Why the record industry couldn't let new GN'R succeed

[11dayempire]

We've all heard the spiel about "managers trying to force GN'R to reform" over promoting the new band, particularly during the 2002-2010 era. I'd never really thought about why, but this article makes a good fist of explaining it:

http://www.classicrockmagazine.com/features/storms-last-stand/

Specifically, this bit:

There was a power shift from record companies to promoters and agents. In 2002 David Bowie announced that he was to perform his classic album Low in its entirety at London’s Royal Festival Hall. (“Hang on,” double-checked a cynical audience: “You’re definitely not going to play any of your new album? Really? And none of that Tin Machine guff? Ok then, I’m in!”) Acts with a similar pedigree who previously had thought that they had to release a new album in order to tour, embraced a new nothing-but-the-hits/your-favourite-album-in-full touring model. Promoters, fed-up of losing small fortunes on hot, hyped young acts with no audience, smelled money. The new law: any band that can reform, will.

[DR DOOM]

Tin Machine cops a lot more flak than it deserves, and mostly by people who have never even heard Tin Machine's albums.

Bowie's 2002 album (Heathen) is really fucking good too.

Storm (RIP) was the king of album covers, no question.

I thought it was Slash's fault new GNR didn't succeed?

Phew, Im glad it wasn't Axl's fault

[wasted]

Obviously if it was then no reunion. It took til 2008 for them to really accept it was never going to happen.

[magisme]

Every excuse in the book from you fuckers. Keep it up. It's good for a laugh.

[AndreCC]

New GNR was a joke from the start.

Even befofe it started... you didn't even know if Slash was still in or was already out. A statement came out 1 year later from Axl stating Slash was out. (it takes a year to write a statement? really?? i wonder why Chinese took so long to make)

Then once that was cleared out... Axl couldn't find the right players...He made a song 3 years later (Oh My God) on a big movie soundtrack (whether the movie was good or not, it had a lot of press, and it had Arnold Shwarzenegger, which is huge), and he fucking presents the movie with slimy unfinished demo...(Yes he actually confirmed it was a demo 9 years later).

Obviously the demo didn't do justice to Axl's new project and considering some of the players on that song were not in the band anymore (i think that's pretty ridiculous, no matter of how it happened). So the first impression was already ruined with all of that!

Then comes Las Vegas and Rock In Rio gig out of the blue and 2 years later?! (sure they were recording their 15 years album).

Then as good as he is, how can you take a guitar player with a kfc bucket on his head and a fucking delusional and twisted mind seriously?...Especially in GNR...

Nobody took it seriously in 2002... let alone now after so many years of silence and failed promises and failed projects, and failed cds...

[Flayer]

Can we make some sort of compromise? I'll stop pretending New GNR could have been a big hit if y'all stop pretending End of Days was a big hit.

[DR DOOM]

"YOURÉ A CHOIRBOY, A FUCKING CHOIRBOY!"

[Graeme]

Does it not annoy anyone else that any manager (excluding probably Merck who was just a bit rubbish) that took the GNR job did so with the ulterior motive of trying to force a reunion rather than just taking on the band as it was and doing their fucking job. If that had been the case, if the industry had actually supported Axl then the current band might be in a much better, more productive place right now, the Chinese Democracy tour might not have started over a year after the album's release, Axl might be in a better place mentally and more open to staying proactive. We might have a different management structure at the moment to the current one which seems to piss so many people off.

I realise this won't make much impact on the "Hurrdurr NuGunsSucks" morons (which, unfortunately the music industry must be full of), but surely the reasonable people out there can agree with this?

[classicrawker]

Does it not annoy anyone else that any manager (excluding probably Merck who was just a bit rubbish) that took the GNR job did so with the ulterior motive of trying to force a reunion rather than just taking on the band as it was and doing their fucking job. If that had been the case, if the industry had actually supported Axl then the current band might be in a much better, more productive place right now, the Chinese Democracy tour might not have started over a year after the album's release, Axl might be in a better place mentally and more open to staying proactive. We might have a different management structure at the moment to the current one which seems to piss so many people off.

I realise this won't make much impact on the "Hurrdurr NuGunsSucks" morons (which, unfortunately the music industry must be full of), but surely the reasonable people out there can agree with this?

What other NuGnR Manager's tried to force a reunion on Axl other than allegedly Azoff?

What amazes me is people always look to blame somebody else for Axl's failures............ Alan Niven figured it long ago when he stated "it is never Axl's fault"

[magisme]

Axl burns bridge after bridge, takes 14 years to "complete" and album that he promised to have out in, what, 1999, then releases said album with a bunch of songs that no one gives a shit about and that even a good percentage of the hard cores thinks are trash, disappears after the release like a child running to his room to hide, comes out of hiding with like 2 shows dedicated to the new album and then reverts to full on nostalgia mode, shows no consideration for the few million of us who bother to pay attention to his washed up ass anymore, and yet we still have a contingent obsessed with unmercifully twisting logic and good sense in order to pretend that Axl shouldn't shoulder an overwhelming lion's share of the blame for what Nu has become?

Fuck that.

[EvH]

The "OMG was a demo" excuse is a fucking joke.

[Flayer]

Going so far as to say that the record industry sabotaged the release is very improbable.

It's not so implausible, though, to say that the record got neglected. If the label was really intent on making it big, they could have done a hell of a lot more to build hype and make it huge. Axl may have been able to get the label to do more for the release if he'd been more cooperative, finished it sooner, etc.

But probably, the label realized that the market as a whole didn't care much for an 80s band comeback album, so they didn't bother putting the extra effort and resources into pushing it, especially after they'd already thrown so much money into the production.

They didn't really take it that seriously. They didn't take it serious enough to really push it or to intentionally sabotage it.

[SunnyDRE]

They had a guy in the band who wore a bucket on his head, and spent all day masturbating in a chicken coop...

Do I really need to say anything else.

[Apollo]

Somehow many other bands were and are able to succeed and overcome the pitfalls that have ravished Axl. Weird.

[wasted]

I the Don Mcgee tried then there was the manager before Beta. Merck at least believed in the band at some point.

I think it was pretty hard to do what Axl wanted to do. In the end he just wanted to make a record. But to the industry or the public its like you tried to murder Slash.

[classicrawker]

Going so far as to say that the record industry sabotaged the release is very improbable.

It's not so implausible, though, to say that the record got neglected. If the label was really intent on making it big, they could have done a hell of a lot more to build hype and make it huge. Axl may have been able to get the label to do more for the release if he'd been more cooperative, finished it sooner, etc.

But probably, the label realized that the market as a whole didn't care much for an 80s band comeback album, so they didn't bother putting the extra effort and resources into pushing it, especially after they'd already thrown so much money into the production.

They didn't really take it that seriously. They didn't take it serious enough to really push it or to intentionally sabotage it.

The record company invested 14 million into the making of ChiDem...does it make any sense they would sabotage it while continuing to fund it?

[wfuckinga]

The "OMG was a demo" excuse is a fucking joke.

OMG was a fucking amazing song, and I'll never understand the reasoning behind saying it was a demo. I listen to the song everyday, the EODST version and RIR 01 version. It's a great song. I've always loved the OMG/Silkworms/Riad sound.

[classicrawker]

I the Don Mcgee tried then there was the manager before Beta. Merck at least believed in the band at some point.

I think it was pretty hard to do what Axl wanted to do. In the end he just wanted to make a record. But to the industry or the public its like you tried to murder Slash.

I the Don Mcgee tried then there was the manager before Beta. Merck at least believed in the band at some point.

I think it was pretty hard to do what Axl wanted to do. In the end he just wanted to make a record. But to the industry or the public its like you tried to murder Slash.

The record label sunk 13-14 million into the making of ChDem so I would say they supported Axl until they finally had a enough and threatened to pull the plug. If you read the timeline and quotes of people who worked on the album in Chinese Whispers Axl would spend long stretches where he would not even show up to the studio while the $$$ clock was ticking and had hundreds of thousands of $$$ in rented gear collecting dust on the labels dime so it is rather absurd to claim everyone was conspiring to keep Axl down..............

Edited October 4, 2013 by classicrawker

[rockerman]

Somehow many other bands were and are able to succeed and overcome the pitfalls that have ravished Axl. Weird.

But they worked thier ass off to do that. They recorded and toured and were visible on the scene.

[Apollo]

I the Don Mcgee tried then there was the manager before Beta. Merck at least believed in the band at some point.

I think it was pretty hard to do what Axl wanted to do. In the end he just wanted to make a record. But to the industry or the public its like you tried to murder Slash.

I the Don Mcgee tried then there was the manager before Beta. Merck at least believed in the band at some point.

I think it was pretty hard to do what Axl wanted to do. In the end he just wanted to make a record. But to the industry or the public its like you tried to murder Slash.

The record label sunk 13-14 million into the making of ChDem so I would say they supported Axl until they finally had a enough and threatened to pull the plug. If you read the timeline and quotes of people who worked on the album in Chinese Whispers Axl would spend long stretches where he would not even show up to the studio while the $$$ clock was ticking and had hundreds of thousands of $$$ in rented gear collecting dust on the labels dime so it is rather absurd to claim everyone was conspiring to keep Axl down..............

A great point that these people always overlook.

The "EVIL" label only gave Axl 14 million dollars and 13 years..........how could ANY band be forced to work with those shackles????

[WhazUp]

If record labels see an opportunity to make money they will support whatever that is, and from my perspective I would argue that they thought GNR would have some success with new material considering how much money they poured into the GNR machine and the making of Chinese Democracy and yet here we are with one album out that sold moderately well (not amazingly well) and GNR is still nowhere close to the moneymakers that they were back in the day.

The old band just has a better appeal to a wider range audience, you can't really get around that point. Regardless of whether it is counterproductive or not by trying to get Axl to reunite, it isn't totally unprecedented from my perspective. After all labels are businesses that go after what benefits them

So all in all considering how much money they poured into newGNR it isn't so much that they couldn't let them succeed but that they realized what newGNR is doing simply just isn't taking the world by the storm as much as they would like

Edited October 4, 2013 by WhazUp

[Apollo]

And the label promoted the heck out of the album until Axl refused to do his end. So this "the label didn't support or promote the album" nonsense is pure nonsense.

[volcano62]

And the label promoted the heck out of the album until Axl refused to do his end. So this "the label didn't support or promote the album" nonsense is pure nonsense.

Labels show support with proper air play, to the point of shoving it down our throats.

[DR DOOM]

Artists get out and promote their album

[Apollo]

And the label promoted the heck out of the album until Axl refused to do his end. So this "the label didn't support or promote the album" nonsense is pure nonsense.

Labels show support with proper air play, to the point of shoving it down our throats.

So labels control how often radio stations play songs?

Here is what the label did for CD

14 million dollars

Waited 13 years for it

Before it's release took out nation wide tv commerical air time, put advertisements in newspapers and magazines.

And on a side note............the most "anticipated album of all time"...........the myspace thing got like 15 million listens............do you really think that there were people out there who would want a GnR album that didn't know CD was released???

This isn't 1975. This is the age of the internet. If Axl farts, people know about it. But you guys are implying that millions of people didn't know about CD. And still don't know to this day. See how ridiculous that sounds?

I don't get all the excuses and blame game. Just because Axl always blames everybody else for his failures doesn't mean that his fans should to.

Axl put out a great album that 3.5 million people purchased. A lot of Axl fans loved it, but the general rock audience didn't really care for it. I loved the album and couldn't care less if 18 people bought it or if it sold 34 million copies. You guys always cry that sales totals don't matter..........but then you freak out about CD not selling enough!!!