guitarpatch

2 minutes ago, lukepowell1988 said:

Think its more to do with odd international licensing than it is the band/Axl.

International licensing and soundtracks do complicate things. We also know the past issues with West Arkeen written songs.

Not much GNR can do on their end. You’re talking about international streaming rights on distribution agreements to appear on soundtracks that were made 20 yrs ago and an estate trying in some fashion to possibly protect royalty revenue that has seen a decline over the years (not that Id agree with that strategy). 

No lawyer fee would be worth reworking agreements for those songs compared to what they generate income wise. 

2 hours ago, bumbleslash69 said:

What was the general reaction when Oh My God was released?

Nowadays it's just a footnote it seems like. I remember back in the "dark days" between 02 and 06 lots of chatter about it. But nothing too concrete is sticking out to me other than they were calling it a demo for some reason.

Got played once per day for a few weeks in a top 20 countdown. Prob means Interscope “paid” for some promo behind it to see if it stuck. It didn’t stick

14 minutes ago, downzy said:

You and everyone here can voice your opinion of GNR management, whether positive or negative, but let’s not make false statements to justify said opinions. 

TB absolutely was involved in setting up NITL, including itineraries and logistics. 

And if you think the benefits of TB’s relationship is all one sided, you’re not familiar enough to speak with any certainty on the matter. 

There are a lot of moving parts that need attention for a band the size of GNR. Whether they are active or not. Every aspect of the band’s business goes through management on some level. None of us are really in the know to say whether or not they are doing a good job under their circumstances. It’s a lot of work and I’d never accuse someone who’s been in the game this long on that level on effort. 

Now we can certainly disagree/voice opinions with things that we see on our end. We do see the final product and it’s an important aspect of it all that should be heard

The way this was all so public is red flag central. 

The only recourse if this was ever a valid attempt is to claim repeatedly you won’t leak it and have it come from another source. 

4 minutes ago, bumbleslash69 said:

What would our man get in trouble with exactly if caught red handed? Copyright infringement?Like when people put up YouTube videos and then have claims made and they're taken offline? 

I'm not well versed in most laws, but hasn't the "most" illegal act already happened? When the locker buyer sold the CDs? 

There is nothing different or special about this just because it's GnR and unreleased, right? It's still sharing UMG material the same way people do everyday with YT videos? 

I'm just trying to follow along. I don't want the guy to get in trouble at all, but I get a little lost when people talk about him going to prison for the rest of his life. I'm thinking it would be a copyright infringement charge for each track that leaks? (Or just one if he puts them as one file like the Radiohead leak)

Infringer pays the actual dollar amount of damages and profits. The law provides a range from $200 to $150,000 for each work infringed. Infringer pays for all attorneys fees and court costs.

That’s per song if they pursue. Not something to take lightly 

8 minutes ago, Modano09 said:

Does it have anything to do with the number of people that worked on/written/recorded a lot of this stuff? Like if he dumps all this on iTunes, it's not just Axl getting the money.

GNR is under a record contract. Technically Axl can’t just throw these songs up online even if he wants to. UMG needs to agree to release it and their contract stipulates if there’s advances that are owed and what’s recoupable for the label to collect. It’s a little more complicated than that and on top of it was originally signed when physical media sales were the base of the agreement. 

2 minutes ago, ll_tj1 said:

Distrubution for profit could cause issue. But sharing?? Im told its not an issue. But who knows

 

Doesn’t matter. He doesn’t own the rights on the discs. Just potentially the physical discs

3 minutes ago, default_ said:

"So for anyone who doesn’t know 

The situation that had a public auction that took place on a storage locker surrendered by failure to pay by the owner who had legally possession of the items

the then purchasing party has 100% legal ownership of the items in that locker.

Axl , Universal and team Brazil cannot seek any legal action for the tracks being spread out bye for now 100% legal owner of those items

To add to that public auctions have a strict contract and transference of property agreement with all persons or business rent a unit 

so unless a time before the auction a police report was made of stolen goods that was itemized and dated which there would already be a public record of and in occurrence the auctioneer would have been made aware before the public auction so yeah 

lol Team Brazil and Axl"

So, just read this at another forum, anyone schooled in those matters could clarify it? 

I wasnt aware that the locker was auctioned because Zutaut didnt pay the bill lol 

They can possibly own the physical cd’s. The person does not however own the contents and rights on those cd’s to distribute. 

8 minutes ago, megaguns1982 said:

Legal issues and monetary issues about his outlay.... privacy issues as this is in very few hands at this point.

He’s most likely getting a letter from UMG that he returns the cds and they’ll threaten damages/potential legal costs if the material gets out. 

His needs to claim the material is already out there elsewhere and that this was before he received the CDs. It’s not on him if it gets out 

12 minutes ago, nikosgnr said:

No one wants that.

As a community we should look after each other on certain matters. Even if it’s to protect someone from themselves at times. I’d rather not see member’s names in posts even if it’s common knowledge or available elsewhere 

5 minutes ago, The Real McCoy said:

UMG wouldn’t really have to do all that much aside from throwing it up on iTunes and Amazon. They wouldn’t even need to do a physical release.

Doesn’t solve the issue of what’s owed under the contract. It’s all under an old major label deal. CD sessions doesn’t necessarily move the needle for what those numbers might be for both sides  

4 minutes ago, downzy said:

GNR likely has contractual obligations with UMG with respect to albums owed and recording rights belonging to UMG.  But UMG would not take all proceeds of any and all sales.  Artists, particularly high-calibre artists like GNR, negotiate recording right royalties along with ownership of publishing rights.  

There's always a financial incentive for any artist/band to release material.  

The financial incentive is already spelled out in the contract with an advance/royalty structure for a release. Whether that makes sense has always been the issue for both sides for these songs. 

In this case, I doubt that UMG would want to count this as part of a album owed under their contract. They’d prob want to release it as CD expanded reissue. Especially if there’s 1 or 2 albums left on the deal. They want control over Slash/GNR albums. Then you get into whether GNR has actually recouped under Chinese Democracy release and what deals/contract renegotiations have been made over the years that have gone into that number on top of the Best Buy Deal 

They’d need to negotiate something for this type of release. To expect them to come up with a deal in a few days time is a bit much considering the likely history. 

3 minutes ago, nikosgnr said:

Although he has prof. picture with uncle Axl and a video in his signature meeting with him and Fernando watching above..

 

I just don’t want to see the guy have issues because his real name pops up in google searches/articles years from now. We all know how those websites work when reporting GNR news. God forbid he doesn’t get some job down the line because of something like this. 

Just now, The Real McCoy said:

Again, the Radiohead method would be the best case scenario for the band here. If this stuff gets out, officially release it for a week or so, and donate the proceeds to charity. Win/win.

I’d gladly pay upwards of $50 for everything directly from the band.

UMG has them under contract. They’d take all of the proceeds. Outside of releasing it, there’s little benefit for GNR 

1 minute ago, Live Like a Suicide said:

I am guilty of that, but he has his real name and social media in his profile, and everybody knows his username, so...

Can just see certain websites writing stories and instead of username a real name being attached to it would probably cause unnecessary complications. Whether he leaks it or not. You don’t want people being searchable in google because of this situation 

On 2019-07-28 at 10:11 AM, Axl_morris said:

... should upload them then claim political asylum in an equadorian embassy

I really wish people would stop using his name 

1 minute ago, nycgunner said:

All of the links were killed on reddit.

Listening to those two leaks - I just don’t get the path Axl took. It’s clearly good music. Why go into hiding and only come out to tour (extensively) playing the same songs from the 80s and 90s over and over. Doesn’t that get boring?

The guy’s creativity was really strong through the 90s and early 00s. We just never saw it. If there is ever an authorized biography, it would be one hell of a read 

Chinese Democracy - it’s a good idea on the surface that you’ll probably never see

I think he was telling us from the beginning...

Botched tours, lineup changes, bad management, and a record label that grew tired and moved on all while everyone around you wants you to reunite the old band. They’ll pay you as long you play the hits 

2 minutes ago, Edward Nygma said:

Why doesn't Axl have these songs? Does the record company have to keep hold of the songs for contractual reasons? 

They paid for them and GNR is still under contract. It’s a bit complicated to just release these tomorrow 

2 minutes ago, MaskingApathy said:

Maybe if this stuff gets leaked in full it will force the band to not make an album of Chinese Leftovers but to create something entirely new from scratch (which is what I want anyways).

There could be more songs from the Bucket/Fortus era of the band to rework 

4 minutes ago, gnfnr2k said:

These cds have not been through the hands of multiple people.  These two clip leaks are not even from him.  As long as people are not stupid and post them in open,  not sure if trading or sharing them is even illegal.  Because if it was then everyone would be screwed for just having all these leaks.

 

 

It’s still illegal. That’s essentially what the p2p lawsuits showed. They technically could go after anyone who put them up on a site. It’s just hard to prove and prob not worth the PR hit 

I agree they should put some layers on their identity. I hope they have so far after being so public about it

1 minute ago, gnfnr2k said:

 

Here is the thing, these were legally bought though from Zutats storage locker.  So the question to ask is are these now the property ofthe person that owns them. As long as he does not sell them or put them on a website to stream, is he allowed to do what he wants with them.

 

 

No they aren’t. It’s still UMG’s property and technically wasn’t Zutant’s or any employee’s right to sell/give away. Unless UMG went behind on a storage locker payment you could then own those specific CDs. It still doesn’t give a right to distribute the copyrighted work that’s on them

Just now, Arnuld said:

Agreed

Bringing to light whoever is responsible for leaking will open things up legally for UMG/GNR. Especially if there’s $ being transferred or held in a fund. Unfortunately that’s the risk with these things and I hope they are all hiding behind some layers for protection 

1 minute ago, Arnuld said:

Holy Shit. That’s badass. 

If true, then hopefully he has a way to listen to CDs in the car and is blasting AFD 99 right now 

23 minutes ago, ZoSoRose said:

I dont think theae tracks will be "release ready". Theyre reference/scratch tracks akin to the other 99 demos we have

I hope people realize this if it gets out. These are probably rough mixes and in some cases mixes they’ve been messing with. None of it has been mastered 

None of it is release ready nor should be judged to that degree (ie: the drums or guitars sound horrible). 

That’s the downside to this thing. There’s little background and it hasn’t been exactly presented to us to understand it 

1 minute ago, Caught_in_a_Coma said:

I wonder what goes through Axl's head when he (and others, but he's the main driving force behind it) write all these songs, most are probably at least great, and he just sits on them for years.  Is this just more evidence that Axl really simply doesn't care about certain things (like glory and adoration or attention)?  Or more evidence he is pretty sensitive to how stuff he makes is received?  Does he think these songs aren't up to snuff or did the ChiDem album reception just make him not care about giving more music to many people who won't appreciate it? 

Lots of artists write and record songs that never make albums or are ever intended to be released. It’s part of the process. They take the best of the bunch, bunch songs that have a similar sound or theme. or save songs for the future that they want to work on

It’s not uncommon to have 18-30 songs and only 10 make the album