Chinese Democracy may become the most underrated album in history.

[wasted]

The gods are ready to obey.

[wkuk04]

CD will be regarded as a classic in time to come.

[Nosaj Thing]

CD is a terrible album, nobody will listen to it in 20 years.

[BetterDay7]

I think Chinese Democracy a complete and utter masterpiece. Without a doubt, the greatest album of the 2000's and certainly the most underrated album of the 2000's. To me, its the last real rock n roll masterpiece. No other artist will ever have the clout or be given the leeway to even attempt an undertaking the scope of Chinese Democracy. People complain about the production, but I think that is one of its strengths- the time it took to record, the layers of sound, and plethora of musicians involved- all contributed to the epic, grandiose feel of the album. The musicianship is first rate and the lyrics are authentically autobiographical. CD is about coming to terms with pain, loss, betrayal, and finding a way to rise above, overcome, and forge ahead. It's intense, intelligent, and romantically stimulating in both a literal and figurative sense.

Yes, I'm an Axl fanatic, but its Chinese Democracy that made me that way. I grew up with GNR, but was always more into the alternative/indie scene back then- Nirvana, Pearl Jam, AiC, Sonic Youth, Neil Young, Pixies, NIN, etc. When I was younger I thought GNR was too cartoonish for my taste, but CD made me reevaluate and appreciate the entire catalog. Now I love the entire anthology, but its Chinese Democracy that really drew me in enough to get past the misconstrued images of Axl/GNR and appreciate the music for what it is. I think most people's misperceptions are already too constructed to let them make an objective, unbiased evaluation of the album. As someone else said, the songs are pretty bulletproof. You can tell someone really cared for and pored over the material and took the time to perfect all the elements of each song down to the finest details. As I mentioned previously, I feel like that is CD's strength, not its weakness.

well said.

To me Chinese Democracy reminds me a little of Kate Bush’s album, The Dreaming. Chinese Democracy is more accessible than The Dreaming though. That [Dreaming] was slated at the time yet is now seen as daring, experimental and a classic, although not by huge swathes of people. It was CD that made me revise my thinking and come to the conclusion that Axl is probably a genius musician.

[BetterDay7]

Laundry Service was critically acclaimed at the time, commercially successful and is still widely regarded by fans and laymen alike. I do not see as many claims for CD on those three accounts.

Lets be blunt, no one has a good word for Chi Dem except GnR fanatics. And I do mean fanatics, a great portion of even GnR fans think it's a load of bollocks. It truly is a case of what Kurt Cobain once said in the song Aero Zeppelin, 'you could shit upon the stage, they'll be fans'...and thats what it is i think.

It's the same with art or music or films, whenever someones a fanatic of something, say for instance, i dunno, someones a Marlon Brando fanatic. You have the bona fide strokes of genius in Streetcar, Waterfront etc etc, the ones well all know...but i bet you any money you go on a Brando fansite or message board and they'll be people there claiming The Island of Dr Moreau to be a fuckin' earth shattering performance...and it's just not and only is if you are blindly in love with the man.

Now I'm the biggest Brando fan i know but i think it's a terrible disservice both to your own intellect and to the actual work of 'x' artist to just say EVERYTHING they did is brilliant, because it sort of detracts from what they did do that actually was brilliant because you are painting all of it with the same brush. Also, you might reccomend ALL that persons shit and the person you're reccomending it too picks one of the crap ones first and you've just basically lost someone who might've appreciated it and thats always a big thing with me, reccomending people stuff and then them liking it, i don't know why, i guess it's just like a cool thing shared y'know?

'It's a very creative album', what in Gods name is that supposed to mean anyway?!?

Mmm... G n' R fanatics. That's interesting cos I see it differently - in my case anyway.

I've come to the G n R back catalogue late in life (put it this way, me and Duff could have gone to the same elementary school, age-wise.) I love G n R now (wasn't fussed in the 80s) but I'm not a fanatic.

I came to CD thinking, 'Well, suppose I'd better buy this one too... though people say it's fifty shades of s***e.' I stuck it on and I was only half listening when I suddenly thought... 'What's all this then? This sounds okay. I thought it was meant to be rubbish... I'll just give it another go...' And that was it. Fell in love with the album.

[PirateRadio]

It could have been great. But several things had to take place that Axl apparently refused or couldn't pull off - keep Slash or find a sustainable acceptable replacement in all fans' eyes, release it on time, promote and tour it properly, not wear jersey's or look 'weird', and not over produce it.

Keeping Slash was the key if he was hell-bent on keep the name. Keeping it was in the best interest of Axl, not GNR.

Everything that's wrong with the ChiDem era is found in the OP video. CD could have been a fantastic song. But for me, the grity vocals do not match up with the shredder clean guitar parts. I completely understand the perscpective of - who is even playing the guitar parts?? Back in the day, the answer was always, "Slash." And if you found out that Izzy was highlighted, it was cool to know, and you felt more like a GNR superfan. Fink was a freak, and Buckethead wore a bucket on his head. I mean...really, Axl??? I understand that Slash didn't want to move in a similar musical direction as Axl, and that's Slash's fault. Axl had some really fresh ideas and I think he could've made it work. But he didn't find a Slash that people took to. He ended up with other bands' guitar players, and probably should've found a guy that was unknown who could blow everyone away with his personality, stage presence, and ability. He needed a 1985 version of Slash that was closer in age to 1999 Axl Rose. He needed Jesus.

[Apollo]

I think CD is the most underrated rock album of the last 20 years.

But I understand that is a personal preference and my own opinion and that in terms of world wide perception, most people don't agree.

I don't think it will be considered one of the most underrated albums of all time. But I bet a decade from now people might look back and say "you know, this album is better than I thought"

[wasted]

If you like the album you're a fanatic. Has the makings of a cult classic. Join my dojo. Assume the Axl time position.

Edited April 13, 2015 by wasted

[DieselDaisy]

It is a shitty record which will be still a shitty record in 20 years. Nobody likes Korn now. Nobody will like Korn in 2035.

[wasted]

It is a shitty record which will be still a shitty record in 20 years. Nobody likes Korn now. Nobody will like Korn in 2035.

Korn sold a huge amount of records and basically invented Nu metal if you overlook the Faith no More influence.

[DieselDaisy]

It is a shitty record which will be still a shitty record in 20 years. Nobody likes Korn now. Nobody will like Korn in 2035.

Korn sold a huge amount of records and basically invented Nu metal if you overlook the Faith no More influence.

Your words!

[wkuk04]

It is a shitty record which will be still a shitty record in 20 years. Nobody likes Korn now. Nobody will like Korn in 2035.

I've never personally made the connection between Korn & Guns N' Roses.

[wasted]

It is a shitty record which will be still a shitty record in 20 years. Nobody likes Korn now. Nobody will like Korn in 2035.

Korn sold a huge amount of records and basically invented Nu metal if you overlook the Faith no More influence.

Your words!

?

Korns debut is when the term nu metal was first uttered. Ross Robinson etc.

They sold a lot of records in 90s. 35 million records worldwide, Follow the Leader, Issues Billboard no 1s. Untouchables pretty big too. I think they have 10 albums that enter top 10 Billboard. So nobody listens to them seems a bit harsh.

When I listen to Got the Life it sounds a lot like Shacklers in a way.

Edited April 13, 2015 by wasted

[wasted]

It is a shitty record which will be still a shitty record in 20 years. Nobody likes Korn now. Nobody will like Korn in 2035.

I've never personally made the connection between Korn & Guns N' Roses.

Only Shacklers for me as some element of Korn.

[wkuk04]

It is a shitty record which will be still a shitty record in 20 years. Nobody likes Korn now. Nobody will like Korn in 2035.

I've never personally made the connection between Korn & Guns N' Roses.

Only Shacklers for me as some element of Korn.

Yeah, I can hear that. I love SR.

[wasted]

But the whole album sounding like Korn isn't even close to being true.

[DieselDaisy]

It is a shitty record which will be still a shitty record in 20 years. Nobody likes Korn now. Nobody will like Korn in 2035.

Korn sold a huge amount of records and basically invented Nu metal if you overlook the Faith no More influence.

Your words!

?

Korns debut is when the term nu metal was first uttered. Ross Robinson etc.

They sold a lot of records in 90s. 35 million records worldwide, Follow the Leader, Issues Billboard no 1s. Untouchables pretty big too. I think they have 10 albums that enter top 10 Billboard. So nobody listens to them seems a bit harsh.

When I listen to Got the Life it sounds a lot like Shacklers in a way.

Not Got the Life. Good God. Exact same riff.

Korn's debut instigated the worst musical trend in music history. Again, your words.

[wasted]

It is a shitty record which will be still a shitty record in 20 years. Nobody likes Korn now. Nobody will like Korn in 2035.

Korn sold a huge amount of records and basically invented Nu metal if you overlook the Faith no More influence.

Your words!

?

Korns debut is when the term nu metal was first uttered. Ross Robinson etc.

They sold a lot of records in 90s. 35 million records worldwide, Follow the Leader, Issues Billboard no 1s. Untouchables pretty big too. I think they have 10 albums that enter top 10 Billboard. So nobody listens to them seems a bit harsh.

When I listen to Got the Life it sounds a lot like Shacklers in a way.

Not Got the Life. Good God. Exact same riff.

Korn's debut instigated the worst musical trend in music history. Again, your words.

I'm not sure if that is true, it's like a scene thing it never holds true. But that term was bandied around them. That's where it oriented in a Korn review.

Whether its good or you like it. I'm not huge Korn fan. But there's something in the sound also the drummer and bassist are monsters. It's a bit awarkward for me tho, especially lyrically. Did My Time is one I like. It's a different angle on rock.

[DieselDaisy]

Exact same riff in both songs,

0:02+

0:00+

[wasted]

That's where I hear that backwards riff. But it's not specific to that Korn song it's in every song or those bands. Maybe some else knows more, Slash called it guitars through a sausage grinder. It was a trend I think. Why Bucket is playing those kind of riffs in GNR. But it's like an 80s horror movie vibe mixed with Double talking jive meets Locomotive.

Edited April 13, 2015 by wasted

[DieselDaisy]

It is the exact same riff, note for note.

[wasted]

Ive being saying this for 7 years, nobody listens, theres is no god. Bucket does a lot of those kind of riffs. Axl is good at stealing stuff. Emotional Rescue has the lyrics You could be Mine at the end.

Edited April 13, 2015 by wasted

[Iron MikeyJ]

Gnr always stole things, or you could say "influenced by" I suppose. I mean it's not out right thievery, like go to court type stuff, But you can draw some real serious comparisons if you look hard enough.

One I came upon about a year ago, that many folks on here argued with me about was Double Talkin Jive. I learned the main riff to dtj many years ago on guitar. Well about a year and half ago, my old band wanted to play oh well by Peter Greens Fleetwood Mac, so I learned that song. Well the riffs in the two songs are very similiar, not identical, but very close. The Fleetwood Mac riff is actually the far more intricate and challenging of the two, dtj is almost like the cliff notes version. But I think we are fooling our selves if we don't admit that Izzy was probably playing Oh Well one day at band practice, and the band really got off on it. So they simplified it and made their own song out of it. Which happens a lot in rock history, its no secret. Am I saying it was a conscious effort to rip off Fleetwood Mac? No. I bet only Izzy knew what they were playing, the rest of the guys probably just thought it was his own riff. Then once you change it up some, it is your own. But the skeleton to Oh Well is still there.

Edited April 13, 2015 by Iron MikeyJ

[Len Cnut]

The 'where do we go now' refrain in SCOM is taken from a song by Jimmy Walker called Where Do We Go From Here? At the bit where the lyrics go 'hooray for the men of vision, may they never disappear, who leave us to ask the question where do we go, where do we go, where do we go from here?' at which point the back singers are going 'where do we go now, where do we go now, where do we go from here?' Good chance Axls heard it too cuz the song was in the soundtrack to Vanishing Point, which he quotes on Breakdown.

Edited April 13, 2015 by Len B'stard

[Iron MikeyJ]

That's why I always find it funny when folks on here start ragging on Zeppelin, saying "they stole this, they ripped off that, they stole every hit they had, blah, blah, blah". You know what separates Zeppelin's thievery from every other rock band? They got caught. Plain and simple. Zeppelin were way more unashamed and in your face about what they took, all other bands really try hard to hide it. But I'm telling you 99% of all rock and roll bands and artists stole something throughout their careers.