Album speculation Guys let's all

[John Bonham]

Losers gonna lose

[Dazey]

CD 2 would be similiar to CD but like all sequels inferior to the original.

No.

Star Wars The Empire Strikes Back is better than the original.

Terminator 2: Judgement Day is better than the original.

The Dark Knight is better than the original.

Mad Max 2 is better than the original.

The Lord of the Rings: The Return of the King is better than the original.

The Godfather Part II is on the same caliber if not slightly better than the original.

Aliens is on the same caliber if not slightly better than the original.

Chinese Democracy 2 will be worse than the original, though.

Terminator 2 is not better than the original!

[Amir]

CD 2 would be similiar to CD but like all sequels inferior to the original.

No.

Star Wars The Empire Strikes Back is better than the original.

Terminator 2: Judgement Day is better than the original.

The Dark Knight is better than the original.

Mad Max 2 is better than the original.

The Lord of the Rings: The Return of the King is better than the original.

The Godfather Part II is on the same caliber if not slightly better than the original.

Aliens is on the same caliber if not slightly better than the original.

Chinese Democracy 2 will be worse than the original, though.

Terminator 2 is not better than the original!

Greatest scene from the whole series:

[RandallFlagg]

CD is a great album imo, yeah doesn't really reflect the money and time and personnel spent on it, but it's a hell of a record when you consider where Axl came from whilst composing it. Nothing groundbreaking or particularly innovative but the diversity and quality of each track is wondrous and his vocals are killer as you'd expect. Scraped is a bit dodgy and the lyrics are nowhere near as good as his old stuff but they're the only gripes I got. I spin it at least once a month and am still appreciating things, the riffs are focused on less but the solos and songwriting is high quality stuff, the rockers are a lot weaker than old GNR but it makes up for it with the out there stuff. It ISN'T as ambitious as the old days but this is a wiser and more vulnerable man, it's more compact and precise than raw and meandering,

Something like Shackler's is simple enough but I've never heard something so disco yet dark. Sorry is gloriously gloomy, Catcher is schizo genius and really beautiful, Better goes all over the show, Prostitute cathartic acid with a coating of deceptive sugar, TWAT is unreal when it gets going, Riad is bizarre but catchy as heck, SOD could almost fit on UYI, If The World comes out of nowhere and rockets off on some crazy ass soul groove escapade... the variation is a joy to behold. There is a distinct lack of cohesion but we must remember Axl didn't really trust anyone whilst conjuring it up, with the band he has now there'd be a more glued together and structured effort but it seems he still don't trust anyone even if they've done him justice on the stage for years now.

[tinyrobot]

I'm pretty sure the entire community has given him more money via concerts worldwide than that lol. Axl will do what he wants, when he wants to do it and it's been that way since high school. Why some of you think this is something new is beyond me.

hey, are you Combos from Gnronline.com?

[Rovim]

Axl wanted everyone to call him a genius for CD. When most people laughed at him or ignored him instead, the door was slammed shut on new music. It's much easier for Axl to have sycophants tell him he has 41 albums worth of incredible material in the vault than it is to have the public tell him he's washed up and finished.

But isn't that just an assumption on your part? A pretty wild one too imo. There is no evidence to support Axl wanted everyone to call him a genius for CD. He talked about it being "just an album" and not trying to make a masterpiece. I have no reason to believe he lied to us when he said that.

I really have to defend the position that Axl wanted CD to be a masterpiece?

lol "Axl said...."

Yeah, actually you do, cause you don't have anything to support your claim. "Axl is crazy, Axl is a liar" is not going to cut it. He never claimed to be a genius, and denied what you said about him wanting Chinese to be a masterpiece. I guess I believe him and you don't.

[Intercourse]

Axl wanted everyone to call him a genius for CD. When most people laughed at him or ignored him instead, the door was slammed shut on new music. It's much easier for Axl to have sycophants tell him he has 41 albums worth of incredible material in the vault than it is to have the public tell him he's washed up and finished.

But isn't that just an assumption on your part? A pretty wild one too imo. There is no evidence to support Axl wanted everyone to call him a genius for CD. He talked about it being "just an album" and not trying to make a masterpiece. I have no reason to believe he lied to us when he said that.

I really have to defend the position that Axl wanted CD to be a masterpiece?

lol "Axl said...."

Yeah, actually you do, cause you don't have anything to support your claim. "Axl is crazy, Axl is a liar" is not going to cut it. He never claimed to be a genius, and denied what you said about him wanting Chinese to be a masterpiece. I guess I believe him and you don't.

So what do you think is going on then? Axl just doesn't fancy releasing anything?

He wanted to bury the old band, especially Slash. He spent 15 years furiously tinkering with a bunch of tunes over and over...all of that is well documented.

Why bother? Because he wanted to show that "Axl IS Guns N Roses". He made that assertion to Matt when he fired him and he had Goldstein peddling that message for the longest time.

CD has come and gone...I don't think Axl could believe that happened. There was talk of a re-release 3 years after the fact. What does that tell you? It says that the CEO still believed that Joe Public had missed the point of CD and that he was going to try to get them to unmiss it. Most sane people couldn't believe this re-release strategy.

So, while Axl may not have flat out defined himself as a "genius", his intentions around CD show he certainly believed he deserved alot more public love and acknowledgement for his opus.

So..studying Axl's form for the last 25 years, rejection = big hurt = big withdrawl. As Mags said, its far easier to have Asshat the pretend guitar player, Seb Bach and the Lebis crew tell him he's an awesome talent than actually growing a set and putting more tunes out there and taking the public view on the chin.

[Rovim]

Axl wanted everyone to call him a genius for CD. When most people laughed at him or ignored him instead, the door was slammed shut on new music. It's much easier for Axl to have sycophants tell him he has 41 albums worth of incredible material in the vault than it is to have the public tell him he's washed up and finished.

But isn't that just an assumption on your part? A pretty wild one too imo. There is no evidence to support Axl wanted everyone to call him a genius for CD. He talked about it being "just an album" and not trying to make a masterpiece. I have no reason to believe he lied to us when he said that.

I really have to defend the position that Axl wanted CD to be a masterpiece?

lol "Axl said...."

Yeah, actually you do, cause you don't have anything to support your claim. "Axl is crazy, Axl is a liar" is not going to cut it. He never claimed to be a genius, and denied what you said about him wanting Chinese to be a masterpiece. I guess I believe him and you don't.

So what do you think is going on then? Axl just doesn't fancy releasing anything?

He wanted to bury the old band, especially Slash. He spent 15 years furiously tinkering with a bunch of tunes over and over...all of that is well documented.

Why bother? Because he wanted to show that "Axl IS Guns N Roses". He made that assertion to Matt when he fired him and he had Goldstein peddling that message for the longest time.

CD has come and gone...I don't think Axl could believe that happened. There was talk of a re-release 3 years after the fact. What does that tell you? It says that the CEO still believed that Joe Public had missed the point of CD and that he was going to try to get them to unmiss it. Most sane people couldn't believe this re-release strategy.

So, while Axl may not have flat out defined himself as a "genius", his intentions around CD show he certainly believed he deserved alot more public love and acknowledgement for his opus.

So..studying Axl's form for the last 25 years, rejection = big hurt = big withdrawl. As Mags said, its far easier to have Asshat the pretend guitar player, Seb Bach and the Lebis crew tell him he's an awesome talent than actually growing a set and putting more tunes out there and taking the public view on the chin.

Axl is insecure artistically. He cares a lot about what others think of him and Tommy said that about him too.

I'm sure he wanted to prove everyone wrong, and that he didn't need the old line up to make a Guns album, but when you're finally free to dictate the entire artistic direction, and you have no budget constrictions, it's hard not to use all of that as a musician.

His intention around Chinese clearly show that he wanted to make this album no matter what, and that he was deeply connected to the material emotionally, and of course he wanted it to do well.

Releasing one album in 20 years is a symptom of being insecure as an artist and stubborn. He was always like that. He didn't want to release UYI in 1991 as well.

The "I am Guns N' Roses" thing could mean it was just another way of him to say he didn't need the old guys just to keep Gn'R alive.

Years later he said: "I don't excatly know what Gn'R is". That was after a lot of line up changes, so my guess is now he kinda sees it as he's the core of the band and everything revolves around him, but as long as he's still the leader of Gn'R, it will still at least exist as his artistic outlet. It's his band. That's how he sees it imo.

Edited May 13, 2014 by Rovim

[Broskirose]

Despite my previous post in this thread, if I'm being totally honesty I'd probably lay down a hundred or so it if meant I was guaranteed new music.

[wasted]

CD is a great album imo, yeah doesn't really reflect the money and time and personnel spent on it, but it's a hell of a record when you consider where Axl came from whilst composing it. Nothing groundbreaking or particularly innovative but the diversity and quality of each track is wondrous and his vocals are killer as you'd expect. Scraped is a bit dodgy and the lyrics are nowhere near as good as his old stuff but they're the only gripes I got. I spin it at least once a month and am still appreciating things, the riffs are focused on less but the solos and songwriting is high quality stuff, the rockers are a lot weaker than old GNR but it makes up for it with the out there stuff. It ISN'T as ambitious as the old days but this is a wiser and more vulnerable man, it's more compact and precise than raw and meandering,

Something like Shackler's is simple enough but I've never heard something so disco yet dark. Sorry is gloriously gloomy, Catcher is schizo genius and really beautiful, Better goes all over the show, Prostitute cathartic acid with a coating of deceptive sugar, TWAT is unreal when it gets going, Riad is bizarre but catchy as heck, SOD could almost fit on UYI, If The World comes out of nowhere and rockets off on some crazy ass soul groove escapade... the variation is a joy to behold. There is a distinct lack of cohesion but we must remember Axl didn't really trust anyone whilst conjuring it up, with the band he has now there'd be a more glued together and structured effort but it seems he still don't trust anyone even if they've done him justice on the stage for years now.

I feel like the 1st side is pretty cohesive. Side 2 is more UYI II - esque, it has highs and lows but is more experimental. Scraped, Sorry, maybe even Madagascar seem to be the 4th dimension of the album.

[wasted]

the question is would they have been better off whipping off the Snakepit record as the next GNR album and using the 14 million dollars for 3 big budget videos?

Edited May 13, 2014 by wasted

[magisme]

Axl wanted everyone to call him a genius for CD. When most people laughed at him or ignored him instead, the door was slammed shut on new music. It's much easier for Axl to have sycophants tell him he has 41 albums worth of incredible material in the vault than it is to have the public tell him he's washed up and finished.

But isn't that just an assumption on your part? A pretty wild one too imo. There is no evidence to support Axl wanted everyone to call him a genius for CD. He talked about it being "just an album" and not trying to make a masterpiece. I have no reason to believe he lied to us when he said that.

I really have to defend the position that Axl wanted CD to be a masterpiece?

lol "Axl said...."

Yeah, actually you do, cause you don't have anything to support your claim. "Axl is crazy, Axl is a liar" is not going to cut it. He never claimed to be a genius, and denied what you said about him wanting Chinese to be a masterpiece. I guess I believe him and you don't.

Or you could go look at interviews with people who worked on the album who aren't named Axl. Just a thought.

[Rovim]

Axl wanted everyone to call him a genius for CD. When most people laughed at him or ignored him instead, the door was slammed shut on new music. It's much easier for Axl to have sycophants tell him he has 41 albums worth of incredible material in the vault than it is to have the public tell him he's washed up and finished.

But isn't that just an assumption on your part? A pretty wild one too imo. There is no evidence to support Axl wanted everyone to call him a genius for CD. He talked about it being "just an album" and not trying to make a masterpiece. I have no reason to believe he lied to us when he said that.

I really have to defend the position that Axl wanted CD to be a masterpiece?

lol "Axl said...."

Yeah, actually you do, cause you don't have anything to support your claim. "Axl is crazy, Axl is a liar" is not going to cut it. He never claimed to be a genius, and denied what you said about him wanting Chinese to be a masterpiece. I guess I believe him and you don't.

Or you could go look at interviews with people who worked on the album who aren't named Axl. Just a thought.

I did. I don't remember anyone of them saying he wanted to prove he was a genius while making Chinese. And even if they did, is this an established fact Axl is a liar?

Edited May 13, 2014 by Rovim

[John Bonham]

Cut it out guys -- we all know Axl Rose is no genius.

[Intercourse]

To this day, I just don't know why the guy didn't do a solo album at the time.

He would have filled massive venues on his own; he could have had some of the coolest musicians join him in his band as his name was so huge.

Just leave the "day job" for a few years like Gwen Stefanni and see what happens..

All the members could have gotten over themselves, completed their ego trips via solo albums then come back in 1996 with GNR and gone for the podium again.

The nuclear option was just soo fucking dumb.

[FoxySCFC]

To this day, I just don't know why the guy didn't do a solo album at the time.

He would have filled massive venues on his own; he could have had some of the coolest musicians join him in his band as his name was so huge.

Just leave the "day job" for a few years like Gwen Stefanni and see what happens..

All the members could have gotten over themselves, completed their ego trips via solo albums then come back in 1996 with GNR and gone for the podium again.

The nuclear option was just soo fucking dumb.

I wish he had put a solo band together with Bucket, he wouldnt have been held down under the weight of expectation that comes under the Guns name especailly once you have replaced all the members.

He would have been free from all the legal issues with the Guns name and i imagine would have been free from all the issues hes had with the record company.

I dont agree that he would have filled stadiums on his own and I think Axl's ego wouldnt allow him to play small time venues again to build up a new fanbase.

On topic i think the OP is just trying to be funny and has failed miserably?

[D-GenerationX]

To this day, I just don't know why the guy didn't do a solo album at the time.

He would have filled massive venues on his own; he could have had some of the coolest musicians join him in his band as his name was so huge.

Just leave the "day job" for a few years like Gwen Stefanni and see what happens..

All the members could have gotten over themselves, completed their ego trips via solo albums then come back in 1996 with GNR and gone for the podium again.

The nuclear option was just soo fucking dumb.

I totally disagree.

Keeping he name was the smart business play. "Guns N' Roses" headlines festivals with no new album in over 10 years. "The Axl Rose Band" plays the side stage at about 4 in the afternoon.

[Nosaj Thing]

Keeping he name was the smart business play.

This.

It was clearly bullshit that Axl kept the name for other reasons. From a business perspective, that was the smart move and the dumb move was for Slash and Duff to sing it over as it was toilet paper.

That said, they're all millionaires though, so maybe they just don't care as much as we would think.

[D-GenerationX]

Keeping he name was the smart business play.

This.

It was clearly bullshit that Axl kept the name for other reasons. From a business perspective, that was the smart move and the dumb move was for Slash and Duff to sing it over as it was toilet paper.

That said, they're all millionaires though, so maybe they just don't care as much as we would think.

Oh, I bet Duff does.

He's gotten far more business savvy over the years. This can't be lost on him.

[Nosaj Thing]

Oh, I bet Duff does.

He's gotten far more business savvy over the years. This can't be lost on him.

I think it's very fair to say that both Slash and Duff have realized the dumb move they made and not now, but years ago. With that said, I certainly don't think they lose any sleep over it.

It's like remembering how you didn't fuck that incredibly hot chick because you were in a relationship, relationship that ended few months after that event. You remember that and say "damn, what an idiot I was!" but then, you keep on living.

Edited May 13, 2014 by Nosaj Thing

[D-GenerationX]

Oh, I bet Duff does.

He's gotten far more business savvy over the years. This can't be lost on him.

I think it's very fair to say that both Slash and Duff have realized the dumb move they made and not now, but years ago. With that said, I certainly don't think they lose any sleep over it.

It's like remembering how you didn't fuck that incredibly hot chick because you were in a relationship, relationship that ended few months after that event. You remember that and say "damn, what an idiot I was!" but then, you keep on living.

If only some of the fans could see it that way.

[Intercourse]

To this day, I just don't know why the guy didn't do a solo album at the time.He would have filled massive venues on his own; he could have had some of the coolest musicians join him in his band as his name was so huge.Just leave the "day job" for a few years like Gwen Stefanni and see what happens.. All the members could have gotten over themselves, completed their ego trips via solo albums then come back in 1996 with GNR and gone for the podium again.The nuclear option was just soo fucking dumb.

I totally disagree.Keeping he name was the smart business play. "Guns N' Roses" headlines festivals with no new album in over 10 years. "The Axl Rose Band" plays the side stage at about 4 in the afternoon.

You're not thinking this out. There would still be the original GNR today, like U2 but with Axl and the rest of them releasing solo albums to pursue their own music they felt was not suitable for GNR in between album cycles. I'm willing to bet that original GNR would still be playing stadiums today, even if they had done fuck all in years and Axl would be making serious coin.

Keeping the name looked smart to Axl because he believed that he was Capable of taking the band to even greater heights but wilth all the control and big money going to him.

Still worked out for him, but keeping the old band together while keeping a healthy solo career about the size of Jack Whites would have been a better cash cow.

Edited May 13, 2014 by Intercourse

[D-GenerationX]

You're not thinking this out. There would still be the original GNR today, like U2 but with Axl and the rest of them releasing solo albums to pursue their own music that's not suitable for the GNR in between album cycles. I'm willing to bet that original GNR would still be playing stadiums today, even if they had done fuck all in years and Axl would be making serious coin.

Keeping the name looking smart to Axl because he believed that he was Capable of taking the band to even greater heights but wilth all the control and big money going to him.

Still worked out for him, but keeping the old band together while keeping a healthy solo career about the size of Jack Whites would have been a better cash cow.

No, I see your point.

I think it falls apart though, I think, when you consider that guys in bands that release solo albums commit to getting them churned out quickly so they can get back to their primary band. That is just never going to happen with our man. The odds of him writing recording, and cutting and album in 3-4 weeks is a total fantasy.

[Intercourse]

You're not thinking this out. There would still be the original GNR today, like U2 but with Axl and the rest of them releasing solo albums to pursue their own music that's not suitable for the GNR in between album cycles. I'm willing to bet that original GNR would still be playing stadiums today, even if they had done fuck all in years and Axl would be making serious coin.Keeping the name looking smart to Axl because he believed that he was Capable of taking the band to even greater heights but wilth all the control and big money going to him.Still worked out for him, but keeping the old band together while keeping a healthy solo career about the size of Jack Whites would have been a better cash cow.

No, I see your point.I think it falls apart though, I think, when you consider that guys in bands that release solo albums commit to getting them churned out quickly so they can get back to their primary band. That is just never going to happen with our man. The odds of him writing recording, and cutting and album in 3-4 weeks is a total fantasy.

Think of it a different way... Original GNR release an album every 5 years and tour for 12 months with each. Giving one year to write the album, each band member has 3 years to do their own projects. If Axl wants to take 6 years to bring out his own album, no problem just delver your GNR piece every five years. He kept a tighter schedule than with the original band, why not now?

It would be easier for him as he would have nothing to prove, no pressure of taking the name, no pressure to replace Slash and Izzy....just do like U2, Bon Jovi and Springsteen do... Drop your album, sell a few mill, play stadiums go home and then go back out with your own band, your own tunes and play sheds and arenas, Win win.

Look at Gwen Steffani, big solo artist, big in No Doubt. No fighting, no lawsuits, no split fan base, no lost years. ,

Edited May 13, 2014 by Intercourse

[Iron MikeyJ]

But what was the rest of No Doubt doing while Gwen was "being a solo artist"? Just sitting on their asses? Just because we didn't hear about any fighting or controversy doesn't mean they didn't happen.....

Of course it's possible that the guys in the band were ready for a break anyways, but without any proof of that I'm not going to assume they were all fine with Gwen's solo career.

I'm in a band, so I understand how "hurt feelings" and "miscommunication" can really effect things. I also understand the double edge sword of always making music with people that have the same strengths and weaknesses. If I were in the position to do a solo album, I might. I also would understand if my singer wanted to do a solo project at some point in the future. But if that solo project sounds an awful lot like the music that "the band" makes, that's when problems would arise. No point in making a solo album that should have or could have been recorded by the band, that's just being greedy and ignorant imo. The greed is obvious because you get all the money, but the ignorance is harder to see. Because other than greed, why make an solo album that sounds similiar to your band? If you are not going to try new things and experiment you might as well just do an album with your band then. In Gwen's case, her solo work is a lot poppier than No Doubt's work, so I understand her need to do it. It allows her to get that out of her system, so she has a clearer mind when she returned to No Doubt. But look at Steve Perry from Journey. When he made his solo album, he took songs that very much could have been the next Journey album. Which that move pretty much resulted in the end of Journey imo, sure they are still around, but now just a nostaligia band. So was his solo album worth what it did to his band and career? I would say not. Solo albums are a very tricky and sensative subject when you are in a band.