mikeman5150

Use your illusion tour vs. not in this lifetime tour

128 posts in this topic

On 4/19/2017 at 5:44 PM, liqddynamite said:

Correct.  People need to realize that back then artists made their money from album sales and the tour was a means to sell albums.  Today, its basically the other way around.  

Sort of, but not exactly. Bands also made a lot of money off of touring back in the day.

The general standard was that bands made one dollar per album sold. So for the majority of bands, touring made them more money than album sales. 

But you are correct in terms of what happens today in the rock world. Rock bands don't sell as many albums so touring is the main revenue source.  

**********

Like many have said. You can't really compare the two tours. 

The Illusions were amazing because GnR was actually sharing new music with their fans. And you could get great tickets without having to take out a second mortgage. 

Illusions was all about the music. This tour is 94% about filling up the retirement accounts, 5% about Slash/Duff finishing up their GnR time on a positive note, and 1% about the fans. 

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21 hours ago, Derick said:

Right now, they are doing what they should do and what most of the audience that going to the shows expect them to do. Contrary to what some people say, an act of nostalgia in this context is not a bad thing. The songs they made are not disposable, there is no expiration date for this kind of art. The context plays for them, they did not stay 4 or 5 years apart, they were more than 20 years without playing together and a lot of people already had this matter closed. A new album right now is irrelevant compared to the expectation of seeing them back together playing those songs that enshrined them. After the tour yes, they should bring something new to the table but at this moment a new album would be only to calm the anxiety of a few hardcore fans and probably would be a bad business strategy.

Lol. 

Sharing new music with your fans is never a bad idea. Unless that music sucks. 

Bad business strategy? What? The regrouping lineup will never be as popular as they were last year. Each tour will lose the luster and hype of the big three sharing the stage again. Audience sizes will shrink when GnR comes back to your town for the 2 or 3 time. In terms of business strategy - releasing new songs or an album at the start of or during this tour would have 100% been the correct move.  

Finally, your entire point is rather off base. GnR playing two brand new songs during this tour would have increased attendance. There isn't one person in the entire world who would have said "GnR added two new songs to the setlist? Well f*ck them. Now I'm not going to the concert." But you know what? GnR is coming to my state again this year. I'm not going. But if they were going to play a couple new tunes - I would get front row seats. 

It's great you are a super fan. But take off your Rose colored glasses and look at things logically and objectively. 

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Posted (edited)

5 hours ago, Apollo said:

Lol. 

Sharing new music with your fans is never a bad idea. Unless that music sucks. 

Bad business strategy? What? The regrouping lineup will never be as popular as they were last year. Each tour will lose the luster and hype of the big three sharing the stage again. Audience sizes will shrink when GnR comes back to your town for the 2 or 3 time. In terms of business strategy - releasing new songs or an album at the start of or during this tour would have 100% been the correct move.  

Finally, your entire point is rather off base. GnR playing two brand new songs during this tour would have increased attendance. There isn't one person in the entire world who would have said "GnR added two new songs to the setlist? Well f*ck them. Now I'm not going to the concert." But you know what? GnR is coming to my state again this year. I'm not going. But if they were going to play a couple new tunes - I would get front row seats. 

It's great you are a super fan. But take off your Rose colored glasses and look at things logically and objectively. 

Please reread what I wrote. Anyway, I reaffirm it , an album at this moment is a bad strategy! At this point, they do not need new music to have a successful tour, you know, I said right now! And what you wrote reaffirms what I said, new music right now would only serve to calm the hardcore fans anxiety . They will rather need something new after this tour ends, but it's not over yet and they're still box office hit.

Edited by Derick

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Can't compare....

UYI tour was Guns N Roses in their prime

NITL is an awesome nostalgia/reunion tour

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5 hours ago, RONIN said:

They played Perfect Crime, Locomotive, Bad Obsession, Dust N' Bones, Right Next Door to Hell, and Pretty Tied Up during the UYI tour.

So no (imho). UYI> NITL Setlist 

Way more deep cuts during UYI. NITL is overstuffed with covers and Chinese Democracy songs.

UYI > NITL setlist......  Didn't have to suffer through CD songs..

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One thing better about the NITL tour over the UYI tour is the elimination of the drum solo.  Also, Slash and Duff being sober makes them better than they were.

Also, I broke up with my high school GF the day after we went to the UYI show in Miami together.  I saw NITL in Orlando with my wife and we are still married so I guess my relationships are better in the NITL tour.

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Posted (edited)

15 hours ago, Apollo said:

Finally, your entire point is rather off base. GnR playing two brand new songs during this tour would have increased attendance. There isn't one person in the entire world who would have said "GnR added two new songs to the setlist? Well f*ck them. Now I'm not going to the concert." But you know what? GnR is coming to my state again this year. I'm not going. But if they were going to play a couple new tunes - I would get front row seats. 

As is yours. There are also not many saying, "Now that they are playing 2 new songs, I'm going.". Since new music won't compete with the hits (and those people, who fill the stadiums, want to hear the hits), it won't increase attendance numbers. New music would have an effect on the second round they are hitting these markets. Without new songs some might say, "I already saw them, it's the same show, so I'm not going again.", but with new songs they just might be inclined to go again. From a business point of view the best way to do it is to first do a reunion tour, then release a new album and then tour the same markets again. 

Edited by PatrickS77

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13 hours ago, PatrickS77 said:

As is yours. There are also not many saying, "Now that they are playing 2 new songs, I'm going.". Since new music won't compete with the hits (and those people, who fill the stadiums, want to hear the hits), it won't increase attendance numbers. New music would have an effect on the second round they are hitting these markets. Without new songs some might say, "I already saw them, it's the same show, so I'm not going again.", but with new songs they just might be inclined to go again. From a business point of view the best way to do it is to first do a reunion tour, then release a new album and then tour the same markets again. 

Except they are already touring the same markets again. GnR came to my state last year. Now they are coming again this summer. Will they be supporting a new album this time around? If not, I guarantee the attendance numbers will be lower this year than last year. 

New music would increase attendance levels. Especially for a band that has released one album in the last 20 years. 

To argue that GnR is making a smart move by not sharing a new song with their fans....lol, that's just looking at the situation through Rose covered glasses (IE: automatically saying any move Axl does is the "right" move).  

Gnr should play a new song or two on the second leg of this tour. And then they should release a full length album asap. And sometime in the middle of that, Axl should share some of the reported 20-to-75 songs he has "in the can" with his millions of fans. 

Sharing music with your fans is never a bad idea. 

Unless you aren't confident that the band can put on a quality show or release more quality music?

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I find people talking about music in corporate speak, markets and ''supply and demand'', alarming! I suppose this is the sort of band Guns are now, and the sort of vernacular needed to defend their preposterous greatest hits junket, but what about artistry, following your muse, doing something original just because you want to do it and/or have a spark of creativity?

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6 minutes ago, Apollo said:

Except they are already touring the same markets again. GnR came to my state last year. Now they are coming again this summer. Will they be supporting a new album this time around? If not, I guarantee the attendance numbers will be lower this year than last year. 

New music would increase attendance levels. Especially for a band that has released one album in the last 20 years. 

To argue that GnR is making a smart move by not sharing a new song with their fans....lol, that's just looking at the situation through Rose covered glasses (IE: automatically saying any move Axl does is the "right" move).  

Gnr should play a new song or two on the second leg of this tour. And then they should release a full length album asap. And sometime in the middle of that, Axl should share some of the reported 20-to-75 songs he has "in the can" with his millions of fans. 

Sharing music with your fans is never a bad idea. 

Unless you aren't confident that the band can put on a quality show or release more quality music?

Except the US (in which they perform in different cities) and South America (which always seems to sell better than anywhere else), they are not touring the same markets. They are still on the first round until July and keep the ball rolling by going into the US cities they didn't hit the first time around. And between that, tell me, when are they supposed to record new material? That takes some time. I'm sure there will come a time sometime after the South America leg, where they might look into that. Should they then announce a third round with US dates, we can start to complain. But so far, it is too early. And again. The majority of the people, who are going to see them now, do not care for new music. Period. And no one wants to hear the old CD crap that wasn't good enough for the original CD album. Every extra song means less hits, which the people really want to see.

And yes. It is questionable that they really can release music that lives up to AFD and UYI. To some even UYI is a let down. So what makes you think that those people will be won over by new music?

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1 minute ago, DieselDaisy said:

but what about artistry, following your muse, have a spark of creativity?

He followed his muse for 10 years and the result was a lot of recorded music, 3 to 4 albums including Chinese according to Richard, but only a fraction of it released. Maybe there's no problem with creativity, or drive.

The tour is for making money, the albums to make an artistic statement. It's very simple to understand and accept.

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6 minutes ago, DieselDaisy said:

 but what about artistry, following your muse, doing something original just because you want to do it and/or have a spark of creativity?

Well, maybe their muse has left!? If their muse is with them, I'm sure they will release new music. But if they only release music, because they think they have to, to keep fans satisfied and buying tickets for their shows, is that really what we want? Do you think music that is created because they have to create music to appease the fans will be good or special? 

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1 minute ago, Rovim said:

He followed his muse for 10 years and the result was a lot of recorded music, 3 to 4 albums including Chinese according to Richard, but only a fraction of it released. Maybe there's no problem with creativity, or drive.

The tour is for making money, the albums to make an artistic statement. It's very simple to understand and accept.

I cannot seen Guns N' Roses ever resurfacing as an album band. I just think they'll tour the hits forevermore until Rose retires.

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2 minutes ago, PatrickS77 said:

Well, maybe their muse has left!? If their muse is with them, I'm sure they will release new music. But if they only release music, because they think they have to, to keep fans satisfied and buying tickets for their shows, is that really what we want? Do you think music that is created because they have to create music to appease the fans will be good or special? 

Then they should just retire once they have given the world one pass with the reunion jaunt.

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9 minutes ago, DieselDaisy said:

I cannot seen Guns N' Roses ever resurfacing as an album band. I just think they'll tour the hits forevermore until Rose retires.

I can see a trilogy or a double album in the works.

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12 minutes ago, DieselDaisy said:

Then they should just retire once they have given the world one pass with the reunion jaunt.

And why exactly should the do that? As long as people are buying tickets, they are not wrong for continuing. When people stop buying tickets, they will have no other choice than to stop too.

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On ‎4‎/‎21‎/‎2017 at 9:42 AM, Apollo said:

 

But you are correct in terms of what happens today in the rock world. Rock bands don't sell as many albums so touring is the main revenue source.  

 

Not just Rock Bands.  All music acts.  Albums don't really sell well anymore.  The best revenue generator is probably iTunes but those are downloads of individual songs so people aren't being forced to buy albums (or high priced singles) to get the one or two songs they want.  Back in the day (all the way back in the 90's), an act could make huge amounts of money just selling albums.  That simply isn't possible anymore.  Sure you can make a good living but not become wealthy.  To make the big bucks, artists must use their popular songs to sell tickets (which are way more expensive than they used to be) to concerts.

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29 minutes ago, PatrickS77 said:

And why exactly should the do that? As long as people are buying tickets, they are not wrong for continuing. When people stop buying tickets, they will have no other choice than to stop too.

It is just 'music as a museum' piece. What is the point anymore when you have not got anything inspirational to say, other than of course money accumulation?

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Posted (edited)

10 minutes ago, DieselDaisy said:

It is just 'music as a museum' piece. What is the point anymore when you have not got anything inspirational to say, other than of course money accumulation?

The Stones do it. Other than a covers album they function the same. You act like it's so dirty for an old hard rock band to give nostalgia to their fans. There is demand for it, so why not? Axl is all smiles and seems to have a good time. He answered the new music question already, you just don't like the answer: not soon, but he'd like to do it eventually.

Edited by Rovim

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Just now, Rovim said:

The Stones do it. Other than a covers album they function the same. You act like it's so dirty for an old hard rock band to give nostalgia to their fans. There is demand for it, so why not? Axl is all smiles and seems to have a good time. He answered the new music question already, you just don't like the answer: not soon, but he'd like to do it.

I'm a massive Stones fan but I think the Stones should have buggered-off years ago.

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Posted (edited)

9 minutes ago, DieselDaisy said:

I'm a massive Stones fan but I think the Stones should have buggered-off years ago.

My point is bands get old but band members want to stay rich/still play together. Doesn't mean the fire is not there anymore for an album, but live it's a job and it's silly to expect musicians to not do their thing. What are they supposed to do instead? Slash getting a job as a life coach? get real. They still want to do it, and the quality of the shows for casuals and even a lot of hardcore fans is fair. Axl is showing no signs of stopping and still has artistic intentions for the future. They haven't played together for a long time. Maybe later they'll throw some inspiration into the mix.

 

Edited by Rovim

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Just now, Rovim said:

My point is bands get old but band members want to stay rich/still play together. Doesn't mean the fire is not there anymore for an album, but live it's a job and it's silly to expect musicians to not do their thing. What are they supposed to do instead? Slash getting a job as a life coach? get real. They still want to do it, and the quality of the shows for casuals and even a lot of hardcore fans is fair. Axl is showing no signs of stopping and still has artistic intentions for the future.

 

Must I post the Charlton Heston gif?

 

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