What if album had suprise release ?

[Rustycage]

The Best Buy deal was originally 1.6 million copies. That is included in the sales figures since they were sold to Best Buy and shipped. 1.6 million of the 2.6 million figure is the Best Buy deal. No, they didn't "buy another 1 million." They already had them and they collected dust until 2011 when they were brought out for clearance. Then they ended up in dollar stores when they didn't clear.

Edited September 22, 2015 by Rustycage

[fred_carston]

if the original line up got back together and released LOTRP would people still say it was a stupid album title or would it suddenly be cool because Sla$h is involved ?

[SoulMonster]

Back to a more coherent and relevant discussion.

Surely if CD had sold that many more albums, it would have achieved an additional x# status.

1x Platinum in America (between 1-1.9 million)

3x Platinum in Canada (240,000-319,000)

1x Platinum in Australia (70,000-139,000)

1x Gold in Germany (100,000-199,000)

1x Platinum in Iceland (10,000-19,000)

1x Gold in Japan (100,000-249,000)

According to the album certifications, even if you bloat it to the highest possible amount, it has sold 3 million records.

The record reached MANY additional certifications than those you have listed (i.e. Gold in Indonesia, one of the world's most populous countries, and Platinum in Argentina).

[Rustycage]

Gold in Indonesia is 5,000.

Platinum is 40,000 in Argentina.

Got anything else?

EDIT: Corrected

Edited September 22, 2015 by Rustycage

[SoulMonster]

Gold in Indonesia is 35,000.

Platinum is 20,000 in Argentina.

Got anything else?

Platinum: Finland, the Czech Republic, Germany, Ireland, Italy, Norway, Poland, Romania, Switzerland, the United Kingdom, Argentina, Australia, New Zealand, and South Africa.

Gold: Austria, Belgium, Denmark, France, Greece, Hungary, the Netherlands, Sweden, Indonesia, Japan, Malaysia, Singapore, Taiwan, Thailand, Brazil, and Colombia.

In addition comes USA and Canada, I guess.

Btw, this list is not complete AND the record has quite possibly reached higher certifications in some markets since this list was compiled in 2009.

[Rustycage]

Your new revised list without a link but will give benefit of the doubt.

Finland: 20,000

CR: 5,000

Germany(shipments): Was already included with the updated totals

Ireland: 15,000

Italy(including streaming): 50,000

Norway: 30,000

Poland: 20,000

Romania: Back up this claim

Switzerland: 20,000

UK(shipments): Already included

Argentina: You're repeating yourself

Australia(shipments): Already included

New Zealand: 15,000

South Africa 40,000

You new "revised" list platinum total: 195,000

Gold:

Austria: 75,000

Belgium: 15,000

Denmark(shipments): 10,000

France: 50,000

Greece(shipments): 3,000

Hungary: 1,000

Netherlands(shipments): 20,000

Sweden(shipments): 20,000

Indonesia: Repeating yourself again

Japan(shipments): Again, already mentioned.

Malaysia: 5,000

Singapore: 5,000

Taiwan: 5,000

Thailand: 5,000

Brazil: 20,000

Colombia: 5,000

Gold total: 239,000

From earlier:

Indonesia: 5,000

Argentina: 40,000

Total after the 2.6 million figure with laziness and giving you the benefit of the doubt: 479,000

We are STILL at 3 million albums. I was generous earlier when I originally said 3 million. Even if you want to use that number, you're at 3.5 million with a lot of them being shipments and not sales. I find you trying to stack numbers twice on there by repeating what I have already listed. Certification matters, not blank claims. To be honest, your list looks like a whole bunch of a little.

Edited September 22, 2015 by Rustycage

[Rustycage]

Just for the fuck of it, let's figure out just how many were shipments instead of actual sales. These countries certify based on shipments instead of sales.

USA: 1.6 million

Canada: 240,000

Australia: 70,000

Germany: 100,000

Japan: 100,000

Denmark: 10,000

Greece: 3,000

Netherlands: 20,000

Sweden: 20,000

United Kingdom: 300,000

2.46 million of the totals are certified by shipments and NOT sales. Assuming that more sold is wishful thinking and denying that all were not sold and supply is still available.

2/3 of the album totals are inflated by shipments.

Edited for more accuracy.

Edited September 22, 2015 by Rustycage

[wkuk04]

Now these numbers are up to date?

Rusty. You got a source?

[DieselDaisy]

Am I going to have to get my calculator out for this?

[Rustycage]

Now these numbers are up to date?

Rusty. You got a source?

/sigh

A source for which?

The fact that majority of the certifications were done under shipments? Yes. The certifying bodies themselves.

The source for the 2.6 million figure? Yes. Again, the certifying bodies.

The source for what qualifies as gold and platinum in those countries? Yes. Again, the bodies themselves. lol

What are you trying to dispute? I'm not the one claiming that more albums have been bought since the official numbers of '09 when we know for a fact that not all of the shipped copies were actually sold. Demand never reached the levels anticipated by the shipment totals.

What's even more funny is that all but 10,000 of the original 2.6 million figure were certified by shipments. You are a fool for marketing and actually believe 2.6 million different people bought the album that soon.

Edited September 22, 2015 by Rustycage

[wasted]

3 mil. To the bar...that's a take!

[Rustycage]

GNR are lucky if they even actually actually sold 1.5 million copies of CD to the public. We know that as of 2011, over million were collecting dust in the Best Buy warehouse.

[wasted]

Indianna Rose says it belongs in a museum.

[SoulMonster]

Now these numbers are up to date?

Rusty. You got a source?

No, they aren't updated, they were from 2009, like I said when I posted about the certifications.

The question then is of course how much can have been sold since then, and what the sale numbers are in all the other countries where the record never reached any certifications or where this happened after 2009 or where never publicly disclosed.

Edited September 22, 2015 by SoulMonster

[SoulMonster]

Your new revised list without a link but will give benefit of the doubt.

Finland: 20,000

If a record has sold to Gold in Finland it means it has sold between 20k and 30k. Surely CD has sold more than 20k in Finland, especially since the Gold certification came already back in 2009 . I haven't checked the rest of your numbers (Finland was first), but if you have just listed the absolute minimum sales to reach the known certifications, then your total number will be much lower than what it really is. ESPECIALLY since we know these certifications were reached in 2009 and that the record may have sold to higher certifications since then.

In addition, you are still just adding numbers for parts of the global market.

In short, the actual total global sale of CD must be significantly higher than what you arrive at.

What is funny is that I don't really care how many copies have been sold. It means zero to me. I just like numbers.

UK(shipments): Already included

Just noticed another thing. Where have you included the numbers for UK? I haven't been paying much attention to this thread previously and is interested how much CD sold over there.

[SoulMonster]

It is tempting to try to calculate global sales based on known certifications, but the weakness of that approach is that we don't have updated certifications, that we are apt to look at the lowest numbers, and that this method doesn't factor in sales numbers from countries where no certifications have been reached or is readily available.

An alternative approach is to take actual sales numbers that are recent, and then extrapolate for other markets. The obvious weakness of this method is to be able to only include markets where we can assume the sales numbers will be similar (per capita). Let's try this for USA and UK, where we do have quite recent sales numbers ( at least for the UK). We will extrapolate to North America and Europe (about 1 billion in total population).

USA.

Known sales of CD in 2011: 614.000.

Population: ~ 300 mill (30 % of the total).

Extrapolation for 2011: 2.4 millions.

Comment: So, if we extrapolate for USA, we calculate that the sales figures in the whole of North America and Europe in 2011 should have been about 2.4 millions. This is just for 1/6 of the total global market, but definitly the most-buying segment. This was also back in 2011, so we would expect the number to by significantly higher by now. Probably a million more? But this is just guesswork.

UK.

Known sales of CD in 2014: 368.899.

Population: 64 mill (6.4 % of the total).

Extrapolation: 5.76 millions.

Comment: That's a surprisingly high number, don't you think? At least it is based on a current number, but we still haven't factored in all the other markets beside North America and Europe. It may be that people in the UK are just more fond of GN'R than people elsewhere in the regions looked at, or that they just buy more records in total. Or maybe this isn't too far off, and the sale of CD actually has been higher than I thought.

Edited September 22, 2015 by SoulMonster

[Apollo]

It is tempting to try to calculate global sales based on known certifications, but the weakness of that approach is that we don't have updated certifications, that we are apt to look at the lowest numbers, and that this method doesn't factor in sales numbers from countries where no certifications have been reached or is readily available.

An alternative approach is to take actual sales numbers that are recent, and then extrapolate for other markets. The obvious weakness of this method is to be able to only include markets where we can assume the sales numbers will be similar (per capita). Let's try this for USA and UK, where we do have quite recent sales numbers ( at least for the UK). We will extrapolate to North America and Europe (about 1 billion in total population).

USA.

Known sales of CD in 2011: 614.000.

Population: ~ 300 mill (30 % of the total).

Extrapolation for 2011: 2.4 millions.

Comment: So, if we extrapolate for USA, we calculate that the sales figures in the whole of North America and Europe in 2011 should have been about 2.4 millions. This is just for 1/6 of the total global market, but definitly the most-buying segment. This was also back in 2011, so we would expect the number to by significantly higher by now. Probably a million more? But this is just guesswork.

UK.

Known sales of CD in 2014: 368.899.

Population: 64 mill (6.4 % of the total).

Extrapolation: 5.76 millions.

Comment: That's a surprisingly high number, don't you think? At least it is based on a current number, but we still haven't factored in all the other markets beside North America and Europe. It may be that people in the UK are just more fond of GN'R than people elsewhere in the regions looked at, or that they just buy more records in total. Or maybe this isn't too far off, and the sale of CD actually has been higher than I thought.

Did you take into account that album sales decrease after the first few months of release?

And I read once where the BB deal was for the 1.6 million, but that CD has actually only sold 500,000 copies in the US. How does somebody like us - not working for them - have access to the actual number that ended up being sold?

Common sense would be that album sales dropped off the map after the first six months or year. That's what happens to the majority of albums. Unless your record is an all time universally loved classic (I had to add that as you would say "well dark side of the moon is still selling")

CD isn't universally loved and isn't considered a classic iconic album. CD hasn't been selling thousands of copies a week in every area of the world.

[Rustycage]

Your new revised list without a link but will give benefit of the doubt.

Finland: 20,000

If a record has sold to Gold in Finland it means it has sold between 20k and 30k. Surely CD has sold more than 20k in Finland, especially since the Gold certification came already back in 2009 . I haven't checked the rest of your numbers (Finland was first), but if you have just listed the absolute minimum sales to reach the known certifications, then your total number will be much lower than what it really is. ESPECIALLY since we know these certifications were reached in 2009 and that the record may have sold to higher certifications since then.

In addition, you are still just adding numbers for parts of the global market.

In short, the actual total global sale of CD must be significantly higher than what you arrive at.

What is funny is that I don't really care how many copies have been sold. It means zero to me. I just like numbers.

UK(shipments): Already included

Just noticed another thing. Where have you included the numbers for UK? I haven't been paying much attention to this thread previously and is interested how much CD sold over there.

You're the one making the claim about Finland. The exact number is your responsibility. You did not clarify how many times it went Platinum. If it was only once, 20,000 is all we know for sure. Max would be 39,999 obviously. If you want to inflate it, do so with something other than just throwing claims out there.

Again, 2/3 of the certifications came from shipped numbers and NOT sales. Therefore, while you want to inflate the most minimal of numbers with wild assumptions, you are ignoring that they will fall under the umbrella of those NOT SOLD in the other much larger markets. 1 extra soild in Finland will cover 1 of the million in USA that weren't sold in 2009 or however many were not sold in the UK. You can't have it both ways.

The point here is the demand for the follow up and the demand for CD was clearly not as high as the total you guys like to throw out there and that is because of the flimsy surface of those numbers.

Regarding the UK and other countries, what you can't seem to grasp is they calculate the total for their certification by shipped albums and not sales. You want it both ways. You want to act like after the supply is stocked, any additional demand will come from a new supply. That is foolish and without something(such as a x2 or x3 certification), the3 exact numbers are for you to find since you made the claim. What I've done is got the numbers to a close proximity.

BPI is included in the 2.6 million shipped albums that resulted in the 1x Platinum certification.

Now these numbers are up to date?

Rusty. You got a source?

No, they aren't updated, they were from 2009, like I said when I posted about the certifications.

They are updated. Do you have one single source that CD went 2x Platinum is the USA? UK? Anywhere? The numbers are tracked for you.

Again, what you're failing to grasp is that all but 10,000 copies of the 2.6 million figure were SHIPPED albums to the main markets. Therefore, THAT is why the numbers haven't changed much. Demand hasn't overtaken the supply. Not even close.

Edited September 22, 2015 by Rustycage

[Nosaj Thing]

CD sold 3-3.5 million.

If you truly want to make that number higher, head to your nearest Dollar Tree store and get the same, exact Best Buy exclusive copy for 99 cents. I repeat, ninety nine cents.

[SoulMonster]

It is tempting to try to calculate global sales based on known certifications, but the weakness of that approach is that we don't have updated certifications, that we are apt to look at the lowest numbers, and that this method doesn't factor in sales numbers from countries where no certifications have been reached or is readily available.

An alternative approach is to take actual sales numbers that are recent, and then extrapolate for other markets. The obvious weakness of this method is to be able to only include markets where we can assume the sales numbers will be similar (per capita). Let's try this for USA and UK, where we do have quite recent sales numbers ( at least for the UK). We will extrapolate to North America and Europe (about 1 billion in total population).

USA.

Known sales of CD in 2011: 614.000.

Population: ~ 300 mill (30 % of the total).

Extrapolation for 2011: 2.4 millions.

Comment: So, if we extrapolate for USA, we calculate that the sales figures in the whole of North America and Europe in 2011 should have been about 2.4 millions. This is just for 1/6 of the total global market, but definitly the most-buying segment. This was also back in 2011, so we would expect the number to by significantly higher by now. Probably a million more? But this is just guesswork.

UK.

Known sales of CD in 2014: 368.899.

Population: 64 mill (6.4 % of the total).

Extrapolation: 5.76 millions.

Comment: That's a surprisingly high number, don't you think? At least it is based on a current number, but we still haven't factored in all the other markets beside North America and Europe. It may be that people in the UK are just more fond of GN'R than people elsewhere in the regions looked at, or that they just buy more records in total. Or maybe this isn't too far off, and the sale of CD actually has been higher than I thought.

Did you take into account that album sales decrease after the first few months of release?

The numbers I used for the extrapolation were from 2011 (for the US) and 2014 (for the UK. This is all explained above, and the whole rationale for this method was to use recent numbers and then extrapolate to markets where the sales numbers are unknown. Read my post again.

How we have access to actual sales numbers? I don't know how those numbers are compiled, but it can't be that difficult.

Yes, the sales figures drop sharply a few months after release. But again, the numbers used for extrapolation were recent (well, not for the US; but at least a few years after release) sales numbers. In general I would also like to add that records may sell substantially well after release, like CD did in the US when it was re-released in 2011 with a lower price tag, causing it to re-enter Billboard 200.

Your new revised list without a link but will give benefit of the doubt.

Finland: 20,000

If a record has sold to Gold in Finland it means it has sold between 20k and 30k. Surely CD has sold more than 20k in Finland, especially since the Gold certification came already back in 2009 . I haven't checked the rest of your numbers (Finland was first), but if you have just listed the absolute minimum sales to reach the known certifications, then your total number will be much lower than what it really is. ESPECIALLY since we know these certifications were reached in 2009 and that the record may have sold to higher certifications since then.

In addition, you are still just adding numbers for parts of the global market.

In short, the actual total global sale of CD must be significantly higher than what you arrive at.

What is funny is that I don't really care how many copies have been sold. It means zero to me. I just like numbers.

UK(shipments): Already included

Just noticed another thing. Where have you included the numbers for UK? I haven't been paying much attention to this thread previously and is interested how much CD sold over there.

You're the one making the claim about Finland. The exact number is your responsibility. You did not clarify how many times it went Platinum. If it was only once, 20,000 is all we know for sure. Max would be 39,999 obviously. If you want to inflate it, do so with something other than just throwing claims out there.

My point was that you are using the absolute lowest theoretical numbers, dated back to 2009, for a subset of the global market. In other words, your calculation will be well below the real numbers. I am not saying there is anythign wrong with that, it is the natural way to try to calculate sales, just that it is imporant everyone understands this so they don't take your total as the truth but understand the real number must be much higher.

As you can see from another post of mine I attempted a different way of calculating.

[Rustycage]

You're simply trying to omit that shipped albums were certified and any additional demand would come from a new supply in those markets. It's groundless and if you like numbers, do the simple math. 2/3 of the total numbers are shipped certifications. You can't just throw extra shit on there to make it look prettier.

CD sold 3-3.5 million.

If you truly want to make that number higher, head to your nearest Dollar Tree store and get the same, exact Best Buy exclusive copy for 99 cents. I repeat, ninety nine cents.

What's funny is that won't make it higher. They were already considered SOLD.

[Rustycage]

It is tempting to try to calculate global sales based on known certifications, but the weakness of that approach is that we don't have updated certifications, that we are apt to look at the lowest numbers, and that this method doesn't factor in sales numbers from countries where no certifications have been reached or is readily available.

An alternative approach is to take actual sales numbers that are recent, and then extrapolate for other markets. The obvious weakness of this method is to be able to only include markets where we can assume the sales numbers will be similar (per capita). Let's try this for USA and UK, where we do have quite recent sales numbers ( at least for the UK). We will extrapolate to North America and Europe (about 1 billion in total population).

USA.

Known sales of CD in 2011: 614.000.

Population: ~ 300 mill (30 % of the total).

Extrapolation for 2011: 2.4 millions.

Comment: So, if we extrapolate for USA, we calculate that the sales figures in the whole of North America and Europe in 2011 should have been about 2.4 millions. This is just for 1/6 of the total global market, but definitly the most-buying segment. This was also back in 2011, so we would expect the number to by significantly higher by now. Probably a million more? But this is just guesswork.

UK.

Known sales of CD in 2014: 368.899.

Population: 64 mill (6.4 % of the total).

Extrapolation: 5.76 millions.

Comment: That's a surprisingly high number, don't you think? At least it is based on a current number, but we still haven't factored in all the other markets beside North America and Europe. It may be that people in the UK are just more fond of GN'R than people elsewhere in the regions looked at, or that they just buy more records in total. Or maybe this isn't too far off, and the sale of CD actually has been higher than I thought.

Did you take into account that album sales decrease after the first few months of release?

The numbers I used for the extrapolation were from 2011 (for the US) and 2014 (for the UK. This is all explained above, and the whole rationale for this method was to use recent numbers and then extrapolate to markets where the sales numbers are unknown. Read my post again.

How we have access to actual sales numbers? I don't know how those numbers are compiled, but it can't be that difficult.

Yes, the sales figures drop sharply a few months after release. But again, the numbers used for extrapolation were recent (well, not for the US; but at least a few years after release) sales numbers. In general I would also like to add that records may sell substantially well after release, like CD did in the US when it was re-released in 2011 with a lower price tag, causing it to re-enter Billboard 200.

Your new revised list without a link but will give benefit of the doubt.

Finland: 20,000

If a record has sold to Gold in Finland it means it has sold between 20k and 30k. Surely CD has sold more than 20k in Finland, especially since the Gold certification came already back in 2009 . I haven't checked the rest of your numbers (Finland was first), but if you have just listed the absolute minimum sales to reach the known certifications, then your total number will be much lower than what it really is. ESPECIALLY since we know these certifications were reached in 2009 and that the record may have sold to higher certifications since then.

In addition, you are still just adding numbers for parts of the global market.

In short, the actual total global sale of CD must be significantly higher than what you arrive at.

What is funny is that I don't really care how many copies have been sold. It means zero to me. I just like numbers.

UK(shipments): Already included

Just noticed another thing. Where have you included the numbers for UK? I haven't been paying much attention to this thread previously and is interested how much CD sold over there.

You're the one making the claim about Finland. The exact number is your responsibility. You did not clarify how many times it went Platinum. If it was only once, 20,000 is all we know for sure. Max would be 39,999 obviously. If you want to inflate it, do so with something other than just throwing claims out there.

My point was that you are using the absolute lowest theoretical numbers, dated back to 2009, for a subset of the global market. In other words, your calculation will be well below the real numbers. I am not saying there is anythign wrong with that, it is the natural way to try to calculate sales, just that it is imporant everyone understands this so they don't take your total as the truth but understand the real number must be much higher.

As you can see from another post of mine I attempted a different way of calculating.

The total will never be known but the x number of times it is certified will be known and it has not been certified more times gold or platinum since the 2.6 million in those markets counted. That is why that number does not change. The supply was never exhausted.

Your calculating is incorrect from the start when you're considering the 2.6 million as an exhausted supply when no certification or source from you verifies it. You're trying to stack numbers that aren't there. It's flat out wrong.

[SoulMonster]

It is tempting to try to calculate global sales based on known certifications, but the weakness of that approach is that we don't have updated certifications, that we are apt to look at the lowest numbers, and that this method doesn't factor in sales numbers from countries where no certifications have been reached or is readily available.

An alternative approach is to take actual sales numbers that are recent, and then extrapolate for other markets. The obvious weakness of this method is to be able to only include markets where we can assume the sales numbers will be similar (per capita). Let's try this for USA and UK, where we do have quite recent sales numbers ( at least for the UK). We will extrapolate to North America and Europe (about 1 billion in total population).

USA.

Known sales of CD in 2011: 614.000.

Population: ~ 300 mill (30 % of the total).

Extrapolation for 2011: 2.4 millions.

Comment: So, if we extrapolate for USA, we calculate that the sales figures in the whole of North America and Europe in 2011 should have been about 2.4 millions. This is just for 1/6 of the total global market, but definitly the most-buying segment. This was also back in 2011, so we would expect the number to by significantly higher by now. Probably a million more? But this is just guesswork.

UK.

Known sales of CD in 2014: 368.899.

Population: 64 mill (6.4 % of the total).

Extrapolation: 5.76 millions.

Comment: That's a surprisingly high number, don't you think? At least it is based on a current number, but we still haven't factored in all the other markets beside North America and Europe. It may be that people in the UK are just more fond of GN'R than people elsewhere in the regions looked at, or that they just buy more records in total. Or maybe this isn't too far off, and the sale of CD actually has been higher than I thought.

Did you take into account that album sales decrease after the first few months of release?

The numbers I used for the extrapolation were from 2011 (for the US) and 2014 (for the UK. This is all explained above, and the whole rationale for this method was to use recent numbers and then extrapolate to markets where the sales numbers are unknown. Read my post again.

How we have access to actual sales numbers? I don't know how those numbers are compiled, but it can't be that difficult.

Yes, the sales figures drop sharply a few months after release. But again, the numbers used for extrapolation were recent (well, not for the US; but at least a few years after release) sales numbers. In general I would also like to add that records may sell substantially well after release, like CD did in the US when it was re-released in 2011 with a lower price tag, causing it to re-enter Billboard 200.

Your new revised list without a link but will give benefit of the doubt.

Finland: 20,000

If a record has sold to Gold in Finland it means it has sold between 20k and 30k. Surely CD has sold more than 20k in Finland, especially since the Gold certification came already back in 2009 . I haven't checked the rest of your numbers (Finland was first), but if you have just listed the absolute minimum sales to reach the known certifications, then your total number will be much lower than what it really is. ESPECIALLY since we know these certifications were reached in 2009 and that the record may have sold to higher certifications since then.

In addition, you are still just adding numbers for parts of the global market.

In short, the actual total global sale of CD must be significantly higher than what you arrive at.

What is funny is that I don't really care how many copies have been sold. It means zero to me. I just like numbers.

UK(shipments): Already included

Just noticed another thing. Where have you included the numbers for UK? I haven't been paying much attention to this thread previously and is interested how much CD sold over there.

You're the one making the claim about Finland. The exact number is your responsibility. You did not clarify how many times it went Platinum. If it was only once, 20,000 is all we know for sure. Max would be 39,999 obviously. If you want to inflate it, do so with something other than just throwing claims out there.

My point was that you are using the absolute lowest theoretical numbers, dated back to 2009, for a subset of the global market. In other words, your calculation will be well below the real numbers. I am not saying there is anythign wrong with that, it is the natural way to try to calculate sales, just that it is imporant everyone understands this so they don't take your total as the truth but understand the real number must be much higher.

As you can see from another post of mine I attempted a different way of calculating.

The total will never be known but the x number of times it is certified will be known and it has not been certified more times gold or platinum since the 2.6 million in those markets counted. That is why that number does not change. The supply was never exhausted.

Your calculating is incorrect from the start when you're considering the 2.6 million as an exhausted supply when no certification or source from you verifies it. You're trying to stack numbers that aren't there. It's flat out wrong.

You are claiming that we have updated data for certifications. How do you know this? The list of certifications I posted were from 2009 (!). At that date the sales numbers could have been on the verge of tipping into the next certification category, meaning that the real numbers may be much higher.

I don't know what yu are talking about when you mention the number 2.6 millions. Read my post again, I am basing the extrapolation on actual sales numbers, and none of those numbers were 2.6 millons (they were 0.6 millions for US in 2011 and 0.35 millions for UK in 2014).

Apollo: You asked about how the sales data was generated, read this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nielsen_SoundScanand especially the "Tracking" section of the article. I assume a similar system is in place for the UK.

Edited September 22, 2015 by SoulMonster

[Rustycage]

LMAO as of 2011, there were 1 million still stocked from the 1.6 million deal with Best Buy that is included in the original 2.6 million figure. This market was not on the verge. This is only 1 of several major markets that certified through shipping.

You seem to think the number should have risen. The clear reason it has not is because you can't count the same album twice. That's elementary.

No new certifications have come in the major markets that were originally reported in '09. I was lazy and took your word on the other countries you listed and even with that, there is still no basis that over 3 million were sold. There is actually no basis that even half of that were sold.

Do you understand that selling to a distributor is not the same as selling to a retail customer? With different bodies using different criteria for certifying, it matters. It is no mystery why over 9 of every 10 albums distributed at the time of release fall into the shipped=sold category. It's polishing a turd.

Here is the list of the countries I know of right now that certify through shipment to distributors instead of actual sales:

Australia

Brazil

Canada

Chile

China

Denmark

Germany

Greece

Israel

Japan

Mexico

Netherlands

New Zealand

South Africa

Spain

Sweden

United Kingdom

USA

Edited September 22, 2015 by Rustycage

[Mao5]

I'm ready to bet that CD sold less than 3 million. Complete flop. CD2 sales would be worse if it was released.