GNR no Major Touring in the USA Why?

[rocker rockstar]

I noticed there is only a few shows in the USA. Why? Is Axl boycotting Ticketmaster because of the lawsuit with his ex-manager that runs Ticketmaster.

[gunsguy]

Truth is no one knows whats up, I imagine they will tour the US in due time

[SunnyDRE]

Lawsuit may have something to do with it, but I think it probaly has more to do with potential sales and revenue.

I don't think this version of GNR could sell out Convention centers (basketball arena's), and maybe some promoters are a little leary.

think about it......if you owned an arena, or you worked for a city that owned the convention center - would you rather book gnr and sell 11,000 tickets (capacity 20,000).....or do wwe, rotc meets, cheerleader comps, that will sellout?

Gnr should do a club tour.

[Naupis]

Lawsuit may have something to do with it, but I think it probaly has more to do with potential sales and revenue.

I don't think this version of GNR could sell out Convention centers (basketball arena's), and maybe some promoters are a little leary.

think about it......if you owned an arena, or you worked for a city that owned the convention center - would you rather book gnr and sell 11,000 tickets (capacity 20,000).....or do wwe, rotc meets, cheerleader comps, that will sellout?

Gnr should do a club tour.

I saw them in Cleveland in 06 and there were maybe 5,000 people in the Cavs arena. I don't think they could sell that right now in a mid market like this just given the way the economy is. Unless your Bieber, Taylor Swift, Gaga or one of the elite nostalgia acts ticket sales are down big in the States.

Seeing them in a half empty arena is not fun, but Axl has never shown much of a willingness to go on a tour of smaller venues.

Outside of a new album to change the dynamic here in the States I just don't see how another U.S tour ends up being all that successful. The demand is just not there.

[bigcountry]

I read a few weeks back the EVERYONE that is a statium act are having a very hard time selling tickets here in the US execpt a few(they only said about 3 band/artist). They went on to say that promoters just are not going to take the risk of lossing even more money on these large acts in big places. It also stated than the smaller venues are doing really good with acts that are willing to take a step back so to speak and play in smaller places. Whick makes sense to me. Down econemy no money for seats exspecially if they are not close up. And that was one of the major concerns of the concert goers is having to pay so much for noise bleeds and even when they discount them most people just stayed at home because of not being close up.

I would rather pay more and go to a concert in a smaller venue than pay a little less and get shitty seats.

[rocker rockstar]

Sometimes you need to play the small shows and work your way up to the big shows again. Maybe Axl is not willing. But there is so many festivals in the summer here in the USA that GNR could have been a headliner it is crazy they could have sold out large stadiums maybe not Arenas. I think Stadiums make better shows than Arenas anyways. I am also a fan of small clubs. Maybe a small club tour then some festivals like Ozzy Fest, then starts a stadium tour.

[kyrie]

Ok, there's just so much speculation about the U.S. thing:

Lets look at it this way: Multiple touring artists are canceling U.S. shows this summer. Limp Bizkit canceled an entire tour. Lilith Fair canceled dates and then canceled even more on top of that. And before you think it's washed up Nu-Metal acts and aging neo-feminist chanteuses, Rhianna has axed shows as well due to ticket sales and she's considered a "top act". You've got other tours practically giving away tickets.

So, one might suggest that Guns made a wise decision avoiding the U.S. for now. They pulled 15,000+ in Toronto, and 9,000 - 10,000 in the other big Canadian cities, and 5,000 - 6,000 in the smaller ones. Great showing, great tour. Now, look at the U.S. - yes, Guns will sell out MSG. They'll sell well in Boston, Chicago, and some other big markets. But doing another 30 date U.S. tour - not going to sell great in this economy period. No one besides Bon Jovi (sadly), U2, and a few other acts impervious to touring woes will.

On the other hand, they've done Canada where the album was #1 and went 3x platinum on our charts, then South America to huge crowds, and now Europe where it was also a #1 record in many countries. Why?

Well, those countries supported the album more. It makes financial sense.

They're doing Sturgis in the downtime and that should be great promotion. They'll do the U.S. most likely next year. Next up after Europe is Australia. I still expect to see German dates, maybe some solo U.K. dates... guys this tour is likely far from over. Come December in Australia they'll have toured a full year. Now figure... Germany, U.K., some other Euro dates, Mexico, the U.S., maybe South Africa, maybe a more extensive tour of Asia... this could very well be a 2-year tour. The U.S. will get its turn, just chill...

[Cdlove]

Why dont, like I have said forever, do like 15-20 shows in big markets, like one show in NY, then Boston, then Atlanta, Then Orlando, then head west? Or they could do a amphitheater tour, they would sell out those 10,000-15,000 seat venues fast.

[Snowmass]

Not sure why he doesn't line up say MSG, Vegas, LA, Chicago atleast. Pretty much guaranteed sell outs in those markets.

[kyrie]

Lawsuit may have something to do with it, but I think it probaly has more to do with potential sales and revenue.

I don't think this version of GNR could sell out Convention centers (basketball arena's), and maybe some promoters are a little leary.

think about it......if you owned an arena, or you worked for a city that owned the convention center - would you rather book gnr and sell 11,000 tickets (capacity 20,000).....or do wwe, rotc meets, cheerleader comps, that will sellout?

Gnr should do a club tour.

You book the arena and sell 11,000 tickets if you're a promoter with a brain. The arena owner has nothing to do with it, because the arena is rented out at a flat fee and that has nothing to do with tickets. At most, they'll make money of refreshments, and you'll sell more beer and snacks at a GN'R show than at a cheerleader competition or ROTC meeting, or even WWE given their attendance sucks now due to UFC eating away at their viewership (I work in a related industry, I've seen the PPV buy rates for WWE these days vs. UFC, and the WWE gate is down too).

Sellouts don't make a tour profitable - yes they help, but you can be profitable without selling out. Go look at the PollStar numbers released recently and where GN'R rank, without selling out a lot of shows.

I know this board is obsessed with sellouts because GN'R is everyone's favorite band but for a promoter, you book what makes you the most money. Club tour? Are you kidding? You can sell 5,000 tickets if priced right with an arena booked and still be profitable, so why would you book a club that holds 500 if you're lucky? At the club level, you're either going to have ticket prices that are so high the average fan can't go, or you're going to have to book multiple nights and hope the venue is available and also pay the band multiple booking fees etc. And you're still going to have less potential earnings in the end.

GN'R drew 15,000+ in Toronto and 5,500 a 30 minute drive away in Hamilton, with shows a week apart. 20,000+ in two nights at two arenas. I was at both shows. Canada makes a good guinea pig. You'll pull similar numbers to Toronto in New York (actually you'll probably sell out New York), Chicago, Boston, and some other big markets.

You get the smaller numbers in smaller markets.

GN'R should simply do a 10 - 15 date arena tour. Ditch some of the smaller markets. Play the cities where the band historically sells well - the Northern states, for starters - and add on a few major markets like Dallas, L.A., etc. Don't try booking three shows in Florida and five in Cali or whatever they did last time. If it's summer do a festival date then rather than arenas, do Amphitheaters perhaps.

My suggestion:

New York (packed in 02 and 06)

Albany (drew 10,000+ in 2002, not played in 06)

Detroit

Chicago

Boston

Minneapolis

Philadelphia - hey, Montreal got them back

Florida - 1 Florida show, not 4!!! as in 06. Tampa or Orlando

Dallas

Phoenix

Los Angles

Las Vegas

Maybe Buffalo or Pittsburgh. Maybe Houston depending on how Dallas does. Couple other maybes.

And that's it. Don't over saturate the market. If a show sells well, add a second night. Schedule so that there's plenty of breaks to allow for that.

Edited July 22, 2010 by kyrie

[GunsNRevolvers2]

Lawsuit may have something to do with it, but I think it probaly has more to do with potential sales and revenue.

I don't think this version of GNR could sell out Convention centers (basketball arena's), and maybe some promoters are a little leary.

think about it......if you owned an arena, or you worked for a city that owned the convention center - would you rather book gnr and sell 11,000 tickets (capacity 20,000).....or do wwe, rotc meets, cheerleader comps, that will sellout?

Gnr should do a club tour.

You book the arena and sell 11,000 tickets if you're a promoter with a brain. The arena owner has nothing to do with it, because the arena is rented out at a flat fee and that has nothing to do with tickets. At most, they'll make money of refreshments, and you'll sell more beer and snacks at a GN'R show than at a cheerleader competition or ROTC meeting, or even WWE given their attendance sucks now due to UFC eating away at their viewership (I work in a related industry, I've seen the PPV buy rates for WWE these days vs. UFC, and the WWE gate is down too).

Sellouts don't make a tour profitable - yes they help, but you can be profitable without selling out. Go look at the PollStar numbers released recently and where GN'R rank, without selling out a lot of shows.

I know this board is obsessed with sellouts because GN'R is everyone's favorite band but for a promoter, you book what makes you the most money. Club tour? Are you kidding? You can sell 5,000 tickets if priced right with an arena booked and still be profitable, so why would you book a club that holds 500 if you're lucky? At the club level, you're either going to have ticket prices that are so high the average fan can't go, or you're going to have to book multiple nights and hope the venue is available and also pay the band multiple booking fees etc. And you're still going to have less potential earnings in the end.

GN'R drew 15,000+ in Toronto and 5,500 a 30 minute drive away in Hamilton, with shows a week apart. 20,000+ in two nights at two arenas. I was at both shows. Canada makes a good guinea pig. You'll pull similar numbers to Toronto in New York (actually you'll probably sell out New York), Chicago, Boston, and some other big markets.

You get the smaller numbers in smaller markets.

GN'R should simply do a 10 - 15 date arena tour. Ditch some of the smaller markets. Play the cities where the band historically sells well - the Northern states, for starters - and add on a few major markets like Dallas, L.A., etc. Don't try booking three shows in Florida and five in Cali or whatever they did last time. If it's summer do a festival date then rather than arenas, do Amphitheaters perhaps.

My suggestion:

New York (packed in 02 and 06)

Albany (drew 10,000+ in 2002, not played in 06)

Detroit

Chicago

Minneapolis

Philadelphia - hey, Montreal got them back

Florida - 1 Florida show, not 4!!! as in 06. Tampa or Orlando

Dallas

Phoenix

Los Angles

Las Vegas

Maybe Buffalo or Pittsburgh. Maybe Houston depending on how Dallas does. Couple other maybes.

And that's it. Don't over saturate the market. If a show sells well, add a second night. Schedule so that there's plenty of breaks to allow for that.

You're going to put Minneapolis, Buffalo and Phoenix in over Boston..Eh wah?

[kyrie]

Lawsuit may have something to do with it, but I think it probaly has more to do with potential sales and revenue.

I don't think this version of GNR could sell out Convention centers (basketball arena's), and maybe some promoters are a little leary.

think about it......if you owned an arena, or you worked for a city that owned the convention center - would you rather book gnr and sell 11,000 tickets (capacity 20,000).....or do wwe, rotc meets, cheerleader comps, that will sellout?

Gnr should do a club tour.

You book the arena and sell 11,000 tickets if you're a promoter with a brain. The arena owner has nothing to do with it, because the arena is rented out at a flat fee and that has nothing to do with tickets. At most, they'll make money of refreshments, and you'll sell more beer and snacks at a GN'R show than at a cheerleader competition or ROTC meeting, or even WWE given their attendance sucks now due to UFC eating away at their viewership (I work in a related industry, I've seen the PPV buy rates for WWE these days vs. UFC, and the WWE gate is down too).

Sellouts don't make a tour profitable - yes they help, but you can be profitable without selling out. Go look at the PollStar numbers released recently and where GN'R rank, without selling out a lot of shows.

I know this board is obsessed with sellouts because GN'R is everyone's favorite band but for a promoter, you book what makes you the most money. Club tour? Are you kidding? You can sell 5,000 tickets if priced right with an arena booked and still be profitable, so why would you book a club that holds 500 if you're lucky? At the club level, you're either going to have ticket prices that are so high the average fan can't go, or you're going to have to book multiple nights and hope the venue is available and also pay the band multiple booking fees etc. And you're still going to have less potential earnings in the end.

GN'R drew 15,000+ in Toronto and 5,500 a 30 minute drive away in Hamilton, with shows a week apart. 20,000+ in two nights at two arenas. I was at both shows. Canada makes a good guinea pig. You'll pull similar numbers to Toronto in New York (actually you'll probably sell out New York), Chicago, Boston, and some other big markets.

You get the smaller numbers in smaller markets.

GN'R should simply do a 10 - 15 date arena tour. Ditch some of the smaller markets. Play the cities where the band historically sells well - the Northern states, for starters - and add on a few major markets like Dallas, L.A., etc. Don't try booking three shows in Florida and five in Cali or whatever they did last time. If it's summer do a festival date then rather than arenas, do Amphitheaters perhaps.

My suggestion:

New York (packed in 02 and 06)

Albany (drew 10,000+ in 2002, not played in 06)

Detroit

Chicago

Minneapolis

Philadelphia - hey, Montreal got them back

Florida - 1 Florida show, not 4!!! as in 06. Tampa or Orlando

Dallas

Phoenix

Los Angles

Las Vegas

Maybe Buffalo or Pittsburgh. Maybe Houston depending on how Dallas does. Couple other maybes.

And that's it. Don't over saturate the market. If a show sells well, add a second night. Schedule so that there's plenty of breaks to allow for that.

I knew I forgot something! Good catch Yes Boston on there also!

[SLCPUNK]

I noticed there is only a few shows in the USA. Why? Is Axl boycotting Ticketmaster because of the lawsuit with his ex-manager that runs Ticketmaster.

I think it will be in 2011 or so. They've always toured outside the country first, I don't see anything really different this time.

[AbominableHoman]

The cats out of the bag: Slash isn't in Guns N' Roses anymore and Chinese Democracy isn't drawing in any new fans. That's why.

Everyone knows Axl is touring with hired Guns and he isn't the most popular individual in the music scene.

[The Glow Inc.]

Well, I believe that he will eventually tour the US at some point.

I think that he understood that after releasing Chinese the way he did, not doing anything for a year, he couldn't launch this tour in the US because ticket sells would have been terrible.

I believe he's trying to get some momentum by touring Europe, Asia and South America first, generate a bit of buzz if that's possible.

Or he's got a joker card in his pocket, coming to a store near you this november...

But I don't think so

[Axl_morris]

It boils down to this guys...

GNR know that European fans>US fans!

FACT!!!

[wasted]

i think they should just hang out in NYC playing club shows, building up to a Giants Stadium show in 2012 with the release of CD II.

[Matt13]

Why is it that people can't get it through their heads that GNR's last manager controls the U.S. market and Ticketmaster? That it wasn't a happy split?

2+2 people. 2+2.

[mrandyk]

It boils down to this guys...

GNR know that European fans>US fans!

FACT!!!

I dont know about that. I think its more a matter of so much of the US buys into such shitty music that the fans of actual rock are all overshadowed.

[ManetsBR]

It boils down to this guys...

GNR know that European fans>US fans!

FACT!!!

and they also know that South American Fans own the rest of the world

[Guest gunns5]

It boils down to this guys...

GNR know that European fans>US fans!

FACT!!!

and they also know that South American Fans own the rest of the world

Australians beg to differ

[Stro]

I think the cowboy hats have been subliminal advertising for a USA tour. Axl knows that, especially in the middle of the country, the only things that draw are nostalgia acts and country acts. He's just letting the image seep into the collective conscious. Then he'll be welcoming Idahoans to the farm.

[Ed Vega]

Dropping a Country & Western flavored album right now would actually be a great idea. Acoustic "Better" anyone?

[SunnyDRE]

I think the cowboy hats have been subliminal advertising for a USA tour. Axl knows that, especially in the middle of the country, the only things that draw are nostalgia acts and country acts. He's just letting the image seep into the collective conscious. Then he'll be welcoming Idahoans to the farm.

I actually think he would do well to hit some smaller cities in the Midwest.

Instead of St. Louis, why not Omaha? Instead of Chicago, why of Des Moines? Instead of New York, why not Hartford?

Lawsuit may have something to do with it, but I think it probaly has more to do with potential sales and revenue.

I don't think this version of GNR could sell out Convention centers (basketball arena's), and maybe some promoters are a little leary.

think about it......if you owned an arena, or you worked for a city that owned the convention center - would you rather book gnr and sell 11,000 tickets (capacity 20,000).....or do wwe, rotc meets, cheerleader comps, that will sellout?

Gnr should do a club tour.

You book the arena and sell 11,000 tickets if you're a promoter with a brain. The arena owner has nothing to do with it, because the arena is rented out at a flat fee and that has nothing to do with tickets. At most, they'll make money of refreshments, and you'll sell more beer and snacks at a GN'R show than at a cheerleader competition or ROTC meeting, or even WWE given their attendance sucks now due to UFC eating away at their viewership (I work in a related industry, I've seen the PPV buy rates for WWE these days vs. UFC, and the WWE gate is down too).

You underestimate the popularity of those things; but hey you live in canada, so it's understandable that you wouldn't really know what draws, in the US...probaly just talking out of your ass.

Sorta like I do when we're dicussing what's popular in Canada, .....oh wait,since I don't live in Canada, I don't do that.

Edited July 22, 2010 by SunnyDRE

[dalsh327]

They played the US over the past decade, and I think he wanted to take the show to places they don't get to play as much, where the sales have been decent, and the crowd reaction's been the loudest. Some artists love playing other countries, some artists dread it. Van Halen never toured outside of North America last tour.

What if GNR just decided never to tour America and play a festival show here and there, and tour the rest of the world?

If a band isn't coming around soon, book a flight and make a trip out of it.

I'd prefer they'd play smaller venues and charge more to see them, but they want a big stage setup and large crowds. I think the residency format is good, esp. in Vegas. Would Axl take Steve Wynn up on a multimillion dollar deal to play Vegas for 5 years? Probably... a theater and sound system designed to Axl's liking, a short plane flight away, and a lot of people coming in to see the show from everywhere. And as far as when the show starts, it would be easier to pull off going on stage at midnight-1 AM there.