Has the "regrouping" ruined the hype for a possible future AFD Reunion?

[bigpoop]

16 minutes ago, bt88 said:

I have. I don't have a problem with Richard and thats the difference here. Here's a hypothetical- the current old/new hybrid line up is already playing stadiums- what difference does Izzy and Steven being in the band make as a whole? Do they sell MORE tickets? Get HIGHER demand for shows?  People outside of the forums know Axl and Slash, and then Duff. Thats why this version is playing stadiums and Nu GNR were playing smaller arenas. Whats the measurable effect of having Izzy and Steven on board? 

That's easy.

 

Having them there makes it actually sound like Guns N' Roses. Some of us see this as a desirable thing and have difficulty understanding those that don't.

15 hours ago, bt88 said:

Did people who are currently clamoring for Izzy and Adler stop paying attention when it was Gilby and Matt? I'm guessing no.  

Yes. I most certainly did. People keep throwing that out like it's an instant argument killer and no one will say yes. I'm here to tell you there were definitely people that did not accept the lineup change. 

[sonofnazareth]

25 minutes ago, bt88 said:

I have. I don't have a problem with Richard and thats the difference here. Here's a hypothetical- the current old/new hybrid line up is already playing stadiums- what difference does Izzy and Steven being in the band make as a whole? Do they sell MORE tickets? Get HIGHER demand for shows?  People outside of the forums know Axl and Slash, and then Duff. Thats why this version is playing stadiums and Nu GNR were playing smaller arenas. Whats the measurable effect of having Izzy and Steven on board? 

1. The original GNR chemistry/sound/spirit.

2. I think that more people outside of the forums miss Izzy and Steven than you would think. 

If this is about selling tickets/higher demand for shows alone, then they might as well get Taylor Swift, Justin Bieber and Kanye West in the band.

[Tom-Ass]

48 minutes ago, sonofnazareth said:

2. I think that more people outside of the forums miss Izzy and Steven than you would think. 

There certainly are.. I see it quite a bit. There are definitely casual fans that have no idea but people underestimate how big Gn'R were. To say that people outside of this forum only know Slash and Axl is just not the case. A lot of the people that only know those two probably aren't going to shows any way.

[bt88]

Do you guys do this with other bands too? Do you not go see Journey or Smashing Pumpkins or Weezer whoever else unless its the EXACT line up you liked at a specific moment in time? Also how do you put the lack of Izzy on the current band? isnt it possible what we know about Izzy that he may not have wanted to do it? Are they just supposed to shut it down without him despite the high levels of demand? What do you think this is about? Of Course ticket sales are a goal. How could it not be? and thats not the same as it being a cash grab. And public interest is a goal, and its hard to argue the public interest is as high as its been in a long long time. Thats probably their goal even if it isnt ours. 

Edited April 5, 2016 by bt88

[sonofnazareth]

17 minutes ago, bt88 said:

Do you guys do this with other bands too? Do you not go see Journey or Smashing Pumpkins or Weezer whoever else unless its the EXACT line up you liked at a specific moment in time? Also how do you put the lack of Izzy on the current band? isnt it possible what we know about Izzy that he may not have wanted to do it? Are they just supposed to shut it down without him despite the high levels of demand? Tickets sales my not the goal but public interest certainly is and its hard to argue the public interest is as high as its been in a long long time. Thats probably their goal even if it isnt ours. 

I have seen bands with two or more original members and a couple of randoms thrown into the pot..they lacked the spark and 'feel' of the original band, and gave a 'professional' but tedious performance. They are entertaining (if you've never seen the real thing), but can never be compared to the original band from a musical perspective. 

Examples: Black Sabbath, Bad Company, Deep Purple, UFO. And yes, Journey is not the same without Steve Perry or even Gregg Rolie for that matter, and come on, D'arcy and Iha were such an integral part of the Pumpkin's stage presence and sound. 

We do not know if Izzy was contacted, offered a disrespectful contract or if his wish was for an AFD 5 reunion. They can do whatever they want..its their life and the fans' money. 

Edited April 5, 2016 by sonofnazareth

[Tom-Ass]

28 minutes ago, bt88 said:

Do you guys do this with other bands too? Do you not go see Journey or Smashing Pumpkins or Weezer whoever else unless its the EXACT line up you liked at a specific moment in time? Also how do you put the lack of Izzy on the current band? isnt it possible what we know about Izzy that he may not have wanted to do it? Are they just supposed to shut it down without him despite the high levels of demand? What do you think this is about? Of Course ticket sales are a goal. How could it not be? and thats not the same as it being a cash grab. And public interest is a goal, and its hard to argue the public interest is as high as its been in a long long time. Thats probably their goal even if it isnt ours. 

It all depends on the band.. Most do not charge $300 dollars for tickets lol.  For a band where only 3 out of 7 are original members. Most people realize that it is hard to keep the same lineup 30 years after a bands inception.. It is what it is.. Just how to see how it plays out. I was all in at 3 out of 6 members.. Throw in the chick from Kid's incorporated and it throws off the ratio even more. She is easily counts for 2 unoriginals.

[bigpoop]

Does Weezer set up a museum at their gigs?  Do they do play stunt gigs at the clubs they played starting out?  

 

Whether they use they "r" word or not doesn't change the fact that that is what they're selling.   

 

The fact is, these guys are trading heavily on the history of the band and they're doing it with a bunch of people that weren't there. And that's kinda lame.

 

Edited April 5, 2016 by bigpoop

[scooby845]

Hey guys how's everyone doing? 

 

To make long story short, I'm coming from now deserted chinesedemocracy.com forum where I've been member since 2010.. Needless to say it looks like a ghost town now since all the nuGuns fans resigned from their respective jobs as supporters since the reunion occurred...

 

Here I come (in from a cold...haha) with the intention of sharing this amazing journey with all of you...Needless to say I'm as die hard GnR fan as it gets, with genuine respect to all the post-Slash era members that contributed to GnR...

 

So I figured... I should give my two cents...

 

Of all the talk the reunion has been given, yes I myself expected the original AFD 5. I mean who didn't..? Not that I'm unsatisfied with the current situation ( I myself got to see GnR in 2010 and 2012 with the former being Axl's best voice year since UYI tour and latter the second best in 2009-2014 era...) it's just it could have been better... With all the talk surrounding reunion and hype mounting 23 prior to... I come to the conclusion that the original AFD 5 shoud have performed... GnR were the 'lightning in the bottle' in their heyday so to tell and this was the only chance to let that lightning out of the bottle.... Steven and Izzy should have been there (I'll come back to this later...)

 

Regarding the promotion problem some of you might say - it was never billed as 'reunion'...and it would have been a major kick in the face to all those who expected the AFD5... yeah I know... but that's just the formality...we all know what's in everyone's mind considered reunion - Slash and Axl... but for the Appetite-era 

fans the so-called reunion of Axl and Slash meant a one-off thing could happen..to se AFD5... which brings us to the next issue which was aforementioned as something I would get back to....

 

Steven problem... he's always wanted it and he should get it...and not only that, he DESERVES it... many of the users from what I've read on this forum as a guest prior to reunion and whom I don't wanna classify as haters, rather as nuGuns supporters, strictly asserted that Steven is unable to tour with Guns due to his emotional instability .. some of them even claimed he cannot play due to drug filled past.. Well that's long gone and I think he let go off that and he's ready. He's been touring his band and YouTube videos prove his capability of playing AFD.. 

 

Which brings us to Matt-Frank problem...Steven himself said he got no problem of sharing the stage with Matt as long as he opened and closed the show.. For that matter even if Axl's got no intention of working with Matt, I don't see why Steven and Frank couldn't collaborate.. There are 7 songs from AFD they always perform live with Patience and Civil War.. and you tell me Steven's INCAPABLE of THAT??? I mean really.. he could play 100 stadiums with 9 songs a night...

I don't really like Frank considering his grooveless beating but it is as it gets.. which brings us to...

 

Izzy problem... I got nothing against Fortus, I even consider him the best post-Slash era guitarist and for that matter he is a decent substitution.. it's just if they get Steven Izzy is back. No more a recluse...

 

Some might say it's the best thing we got fro this reunion,, but it could be a lot better and it's not something impossible.. For all we know this more looks like Slash and Duff joined nuGuns.. 1. CD songs 2. 2nd keyboardist (completely unnecessary 3. nuGuns rhythm section...

 

Conclusion. My intention was to share a vision of a true GnR fan.. yes that vision includes a support of all their incarnations and endeavors but it seems surreal and hypocritical to assert this is better than having Izzy and Steven (with or without Matt) back or even Gilby for that matter...After all those 5 guys recorded what we listen to nowadays... they are the public image..they are the brand.. they are skin n' bones.. the soul n' spirit...they are Guns N; Roses!

 

With respect to all and their respective opinions...let us embark on a journey of a (Not In This) lifetime!! 

 

Peace..

*No this is not a spam... topics are similar

[Seb91]

I feel the same way about the GN'R reunion as I felt about the Black Sabbath when the news broke that Bill Ward wouldn't be part of it in that I'm really excited that the majority of the classic lineup of one of my all time favourite bands is back together but at the same I feel a bit disappointed that it's not a fuller reunion. All the key GN'R members are alive and well so technically  it could happen although obviously Izzy seems to prefer smaller scale things and Adler could be something of a liability. However, I feel that Matt and Gilby, whilst not being part of the AFD lineup would still have made it seem more of a real 'return' to something rather than being a new lineup of the band and feeling like a continuation of the last few years. 

I saw Fleetwood Mac with Christine McVie last year and there's truly nothing better than seeing the full classic lineup of a band completely killing it. What's frustrating is that Matt and Adler were obviously up for doing it together as per the Hall Of Fame induction and given that Izzy has guested over the years chances are he may have done a few guest spots. They're also charging reunion prices for tickets. I have nothing against bands playing without key members (I mean I was a huge nuGuns fan after all!) - I'm seeing Queen later in the year who are obviously missing key members. They weren't charging the equivalent of $300 a ticket though...

Edited April 5, 2016 by BassistSeb

[Tom-Ass]

47 minutes ago, BassistSeb said:

I feel the same way about the GN'R reunion as I felt about the Black Sabbath when the news broke that Bill Ward wouldn't be part of it in that I'm really excited that the majority of the classic lineup of one of my all time favourite bands is back together but at the same I feel a bit disappointed that it's not a fuller reunion. All the key GN'R members are alive and well so technically  it could happen although obviously Izzy seems to prefer smaller scale things and Adler could be something of a liability. However, I feel that Matt and Gilby, whilst not being part of the AFD lineup would still have made it seem more of a real 'return' to something rather than being a new lineup of the band and feeling like a continuation of the last few years. 

I saw Fleetwood Mac with Christine McVie last year and there's truly nothing better than seeing the full classic lineup of a band completely killing it. What's frustrating is that Matt and Adler were obviously up for doing it together as per the Hall Of Fame induction and given that Izzy has guested over the years chances are he may have done a few guest spots. They're also charging reunion prices for tickets. I have nothing against bands playing without key members (I mean I was a huge nuGuns fan after all!) - I'm seeing Queen later in the year who are obviously missing key members. They weren't charging the equivalent of $300 a ticket though...

I am a HUGE Sabbath fan and was bummed about Bill as well but this is far worse in my opinion.. At least with Sabbath 75% of the band was there.. Bill Ward is my favorite all time drummer and the guy taking his pot was incredible.. This drummer, not so much and there is only like 40% originals on the stage.. I was full on ready to accept 50% for what it was until they surprised us with Strawberry Shortcake.. Let Axl have his binky's Frank and Fortus.. Let Axl play his massively popular CD songs.. But do you really need to turn the knife by having some raver chick add synths over classic songs that are better without them? Then again as you mentioned, there are far more legendary bands than Gn'R that don't charge $300 a ticket.. 

I blame Slash and Duff for this mess as much as anyone.. For years I admired their integrity.. Seeing that chick on stage made me realize that this is just about the money. Just don't do or say anything that might piss Axl off. There is no way in hell that they think Strawberry Shortcake is a good idea or has a purpose. I don't care if they come out tomorrow and say she does.. They are full of it.

[Seb91]

9 hours ago, Tom-Ass said:

I am a HUGE Sabbath fan and was bummed about Bill as well but this is far worse in my opinion.. At least with Sabbath 75% of the band was there.. Bill Ward is my favorite all time drummer and the guy taking his pot was incredible.. This drummer, not so much and there is only like 40% originals on the stage.. I was full on ready to accept 50% for what it was until they surprised us with Strawberry Shortcake.. Let Axl have his binky's Frank and Fortus.. Let Axl play his massively popular CD songs.. But do you really need to turn the knife by having some raver chick add synths over classic songs that are better without them? Then again as you mentioned, there are far more legendary bands than Gn'R that don't charge $300 a ticket.. 

I blame Slash and Duff for this mess as much as anyone.. For years I admired their integrity.. Seeing that chick on stage made me realize that this is just about the money. Just don't do or say anything that might piss Axl off. There is no way in hell that they think Strawberry Shortcake is a good idea or has a purpose. I don't care if they come out tomorrow and say she does.. They are full of it.

I also guess that with Sabbath, Bill was at least invited even if he found the terms of his contract insulting. I actually didn't mind Frank's drumming at the nuGuns shows I saw but I think what's rubbing me up the wrong way about it is that they're effectively advertising this as a reunion - return to the old logo, pop up museum, crazy ticket prices etc. when there's three people on stage who weren't there during the UYI tour. I've got nothing against Melissa at all, from what I've heard of her stuff before (I first found out about her via Bucket's Best Regards set) she's a great musician, however, pre CD GN'R doesn't call for synths (especially as Dizzy's already there) and the two CD tracks they played the other night would have worked without a synth player. I always figured in a reunion Fortus would probably be the guitar player but it's crazy to me that Matt was excluded. With another synth player and without Matt, who was around for the UYI era and was obviously a big part of VR, this certainly seems like another chapter in the nuGuns saga rather than a big nostalgic reunion. 

I guess I was hoping for the HOF lineup with Axl on vocals with guest spots from Izzy. I'm happy with Fortus being the main guy as you've got to be realistic.

I do however think the Troubadour show looked great and I'm the most excited about GN'R I've been in a long time. That being said, I don't know whether I'll make a show due to ticket prices. I kind of have a rule that I won't pay more than £100 (around $141 according to Google), the time I was going to break that rule was for the Zeppelin reunion but didn't end up getting tickets for. The only bands I've paid £100 to see are The Stones and David Gilmour and the latter's a charity show. I think it's crazy how high ticket prices have gone up. I mean, for the same price that GN'R are charging you could go to a three day festival!

Edited April 6, 2016 by BassistSeb

[dalsh327]

GNR never broke up. This isn't a "reunion" even though we're calling it that. A couple of members quit and came back. GNR has "eras" to it and even going back to "the original GNR", lineups have changed since 1985, haven't they?? 

The one thing is that Slash, Axl, and Duff never stopped being business partners. It doesn't mean Axl didn't give up the name, but he gave a lot of control up. By choice. 

Keep in mind Black Sabbath had already done a full reunion and people had the chance to see it. 

Steve Perry going back to Journey would be a huge deal, the reunion album did really well and people were pissed they didn't tour. 

The AFD album was massive and some of the fans want the people who were on that album. It doesn't mean they're not going to go see the band, but it leaves them feeling incomplete. 

 

 

[AncientEvil80]

3 minutes ago, dalsh327 said:

GNR never broke up. This isn't a "reunion" even though we're calling it that. A couple of members quit and came back. GNR has "eras" to it and even going back to "the original GNR", lineups have changed since 1985, haven't they?? 

Well, somebody loves to cuddle with his own illusions, huh? 

GNR imploded. Officially slowly dying the moment Popcorn was ousted. 

 

 

[dalsh327]

3 hours ago, AncientEvil80 said:

Well, somebody loves to cuddle with his own illusions, huh? 

GNR imploded. Officially slowly dying the moment Popcorn was ousted. 

 

 

It is what it is. They climbed Mount Everest as a band.

 

 

[Tom-Ass]

5 hours ago, BassistSeb said:

 this certainly seems like another chapter in the nuGuns saga rather than a big nostalgic reunion. 

Thank You!! It really is more a continuation of NuGnR than anything.., That is all great for people that were into that.. But that isn't what it is being advertised and what is selling tickets.

[AncientEvil80]

4 hours ago, dalsh327 said:

It is what it is. They climbed Mount Everest as a band.

 

 

They surely did, but making music (as in art) is never a race. Nor it should ever be. 

I think some people in the band thought it could/would/should be. Bad mistake, and we've seen the dire consequences.

[dalsh327]

4 hours ago, Tom-Ass said:

Thank You!! It really is more a continuation of NuGnR than anything.., That is all great for people that were into that.. But that isn't what it is being advertised and what is selling tickets.

It brings back some of what made GNR great, and keeps some of the nuGuns material intact, but it also depends on how much in the vault has Buckethead's fingerprints on it. Maybe with Melissa (and Brain) involved in GNR, that could reopen a conversation between Axl & Bucket, when GNR passes through San Francisco.