Who are the most influential musicians of all-time?d

[wasted]

I feel like Elvis took rock n roll to white folk and Eminem took rap to the trailer park. Hence the most influential on mainstream propaganda.

[DieselDaisy]

My sister is seeing Eminmems in Glasgow. As I said to her, I wouldn't pay a tuppence to see him if he was playing the King's Head.

[Len Cnut]

2 hours ago, DieselDaisy said:

My sister is seeing Eminmems in Glasgow. As I said to her, I wouldn't pay a tuppence to see him if he was playing the King's Head.

The man is a prodigy.

3 hours ago, wasted said:

I feel like Elvis took rock n roll to white folk and Eminem took rap to the trailer park. Hence the most influential on mainstream propaganda.

Tupac took rap overground, not Eminem.  Or rather Death Row did.

[Fitha_whiskey]

5 hours ago, J Dog said:

Don't feel bad I don't know them either.

Yeah- I was wondering if any other Americans have heard of them? You, Dan H and myself never heard of them before. I don't think they really crossed the pond...

[Len Cnut]

6 hours ago, J Dog said:

Don't feel bad I don't know them either.

It was a whole genre around those guys, Krautrock, it was majorly influential to the more arty end of punk.  Groups like Neu!, Can, Tangerine Dream etc.  Artists like Bowie as I said were hugely influenced by it, also PiL and Joy Division and The Fall and groups like that.  Bowies Berlin Trilogy is heavily influenced by them.  They're in an episode of The Simpsons if I'm not mistaken...or referred to anyway.

Edited May 2, 2017 by Len Cnut

[J Dog]

1 hour ago, Fitha_whiskey said:

Yeah- I was wondering if any other Americans have heard of them? You, Dan H and myself never heard of them before. I don't think they really crossed the pond...

Doesn't seem like it. I checked out some of their stuff when I quoted you, honestly, I don't think we're, or at least me, missed much.

Not denying the influence part or anything, if the people who know them say it then I can believe it.

[wasted]

2 hours ago, Len Cnut said:

The man is a prodigy.

Tupac took rap overground, not Eminem.  Or rather Death Row did.

Maybe overground but not the mall? 

Musically Tupac is more influential but Eminem is the top selling act in the 00s. He changed white america. 

[Dan H.]

2 hours ago, Fitha_whiskey said:

Yeah- I was wondering if any other Americans have heard of them? You, Dan H and myself never heard of them before. I don't think they really crossed the pond...

Maybe its a Captain Beefheart thing. They never went mainstream and now years later they're a hidden gem of influence for people willing to look. The Pixies are kinda like that, but a bit more accessible.

Whats interesting is that when Kraftwork popped up on my Pandora, I thought they were a fairly recent indie electronic group, as they sound so much like the style of today. I suppose that's a huge testiment to their influence, that their sound is still around today. In fact its clear they had a huge impact on my favorite band LCD Soundsystem. James Murphy of LCD is an underground music nerd, and when he experiments with electronics it sounds similar to Kraftwerk

 

Edited May 2, 2017 by Dan H.

[J Dog]

28 minutes ago, wasted said:

Maybe overground but not the mall? 

Musically Tupac is more influential but Eminem is the top selling act in the 00s. He changed white america. 

Idk. There's a reason why so many rap albums in the early-mid 90s went triple and quadruple platinum, they tapped into the white kids. Eminem was that on steroids, but millions of white kids bought the hell out of Snoop, Pac, Biggie etc. 

I'd probably say Dre had a bigger influence, and one of the bigger ones for rap. Musically he inspired a decade of copycats and changed how popular rap music sounded. I like to compare The Chronic to Nevermind. And his production is some of the best in rap history. And looking at what branched off directly from him....NWA, Death Row, Snoop, Eminem, 50 Cent, Game, Kendrick Lamar....that's a nice list to say you had a hand in all that. The influence that comes from the Dre tree is huge.

[Len Cnut]

36 minutes ago, wasted said:

Maybe overground but not the mall? 

Musically Tupac is more influential but Eminem is the top selling act in the 00s. He changed white america. 

I'd say to the mall as well, Pac sold like 80 million records.  Granted Em' blows that out of the water but thats a lot of units shipped, enough for him to be a pretty good shout for bringing hip hop to the suburbs.  I mean NWA were, again, a big thing even in the mainstream but I think it'd be a little unfair to give them the title of being the ones who took it over over overground, Death Row, The Chronic, Doggystyle, these were massive sellers too...but no one can rightly dispute the size of the dent Pac made and his global appeal.

[wasted]

5 minutes ago, J Dog said:

Idk. There's a reason why so many rap albums in the early-mid 90s went triple and quadruple platinum, they tapped into the white kids. Eminem was that on steroids, but millions of white kids bought the hell out of Snoop, Pac, Biggie etc. 

I'd probably say Dre had a bigger influence, and one of the bigger ones for rap. Musically he inspired a decade of copycats and changed how popular rap music sounded. I like to compare The Chronic to Nevermind. And his production is some of the best in rap history. And looking at what branched off directly from him....NWA, Death Row, Snoop, Eminem, 50 Cent, Game, Kendrick Lamar....that's a nice list to say you had a hand in all that. The influence that comes from the Dre tree is huge.

True Dre masterminded Eminem's success really. So he could take credit it for. 

[Len Cnut]

5 minutes ago, wasted said:

True Dre masterminded Eminem's success really. So he could take credit it for. 

In defence of Em' he was fuckin' lethal and making a lot of noise in the underground, that kid was gonna make it into the spotlight one way or another.  And y'know for all the credit Dre is given for his success (and he was a fair part of it) check out his albums, check out how many songs are actually Dre produced, you'll be suprised.  And I'm talking from the debut onwards.

[wasted]

5 minutes ago, Len Cnut said:

I'd say to the mall as well, Pac sold like 80 million records.  Granted Em' blows that out of the water but thats a lot of units shipped, enough for him to be a pretty good shout for bringing hip hop to the suburbs.  I mean NWA were, again, a big thing even in the mainstream but I think it'd be a little unfair to give them the title of being the ones who took it over over overground, Death Row, The Chronic, Doggystyle, these were massive sellers too...but no one can rightly dispute the size of the dent Pac made and his global appeal.

I suppose depends how you see influence. I see Em taking rap deep into the mainstream, the final step from fantasy into legitimizing/ruining it. Eminem has hits with Rihanna in the pop charts. Overall Eminem is like Elvis , he has a more far reaching symbolic influence. 

[J Dog]

2 minutes ago, wasted said:

True Dre masterminded Eminem's success really. So he could take credit it for. 

Oh I don't mean take credit for it. I'm just saying from NWA to Eminem to Kendrick, there are huge names directly linked to Dre. Plus, he created that g-funk. I know you know about that g-funk.

[Len Cnut]

3 minutes ago, J Dog said:

Oh I don't mean take credit for it. I'm just saying from NWA to Eminem to Kendrick, there are huge names directly linked to Dre. Plus, he created that g-funk. I know you know about that g-funk.

I think Dre is overrated myself.  Not in reference to what you're saying, which is all accurate, just as an artist.

[wasted]

3 minutes ago, Len Cnut said:

In defence of Em' he was fuckin' lethal and making a lot of noise in the underground, that kid was gonna make it into the spotlight one way or another.  And y'know for all the credit Dre is given for his success (and he was a fair part of it) check out his albums, check out how many songs are actually Dre produced, you'll be suprised.  And I'm talking from the debut onwards.

Dre has all the beat beats as I remember. But it's more just the vision or concept of it. Dre or whoever could only take it that far, Eminem just took right into the mainstream where little kids at school are singing Monster. 

[J Dog]

5 minutes ago, Len Cnut said:

I think Dre is overrated myself.  Not in reference to what you're saying, which is all accurate, just as an artist.

As a rapper yeah. But even he admits he's not a born rapper and it just comes with the territory.

Now if you're talking production I'd have to disagree.

[wasted]

8 minutes ago, J Dog said:

Oh I don't mean take credit for it. I'm just saying from NWA to Eminem to Kendrick, there are huge names directly linked to Dre. Plus, he created that g-funk. I know you know about that g-funk.

That's the music, but did Dre take rap as deep into the mainstream as Em. Em's presence points back to all the Dres n NWAs. I think Dre knew what he was doing. 

[Len Cnut]

1 minute ago, wasted said:

Dre has all the beat beats as I remember. But it's more just the vision or concept of it. Dre or whoever could only take it that far, Eminem just took right into the mainstream where little kids at school are singing Monster. 

The thing he makes these albums, he don't write his fuckin' rhymes, released two solo albums (which were bangin' i gotta say, stone cold classics but he's hardly on em, though i get he's a producer).  Half of that first album is Snoop and the biggest singles off the second are carried by either Em' or Snoop or whoever.  Other than that Doggystyle, he produced that, crazy credit he gets for that.  Aftermath Presents was a piece of shit, Compton was a piece of shit.  The guys overrated.  I'll always rate him on the strength of the two Chronics and Doggystyle and some other sick turns of production he's done but pound for pound could you reasonably put him ahead of someone like, for instance, The RZA?  I don't think so.

[wasted]

2 minutes ago, Len Cnut said:

The thing he makes these albums, he don't write his fuckin' rhymes, released two solo albums (which were bangin' i gotta say, stone cold classics but he's hardly on em, though i get he's a producer).  Half of that first album is Snoop and the biggest singles off the second are carried by either Em' or Snoop or whoever.  Other than that Doggystyle, he produced that, crazy credit he gets for that.  Aftermath Presents was a piece of shit, Compton was a piece of shit.  The guys overrated.  I'll always rate him on the strength of the two Chronics and Doggystyle and some other sick turns of production he's done but pound for pound could you reasonably put him ahead of someone like, for instance, The RZA?  I don't think so.

You mean as an artist, no. But in terms of Em he gave him that platform, the authority of the sound and production was the launchpad for those early albums. It might be the wrong angle, but I see Em as a more influential figure, culturally maybe. If they were knocking on the door he kicked it down. 

[Len Cnut]

15 minutes ago, wasted said:

You mean as an artist, no. But in terms of Em he gave him that platform, the authority of the sound and production was the launchpad for those early albums. It might be the wrong angle, but I see Em as a more influential figure, culturally maybe. If they were knocking on the door he kicked it down. 

Can't argue with that.  And, lest I'm misunderstood, i do rate the guy highly, i just think if you apply a little scrutiny there he ain't like, the fuckin' be all and end all like he is made out to be.

[J Dog]

The two Chronics and Doggystyle are enough to cement Dre, I think they're that good. The Chronic just did so much for rap, it's truly one of those game changing albums. And I just love the g-funk and think it's one of the better sounding eras in the history of hip hop, so whoever gave us that gets big points from me. One of Em's biggest hits was produced by Dre. As well as 50 and Pac. He's good.

I do agree with you about Pac, by far he had the biggest reach out of all of them.

[Len Cnut]

4 minutes ago, J Dog said:

The two Chronics and Doggystyle are enough to cement Dre, I think they're that good. The Chronic just did so much for rap, it's truly one of those game changing albums. And I just love the g-funk and think it's one of the better sounding eras in the history of hip hop, so whoever gave us that gets big points from me. One of Em's biggest hits was produced by Dre. As well as 50 and Pac. He's good.

I do agree with you about Pac, by far he had the biggest reach out of all of them.

I agree and it's on the weight on those alone that he is worthy of eternal respect, Chronic and Doggystyle, I'm speaking I guess more about this fallacy that everything he ever touches is top quality product.  I guess part of his job is finding the artists too and in that respect he's kinda unparralleled.  But if Dre gets all that respect for those then The RZA should be some kinda God for his production work on the Wu solo debuts.

Edited May 2, 2017 by Len Cnut

[J Dog]

4 minutes ago, Len Cnut said:

I agree and it's on the weight on those alone that he is worthy of eternal respect, Chronic and Doggystyle, I'm speaking I guess more about this fallacy that everything he ever touches is top quality product.

I'm sorry homie, I'd even disagree with that  I dont think he produces much bullshit at all. As much shit as Relapse gets, even from Eminem himself, the production is never questioned. It sounds fantastic. Anything he did with Snoop during No Limit was straight. 

Dre is actually my least favorite cat out of NWA or Death Row or even Aftermath btw. But I love his sound.

[Len Cnut]

1 minute ago, J Dog said:

I'm sorry homie, I'd even disagree with that  I dont think he produces much bullshit at all. As much shit as Relapse gets, even from Eminem himself, the production is never questioned. It sounds fantastic. Anything he did with Snoop during No Limit was straight. 

Dre is actually my least favorite cat out of NWA or Death Row or even Aftermath btw. But I love his sound.

Nah man, NWA is all Cube.  Dre did some good production on Xzibits album Relentless was it called?