Alan Niven, "I cannot digest is that he states that he is Guns N' Roses because on his own – he is not.”

[wasted]

Quite a few bands I like have had line up changes, Stones, Faith no more, Megadeth- to be honest I don't know the Stones bassist, or the guitarist on Album of the Year or who the fuck is in Megadave, or AcDc. So in someways I see Guns as the new Stones or Starship. Slash is like the Brian jones of GNR.

[GNR123GNR456]

Thsi guy is just jealous that he's not managing the band now and getting a shit load of money from the current tour.

[wasted]

This is true he has a vested interest in the og lineup，could even be right from a purists perspective but it's not his band. I would say 80% of fans are totally happy with GNR today. The lineups issues are for the obsessed really and people involved with the band.

[williambailey01]

Thsi guy is just jealous that he's not managing the band now and getting a shit load of money from the current tour.

Hardly...Niven had 17% commision on all of the music Guns released during his contract with the band up to 1993 which meant anything that was recorded during that time he got a commisoin on for perpetuity...Meaning he would get paid for every copy of AFD, Lies, UYI sold forever...He sold that right back to the band to get away from Axl for $3.5 million so he walked away from a lot of money so as not to have to deal with Axl anymore. So I doubt he is jealous as he could have been getting paid for doing nothing...............

read the interview here

http://www.4shared.com/document/uL3cGY6J/Niven_interview.html?

Don't bother trying to give some people facts, that's way too logical. They disagree with his opinion so it's easier for them to just say Niv is jealous that he is not managing the band now, sour grapes blah blah therefore by illogical extension his opinion is not valid.

I mean if he was just about money why did he turn down managing VR - that would have been some easy cash there. Maybe he cares about musical integrity and actually wants the artists he works with to be successful and connect with their audience etc etc.

Who says he would even want to work with Axl again. I mean look at all the managers Axl has been through since he fired Niven, would you really want to put yourself through all that shit again. Doug Goldstein seems to be the only manager that really wants to weasel his way back into Axl's life. I mean did you read that suck up letter that was posted recently that Goldstein sent to Axl, man that was vomit inducing.

[ThinkAboutYou]

I mean did you read that suck up letter that was posted recently that Goldstein sent to Axl, man that was vomit inducing.

I'll have to look for that

Edited September 22, 2010 by ThinkAboutYou

[Christian]

"But if I were Axl, in NO WAY would I call

that band Guns N’ Roses. The kids know

GN’R. No need to explain to you, just listen

to the albums we recorded. You can’t

argue with that."

- Duff McKagan

Damn fucking straight! You Axlites don't understand that just because Axl forced himself to own the name back in the days, doesn't mean that this "band" is Guns N' Roses. To me and most of the real GNR fans, the name Guns N' Roses represents a unit of five guys from the streets who was an equal gang. A gang who helped each other build the most dangerous and badass band in the world. A band who was a democracy and not a dictorship (at least before Axl made himself the "boss"). But you fanboys are just too blind to see the name for what it really is. You guys just say "Uh, it's just a name, get over it mullethead. And BWT, Axl should grow back his goatie again 'cause it roxx" etc.

[Jackie Moon]

"But if I were Axl, in NO WAY would I call

that band Guns N’ Roses. The kids know

GN’R. No need to explain to you, just listen

to the albums we recorded. You can’t

argue with that."

- Duff McKagan

Damn fucking straight! You Axlites don't understand that just because Axl forced himself to own the name back in the days, doesn't mean that this "band" is Guns N' Roses. To me and most of the real GNR fans, the name Guns N' Roses represents a unit of five guys from the streets who was an equal gang. A gang who helped each other build the most dangerous and badass band in the world. A band who was a democracy and not a dictorship (at least before Axl made himself the "boss"). But you fanboys are just too blind to see the name for what it really is. You guys just say "Uh, it's just a name, get over it mullethead. And BWT, Axl should grow back his goatie again 'cause it roxx" etc.

i dont consider it guns n' roses just because axl says so. that doesn't justify the name.

it comes down to two things for me.

1.musical direction. AFD transformed into UYI, transformed into CD. seems a logical progression IMO. further on down the same road gnr has been traveling since 1985.

2.attitude. everyone talks about the great rebellious attitude of the original band, thats what makes gnr gnr, the "gang", the rebellious spirit

axl replaced slash with a guy wearing a kfc bucket on his head, then took 15 years to release one album. when he finally put it out there, he goes MIA.

i think the CD saga is in the spirit of guns n' roses.

tokenmentionofslashnotbeinggnrbyplayingwithfergieandthepussycatdolls

Edited September 22, 2010 by Jackie Moon

[ohmygod]

i dont consider it guns n' roses just because axl says so. that doesn't justify the name.

it comes down to two things for me.

1.musical direction. AFD transformed into UYI, transformed into CD. seems a logical progression IMO. further on down the same road gnr has been traveling since 1985.

2.attitude. everyone talks about the great rebellious attitude of the original band, thats what makes gnr gnr, the "gang", the rebellious spirit

axl replaced slash with a guy wearing a kfc bucket on his head, then took 15 years to release one album. when he finally put it out there, he goes MIA.

i think the CD saga is in the spirit of guns n' roses.

tokenmentionofslashnotbeinggnrbyplayingwithfergieandthepussycatdolls

Thank you for getting it. I'm in the same boat in my thought of gnr.

I love how this band seriously does what they want. Bad press, no press, whatever, they STILL play by their own rules. This is a tight band who really seem to get along well. I believe Axl has spoken about how much he loves these guys, and how much fun the band has.

[BassLikeHot]

i dont consider it guns n' roses just because axl says so. that doesn't justify the name.

it comes down to two things for me.

1.musical direction. AFD transformed into UYI, transformed into CD. seems a logical progression IMO. further on down the same road gnr has been traveling since 1985.

2.attitude. everyone talks about the great rebellious attitude of the original band, thats what makes gnr gnr, the "gang", the rebellious spirit

axl replaced slash with a guy wearing a kfc bucket on his head, then took 15 years to release one album. when he finally put it out there, he goes MIA.

i think the CD saga is in the spirit of guns n' roses.

tokenmentionofslashnotbeinggnrbyplayingwithfergieandthepussycatdolls

Thank you for getting it. I'm in the same boat in my thought of gnr.

I love how this band seriously does what they want. Bad press, no press, whatever, they STILL play by their own rules. This is a tight band who really seem to get along well. I believe Axl has spoken about how much he loves these guys, and how much fun the band has.

That, and slandering a GN'R fan forum moderator with Fisher Price wit.

[ohmygod]

tokenmentionofslashnotbeinggnrbyplayingwithfergieandthepussycatdolls

You sly cat you, i missed that the first time.

You definitely get stye points for that.

[Daedalus]

BraveWords.com: For me, it was really more a question of is this what I waited fourteen years for? These songs could have been worked up in six months.

Alan Niven:“Here’s my pot shot about Chinese Democracy. Axl made two huge mistakes. One was releasing it and the other was Irving Azoff.”

BraveWords.com: Irving Azoff? Really? Why?

Alan Niven: “If I’d been in a responsible position to advise and counsel Axl, I would have done everything in my power to make sure that Chinese Democracy was something that people always talked about and wondered about, but never actually got to completely hear, that it would never be actually released. Recording went on for so long that there was no way in hell that the record he was putting together was going to meet expectations. The minute it was released it became just one more record. Before its release it was a myth. It was fascinating. People talked about it. People wanted to hear it. The third mistake was that he should have made sure to keep all his tapes and all his discs under his wing and under his lock and key, so, that there wouldn’t have been any leaks. Then he could have released the occasional track and he could have worked them 'live' for another ten years. That would have been more mysterious, more engaging, more fascinating…”

BraveWords.com: The Toronto Star interviewed me about Chinese Democracy’s release and my quote was that ‘Chinese Democracy – the myth would always be greater than the actual album’.

Alan Niven: “Absolutely and if Axl had gone out and toured when he needed to he could have played the occasional song from it live. There would have been a process there for him… the immediacy of performance really sharpens up a musical statement and releasing the whole album was a mistake. I think the release was done purely based on financial reasons. And Irving wanted to get it out of the way because he wanted the reunion. I doubt he was motivated to see it successful. He essentially got paid for it's release, not it's subsequent performance and the deal with Best Buy was set up that way. Going with Best Buy narrowed the market reach - Wal Mart would have been a better exclusive - they have a deeper reach into secondary and tertiary markets - but best of all would have been to let everyone have it. There is a sense that the deal was designed to maximize the immediate take - to grab that and run to the next point of agenda - a re-union. I don’t think Irving ever understood the unlikelihood of that reunion ever taking place and how deep feelings run.”

This.

[Jackie Moon]

the problem is the two eras (hell, 4 even) are just so different, the umbrella of "guns n roses fan" is so wide that it makes a consensus nearly impossible.

there are a lot of old gnr fans who have zero interest in the new sound. of course they dont think its guns n' roses, they have zero invested in this. what are they going to get out of this? a silkworms leak? there is nothing for them here. all it is, is a roadblock. standing between them and 20 year glory.

for the fans of both, there is a much more balanced view. im not necessarily saying we are closer to the truth, we are all in the same boat here, fans swimming in a sea of allegations and illusions, but the people who have interest in both eras see things more evenly i would say.

Edited September 22, 2010 by Jackie Moon

[Christian]

1.musical direction. AFD transformed into UYI, transformed into CD. seems a logical progression IMO.

Exept that CD didn't have Izzy, Slash or Duff to contribute with the song writing. They are all essential to make a real GNR product, don't you get it? Steven is also essential of course, but they did survive with 4 out of 5 gunners on UYI, even though Matt's drumming is very boring and uninspiring at times. But when it's just 1 out og 5 left, there is just no point to use the name Guns N' Roses anymore, not matter how great you think CD is...

This is true he has a vested interest in the og lineup，could even be right from a purists perspective but it's not his band. I would say 80% of fans are totally happy with GNR today. The lineups issues are for the obsessed really and people involved with the band.

Bullshit! 80% of fans on THIS FORUM are happy with it. In the real world it's the complete opposite.

[Spoon87]

So, this thread is the usual same old same judging from the last couple of pages? Yay!

[Jackie Moon]

1.musical direction. AFD transformed into UYI, transformed into CD. seems a logical progression IMO.

Exept that CD didn't have Izzy, Slash or Duff to contribute with the song writing. They are all essential to make a real GNR product, don't you get it? Steven is also essential of course, but they did survive with 4 out of 5 gunners on UYI, even though Matt's drumming is very boring and uninspiring at times. But when it's just 1 out og 5 left, there is just no point to use the name Guns N' Roses anymore, not matter how great you think CD is...

when i say it sounds like the natural progression of gnr i mean "guns n' roses" , the band, im not talking specific members. what you said is more along the lines of "its the logical progression of slash, duff and axl". no, its the natural progression of guns n roses, not the members. members change. its been happening since 1985? its nothing new. im using the name guns n' roses in a general sense. great musicians making great music whether its AFD or CD.

its clear you are hung up on the specific members. for you it seems gnr = axl, izzy, slash, duff steve/matt

so there really is no winning. its like your mind is already made up, the band = original line up and anything else is illegit.

im not arguing with you, i like you and your opinion is valid, but like i said earlier, people who are "stuck" in the original era aren't going to see it from both sides. for a lot of people, gnr = the original 5 and it doesn't matter how good newgnr is or how much they sound like original era, its not guns n roses, and nothing will change that.

FYI i agree the name is pointless and should have been left in 1996.

Edited September 22, 2010 by Jackie Moon

[stivbator]

Does it really matter at this time ? Whats done is done and any amount of wishful thinking will not change those facts. I loved the AFD lineup but have managed to accept that it is now gone and can enjoy this era for what it is , i don't really care what it is called because i still enjoy the music ( fuckin catcher live is incredible ) and i can live with it.

[Zint]

Come on Axl and Slash stop the petty bickering and get the original band back together so my friend Zint does not have to settle for second best

It wasn't even second best.

It wasn't Guns n Roses at all according to this thread.

Guns n Roses ended at Farm Aid '90.

Wow...just thought of another bummer...I didn't see The Stooges this summer,replacement James Williamson was on guitar.

fawk!!!

Actually if I thought about it enough,probably most of the bands I've ever seen I've never seen.

Damn you departing band members!!!

[dimitrisaxl]

I thought tha I've seen Iron Maiden. But now I realize that it was Bruce Dicckinson singing. Damn!!

[star]

So, this thread is the usual same old same judging from the last couple of pages? Yay!

Yep. This is one arguement that will never die. The fans are divided.

Edited September 22, 2010 by star

[Use Your Delusion 1]

further proof for you idiots of this board that as a musician, get that word, Izzy was far better than Axl or Slash

[moreblack]

I thought tha I've seen Iron Maiden. But now I realize that it was Bruce Dicckinson singing. Damn!!

see, in that case it didn't become Iron Maiden until Dickinson joined

[Ali]

I thought tha I've seen Iron Maiden. But now I realize that it was Bruce Dicckinson singing. Damn!!

see, in that case it didn't become Iron Maiden until Dickinson joined

Tell that to the people who like Paul Di'Anno. See, it's all just a matter of perspective and opinion.

Ali

[misch]

I thought tha I've seen Iron Maiden. But now I realize that it was Bruce Dicckinson singing. Damn!!

I thought that I've seen The Beatles. But now I realize that it was Ringo drumming. Damn!!

[tat2d1]

Alot of GnR fans are hypocrites. Any other band gets down to 1 original member and decides to carry on with the name & fans will lash out, "That's not (enter band name here)!!", but when Axl does it, it's another story. It's okay because it's the mighty Axl Rose. Gimme a fucking break. I like the new band, & refer to them as GnR, but in my heart I know this is The Axl Rose Band going under the GnR name simply because Axl has the right to do so ( and possibly figured a cd labeled with the GnR name would sell more than a cd labeled Axl Rose). As long as the music is good, that's all that matters, imo.

[moreblack]

Todd Kerns blog puts things into perspective

re: new guys playing with established guy and the hate they get from some crowds...