Axl Apologizes to Cleveland but Stands Firm!

[Damn_Smooth]

Look, you can defend Axl's decisions and career path all you want...yes, he is talented...but to dismiss/ignore the fact that he has obvious issues that at times border on lunacy is just plain stupid. He can do whatever he wants as long as he isn't hurting anyone, that's his right...but the all bootlickers trying to turn stupidity into brilliance is just insulting to ones intelligence...

Where did I claim that he has no issues or defend his entire career? Since you brought up intelligence, you may as well learn to read more successfully.

What I pointed out about Slash and Duff's legal moves is undeniable. It has nothing to do with "turning stupidity into brilliance" etc- its just the plain facts. If Axl acts to protect his business interests, he's a horrible shark of a man, if the others do it they're just acting rationally to protect themselves.

I wasn't referring to just you, but all of the Axl worshippers that endlessly defend every move the guy makes, including the HOF debacle. The plain fact, as you like to call it, is that Axl in a nut who continues to act in his own disinterest...which in turn, ends up frustrating a lot of fans who would like to see him succeed rather than shoot himself in the foot. But hey, I guess he doesn't owe us a happy ending...

Oh yeah, if somebody doesn't see Axl's refusal to show up at an award show as some horrifically cruel act of pure evil, it must be because they "worship" Axl. If somebody chooses to treat Slash as a human being rather than some beacon of holy light, sooner or later they'll be attacked for "worshiping" Axl.

Your definition of success may not be what Axl's looking for. As I said, its understandable that he has no appetite for even further complicated legal contracts with loopholes that can consume him forever and ever and a reunion is unlikely to come without this condition. That would be one way of shooting oneself in the foot. He seems happier with the current band that he did in the 90s. Maybe that's all that he's looking for.

I'm not talking about, nor have I mentioned Slash or the other guys...I don't really care about all of their differences and old history, I do know that with age usually comes wisdom...and the other guys do seem a lot more "functional" and productive, at least Slash, Duff and Matt. But Axl has to realize that his gravy train is going to run out...he is going to need to get butts into seats and sell albums if he wants to keep his train rolling...it can't be cheap to keep his large band and team on the payroll. Continued dumb moves are not going to help ticket or albums sales, assuming he delivers some new music...or help his credibility.

You talked about things "swirling" and I simply mentioned that questionable things have been linked to others besides Axl. Slash and Duff have produced more music than Axl but Velvet Revolver had its fair share of acrimony and ugliness, drug relapses etc with Slash declaring at the end that he was miserable in VR.

Axl works for his living singing his songs, if its a "gravy train" its one he fuels with some hard labour from himself and the rest of GN'R. He's done a rather successful run around the US recently with many good reviews specially from the fans and without too much drama and has tried to give his own position on things in a reasoned manner so credibility should benefit from those things. He's fine touring to smaller audiences than large reunion crowds because he's not interested in the complications involved in that. The ultimate dumb move may be to throw away his peace of mind in trying to please others for whom his only worth is in playing with people he has left behind in his past.

Whatever floats his boat I guess, but my point is, on his current path, his crowds and venues are going to keep getting smaller...and at some point his lineup will not be sustainable. He would need to do some damage control and deliver a killer album to turn things around, in my opinion. (Well, also promote said killer album!!)

I can see the ad :Now appearing at your local Holiday Inn Lounge...Axl Rose of GNR fame doing his all his favorite songs from his comeback album Chinese Democracy"

There's no way he could avoid a reunion with Steven if he toured like that.

[maynard]

It would be cool if they did one show where it was all CD.

Indeed, but Axl simply can't perform songs like Prostitute live. Shame, it's a good song. I guess we'll be stuck with CD, Better, Sorry for the future. IRS was dropped, CITR made few appearances.

It's weird cause in the majority of the CD songs, Axl sings with clean vocals, so I thought it wouldn't be so hard to re-do that live.

If one day he releases another album, I guess it would be very hard to get to hear them live if they share the same complexity as many of the CD material.

[russfaraday]

Axl should try out an acoustic, low-key version of Prostitute and see how it is. I think it'd be amazing and he'd be able to do it live because it wouldn't strain his voice.

[rabia]

Look, you can defend Axl's decisions and career path all you want...yes, he is talented...but to dismiss/ignore the fact that he has obvious issues that at times border on lunacy is just plain stupid. He can do whatever he wants as long as he isn't hurting anyone, that's his right...but the all bootlickers trying to turn stupidity into brilliance is just insulting to ones intelligence...

Where did I claim that he has no issues or defend his entire career? Since you brought up intelligence, you may as well learn to read more successfully.

What I pointed out about Slash and Duff's legal moves is undeniable. It has nothing to do with "turning stupidity into brilliance" etc- its just the plain facts. If Axl acts to protect his business interests, he's a horrible shark of a man, if the others do it they're just acting rationally to protect themselves.

I wasn't referring to just you, but all of the Axl worshippers that endlessly defend every move the guy makes, including the HOF debacle. The plain fact, as you like to call it, is that Axl in a nut who continues to act in his own disinterest...which in turn, ends up frustrating a lot of fans who would like to see him succeed rather than shoot himself in the foot. But hey, I guess he doesn't owe us a happy ending...

Oh yeah, if somebody doesn't see Axl's refusal to show up at an award show as some horrifically cruel act of pure evil, it must be because they "worship" Axl. If somebody chooses to treat Slash as a human being rather than some beacon of holy light, sooner or later they'll be attacked for "worshiping" Axl.

Your definition of success may not be what Axl's looking for. As I said, its understandable that he has no appetite for even further complicated legal contracts with loopholes that can consume him forever and ever and a reunion is unlikely to come without this condition. That would be one way of shooting oneself in the foot. He seems happier with the current band that he did in the 90s. Maybe that's all that he's looking for.

I'm not talking about, nor have I mentioned Slash or the other guys...I don't really care about all of their differences and old history, I do know that with age usually comes wisdom...and the other guys do seem a lot more "functional" and productive, at least Slash, Duff and Matt. But Axl has to realize that his gravy train is going to run out...he is going to need to get butts into seats and sell albums if he wants to keep his train rolling...it can't be cheap to keep his large band and team on the payroll. Continued dumb moves are not going to help ticket or albums sales, assuming he delivers some new music...or help his credibility.

You talked about things "swirling" and I simply mentioned that questionable things have been linked to others besides Axl. Slash and Duff have produced more music than Axl but Velvet Revolver had its fair share of acrimony and ugliness, drug relapses etc with Slash declaring at the end that he was miserable in VR.

Axl works for his living singing his songs, if its a "gravy train" its one he fuels with some hard labour from himself and the rest of GN'R. He's done a rather successful run around the US recently with many good reviews specially from the fans and without too much drama and has tried to give his own position on things in a reasoned manner so credibility should benefit from those things. He's fine touring to smaller audiences than large reunion crowds because he's not interested in the complications involved in that. The ultimate dumb move may be to throw away his peace of mind in trying to please others for whom his only worth is in playing with people he has left behind in his past.

Whatever floats his boat I guess, but my point is, on his current path, his crowds and venues are going to keep getting smaller...and at some point his lineup will not be sustainable. He would need to do some damage control and deliver a killer album to turn things around, in my opinion. (Well, also promote said killer album!!)

Axl has said that they'll get a new album out when they can work things out with the record company etc. and it seems he also wants to include DJ in the album so that's going to require some time too. But its clear from his and DJ's comments that they are very aware of the need for a new album and do intend to release one ultimately.

If he was going to just settle to be a permanent touring band, he could just give the US up as a lost cause since the greatest opposition seems centered here. Instead this tour has involved a real effort to mend fences at home, with the great Philadelphia concert, consistent 3 hour shows and The Metal Show and LA Times interviews.

[rabia]

Whatever floats his boat I guess, but my point is, on his current path, his crowds and venues are going to keep getting smaller...and at some point his lineup will not be sustainable. He would need to do some damage control and deliver a killer album to turn things around, in my opinion. (Well, also promote said killer album!!)

...And you honestly think he never plans on doing this?

How long did he take for CD, and what promotion was done...as in interviews, videos, etc...the man is 50 and built his reputation on a screeching high range...that's not going to last forever. Honestly, I have

no idea what his plans are, I am just basing my opinions on some of the mind boggling decisions of the past...

I agree the lack of promotion was mind-boggling. No matter what irritation he had gone through in dealings with Universal, not getting out there to push the album left a void which got filled by the negative voices. A couple of music videos would certainly have helped matters too instead of people listening to old demo versions and live performances of varying quality on Youtube.

But like I said, he has made an effort since late 2009 not to go too long without re-appearing with more touring and its done on a large scale. If simply living off money made off touring indefinitely was his only goal, he could scale down and make much more money that way.

Edited April 20, 2012 by rabia

[Ace Nova]

lol...whatever Axl....pretty pathetic IMO, (I just found out he didn't attend) It wasn't just a slap in the face to Cleveland, it was a slap in the face to just about any fan that actually respected what the band did in the late 80's and early 90's...much more so than apparently Axl himself does nowadays....and then to go forth to say that he doesn't really know what the RRHOF is really about is even more ludicrous - it's not a conspiracy Axl, it's the hall of fame...

Edited April 28, 2012 by Kasanova King

[Damn_Smooth]

lol...whatever Axl....pretty pathetic IMO, (I just found out he didn't attend) It wasn't just a slap in the face to Cleveland, it was a slap in the face to just about any fan that actually respected what the band did in the late 80's and early 90's...much more so than apparently Axl himself does nowadays....and then to go forth to say that he doesn't really know what the RRHOF is really about is even more ludicrous - it's not a conspiracy Axl, it's the hall of fame...

So you didn't care enough to find out what happened until now but you're somehow deeply offended?

That makes a whole hell of a lot of sense. Not really.

[Ace Nova]

lol...whatever Axl....pretty pathetic IMO, (I just found out he didn't attend) It wasn't just a slap in the face to Cleveland, it was a slap in the face to just about any fan that actually respected what the band did in the late 80's and early 90's...much more so than apparently Axl himself does nowadays....and then to go forth to say that he doesn't really know what the RRHOF is really about is even more ludicrous - it's not a conspiracy Axl, it's the hall of fame...

So you didn't care enough to find out what happened until now but you're somehow deeply offended?

That makes a whole hell of a lot of sense. Not really.

I work close to 70 hours a week so no, I no longer have time to check the day to day events of the band....and no, I wasn't "deeply offended"...just rather "turned off"....and the more I think about it, the more I just realize that it's typical Axl, he's been doing stuff like this for the better part of the last 30 years.... so why change now?

[Damn_Smooth]

lol...whatever Axl....pretty pathetic IMO, (I just found out he didn't attend) It wasn't just a slap in the face to Cleveland, it was a slap in the face to just about any fan that actually respected what the band did in the late 80's and early 90's...much more so than apparently Axl himself does nowadays....and then to go forth to say that he doesn't really know what the RRHOF is really about is even more ludicrous - it's not a conspiracy Axl, it's the hall of fame...

So you didn't care enough to find out what happened until now but you're somehow deeply offended?

That makes a whole hell of a lot of sense. Not really.

I work close to 70 hours a week so no, I no longer have time to check the day to day events of the band....and no, I wasn't "deeply offended"...just rather "turned off"....and the more I think about it, the more I just realize that it's typical Axl, he's been doing stuff like this for the better part of the last 30 years.... so why change now?

That's cool. You should check out the performances if you haven't yet. I never have, and never will be, a fan of Myles, but Steven was awesome. I wish I could get the tracks with Myles edited out somehow, but if you like him, that would make it even better.

I never expected Axl to show, so that never really surprised me.

[sailaway]

This entire RRHOF is about one person:

Jann Wenner, the guy who founded ROLLING STONE magazine.

It's all about his posse and sycophants who polish his knob and slobber like Pavlov's dogs when he calls on the phone.

If you don't kneel at his alter then you don't get into his Hall Of Fame. Simple as that.

*It's not the Rock & Roll Hall Of Fame, it's the Museum Of Jann Wenner's Friends And Associates.*

Really. No sour grapes. What's more is the so-called "committee" that picks inductees (there is no public input or any stated criteria) doesn't have any musicians, just Wenner's friends, "rock critics"and people who write reviews,music critics and vermin.

It's all a big con by Wenner to make himself a reall playa in Rock & Roll and getting the suckers (fans)to pay for it.

Axl is crapping on the RnR HOF and I support him doing so, precisely because bands like Kiss and RUSH etc aren't in there.

"Do it for the fans"... THIS fan says I'm glad He didnt do it.

Well, if he came right out and said I don't give a crap about your award, I'm out here working it with my band, that would have been one thing. But it was more like he was trying to have it both ways, "sincerely" thanking the Hall and wishing them the best there at the end to show what a classy guy he is.

[moreblack]

because bands like Kiss and RUSH etc aren't in there.

to be fair, KISS only belongs in the makeup hall of fame.

[sailaway]

because bands like Kiss and RUSH etc aren't in there.

to be fair, KISS only belongs in the makeup hall of fame.

Funny Story:

When Alice Cooper was asked what he thought of Marilyn Manson,he replied "Hmm,A Guy with a girls name,wearing makeup,how unusual"

I like Rush,especially the Joshua Tree

[Caught in a Coma]

because bands like Kiss and RUSH etc aren't in there.

to be fair, KISS only belongs in the makeup hall of fame.

Funny Story:

When Alice Cooper was asked what he thought of Marilyn Manson,he replied "Hmm,A Guy with a girls name,wearing makeup,how unusual"

I like Rush,especially the Joshua Tree

The Joshua Tree is U2...

[sailaway]

because bands like Kiss and RUSH etc aren't in there.

to be fair, KISS only belongs in the makeup hall of fame.

Funny Story:

When Alice Cooper was asked what he thought of Marilyn Manson,he replied "Hmm,A Guy with a girls name,wearing makeup,how unusual"

I like Rush,especially the Joshua Tree

The Joshua Tree is U2...

That's what happens when u don't get enough sleep!

Shoulda said Limelight,trees,and YYZ

[dalsh327]

Look, you can defend Axl's decisions and career path all you want...yes, he is talented...but to dismiss/ignore the fact that he has obvious issues that at times border on lunacy is just plain stupid. He can do whatever he wants as long as he isn't hurting anyone, that's his right...but the all bootlickers trying to turn stupidity into brilliance is just insulting to ones intelligence...

Where did I claim that he has no issues or defend his entire career? Since you brought up intelligence, you may as well learn to read more successfully.

What I pointed out about Slash and Duff's legal moves is undeniable. It has nothing to do with "turning stupidity into brilliance" etc- its just the plain facts. If Axl acts to protect his business interests, he's a horrible shark of a man, if the others do it they're just acting rationally to protect themselves.

I wasn't referring to just you, but all of the Axl worshippers that endlessly defend every move the guy makes, including the HOF debacle. The plain fact, as you like to call it, is that Axl in a nut who continues to act in his own disinterest...which in turn, ends up frustrating a lot of fans who would like to see him succeed rather than shoot himself in the foot. But hey, I guess he doesn't owe us a happy ending...

Oh yeah, if somebody doesn't see Axl's refusal to show up at an award show as some horrifically cruel act of pure evil, it must be because they "worship" Axl. If somebody chooses to treat Slash as a human being rather than some beacon of holy light, sooner or later they'll be attacked for "worshiping" Axl.

Your definition of success may not be what Axl's looking for. As I said, its understandable that he has no appetite for even further complicated legal contracts with loopholes that can consume him forever and ever and a reunion is unlikely to come without this condition. That would be one way of shooting oneself in the foot. He seems happier with the current band that he did in the 90s. Maybe that's all that he's looking for.

I'm not talking about, nor have I mentioned Slash or the other guys...I don't really care about all of their differences and old history, I do know that with age usually comes wisdom...and the other guys do seem a lot more "functional" and productive, at least Slash, Duff and Matt. But Axl has to realize that his gravy train is going to run out...he is going to need to get butts into seats and sell albums if he wants to keep his train rolling...it can't be cheap to keep his large band and team on the payroll. Continued dumb moves are not going to help ticket or albums sales, assuming he delivers some new music...or help his credibility.

You talked about things "swirling" and I simply mentioned that questionable things have been linked to others besides Axl. Slash and Duff have produced more music than Axl but Velvet Revolver had its fair share of acrimony and ugliness, drug relapses etc with Slash declaring at the end that he was miserable in VR.

Axl works for his living singing his songs, if its a "gravy train" its one he fuels with some hard labour from himself and the rest of GN'R. He's done a rather successful run around the US recently with many good reviews specially from the fans and without too much drama and has tried to give his own position on things in a reasoned manner so credibility should benefit from those things. He's fine touring to smaller audiences than large reunion crowds because he's not interested in the complications involved in that. The ultimate dumb move may be to throw away his peace of mind in trying to please others for whom his only worth is in playing with people he has left behind in his past.

Whatever floats his boat I guess, but my point is, on his current path, his crowds and venues are going to keep getting smaller...and at some point his lineup will not be sustainable. He would need to do some damage control and deliver a killer album to turn things around, in my opinion. (Well, also promote said killer album!!)

Billy Joel hasn't put new music out in close to twenty years. It doesn't stop people from going to see him. If Axl goes off the road for a couple of years, the demand to see him in 2 years' time will go up. I just think he returned too soon to the LA and NY areas. People still went to go see them and the band still made money off of UCAP.

What might happen is if the crowd diminishes, he might just do one festival show a year and a small handful of shows. The back catalog is still lucrative. But you also have to take into account in order to record new music, the money has to come from somewhere, unless he's having the band produce, engineer, and do the artwork for it. There's no denying they can do it.

Even if he did go back in the studio with the band and recorded new music, is it worth working on it and settling for breaking even? There's no real encouragement for him to do it, except from the people who want more new music. It's kind of heartbreaking for a band to put new music out and no one listens to it except a handful of critics and hardcore fans. And to go from 100 million copies of your work sold, to struggling to sell 100,000?

That's why GnR's better off releasing a song here and there, just to have something new for the fans, instead of trying to push 14-50 songs out all at once. At least with one or two new songs, it will be a good gauge on working more on new music, or just book more dates in the cities where the demand was highest.

[The Archer]

Whatever floats his boat I guess, but my point is, on his current path, his crowds and venues are going to keep getting smaller...and at some point his lineup will not be sustainable. He would need to do some damage control and deliver a killer album to turn things around, in my opinion. (Well, also promote said killer album!!)

News for you - there are parts of the world where Axl still pulls in 50000 people without breaking a sweat.

There are parts of the world where he STILL hasn't toured yet, where he could easily pull in those many any time he wanted.

Your point about a killer album(s) being necessary for continued touring success is valid, if at all, only for North America.

[Chris 55]

Your point about a killer album(s) being necessary for continued touring success is valid, if at all, only for North America.

It kinda sucks if you can't be a success in your own country

Edited May 4, 2012 by Chris 55

[Flayer]

Your point about a killer album(s) being necessary for continued touring success is valid, if at all, only for North America.

It kinda sucks if you can't be a success in your own country

He should start wearing a Brazilian flag cape

[SoulMonster]

It kinda sucks if you can't be a success in your own country

Why?