Getting smarter?

[netcat]

So there’s this guy, James Flynn. He discovered that, over the past century, your average IQ had increased about 3 points every 10 years, which would be 9 points in a generation. Between 1900 and 2012, it rose nearly 30 points, which means that the average person of 2014 had a higher IQ than 95 percent of the population had in 1900. They called the phenomenon The Flynn Effect

But one thing is still debatable

Do these rising IQ scores actually mean that people are getting smarter?

Flynn: That depends what you mean by smarter. It really breaks down into four questions:

Do we have better genetically engineered brains than we did in 1900? Of course not. Genes don't select like that in four generations. So, if by "intelligence" you mean a brain engineered to accomplish greater things, then we've made no progress at all.

But if you mean: Is our ability to attack a wider range of conceptual problems improved? Then yes, we have gained in intelligence. The average person can do creative work today that they couldn't do in 1900.

If you mean, on the other hand, something like: Were people just as adapted to their circumstances in 1900 as they are today? Well, of course they were. They were able to do factory work, to hunt. They could cope with the world as it existed then. They had an average IQ of 70, but they weren't all mentally retarded. So in that respect there's been no gain in intelligence.

https://www.apa.org/monitor/2013/03/smarter.aspx

Flynn: What is important is how our minds differ from those of people 100 years ago, not whether we label it “smarter” or “more intelligent.” I prefer to say our brains are more modern.

Our brains at autopsy are probably different. We have discovered that the brain is like a muscle. A weightlifter has very different muscles than a swimmer. Similarly, we exercise different portions of our brains in a way our ancestors didn’t. They might have had better memories than we do, so they would have a larger hippocampus [a part of the brain that forms, processes and stores memory]. But, we would have exercised certain areas in the prefrontal lobes more than they did. So, those things would be enlarged.

The other important factor is we have learned to use logic to attack the hypothetical. We have an ability to deal with a much wider range of problems than our ancestors would. For example, if you were a businessperson, you would be much more inventive. You would be more imaginative. We are better at executive functions, or at making business decisions. We are also better at moral reasoning.

http://www.smithsonianmag.com/science-nature/are-you-smarter-than-your-grandfather-probably-not-150402883/?page=2

So in your mind, are you smarter than your parents/grandparents? Are your kids smarter than you? What are the things you feel superior/inferior to your ancestors/descendants

Edited May 2, 2014 by netcat

[Guest Len B'stard]

I think what you gain in intellect in terms of like, information and we lack in just general wit and and the ability to apply that shit. People are a whole lot less practical than before.

I think I'm probably cleverer than my folks in a book-ish way but they have a kinda natural unharnessed kind of practical intellect and wit that has more of a like...functional application to reality.

Common sense my old man calls it

[Dazey]

I would estimate that the collective average IQ is probably dropping and has been for a while.

[Broskirose]

It's been scientifically proven that the more you use the lol smiley the more intelligent you are.

[username]

Luckily we have modern media and pop music to dumb them back down again.

[netcat]

I think what you gain in intellect in terms of like, information and we lack in just general wit and and the ability to apply that shit. People are a whole lot less practical than before.

I think I'm probably cleverer than my folks in a book-ish way but they have a kinda natural unharnessed kind of practical intellect and wit that has more of a like...functional application to reality.

Common sense my old man calls it

for the generation of our grandparents having practical wit was a forced choice. I mean, being put in a situation when there is a direct threat to your wellbeing or your life, most of us would probably develop those practical wit very quickly. I think this is something firmly ingrained in our genetic memory

my grandma had like 5 classes of school education, she survived communism and two world wars and she always managed to have a relatively decent life. She always knew the right people and the right places and she always knew what to do in a dangerous situation. she had excellent people skills, she could perfectly see a persons' true colors. most of the people of my generation seem to be deprived of these abilities. On the other hand my grandma hated music and all forms of art except maybe the movies, and this is something i could never understand

I would estimate that the collective average IQ is probably dropping and has been for a while.

there are lots of different IQ tests. According to the ones Flynn does, IQ scores rise, according to others, they decline

anyways, intelligence is too complicated to be measured with the test or even series of tests

[Georgy Zhukov]

Fewer and fewer people have common sense.

[arnold layne]

I don't know.

Honestly, my mates and I usually sit around the bar and every so often they'll get into a heated discussion about space, science, and religion. The issue is that they all agree about the same things and they all think it's fucking amazing, but it's the same shit every fucking time. These discussions are nothing more than a broken record.

Don't disregard the people who have lived before us. After all, they were the ones who dreamed and who discovered 90% of the worlds mysteries we've uncovered today. Now it's nothing new. It's so accepted that it's almost boring.

We've become so far in terms of knowledge, and to say we're all smarter and more intelligent than ever before defeats the point. That is just plain pretentious.

[AxlisOld]

Our smart people have gotten way smarter. Our dumb people have gotten way dumber.

[Redhead74]

It doesn't seem right to compare people of four generations ago, who didn't have the exposure to education that we have today and existed in a society with a completely different structure. The only thing this article suggests to me is that our brains have the ability to adapt quickly to our environment to ensure our survival. Education, migration, globalisation and technology have changed everything so much that you just can't compare the two. We're no more proactive than our great, great grandparents were and our so called progress is really just about being reactive to the environment we live in.

From my understanding IQ tests are very limited in their use as there are plenty of powerful/successful/innovative people in this world who don't score particularly highly on them. And the same in reverse. Look at Axl, he apparently has a high IQ but the guy has made some pretty dismal choices in his life which have affected him rather significantly.

[Georgy Zhukov]

People are getting dumber and dumber. They can retain more information but they lack common sense.

[Amir]

Nope.

I agree with this guy's hypothesis: http://www.independent.co.uk/news/science/human-intelligence-peaked-thousands-of-years-ago-and-weve-been-on-an-intellectual-and-emotional-decline-ever-since-8307101.html

[DR DOOM]

Our smart people have gotten way smarter. Our dumb people have gotten way dumber.

I have nothing to back it up, but this.

I've never seen so many people (you kids) that can't spell, know nothing about even recent history and are just plain fucking ignorant than I do these days.

[Ace Nova]

I would estimate that the collective average IQ is probably dropping and has been for a while.

Really? How so?

I think the opposite seems to be happening....the younger generations (although maybe not as "street smart") seem to be very academic.

It seems as if a 3.5 - 4.0 GPA and doing well on SAT's is almost common nowadays.

Edited May 3, 2014 by Kasanova King

[Amir]

I would estimate that the collective average IQ is probably dropping and has been for a while.

Really? How so?

I think the opposite seems to be happening....the younger generations (although maybe not as "street smart") seem to be very academic.

It seems as if a 3.5 - 4.0 GPA and doing well on SAT's is almost common nowadays.

I don't know about the US but here in the UK grades are going up because they're dumbing down subjects to meet targets. Most grievous example I can think of is maths, I was learning at 18 what my parents were learning at 13 (they had secondary school education in UK). When I'd spend summers in Iran as a kid I'd just stare in disbelief at what the kids had to learn there for maths, some of it I don't think I ever touched in my secondary school maths education. Grammar hasn't been taught in English classes in the UK for decades now.

Only reason I know about things like past perfect, imperfect, subjunctive, conditional tenses, etc. is because of learning French.

My friends who did Latin go on about things like dative and genitive and I have no clue what they're on about.

[Dazey]

Our smart people have gotten way smarter. Our dumb people have gotten way dumber.

Exactly this^^^^^ Unfortunately due to welfare these days the dumb ones tend to live longer.

[Thin White Duke]

The fact that people still confuse intelligence with knowledge and education proves the lack of intelligence.

[grouse]

. Grammar hasn't been taught in English classes in the UK for decades now.

You have got to be fucking kidding me? right?

[Amir]

. Grammar hasn't been taught in English classes in the UK for decades now.

You have got to be fucking kidding me? right?

Certainly wasn't taught when I was at school, and my sister's a decade younger and she only knows these things for the same reason as I do (learning French).

[Guest Len B'stard]

Our smart people have gotten way smarter. Our dumb people have gotten way dumber.

Exactly this^^^^^ Unfortunately due to welfare these days the dumb ones tend to live longer.

You get right up my arse sometimes McLeod, you fuckin grew up in a council house, you of all people should know the score

[Ace Nova]

. Grammar hasn't been taught in English classes in the UK for decades now.

You have got to be fucking kidding me? right?

Certainly wasn't taught when I was at school, and my sister's a decade younger and she only knows these things for the same reason as I do (learning French).

Are you guys being sarcastic?

[Amir]

. Grammar hasn't been taught in English classes in the UK for decades now.

You have got to be fucking kidding me? right?

Certainly wasn't taught when I was at school, and my sister's a decade younger and she only knows these things for the same reason as I do (learning French).

Are you guys being sarcastic?

Maybe grouse is? I'm not. Grammar is not taught at English schools unless it's for a foreign language. I guess you can go by in life not knowing that "If I were..." is subjunctive.

My parents learnt grammar when they went to secondary school in UK, though.

[Ace Nova]

Maybe grouse is? I'm not. Grammar is not taught at English schools unless it's for a foreign language. I guess you can go by in life not knowing that "If I were..." is subjunctive.

Ok, I think I see. When I was growing up, grammar and English class were basically the same thing. I'm guessing it's not anymore.

[Amir]

Maybe grouse is? I'm not. Grammar is not taught at English schools unless it's for a foreign language. I guess you can go by in life not knowing that "If I were..." is subjunctive.

Ok, I think I see. When I was growing up, grammar and English class were basically the same thing. I'm guessing it's not anymore.

I remember a lot of literature. That was mostly it, apart from I remember doing a bit of linguistics for A-level (last two years of high school, where you choose 4 subjects, English is not compulsory).

[Aaron_H]

I can concur with not knowing any of the grammar terminology except the very basic stuff about tenses, adjectives, verbs and whatnot. I think when learning a second language this can really hold you back - but it's easy to get on fine without that stuff. (Though I do wish I was taught it.. But not enough to go and look it up myself). I'm 25, by the way

As for people getting smarter or dumber - I look at what people born pre 1900 have done in science and there's some pretty big names there. Maybe it's gotten harder to make good discoveries, but a lot of the really big ideas came around with people that were alive before or at that time (and so born before).