magisme Posted January 31, 2015 Share Posted January 31, 2015 I'm probably not giving him an entirely fair shake. I don't follow him. I've only seen him when people share clips with me, like in this thread, and when people share stuff like this it tends to be the more pointed, arrogant shit. Maybe I wouldn't feel the same if I had a more holistic view of him. As it stands, I kind of see him like I see Bill Maher from over here. That's not a compliment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Len Cnut Posted January 31, 2015 Share Posted January 31, 2015 Yeah, i don't like Maher neither and I suppose, to my thinking at least, the reason why i don't like Maher, the main reason, compared to Stephen is cuz Bill Maher is mean spirited and i don't think I've ever heard Stephen be mean-spirited or cruel. I really can't stand that in people, which is odd cuz i can be quite mean spirited sometimes but only ever when i feel like someones being REALLY out of order, not just out of nowhere or in the broad context of talking about a whole group of people etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoulMonster Posted January 31, 2015 Share Posted January 31, 2015 Brilliant, I love him. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magisme Posted January 31, 2015 Share Posted January 31, 2015 I rest my case. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoulMonster Posted January 31, 2015 Share Posted January 31, 2015 I'm probably not giving him an entirely fair shake. I don't follow him. I've only seen him when people share clips with me, like in this thread, and when people share stuff like this it tends to be the more pointed, arrogant shit. Maybe I wouldn't feel the same if I had a more holistic view of him. As it stands, I kind of see him like I see Bill Maher from over here. That's not a compliment. What's your problem with Stephen Fry in the video posted? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magisme Posted January 31, 2015 Share Posted January 31, 2015 All due respect, SM, I'm not going to get into a discussion about issues of religion with you. I'll just say this: humanism is just as retarded as any religion, and for pretty much the same reasons. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lithium Posted January 31, 2015 Author Share Posted January 31, 2015 All due respect, SM, I'm not going to get into a discussion about issues of religion with you. I'll just say this: humanism is just as retarded as any religion, and for pretty much the same reasons.Humanism is retarded because it prefers an invisible deity over critical thinking and evidence? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoulMonster Posted January 31, 2015 Share Posted January 31, 2015 All due respect, SM, I'm not going to get into a discussion about issues of religion with you. I'll just say this: humanism is just as retarded as any religion, and for pretty much the same reasons.Pretty lame to come with vague criticism of Stephen Fry and then not have the balls to be specific when questioned...As for an ism that isn't based on supernatural belief being "just as retarded" as an ism that is, well, that is an insult to everything truly retarded AND to the art of comparing stuff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magisme Posted January 31, 2015 Share Posted January 31, 2015 All due respect, SM, I'm not going to get into a discussion about issues of religion with you. I'll just say this: humanism is just as retarded as any religion, and for pretty much the same reasons.Humanism is retarded because it prefers an invisible deity over critical thinking and evidence?No. It's retarded because it places something at the center of all existence that has no business being at the center, and then it proceeds to develop it's morals and ethics from that initial wellspring of retardation.....lol SM. Any wonder why I won't engage in discussion with him? I'll discuss the issue with anyone else, buddy. Has nothing to do with balls. Has everything to do with your inability to discuss anything with anyone. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoulMonster Posted January 31, 2015 Share Posted January 31, 2015 All due respect, SM, I'm not going to get into a discussion about issues of religion with you. I'll just say this: humanism is just as retarded as any religion, and for pretty much the same reasons.Humanism is retarded because it prefers an invisible deity over critical thinking and evidence?No. It's retarded because it places something at the center of all existence that has no business being at the centerHumanism? You are saying that humanists place humanism at the center of all existence? What the fuck are you talking about? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magisme Posted January 31, 2015 Share Posted January 31, 2015 Nothing that you understand, obviously. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoulMonster Posted January 31, 2015 Share Posted January 31, 2015 Nothing that you understand, obviously. And you fail to see the genius of Stephen Fry? No wonder Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magisme Posted January 31, 2015 Share Posted January 31, 2015 Someone is seriously clutching at straws because I won't discuss with them. ....Lith or anyone else, I'd be happy to elaborate on my thoughts on Fry and humanism and whatever else, but let's wait until this guy goes away. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amir Posted January 31, 2015 Share Posted January 31, 2015 Don't be a dick, mags.Humanism is retarded because it's arrogant in placing human beings and their invented morals and ethics and pisspoor attempt at "rationality" at the centre of the universe, therefore nihilism is the only one true ideology? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoulMonster Posted January 31, 2015 Share Posted January 31, 2015 Lith or anyone else, I'd be happy to elaborate on my thoughts on Fry and humanism and whatever else, but let's wait until this guy goes away.I will leave now so please go ahead and explain why you don't like Stephen Fry in the video above and how, heh, "humanists place humanism in the center of all existence" and how that makes it "equally" retarded as "any religion", to everyone else but me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magisme Posted January 31, 2015 Share Posted January 31, 2015 I'm not being a dick. I stated clearly at the outset that I wasn't going to discuss it with him. He couldn't accept it, so I had to make the point even clearer. Nihilism is no good either. And Nietzsche was not a fuckin' nihilist, so all you wikipedia philosophers can shut the fuck up. Anyone else notice how SM quoted himself and pawned it off as my idea there? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amir Posted January 31, 2015 Share Posted January 31, 2015 Why is nihilism no good? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magisme Posted January 31, 2015 Share Posted January 31, 2015 Why is nihilism no good?Because there is meaning. It doesn't come from a transcendental being or anything like that, it's not fixed or stationary, and it's not always good, but it's there. More sophisticated nihilists understand that to an extent, but, again, this idea of the center is important, and nihilists place this idea of nothingness and meaninglessness at the center. Why? Because God doesn't guarantee meaning? Seems awfully tied to religious thought for something that claims to reject religion. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoulMonster Posted January 31, 2015 Share Posted January 31, 2015 Anyone else notice how SM quoted himself and pawned it off as my idea there? Probably not, since most people here are much brighter than you: humanism is just as retarded as any religion Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magisme Posted January 31, 2015 Share Posted January 31, 2015 "humanists place humanism in the center of all existence" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amir Posted January 31, 2015 Share Posted January 31, 2015 Why is nihilism no good?Because there is meaning. It doesn't come from a transcendental being or anything like that, it's not fixed or stationary, and it's not always good, but it's there. More sophisticated nihilists understand that to an extent, but, again, this idea of the center is important, and nihilists place this idea of nothingness and meaninglessness at the center. Why? Because God doesn't guarantee meaning? Seems awfully tied to religious thought for something that claims to reject religion.What do you mean by meaning? A singular universal meaning, or individual meaning, or something else? If an asteroid or meteorite or whatever was to come tomorrow and wipe out all of human civilisation and life on Earth, would there still be meaning? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magisme Posted January 31, 2015 Share Posted January 31, 2015 Why is nihilism no good?Because there is meaning. It doesn't come from a transcendental being or anything like that, it's not fixed or stationary, and it's not always good, but it's there. More sophisticated nihilists understand that to an extent, but, again, this idea of the center is important, and nihilists place this idea of nothingness and meaninglessness at the center. Why? Because God doesn't guarantee meaning? Seems awfully tied to religious thought for something that claims to reject religion.What do you mean by meaning? A singular universal meaning, or individual meaning, or something else? If an asteroid or meteorite or whatever was to come tomorrow and wipe out all of human civilisation and life on Earth, would there still be meaning?Ah, excellent. No there would not, imo. Meaning is a human construct. So I definitely don't mean a universal meaning, but I also don't mean atomized individual meanings. Our individual meanings are tied to and guided by more general, societal meanings, and vice versa. There is no beginning. There is no end. There is no center. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amir Posted January 31, 2015 Share Posted January 31, 2015 Why is nihilism no good?Because there is meaning. It doesn't come from a transcendental being or anything like that, it's not fixed or stationary, and it's not always good, but it's there. More sophisticated nihilists understand that to an extent, but, again, this idea of the center is important, and nihilists place this idea of nothingness and meaninglessness at the center. Why? Because God doesn't guarantee meaning? Seems awfully tied to religious thought for something that claims to reject religion.What do you mean by meaning? A singular universal meaning, or individual meaning, or something else? If an asteroid or meteorite or whatever was to come tomorrow and wipe out all of human civilisation and life on Earth, would there still be meaning?Ah, excellent. No there would not, imo. Meaning is a human construct. So I definitely don't mean a universal meaning, but I also don't mean atomized individual meanings. Our individual meanings are tied to and guided by more general, societal meanings, and vice versa. There is no beginning. There is no end. There is no center.Why not atomised individual meanings? How can the societal meanings be anything more than a collection of individual meanings if there is no centre? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magisme Posted January 31, 2015 Share Posted January 31, 2015 Why is nihilism no good?Because there is meaning. It doesn't come from a transcendental being or anything like that, it's not fixed or stationary, and it's not always good, but it's there. More sophisticated nihilists understand that to an extent, but, again, this idea of the center is important, and nihilists place this idea of nothingness and meaninglessness at the center. Why? Because God doesn't guarantee meaning? Seems awfully tied to religious thought for something that claims to reject religion.What do you mean by meaning? A singular universal meaning, or individual meaning, or something else? If an asteroid or meteorite or whatever was to come tomorrow and wipe out all of human civilisation and life on Earth, would there still be meaning?Ah, excellent. No there would not, imo. Meaning is a human construct. So I definitely don't mean a universal meaning, but I also don't mean atomized individual meanings. Our individual meanings are tied to and guided by more general, societal meanings, and vice versa. There is no beginning. There is no end. There is no center.Why not atomised individual meanings? How can the societal meanings be anything more than a collection of individual meanings if there is no centre?You imagine that the individual comes before society. It does not. But neither does society come before the individual. They create each other. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amir Posted January 31, 2015 Share Posted January 31, 2015 Why is nihilism no good?Because there is meaning. It doesn't come from a transcendental being or anything like that, it's not fixed or stationary, and it's not always good, but it's there. More sophisticated nihilists understand that to an extent, but, again, this idea of the center is important, and nihilists place this idea of nothingness and meaninglessness at the center. Why? Because God doesn't guarantee meaning? Seems awfully tied to religious thought for something that claims to reject religion.What do you mean by meaning? A singular universal meaning, or individual meaning, or something else? If an asteroid or meteorite or whatever was to come tomorrow and wipe out all of human civilisation and life on Earth, would there still be meaning?Ah, excellent. No there would not, imo. Meaning is a human construct. So I definitely don't mean a universal meaning, but I also don't mean atomized individual meanings. Our individual meanings are tied to and guided by more general, societal meanings, and vice versa. There is no beginning. There is no end. There is no center.Why not atomised individual meanings? How can the societal meanings be anything more than a collection of individual meanings if there is no centre?You imagine that the individual comes before society. It does not. But neither does society come before the individual. They create each other.How is society anything more than a collection of individuals? What is society?And doesn't the existence of people who believe life is without meaning, i.e. nihilists, prove that not every individual has their own meaning? If such an individual kills him/herself, what meaning do they have in this world afterwards? To be mourned? What if they had no loved ones, and died alone? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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