are popular.

""""Are you not allowed to dislike things because other people like them?"""" I don't make the rules or laws of the world that all people must abide by. But if you are asking for my opinion - then people can like or dislike things for ANY reason they choose. In terms of your question relating to this topic, well, that's why I addressed the guy. Because I was curious of his reasons. Being as this is a FORUM where people come to chat with others, it seemed like a reasonable question.

Did that answer your questions?

[Damn_Smooth]

lol KISS.

I'm not a Kiss fan at all. I don't own any of their catalog, and only have one song of theirs on my Ipod - and that's just because it's sooo bad that it is good as a joke song.

But why would you say lol Kiss? They have been around for 40 years, have sold over 100 million albums, and have had years where they were the number one selling tour. Very few bands reach their level of success.

What does that matter? Do you like things solely because other people do? Are you not allowed to dislike things because other people like them?

I swear you try and find any reason to argue with me.

I asked the guy a simple question. I don't like Kiss, maybe you missed that part of my five sentence post.

I'm not here to fight and argue with people. I'm here to chat with other music fans.

I'm curious as to why he wrote his statement, so I asked him. I didn't insult him, I'm engaging him in conversation. Everything doesn't have to turn into a big fight and insult fest.

It's OK, Damn Smooth. Sometimes it's OK for people to just chat about things without it turning ugly. Life is good, DS. It's OK to enjoy it and not always be on edge.

So I asked you 3 simple questions and I'm the one trying to argue? I didn't insult you, I'm engaging in conversation.

Ya, your three questions were asked because you wanted to engage in conversation. Look dude, we've already went over this. I'm not going to be baited by your remarks like other people are. I'll gladly chat with you, because at times you are pretty funny. But I've got no interest in your usual weird thing of wanting to fight with people. So please, again, save that crap for other people.

"""What does that matter?""" Usually when somebody says "lol" and then a name of somebody they are doing it to imply they think that entity is a joke and only worth a laugh. I was asking him to expand on why he thought that way. I don't like Kiss, own zero of their albums. But they have been putting out albums for 40 years and have sold over 100 million records. I personally don't like the band, but to imply they are a joke is pretty ridiculous. I was curious as to why the guy thought that way.

"""Do you like things solely because other people do?""" Nope. Why would I? Who does that? My tastes are all personal preferences. Hopefully all people go that route and don't like things just because they are popular.

""""Are you not allowed to dislike things because other people like them?"""" I don't make the rules or laws of the world that all people must abide by. But if you are asking for my opinion - then people can like or dislike things for ANY reason they choose. In terms of your question relating to this topic, well, that's why I addressed the guy. Because I was curious of his reasons. Being as this is a FORUM where people come to chat with others, it seemed like a reasonable question.

Did that answer your questions?

Yes.

Was that hard?

[Apollo]

lol KISS.

I'm not a Kiss fan at all. I don't own any of their catalog, and only have one song of theirs on my Ipod - and that's just because it's sooo bad that it is good as a joke song.

But why would you say lol Kiss? They have been around for 40 years, have sold over 100 million albums, and have had years where they were the number one selling tour. Very few bands reach their level of success.

What does that matter? Do you like things solely because other people do? Are you not allowed to dislike things because other people like them?

I swear you try and find any reason to argue with me.

I asked the guy a simple question. I don't like Kiss, maybe you missed that part of my five sentence post.

I'm not here to fight and argue with people. I'm here to chat with other music fans.

I'm curious as to why he wrote his statement, so I asked him. I didn't insult him, I'm engaging him in conversation. Everything doesn't have to turn into a big fight and insult fest.

It's OK, Damn Smooth. Sometimes it's OK for people to just chat about things without it turning ugly. Life is good, DS. It's OK to enjoy it and not always be on edge.

So I asked you 3 simple questions and I'm the one trying to argue? I didn't insult you, I'm engaging in conversation.

Ya, your three questions were asked because you wanted to engage in conversation. Look dude, we've already went over this. I'm not going to be baited by your remarks like other people are. I'll gladly chat with you, because at times you are pretty funny. But I've got no interest in your usual weird thing of wanting to fight with people. So please, again, save that crap for other people.

"""What does that matter?""" Usually when somebody says "lol" and then a name of somebody they are doing it to imply they think that entity is a joke and only worth a laugh. I was asking him to expand on why he thought that way. I don't like Kiss, own zero of their albums. But they have been putting out albums for 40 years and have sold over 100 million records. I personally don't like the band, but to imply they are a joke is pretty ridiculous. I was curious as to why the guy thought that way.

"""Do you like things solely because other people do?""" Nope. Why would I? Who does that? My tastes are all personal preferences. Hopefully all people go that route and don't like things just because they are popular.

""""Are you not allowed to dislike things because other people like them?"""" I don't make the rules or laws of the world that all people must abide by. But if you are asking for my opinion - then people can like or dislike things for ANY reason they choose. In terms of your question relating to this topic, well, that's why I addressed the guy. Because I was curious of his reasons. Being as this is a FORUM where people come to chat with others, it seemed like a reasonable question.

Did that answer your questions?

Yes.

Was that hard?

Nope. Took a couple minutes to type out.

[Damn_Smooth]

lol KISS.

I'm not a Kiss fan at all. I don't own any of their catalog, and only have one song of theirs on my Ipod - and that's just because it's sooo bad that it is good as a joke song.

But why would you say lol Kiss? They have been around for 40 years, have sold over 100 million albums, and have had years where they were the number one selling tour. Very few bands reach their level of success.

What does that matter? Do you like things solely because other people do? Are you not allowed to dislike things because other people like them?

I swear you try and find any reason to argue with me.

I asked the guy a simple question. I don't like Kiss, maybe you missed that part of my five sentence post.

I'm not here to fight and argue with people. I'm here to chat with other music fans.

I'm curious as to why he wrote his statement, so I asked him. I didn't insult him, I'm engaging him in conversation. Everything doesn't have to turn into a big fight and insult fest.

It's OK, Damn Smooth. Sometimes it's OK for people to just chat about things without it turning ugly. Life is good, DS. It's OK to enjoy it and not always be on edge.

So I asked you 3 simple questions and I'm the one trying to argue? I didn't insult you, I'm engaging in conversation.

Ya, your three questions were asked because you wanted to engage in conversation. Look dude, we've already went over this. I'm not going to be baited by your remarks like other people are. I'll gladly chat with you, because at times you are pretty funny. But I've got no interest in your usual weird thing of wanting to fight with people. So please, again, save that crap for other people.

"""What does that matter?""" Usually when somebody says "lol" and then a name of somebody they are doing it to imply they think that entity is a joke and only worth a laugh. I was asking him to expand on why he thought that way. I don't like Kiss, own zero of their albums. But they have been putting out albums for 40 years and have sold over 100 million records. I personally don't like the band, but to imply they are a joke is pretty ridiculous. I was curious as to why the guy thought that way.

"""Do you like things solely because other people do?""" Nope. Why would I? Who does that? My tastes are all personal preferences. Hopefully all people go that route and don't like things just because they are popular.

""""Are you not allowed to dislike things because other people like them?"""" I don't make the rules or laws of the world that all people must abide by. But if you are asking for my opinion - then people can like or dislike things for ANY reason they choose. In terms of your question relating to this topic, well, that's why I addressed the guy. Because I was curious of his reasons. Being as this is a FORUM where people come to chat with others, it seemed like a reasonable question.

Did that answer your questions?

Yes.

Was that hard?

Nope. Took a couple minutes to type out.

Well I appreciate it.

[Guest NGOG]

Given my 'esteemed' position, I should probably refrain from saying such things, but niceguy is a fuckin' horrific poster.

Let's all ask four million rhetorical questions every time we post.

Edited April 10, 2014 by NGOG

[Crash Diet]

Nice attempt, but Izzy wasn't there too
I like the HOF band's performance, but c'mon
Axl and Izzy said they don't want to do it under these circumstances
i'm totally ok with this
Axl's failures shows themselves so quickly so there is no need for an embarassing Mickey performance with the old guys
and Izzy doesn't like these ceremonies and awards even back in the day so...

The Hall of Fame sucks more than Ashba's Patience solo.

and this
Rock and Roll Hall of Fame with rappers but without really classic bands like Deep Purple etc.?
Fuck 'em

Edited April 10, 2014 by Crash Diet

[saber_]

Paul Stanley is an attention whore. Of course he's going to the HoF, I'm sure he'll promote some new product be hawking the kiss edition toyota prius, or whatever. You can call Axl many things, but he is not- and has not been for quite some time- an attention whore. And so for Axl, he's willing to forego the induction and doesn't see it the same way Paul does. And let's be honest here, did anyone think attempting to force a reunion was going to work? Dumbassed move by the HoF committee, shoulda waited a couple years. And so, if anything, the HoF incident strengthened Axl's resolve. There will be no reunion.

Edited April 10, 2014 by saber_

[Obsession Of Vanity]

lol KISS.

I'm not a Kiss fan at all. I don't own any of their catalog, and only have one song of theirs on my Ipod - and that's just because it's sooo bad that it is good as a joke song.

But why would you say lol Kiss? They have been around for 40 years, have sold over 100 million albums, and have had years where they were the number one selling tour. Very few bands reach their level of success.

Because as much shit as people give NuGNR, warranted or unwarranted, it's still a better situation than KISS. I was dragged to a Motley Crue/KISS concert in 2012. When Motley Crue circa 2012 blows you off the stage...there's problems. It's hollow, empty, soulless and depressing. I can't stand KISS or Gene Simmons, and I just don't like anything to do with it. Good for people that do. But I just can't stand them. It's not a band, it's a business. And it shows.

[bran]

no one should show up to the HOF.

[Val22]

From what I read today, all the Kiss members that are still alive are going to the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame, but no one is playing, except for Ace who is scheduled to be part of the All star band at the end.

According to what I read today, Paul offered to play with the KISS members of today and then have Peter and Ace come out and play too, but the HOF said no. Paul doesn't feel respected and is still annoyed that the "boys' club" that he calls them should have inducted KISS 20 years ago instead of now.

I hope that all the members go and accept their award and induction and give the members the finger! this is just bullshit!

I accept Paul's feelings, as I had Axl's.

We don't know the whole story. This whole HOF thing is getting to be a joke.

I don't think being inducted into anything matters at all. It's the fans of the bands that matter. Always has been and always will.

[WhazUp]

Rush made it clear that for them it wasn't about some arbitrary award given to them by random folks but rather as a ceremony to honor their loyal fanbase.

It helps Rush has no inner band drama but it would have been awesome for the AFD lineup to all have been there

[ZoSoRose]

It seems everything went together relatively well. I liked how Tommy, Bruce, and Eric went. It would have been nice if something similar happened with GNR, with past and current members attending and the original gang getting inducted. The lack of a performance of any kind tonight is bizarre though and even if they are all there, you know Ace and Peter are still not on the same page as Gene and particularly Paul. It was only last week Paul was calling Ace and Peter racists.

And look, the Hall of Fame is a crock of shit. It literally means nothing. As someone said, Trullijo and Flinginhoffer are in it yet people like Dio, Deep Purple, and many others aren't. It should be every member who played on a record gets inducted or only classic lineups do. This "bending the rules" shit is such bullshit. Despite all that, the museum and ceremonies are really cool but the institution itself means nothing.

Edited April 11, 2014 by ZoSoRose

[scottish nutter]

I never understood what people liked about kiss? In MY opinion their songs are shite and they dress up and look rediculous, iv tried to listen to their albums to see what the fuss was but nope, they are terrible.

If someone else likes them then good for you this is just my opinion lol