To be fair to Axl, did he have an almost impossible task when he set out to create a new band?

[TombRaider]

Does anyone here remember the hype surrounding the Star Wars prequels back in 1997? Even if you could argue that George Lucas could have done a much better job when writing the script and directing the actors, I think he had an almost impossible task in his hands. Namely, creating a movie that would both live up to the hype it created and satisfy the old fans and the critics, while at the same time getting a new generation excited for Star Wars, creating the same level of excitement that swept through the world in the late 70's when Episode IV was first released. I know the Star Wars prequels didn't exactly flop, but they did fail to live up to the hype they created.

Now, to be fair to Axl, was he facing a similar nearly impossible task when he set out to create a new band from scratch, with none of the original musicians whose contributions created some of the most iconic songs in rock history?

Let's forget about the reasons why Axl decided to keep the name of the band, let's forget about who quit and who was fired and who should've done what to keep the UYI lineup or the AFD lineup alive.

I sometimes think it would have taken nothing short of a small miracle for Axl to create an album what would excite everyone, to create an album that would create the same levels of excitement and wonder we saw when the UYI albums came out.

Living up to the hype surrounding the name of GnR is almost impossible, I think. So, to be fair to Axl, the way I see it, even if he had surrounded himself with the best musicians he could find and even if he had listened to everyone involved in the process and even if he had accepted their input while creating Chinese Democracy, chances are, it woud've still been received with criticism and doubt and skepticism from a lot of fans and critics, simply because it was not the old band.

Do you guys think Axl had an almost impossible task in his hands? You know, creating a new band and making an album that would live up to the hype of being a Guns n' Roses album?

Considering the success of AFD, Lies and UYI worldwide, I think those were some big shoes to fill.

[niceguy]

Do you guys think Axl had an almost impossible task in his hands? You know, creating a new band and making an album that would live up to the hype of being a Guns n' Roses album?

Of course it was an impossible task; there was literally NO WAY he could ever create an album that sounded like it came from the same people who made AFD, Lies, and UYI---simply because the people who made those albums were all gone.

And many fans of GNR just don't hear any connection between, say, Shacklers Revenge and Sweet Child o Mine. The songs on ChiDem don't sound like they came from the same band who created AFD, Lies, and UYI, because ChiDem WASN'T created by the same band.

Axl would have been better-off retiring the GNR name and going forward admitting he started a completely new, fresh band. Not only would the GNR fanbase be more open to his new music, but Axl himself wouldn't feel such colossal pressure to live up to the GNR name. Only 5 guys could ever live up to that name, and only for a very brief period in their lives. That band is long gone and never coming back.

[magisme]

So, to be fair to Axl, the way I see it, even if he had surrounded himself with the best musicians he could find and even if he had listened to everyone involved in the process and even if he had accepted their input while creating Chinese Democracy, chances are, it woud've still been received with criticism and doubt and skepticism from a lot of fans and critics, simply because it was not the old band.

This is the only part I disagree with. It's not just cuz it wasn't the old band. It was also cuz most people, myself included, thought the quality of the music was far inferior to the previous band's output and not deserving of the GNR name. Then again, if CD was one mediocre album among 3-4 other strong albums, who knows. But Axl couldn't make that happen.

[Rustycage]

Definitely impossible.

Axl seemed to think that the rest of GNR were just background noise for his vocals. Wrong!

[Flayer]

A more or less impossible task for him to actually get his lineup universally respected as a legitimate successor to classic Guns. He's put together more or less two lineups with a ton of talent, but skill alone does not necessarily translate to legitimacy in the eyes of the fanbase.

Edited June 17, 2013 by Flayer

[WhazUp]

I would definitely say the impossible task was not neccesarily because he put together a new band from scratch, but rather that he called said band GNR.

Forgetting whether or not he should have kept the name or not it is pretty impossible to try and outdo or match the success GNR had in the past when they were already past their prime by the time the new band was becoming a reality in the late 90's. Plus the band was defined in the public's eyes as a band with certain people in it - so no suprise when those people are gone it would make it impossible. Not to mention the musical "fingerprint" becomes altered when all but one member from the old days remains

Edited June 17, 2013 by WhazUp

[jmapelian]

Slash and duff have put, what 3 bands together each since the breakup and put out quite a few albums as well......so from that aspect no - in terms of them gaining any credibility as GnR? He would have been better off calling it something else

[Crash Diet]

Not completely imposibble theoretically,but in Axl's shoes (bipolar, rich as fuck, have issues in his mind) almost imposibble

Edited June 17, 2013 by Crash Diet

[Apollo]

Axl made it impossible by NOT releasing music.

He task was daunting - no doubt. BUT I think he could have been up to the challenge if he would have simply released music. Axl had the talent, the voice, the swagger and the reputation back then where he would have still been a beast in the music world.

Wasn't Duff still in the band for awhile after Slash left?

Even if he'd put out albums back in 2000........then 2004......2008 and 2012 then there was a chance for him to not only carry on the GnR name - but to add to the name's legacy.

But keeping the name and then not releasing music under it.........Axl is to blame for putting himself in the impossible situation. And IMO it's a shame, because the fans are the real losers. One album in 20 years, with no new album in sight. That sucks.

[rockerman]

The task wasnt impossible as much as it was improbable. There are thousands of great muscins in LA at any one given moment that can play any style any way...but as I see it.. you have to go back to square one..You have to jam together in person and play material over and over until you perfect it. The chemistry of a band is vital to the makeup of the attitude and sound. You play of the stregnths and weakness of each member.

GNR was more than the sound and the music though..it was the personality of each member..it was the contribution of each memeber and their lifes experience...it was a unified front at one time that dedicated themselves to making it to the top....that manicness and that X factor was part of the draw. The hostility and aggression was backed up by guys who WERE NOT POSERS...they were not gentleman rockers by any means...they were rough and tumble straight from the gutter and it shined through in AFD and carried through to a bit of UYI. The old guys had a keen eye on what rock and roll was supposed to be and paid tribute to their heros while simultaniously joining them in at the top.....

CD in my opinion was an example of a over thought over produced album. The longer the wait the more and more expectation placed on it.... naturaly you think if its taking this long there must be something extraordinary about it.

Making up of a new band largely from a pool of talent that had none of the characteristics of GNR and putting them in the mold diminished the essensce of GNR. BUT cleary this nuGNR is completely different in structure and habit than that of legacy GNR... it is vastly different in scope and energy. this version is tamer and much more mellow. In my opinion the only thing in common is the name and the songs. The X factor is so far gone that trying to replicate it would be a joke.

Posers or authentic? Pretenders to the throne or the real deal?

Robert Plant and his tour band does not make Led Zeppelin... Axl Rose and his tour band does not make GNR.

IMO Axl should have made a solo record..thus leaving the door open for cooler heads to prevail and time to heal all wounds...for introspection allow for a possible reunion under the GNR banner.

[Apollo]

The task wasnt impossible as much as it was improbable. There are thousands of great muscins in LA at any one given moment that can play any style any way...but as I see it.. you have to go back to square one..You have to jam together in person and play material over and over until you perfect it. The chemistry of a band is vital to the makeup of the attitude and sound. You play of the stregnths and weakness of each member.

GNR was more than the sound and the music though..it was the personality of each member..it was the contribution of each memeber and their lifes experience...it was a unified front at one time that dedicated themselves to making it to the top....that manicness and that X factor was part of the draw. The hostility and aggression was backed up by guys who WERE NOT POSERS...they were not gentleman rockers by any means...they were rough and tumble straight from the gutter and it shined through in AFD and carried through to a bit of UYI. The old guys had a keen eye on what rock and roll was supposed to be and paid tribute to their heros while simultaniously joining them in at the top.....

CD in my opinion was an example of a over thought over produced album. The longer the wait the more and more expectation placed on it.... naturaly you think if its taking this long there must be something extraordinary about it.

Making up of a new band largely from a pool of talent that had none of the characteristics of GNR and putting them in the mold diminished the essensce of GNR. BUT cleary this nuGNR is completely different in structure and habit than that of legacy GNR... it is vastly different in scope and energy. this version is tamer and much more mellow. In my opinion the only thing in common is the name and the songs. The X factor is so far gone that trying to replicate it would be a joke.

Posers or authentic? Pretenders to the throne or the real deal?

Robert Plant and his tour band does not make Led Zeppelin... Axl Rose and his tour band does not make GNR.

IMO Axl should have made a solo record..thus leaving the door open for cooler heads to prevail and time to heal all wounds...for introspection allow for a possible reunion under the GNR banner.

Great post!!!!

[maynard]

me, diceman, rusty, pi2loc, groghan and others are the only people who are fair to axl. he deserves the bashing, he earned it.

[wasted]

Thats why it was a really great idea. Its never been done before. It caused a stir fueled the record. GNR has always had bad publicity. All the negative attention just pushed it further.

[SoulMonster]

The songs on ChiDem don't sound like they came from the same band who created AFD, Lies, and UYI, because ChiDem WASN'T created by the same band.

I remember my reaction when I first heard the UYI's. I was very disappointed by how little those records resembled AFD. Sure, some of the songs could have been lifted off AFD, but all of them were produced differently. Much less grit, much more metal-sounding drums, too polished. And some songs were completely different, like the piano ballads. I was quite frankly disappointed with the direction of the band, although it was hard to say what direction that were, they seemed to move in a dozen of different direction at the same time.

I am not saying that the difference between AFD and UYI is as big as the difference between UYI and CD, but I don't think the differences are so big that they substantiate your point. I see clear similarities between songs off CD and songs of UYI. There are numerous red threads that binds these records, and AFD, together. And yes, Shackler's Revenge is very different, but so were My World or Knockin' On Heaven's Door on UYI compared to AFD.

For me, when listening to CD, I wasn't surprised at all. I knew there would be piano-driven songs. I knew the new guys would bring it further away from the sound of AFD. I knew there would be complex songs. I knew there would be rockers and ballads. I knew it would be a step away from UYI but hopefully less disparate than those records. More of a band effort. Less a result of strong egos fighting for the direction of the music and the direction of the band.

[GUNNER PT]

It's impossible to re-create the original band even with the classic lineup.

People changed, times changed and the fans changed ....

So, lose your illusion and enjoy the show ...

I am not saying that the difference between AFD and UYI is as big as the difference between UYI and CD

I think that the difference between AFD and UYI is bigger than the difference between UYI and ChD.

[wasted]

I don't think they set out to recreate the old band, just carry on with different players. It was definitely optimistic.

[SoulMonster]

I am not saying that the difference between AFD and UYI is as big as the difference between UYI and CD

I think that the difference between AFD and UYI is bigger than the difference between UYI and ChD.

After giving it some more thought, I agree.

[trqster]

Axl was delusional and thought he could actually could recreate Gn'R 'sound' with a whole new band. He couldn't of course. All Axl can do is continue make great rock music with his solo band nuGn'R.

Everything would be fine if Axl had changed the band's name in the first place after Gn'R actually ended - but hey with a solo band name he wouldn't be able to half the cash he made, so I understand his position in a way.

[wasted]

He didn't need to recreate the sound. even AFD and UYI are worlds apart and they have the same producer. CD isn't trying to be UYI or AFD, that's why it works for me anyway.

[Aussiegun]

Axl was delusional and thought he could actually could recreate Gn'R 'sound' with a whole new band. He couldn't of course. All Axl can do is continue make great rock music with his solo band nuGn'R.

Everything would be fine if Axl had changed the band's name in the first place after Gn'R actually ended - but hey with a solo band name he wouldn't be able to half the cash he made, so I understand his position in a way.

More like Axl was delusional that he didn't need Slash/Duff/etc and thought he could do it on his own. By having them gone, he could do whatever music he wanted (which was not the sort of music to either stand the test of time or be popular enough to re-elevate the name)

[wasted]

But he seems to have done it twice with two different line ups. It's sickening.

[F*ck Fear]

It wasn't impossible because he's done it.

It will never be the same, of course.

[phaeryen]

The task was not impossible, but he was a train wreck of a man himself at the time, still trying to cope with the loss of his youth, the loss of his love, the loss of the camraderie of the "boys", the loss of slash, the pain of the negativity in the media towards him, so circumstances got him and beat him down.

He definately had everything he needed to make it work but just couldn't rise to the occasion on a personal level. I don't blame him, he is just a man after all.

Edited June 18, 2013 by phaeryen

[mina1788]

He didn't need to recreate the sound. even AFD and UYI are worlds apart and they have the same producer. CD isn't trying to be UYI or AFD, that's why it works for me anyway.

I like this. +1

[gnfnrs1972]

No member has lived up to the gnr name since the split. But they all have created some good music.