DieselDaisy Posted April 17, 2016 Share Posted April 17, 2016 I remember when Gazza was at Rangers, a big fat bastard (at this stage) with shocking died blond hair doing that Orange order piper gesture. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graeme Posted April 17, 2016 Share Posted April 17, 2016 1 minute ago, Len B'stard said: I must admit that was kinda wonderful. Beats the fuck out of the tired defeated chorus of boos at The Emirates this afternoon anyway . Was that one of my lot jumping up and down in front of the camera on the first vid? Didnt think you had any. Well, except that one the EDL carted out periodically to prove they weren't racist. 'we aint fuckin racists bruv, look, 'eres Ahmed!' Ahmed: Aye, Muhammad can get tae fuck! Haha, most of Glasgow's Asian community are traditionally Rangers supporters, because they were more likely to go to non-denominational schools than Catholic schools... The two players are Arthur Numan and Michael Mols, the Sikh gentleman (Saty Singh) in the middle runs a pretty famous Indian restaurant (Mr. Singh's) which has been a favourite of generations of Rangers teams, he's also a former director of the Rangers Youth Development Fund. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Len Cnut Posted April 17, 2016 Share Posted April 17, 2016 (edited) 1 minute ago, Graeme said: Haha, most of Glasgow's Asian community are traditionally Rangers supporters, because they were more likely to go to non-denominational schools than Catholic schools... The two players are Arthur Numan and Michael Mols, the Sikh gentleman (Saty Singh) in the middle runs a pretty famous Indian restaurant (Mr. Singh's) which has been a favourite of generations of Rangers teams, he's also a former director of the Rangers Youth Development Fund. I would've thought the muslim ones would side with Celtic, with the Palestinian allegiances and what have you. I just took it for granted that the Scottish hated pakis as a general rule Edited April 17, 2016 by Len B'stard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graeme Posted April 17, 2016 Share Posted April 17, 2016 2 minutes ago, Len B'stard said: I would've thought the muslim ones would side with Celtic, with the Palestinian allegiances and what have you. I don't know if that many people take the whole Rangers-Israel, Celtic-Palestine thing that seriously... maybe a few hundred vocal die hards in a fanbase of millions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Len Cnut Posted April 17, 2016 Share Posted April 17, 2016 Just now, Graeme said: I don't know if that many people take the whole Rangers-Israel, Celtic-Palestine thing that seriously... maybe a few hundred vocal die hards in a fanbase of millions. Probably. I cant imagine there are realistically that many of the hundreds of thousands of Celtic supporters who seriously give a fuck for Palestine Hang on, so Celtic are the hate British lot and Rangers are the love British lot? What the fuck you doing supporting Rangers then? . Or does all of Scotland hate Britain equally? I'm thorougly ashamed i live so near Scotland yet know fuck all about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselDaisy Posted April 18, 2016 Share Posted April 18, 2016 Have you not seen that Sikh/Scottish political guy with the patronising left wing voice? He is always on Question Time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Len Cnut Posted April 18, 2016 Share Posted April 18, 2016 4 minutes ago, DieselDaisy said: Have you not seen that Sikh/Scottish political guy with the patronising left wing voice? He is always on Question Time. I only watch Question Time when John Lydon is on (which was once) and when Nigel Farage and Russell Brand are on at the same time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselDaisy Posted April 18, 2016 Share Posted April 18, 2016 I've just noticed. Graeme, you are not exactly diffusing my argument about 'Gers supporters being more inclined to be Unionist with that picture. Should have kept that one hidden, ehh? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselDaisy Posted April 18, 2016 Share Posted April 18, 2016 2 minutes ago, Len B'stard said: I only watch Question Time when John Lydon is on (which was once) and when Nigel Farage and Russell Brand are on at the same time. He turned up a lot during the whole snp thingy, and usually replies to terrorist atrocities with stuff about ''illegal war in Iraq'' and ''Muslims being victimized'' etc. Bearded fat chap with a sikh turban and a scottish accent. Very patronising. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PappyTron Posted April 18, 2016 Share Posted April 18, 2016 (edited) That's what I got when I Googled "Bearded fat chap with a sikh turban". Edited April 18, 2016 by PappyTron 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graeme Posted April 18, 2016 Share Posted April 18, 2016 11 minutes ago, Len B'stard said: Probably. I cant imagine there are realistically that many of the hundreds of thousands of Celtic supporters who seriously give a fuck for Palestine Hang on, so Celtic are the hate British lot and Rangers are the love British lot? What the fuck you doing supporting Rangers then? . Or does all of Scotland hate Britain equally? I'm thorougly ashamed i live so near Scotland yet know fuck all about it. Nah, you're right the first time, but my football and my politics are totally separate, I support Rangers because I've been taken to see them since I was 5 years old and I would never turn my back on them now. I just don't share the archetypal political beliefs associated with Rangers fans. There tend to be two kinds of songs sung at Ibrox, 'Rangers' songs are the ones which are about the club, players, stadium, honours etc. The kinda stuff you would expect football fans to be singing about. Then there are the 'PUL' (Protestant, Unionist, Loyalist) songs which are mainly about the political conflict in Ireland/Northern Ireland going back as far as the Battle of the Boyne in 1690. Singing those songs isn't encouraged by the club, but for many it's an integral part of their support. It's entirely possible to be a Rangers fan and -not- join in any of that, as is summarised brilliantly in this extract from the novel The Sacred Art of Stealing by Christopher Brookmyre: "This was because Angelique de Xavia was a Rangers supporter. No, it's okay. Not that kind of Rangers supporter. Not the catholichating, right-wing, BNP-supporting, anti-Irish, monarchist, triumphalist, boorish, arrogant, ignorant, sash-wearing, bowler-hatted, crimplene-trousered, UVF-tattooed, fluteplaying, King-billy-portrait-on-the-mantlepiece, only-started-going-when-Souness-arrived-but-I-swear-I-was-therein-the-early-eighties, snaw-aff-a-dyke-when-the-team's-no-winning, couldnae-name-a-non-old-firm-player, Union-Jack-waving, Scotland-hating, Nazi-saluting, pipe-bomb-hurling, squeeze-the-toothpaste-at-the-top-end, fart-in-a-spacesuit kind." I'm not one of them and I regard them as people who project their misguided politics onto the club. In turn, they would call me a 'Handwringer' because I don't align with what they see as 'Rangers culture'. My argument is that I am more of a Rangers fan than them, because I only sing the songs about the club, I couldn't give a fuck who guarded Derry's Walls... There are plenty of us, we're just not necessarily that vocal... most Rangers fans I know voted in favour of independence. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Len Cnut Posted April 18, 2016 Share Posted April 18, 2016 2 minutes ago, Graeme said: Nah, you're right the first time, but my football and my politics are totally separate, I support Rangers because I've been taken to see them since I was 5 years old and I would never turn my back on them now. I just don't share the archetypal political beliefs associated with Rangers fans. There tend to be two kinds of songs sung at Ibrox, 'Rangers' songs are the ones which are about the club, players, stadium, honours etc. The kinda stuff you would expect football fans to be singing about. Then there are the 'PUL' (Protestant, Unionist, Loyalist) songs which are mainly about the political conflict in Ireland/Northern Ireland going back as far as the Battle of the Boyne in 1690. Singing those songs isn't encouraged by the club, but for many it's an integral part of their support. It's entirely possible to be a Rangers fan and -not- join in any of that, as is summarised brilliantly in this extract from the novel The Sacred Art of Stealing by Christopher Brookmyre: "This was because Angelique de Xavia was a Rangers supporter. No, it's okay. Not that kind of Rangers supporter. Not the catholichating, right-wing, BNP-supporting, anti-Irish, monarchist, triumphalist, boorish, arrogant, ignorant, sash-wearing, bowler-hatted, crimplene-trousered, UVF-tattooed, fluteplaying, King-billy-portrait-on-the-mantlepiece, only-started-going-when-Souness-arrived-but-I-swear-I-was-therein-the-early-eighties, snaw-aff-a-dyke-when-the-team's-no-winning, couldnae-name-a-non-old-firm-player, Union-Jack-waving, Scotland-hating, Nazi-saluting, pipe-bomb-hurling, squeeze-the-toothpaste-at-the-top-end, fart-in-a-spacesuit kind." I'm not one of them and I regard them as people who project their misguided politics onto the club. In turn, they would call me a 'Handwringer' because I don't align with what they see as 'Rangers culture'. My argument is that I am more of a Rangers fan than them, because I only sing the songs about the club, I couldn't give a fuck who guarded Derry's Walls... There are plenty of us, we're just not necessarily that vocal... most Rangers fans I know voted in favour of independence. How do you feel regularly finding yourself in an envoirnment where your personal beliefs conflict so harshly with half of the people there? And how do you reconcile yourself with being associated to the attendant sterotype? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselDaisy Posted April 18, 2016 Share Posted April 18, 2016 In a lone cul-de-sac in Madrid, there is probably a Barcelona fan. You always had the odd Sunderland fan floating around Tyne and Wear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graeme Posted April 18, 2016 Share Posted April 18, 2016 13 minutes ago, Len B'stard said: How do you feel regularly finding yourself in an envoirnment where your personal beliefs conflict so harshly with half of the people there? And how do you reconcile yourself with being associated to the attendant sterotype? You probably don't agree politically with all Arsenal fans either, pal. I guess that's like asking how I could be comfortable being Scottish when 55% of the population here voted 'no'... Or how could you be proud to be English when UKIP and the Tories combined took more than 50% of the popular vote in England(don't start all of this 'I'm not really English', stuff, from my perspective you're very English). A lot of Rangers fans are proud to be Scottish, we play in blue and white, our crest is the Lion Rampant, the four founders of the club were native Gaelic-speakers who played in the first international against England, we don't pretend to be Irish like Celtic... As far as I'm concerned, Rangers were the Scottish working man's team. There's a lot I get out of following them, I like going to the games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Len Cnut Posted April 18, 2016 Share Posted April 18, 2016 Yeah but Arsenal isnt specifically associated with a particular kind of politics. Or living in Scotland is too broad of a spectrum. I'm not having a go or anything so please dont get me wrong but it reminds me of this thing my cousin once said where we were just fuckin about talking about things we'd love to do and one of mine was scoring the winning goal of the world cup for England and he was like why the fuck would you want to do that, these are the same people who sing 'i would rather be a paki than a turk' etc etc and my contention was it wouldnt matter to me in that moment and its kind of with that in mind that im asking you this because, OK, you're surrounding by a bunch of BNP types as the open minded caring socialist Graeme that i know you to be so like, its a unique sort of situation to be in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PappyTron Posted April 18, 2016 Share Posted April 18, 2016 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselDaisy Posted April 18, 2016 Share Posted April 18, 2016 (edited) You cannot deny that sectarianism is inherent to both clubs though. If you are from a Protestant background you are more liable to support Rangers, and if you are from a Catholic background Celtic. This is still true today. And both teams were sort of used as monuments during turbulent periods of Anglo-Irish history, e.g. 'The Troubles'. It is a similar thing with Barcelona being a source of Catalan aspirations - even sovereignty - during turbulent periods of Spanish history such as under Franco - ''more than a club''. Didn't both Glasgow teams have an 'unwritten' rule on not signing players of the wrong denomination? It was considered this rare thing indeed if a Catholic played for Rangers and vice versa. You could say that sectarianism was actually institutionalised at a club level! Edited April 18, 2016 by DieselDaisy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graeme Posted April 18, 2016 Share Posted April 18, 2016 5 minutes ago, Len B'stard said: Yeah but Arsenal isnt specifically associated with a particular kind of politics. Or living in Scotland is too broad of a spectrum. I'm not having a go or anything so please dont get me wrong but it reminds me of this thing my cousin once said where we were just fuckin about talking about things we'd love to do and one of mine was scoring the winning goal of the world cup for England and he was like why the fuck would you want to do that, these are the same people who sing 'i would rather be a paki than a turk' etc etc and my contention was it wouldnt matter to me in that moment and its kind of with that in mind that im asking you this because, OK, you're surrounding by a bunch of BNP types as the open minded caring socialist Graeme that i know you to be so like, its a unique sort of situation to be in. Man, have you seen the electoral figures in Scotland? Right-wing parties made up less than 15% of the vote (including the Tories)... Considering the Rangers support makes up about 40% of the Scottish population, that's a lot more socialists than even centre-right voters. All of this is just a narrative with some basis in truth, but the fact of the matter is that Scottish society is far too intermixed and nuanced now for binary sectarian lines to have any real meaning. If you want somewhere that those stereotypes continue to hold, you need to go to Northern Ireland. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Len Cnut Posted April 18, 2016 Share Posted April 18, 2016 Just now, Graeme said: Man, have you seen the electoral figures in Scotland? Right-wing parties made up less than 15% of the vote (including the Tories)... Considering the Rangers support makes up about 40% of the Scottish population, that's a lot more socialists than even centre-right voters. All of this is just a narrative with some basis in truth, but the fact of the matter is that Scottish society is far too intermixed and nuanced now for binary sectarian lines to have any real meaning. If you want somewhere that those stereotypes continue to hold, you need to go to Northern Ireland. Thanks for explaining. Like i say, I'm ashamed to know so little about Scotland despite the proximity. Y'know those insulting guys who are like 'Scottish history? Yeah yeah, I've seen Braveheart!' Well I've not even seen Braveheart And quite frankly you put me off doing so That and the fact i thought it looked like shit since the day it came out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PappyTron Posted April 18, 2016 Share Posted April 18, 2016 2 minutes ago, Len B'stard said: Well I've not even seen Braveheart You w0t m8? Turn it in! Braveheart is a great film. Not accurate, mind, but for what it is it's great; doubly so that the big statue that the Scots commissioned of Wallace was actually just Mel Gibson. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Len Cnut Posted April 18, 2016 Share Posted April 18, 2016 (edited) 2 minutes ago, PappyTron said: You w0t m8? Turn it in! Braveheart is a great film. Not accurate, mind, but for what it is it's great; doubly so that the big statue that the Scots commissioned of Wallace was actually just Mel Gibson. I was 12 years old when that film came out, what did i care about Scottish history at that age, i wanted big knockers, guns and explosions back then My idea of culture back then was an episode of Rawhide Trainspotting, that was my window to Scottish culture...just seemed like North London with a funny accent! Edited April 18, 2016 by Len B'stard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselDaisy Posted April 18, 2016 Share Posted April 18, 2016 The Battle of Stirling Bridge; where is the bloody bridge? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PappyTron Posted April 18, 2016 Share Posted April 18, 2016 2 minutes ago, DieselDaisy said: The Battle of Stirling Bridge; where is the bloody bridge? Someone asked that very thing to Mel Gibson. It went like this. "At the scenes of Stirling Bridge there was no bridge in your film" "Well, from a film making point of view we found that having a bridge got in the way" "Ay...the English found that out too!" 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Len Cnut Posted April 18, 2016 Share Posted April 18, 2016 I'm gonna watch Braveheart tommorow now, just to make sense of what yous all are talking about! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PappyTron Posted April 18, 2016 Share Posted April 18, 2016 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tf_RV-g5g2g 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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