Axl Rose Chat #6 - mygnrforum - Dec. 14, 2008

[BMo13]

I read the "homework" letter or whatever it's called. I appreciate Axl taking the time, but I'm not gonna be like many others here and just automatically take it as the gospel. I've also read Slash's book and many of the things in there make sense and some of the Axl statements make sense, but in no way come close to resolving things. The undercurrent of the piece seems to be a "my opportunity to blame Slash" session. I just can't get over the fact that seemingly everyone's (who was involved or around it) story is a lot closer to Slash's than Axl's. Sure Axl has a few people like Del, etc, but it's hard to get past the fact that they still are on the payroll in one way or another. I'm not sure, but I would imagine a lot of the blame rests on both Axl's and Slash's shoulders, but could see it would be different according to them. What I do know is that the dynamic of their relationship, personalities, and talent is what made the original GNR so fucking awesome. Creative and personal tension, that ying and yang is something that can't be quantified or explained, but when you see it, you know it. They had it, the new band doesn't. The new music is good to very good, but it's missing the energy and spirit of the earlier Axl/Slash creations and performances. I don't know if Axl realizes this because he's probably too close to the fire to have the proper perspective,but I hope someday (soon) he does! Are him and Slash ever gonna be best friends? No, and obviously they never were, but sometimes that type of energy brings out the best creatively in people. All the evidence imo, points to this being true between Axl and Slash and their musical endeavors. The tipping point was when Izzy left and there was no buffer for their relationship and they didn't know how to be effective without it. All I hope is that they someday give it a second chance. I'll support both Axl and Slash's seperate works now and in the future, but what I said earlier is what I'm really hoping for...

-Brandon

This was no much less of a "blame" piece than Slash's book was. I think that saying this was about blaming Slash is an oversimplification. It was more about clearing the air. And as far as other people's stories being closer to Slash's, like who? Izzy wasn't around in the mid-90's. Duff? Isn't that about it?

This was very cool. It was in depth and it was straight to the fans, not through the press or a book.

Ali

I would disagree on the first statement. Slash's book lays it out there, but he also never forgets to mention Axl's positive attributes at the same time. Also, I didn't say it was ALL about blaming Slash, I said it was the undercurrent and probably was something he had in mind when deciding to pick this topic to discuss. I appreciate he took the time, but like I said, I'm not taking it as the gospel. People's stories being closer to Slash's would include but not limited to Izzy, Duff, Matt, Gilby, Everyone in the Behind The Music, Ross Halfin, Mick Wall on Axl's unneccesary quest for control, etc.etc.etc.etc.etc. It just seems like everyone's opinion on Axl would make Slash's account make sense and Axl claiming Slash was the actual bad guy doesn't really really make sense when you look at the evidence and why people quit. Also Izzy leaving goes along with Slash's statements that Axl going on stage so late and making them sign contracts (Izzy specifically commented on the contract thing if I remember right) just underminded everything and took the joy out of everything. And why wouldn't it?? In an interview Izzy talked about Axl wanting him to sign a contract essentially saying he was a hired had. So is Axl now telling us Izzy is a liar too?? Parts of the homework thing just seem like revisionist history to me. Could Axl have felt that way? Sure, but eveybody else's actions and statements through the years don't line up with it. That's my opinion anyways.

Edited December 15, 2008 by BMo13

[Chris 55]

SHAVE YOUR MULLET and GET A REAL JOB... INSTEAD OF WORKING AT THE SHOE RENTAL AREA OF THE BOWLING ALLY AND TRYING TO HIT ON 13 YEAR OLD GIRLS

Wow, that was a retarded "insult" to a guy who was stating his opinion.

[The Archer]

In his posts over the past few days, Axl goes on and on now about how not-really-a-band the old GN'R was, how they didn't get along with anything, how there were secret ambitions and plots and politics right from the outset, and tones down the musical accomplishments to a point where we are to think they are insignificant compared to Chinese Democracy.

I love Axl, but the way he has responded has just made me very upset...to try and erase what put you on the map, it's despicable of anyone. Slash is just as in the wrong, but that's just it. It's a 50-50 split, and neither of them can see that. It doesn't take a genius, or someone who was even there. The very fact that they're on entire polar opposites implies that there is some middle ground they are both choosing to ignore.

And does anyone else find Axl's VERY long defense on why he kept the name Guns N' Roses just.......off? I appreciate the man offering his genuine opinion, but it doesn't matter what band it is...if it gets to the point where there is just one of the people left, then it is not the same band of people, and therefore requires a different identity. Guns N' Roses is not a survival story for anyone but Axl, and that makes it AXL'S survival story, not Guns N' Roses.

And?

[GNR06]

To all the haters: why the fuck do you even still come here? This is a GN'R forum. If you don't like GN'R anymore, then why spend time in this forum? Don't you guys have anything else to spend your time with?!?

cupcakes ...

Because we are Guns N Roses fans... Just because we think Chinese Democracy is a joke doesn't make us any less of a Guns N' Roses fan. If Chinese Democracy wasn't released as a Guns record this wouldn't be like this.. Just deal with it.

I would say that all the Axl nutswingers that would constantly ruin threads on the VR section were worse. If they werent VR fans they shouldn't be there. I am a Guns N' Roses fan so I will continue to post here.

No, you are only a fan of the old guns. There is an "original guns" section for guys like you to post.

You've made your point about CD being a joke to you. No matter how hard you try, you aren't going to convince everyone of your take. And BTW, I would be bitter too if I felt the way you do about CD. It would suck to be you.

[Welcome to the Jungle]

If this was just the tip of the ice berg I wonder what else he will share with us

[Chris 55]

And?

[Funeral]

In his posts over the past few days, Axl goes on and on now about how not-really-a-band the old GN'R was, how they didn't get along with anything, how there were secret ambitions and plots and politics right from the outset, and tones down the musical accomplishments to a point where we are to think they are insignificant compared to Chinese Democracy.

I love Axl, but the way he has responded has just made me very upset...to try and erase what put you on the map, it's despicable of anyone. Slash is just as in the wrong, but that's just it. It's a 50-50 split, and neither of them can see that. It doesn't take a genius, or someone who was even there. The very fact that they're on entire polar opposites implies that there is some middle ground they are both choosing to ignore.

And does anyone else find Axl's VERY long defense on why he kept the name Guns N' Roses just.......off? I appreciate the man offering his genuine opinion, but it doesn't matter what band it is...if it gets to the point where there is just one of the people left, then it is not the same band of people, and therefore requires a different identity. Guns N' Roses is not a survival story for anyone but Axl, and that makes it AXL'S survival story, not Guns N' Roses.

STFU you mullet NOOB!

[Lethalis]

Thank you Axl, for taking the time and clear some things up.

To me it makes a lot more sense now why you kept the name. I always wondered about that.

PS: That song by Izzy, Box, if it's really Down By The Ocean, is stuck in my head. At first listen I thought it was just okay, but it's grown on me. Would be great to see what you could do with it (if it's still being considered).

Edited December 15, 2008 by Lethalis

[The Archer]

And?

That was something I couldn't resist. Axl giving us lots of quotable quotes is one of the best things about him talking to us.

Edited December 15, 2008 by The Archer

[D-GenerationX]

How the fuck is Axl trying to tarnish Old GNR'S legacy.

Some people are too retarted.

Because he won't come on here, beg for their forgiveness, and promise to put the old band back together ASAP.

Its sad.

[DCGNR]

If the way he responded made you uncomfortable , then you are looking for the worst-case scenario

He gave his side of the story and did so very intelligently and articulately

It's up to you to decide - but the way he did it was impressive, imo

Edited December 15, 2008 by DCGNR

[sandynroses]

SHAVE YOUR MULLET and GET A REAL JOB... INSTEAD OF WORKING AT THE SHOE RENTAL AREA OF THE BOWLING ALLY AND TRYING TO HIT ON 13 YEAR OLD GIRLS

Wow, that was a retarded "insult" to a guy who was stating his opinion.

I'm sorry, I have to say this: Chris 55, your signature rules

[November_rain]

fuk man, this thread got so boring......the regular mud throwing BS started again which will never end. mygnr as usual.

axl avoid this fkn place man....just look at how the other forums are responding, its more constructive, even when negative. mygnr is all destructive and officially the garbage can of the online gnr community.

signing off this cancer forum now.

Wow man LOL. If I had said all that the children/experts/know-it-alls in here would have jumped on my throat

Anyways, I think it´s pretty cool to have Axl´s side of things and very considerate of him to even come back after all the shit that has been stirred about him in here throughout these years.

[deandebean]

Nice read, even though Axl should use some punctuations more.

Axl's info is mighty interesting. Now, we'll just have to wait for the fallout. There will be one, because I doubt the rest of the gang will stay put. Unless they just don't want Axl coming out with a bigger roar.

One of the posters brought back some Izz interview, I recall. The interview was done in 2001. Since then, Izz and Axl have mended ways. It's old story. No need to come back on that.

Those who think Axl lied, who cares. I mean, end of the story. Now, let's go forward. It's obvious there will be no reunion with Slash and Axl, just like the Beatles would never have come back with Paul and John in the band. It's the same stuff. Let's go on with life.

And for those who think Axl wasn't right in keeping the name intact, grow up; it's a business just like anything else, and the name is the most important asset you have. If the rest of the band members didn't understand that, then they probably have no clue with money.

[Randy Jesus]

SHAVE YOUR MULLET and GET A REAL JOB... INSTEAD OF WORKING AT THE SHOE RENTAL AREA OF THE BOWLING ALLY AND TRYING TO HIT ON 13 YEAR OLD GIRLS

Wow, that was a retarded "insult" to a guy who was stating his opinion.

No it wasn't because most people like him actually do work at a bowling ally. I have seen it time and time again... He isn't stating his opinion, he is trying to take a shot at Axl and hoping for a response.

Edited December 15, 2008 by Billy B

[deandebean]

He did not attack the old band; he just said that the old lineup was that: the old lineup. Now, on with the new.

[oneway23]

No, it's really that.

One of Slash's best friends - Marc Canter said on HTGH that Slash would not let Axl work on the songs that ended up being on the Snakepit record. Axl wanted to work on at least four of them, but Slash wouldn't let him.

Chew on that for a while.

Ali

Wow, Ali, I'd never seen that before...So, Canter really verified and gave credence to what Axl mentioned?

[BMo13]

One of the posters brought back some Izz interview, I recall. The interview was done in 2001. Since then, Izz and Axl have mended ways. It's old story. No need to come back on that.

How is there no need to come back on it, when what Izzy said apparently contradicts what Axl just recently wrote?

[zepsun]

I think this thread is as valid as any other thread. Some people are just assholes on here and think this a pro-GNR site or FUCK OFF! That's not the right way of thinking. This is a site to express your opinions on anything to do with GNR. If you don't like negative opinions, start your own website and admit 'pro-Axl members' only.

Up until Axl's posts, I was quite convinced that Axl was the root of all evil. Now that he is speaking, some things are getting clearer. That said, I still believe there's something that can be said about Duff, Matt and Slash being able to work together again for 8 years now. If there were huge issues, I think Slash had more to gain by healing things with Axl above anyone else.

I think a lot of what's happened with the old Guns is actually the fault of lawyers and managers. Why wouldn't these people want to dictate what happens to the band, if it made their pockets fuller? I think there might have been some 'let me at the wheel' among the band members, but I think it might have been worse among the management and legal level. "Hey Slash, you can sue for this and this and this..." "Hey Axl, Slash is going to sue you for this and this and this"....i mean come on..that shit only makes you paranoid after a while.

I like Axl's music, no matter what. It would be a dream though, to see the old Guns reunited for some special event at least. Maybe the tempestuous nature of the band is what made it so great.

As for this:

No, it's really that.

One of Slash's best friends - Marc Canter said on HTGH that Slash would not let Axl work on the songs that ended up being on the Snakepit record. Axl wanted to work on at least four of them, but Slash wouldn't let him.

Chew on that for a while.

Ali

To me it's not a big deal that a member would say "I don't want you to be part of this song"....The more interesting thing is WHY? Did Slash previously bring it to Axl and Axl trashed it? Did Slash already have Eric's vocals on it? Was he sick of the current situation in GNR and wanted to piss Axl off out of spite? A lot of these things on both sides of the fence sound petty.

Edited December 15, 2008 by zepsun

[BrownRock]

How the fuck is Axl trying to tarnish Old GNR'S legacy.

Some people are too retarted.

D, D, D frickin D. It's retarded not retarted. Do you want jam tarts or something.

[GNR_92]

Sigh. You find haters everywhere these days, eh? As soon as something that requires an opinion is put out there, people can't wait to walk all over it and belittle it.

Go ahead, I'm not here to change that. I'm just disappointed with the way Axl, Slash, and Duff have failed to grow up after all these years, and are STILL Out Ta Get each other. They are in their 40s, for crying out loud. Just take a chapter from Izzy's book already...he was just as much a part of the dysfunction and dislike as the rest of them. Axl and Slash even went on a radio show in early '94 saying they wanted "nothing to do" with Izzy again (don't believe me? youtube it...it's divided into 4 parts). But he just chugged on, both in life and music. No lawsuits, no angry interviews, nothing. He just let it cool down and, these years later, is perfectly comfortable hanging out/playing with any of them. Music = music, not bullshit. In that way, Iz rules, and the rest need to stop and contemplate if it would really be THAT bad to just deal with their issues, person-to-person, and then move on peaceably.

[deandebean]

One of the posters brought back some Izz interview, I recall. The interview was done in 2001. Since then, Izz and Axl have mended ways. It's old story. No need to come back on that.

How is there no need to come back on it, when what Izzy said apparently contradicts what Axl just recently wrote?

Izzy did the interview in 2001. Different times, different moods. Today, they talk to each other; heck, they even played together on some gigs. Usually, I guy that pissed that much on an ex-partner does not go back playing with him unless they cleared the air first. I suspect they had a nice talk and the issues are settled.

Besides, it is apparent that two of the band members understood that the band grew too fast too soon: Izzy, he left because he wasn't comfortable in that environment; Axl, he understood that he needed to protect the name and the product before losing control fast. The other two, I don't know. They mostly seem like guys who enjoyed the ride in the fast lane. They woke up way too late, way after Axl had done what he had to do. But it's only an opinion. And opinions are just that: opinions.

Like I wrote before, let's go forward. The issue is dead anyways.

Edited December 15, 2008 by deandebean

[Bush]

this kind of posts made axl leave the internet the last time...

[AxlCorp]

...I'm just disappointed with the way Axl, Slash, and Duff have failed to grow up after all these years, and are STILL Out Ta Get each other...

That's not a fair assessment. Easy for you to say when you aren't the one being fucked over.

[axldavies]

How is it some people on here have appointed themselves experts at things they don't have a fucking clue about?

It never fails to amaze me how people, who probably work in Burger King, come on here and act as though they know the record industry, the business world and psycology inside out.

Creative and personal tension, that ying and yang is something that can't be quantified or explained, but when you see it, you know it. They had it, the new band doesn't. The new music is good to very good, but it's missing the energy and spirit of the earlier Axl/Slash creations and performances. I don't know if Axl realizes this because he's probably too close to the fire to have the proper perspective,but I hope someday (soon) he does! Are him and Slash ever gonna be best friends? No, and obviously they never were, but sometimes that type of energy brings out the best creatively in people. All the evidence imo, points to this being true between Axl and Slash and their musical endeavors. The tipping point was when Izzy left and there was no buffer for their relationship and they didn't know how to be effective without it. All I hope is that they someday give it a second chance. I'll support both Axl and Slash's seperate works now and in the future, but what I said earlier is what I'm really hoping for...

What a load of pretentious nonesense that is. Telling Axl Rose he doesn't have the 'proper perspective' on the band he's been in for 20+ years, but you do? Jesus. And as if you know what kind of energy brings out the best creatively in people, what the 'tipping point' was and what part Izzy played in their relationship.

We've got both sides of the story. Just take them for what they are without coming to conclusions or offering up some pseudo psycology bullshit on them.