Why is Contraband SO much better than everything Slash and co. did later?

[ManetsBR]

I was listening to Contraband yesterday after a long time. And it's a fucking great album, really top notch. Yet, everything all those guys did after 2004 is absolutely lame compared to it. The first Slash album is good, even better than Libertad, but still shitty compared to Contraband. Why it's so much better, considering it's pretty much the same people in, for example, Libertad? Were they just overly excited to be back on the game or what?

Edited June 5, 2014 by ManetsBR

[TeeJay410]

Dave kushner provided a sound completely different than slash, which made Slash's playing more unique. Duff has always had a similar effect on slash.

But what it comes down to is that Scott Weiland was the real deal, he could sing his ass off and was weird but charismatic. His turmoil have the band an edge and a drive to see the project through.

The only reason for Libertad not being so great is that Scott got too much of a hand in it, they went away from hard rock and quite possibly they had achieved all they had set out to do already on Contraband. They wanted to prove they could make lightning strike twice and it did. They coasted off that.

Edited June 5, 2014 by TeeJay410

[Rovim]

As much as I totally love Contraband, I don't believe for a second that's the best they were capable of as a band without Scott. Not sure if there could be a VR without him, but who thought there could be an AC/DC without Bon Scott (lol)

No. VR's sound identity is rooted in dirty, heavy hard rock. If they managed to write Contraband with someone whos vocal range is limited and his music is not as hard, imagine what they could do with a Frontman that has a great vocal range, writes good lyrics, and pushes Slash, Duff, Dave, and Matt to write an album that borders on the verge of metal, but is still sleazy, bluesy, punky hard rock.

Slash is a riff monster. Duff and Matt are strong as a team in VR. Dave does it's thing. I can almost hear how they can make a better album then Contraband, which only hinted at the potential. But they never found the perfect singer for that group. How it sounds with Slash's guitar and the sound of the band is the most important thing for it to work imo. Similar taste is crucial as well.

[MEXzilla]

Cause he was motivated, simple as that...actually Scott Weiland is the last good singer he had so there's that to.

[UK SUBS]

Hated contraband thought it was complete shite! Album sales mean jack.

Loved libertad - go figure.

[Rovim]

Hated contraband thought it was complete shite! Album sales mean jack.

Loved libertad - go figure.

Damn. Not a single riff or solo you liked there? You Got No Right's amazing solo, Fall To Pieces, Slither's riff. So many great moments there. To each his own I guess. Gravedancer and Messages are quite good though.

[Zanedog]

As much as I totally love Contraband, I don't believe for a second that's the best they were capable of as a band without Scott. Not sure if there could be a VR without him, but who thought there could be an AC/DC without Bon Scott (lol)

No. VR's sound identity is rooted in dirty, heavy hard rock. If they managed to write Contraband with someone whos vocal range is limited and his music is not as hard, imagine what they could do with a Frontman that has a great vocal range, writes good lyrics, and pushes Slash, Duff, Dave, and Matt to write an album that borders on the verge of metal, but is still sleazy, bluesy, punky hard rock.

Slash is a riff monster. Duff and Matt are strong as a team in VR. Dave does it's thing. I can almost hear how they can make a better album then Contraband, which only hinted at the potential. But they never found the perfect singer for that group. How it sounds with Slash's guitar and the sound of the band is the most important thing for it to work imo. Similar taste is crucial as well.

You're kidding if you think that Weiland's vocal range is limited. The dude can sing any style, this live videos of him covering many of the greatest frontmen in rock history. He's done Steven Tyler, David Lee Roth, Morrison, Kurt Cobain, McCartney, Waters, Plant, Bowie, etc. He can be inconsistent, sure, but he gave VR the edge that they needed. His versatility combined with his stage presence made VR more than just "The Ex-GNR members".

The reason why any VR members havent done anything as great as Contraband is because Scott is the best singer he's worked with since Axl. Their other stuff is great, don't get me wrong, but his singers are what makes his material amazing.

Edited June 5, 2014 by Zanedog

[maynard]

It's great modern hard rock. A mix of different styles and personalities. Kinda like AFD 2.0. Very well produced and performed. It's the best release from any GNR member since 1993.

[TeeJay410]

As much as I totally love Contraband, I don't believe for a second that's the best they were capable of as a band without Scott. Not sure if there could be a VR without him, but who thought there could be an AC/DC without Bon Scott (lol)

No. VR's sound identity is rooted in dirty, heavy hard rock. If they managed to write Contraband with someone whos vocal range is limited and his music is not as hard, imagine what they could do with a Frontman that has a great vocal range, writes good lyrics, and pushes Slash, Duff, Dave, and Matt to write an album that borders on the verge of metal, but is still sleazy, bluesy, punky hard rock.

Slash is a riff monster. Duff and Matt are strong as a team in VR. Dave does it's thing. I can almost hear how they can make a better album then Contraband, which only hinted at the potential. But they never found the perfect singer for that group. How it sounds with Slash's guitar and the sound of the band is the most important thing for it to work imo. Similar taste is crucial as well.

But the thing is, some unknown singer likely wouldn't have gotten them noticed. They could have gotten Sebastian Bach if vocal range was the most important thing. But Scott is weird, a degenerate ass hole, and a fuck of a front man. The way he had the balls to use all different vocal inflections and write lyrics like the ones in sucker train blues, weird almost non sequiturs, and be able to sell them at the same time, made the band way more than most any other singers could. Knowing what was going on in Scott's life and the band's life at that time makes the album all the more fascinating a listen.

Libertad had none of that.

[Rovim]

As much as I totally love Contraband, I don't believe for a second that's the best they were capable of as a band without Scott. Not sure if there could be a VR without him, but who thought there could be an AC/DC without Bon Scott (lol)

No. VR's sound identity is rooted in dirty, heavy hard rock. If they managed to write Contraband with someone whos vocal range is limited and his music is not as hard, imagine what they could do with a Frontman that has a great vocal range, writes good lyrics, and pushes Slash, Duff, Dave, and Matt to write an album that borders on the verge of metal, but is still sleazy, bluesy, punky hard rock.

Slash is a riff monster. Duff and Matt are strong as a team in VR. Dave does it's thing. I can almost hear how they can make a better album then Contraband, which only hinted at the potential. But they never found the perfect singer for that group. How it sounds with Slash's guitar and the sound of the band is the most important thing for it to work imo. Similar taste is crucial as well.

But the thing is, some unknown singer likely wouldn't have gotten them noticed. They could have gotten Sebastian Bach if vocal range was the most important thing. But Scott is weird, a degenerate ass hole, and a fuck of a front man. The way he had the balls to use all different vocal inflections and write lyrics like the ones in sucker train blues, weird almost non sequiturs, and be able to sell them at the same time, made the band way more than most any other singers could. Knowing what was going on in Scott's life and the band's life at that time makes the album all the more fascinating a listen.

Libertad had none of that.

Agreed, but my post was aimed more at the future of the band, if there will even be a future. I love Scott and STP, he's great, but who he is just as a person and as a musician, held the rest of the band back.

His musical leanings are not similar enough to the rest of the group. It still worked, commercially too, but I'm strictly talking artistically here: in order to realize the potential, they must find a singer that they are all into musically and vice versa. It must feel right to everyone, and vocal range is not the most important thing, but that seems to really help when it comes to Slash especially. It just sounds right with his style of guitar playing.

Edited June 5, 2014 by Rovim

[Russel Nash]

Cos it has some of the songs of the next GNR album in case of reunion aka big guns. When they realized a reunion was never going to be in this lifetime they decided to release them.

Also Scott was really involved in the process, in Libertad not so much. Rubin was the producer right?

[Rovim]

Cos it has some of the songs of the next GNR album in case of reunion aka big guns. When they realized a reunion was never going to be in this lifetime they decided to release them.

Also Scott was really involved in the process, in Libertad not so much. Rubin was the producer right?

Nah, Brendan O'brien. He worked with Rubin though. Josh Abraham was the producer for Contraband. I agree with Slash: the guitars are not recorded properly. The whole production is muddy, but it's also part of the charm, idk.

Slash was not clean at the time or around that time. It was fitting in a weird way. Scott goes without saying.

As much as I totally love Contraband, I don't believe for a second that's the best they were capable of as a band without Scott. Not sure if there could be a VR without him, but who thought there could be an AC/DC without Bon Scott (lol)

No. VR's sound identity is rooted in dirty, heavy hard rock. If they managed to write Contraband with someone whos vocal range is limited and his music is not as hard, imagine what they could do with a Frontman that has a great vocal range, writes good lyrics, and pushes Slash, Duff, Dave, and Matt to write an album that borders on the verge of metal, but is still sleazy, bluesy, punky hard rock.

Slash is a riff monster. Duff and Matt are strong as a team in VR. Dave does it's thing. I can almost hear how they can make a better album then Contraband, which only hinted at the potential. But they never found the perfect singer for that group. How it sounds with Slash's guitar and the sound of the band is the most important thing for it to work imo. Similar taste is crucial as well.

You're kidding if you think that Weiland's vocal range is limited. The dude can sing any style, this live videos of him covering many of the greatest frontmen in rock history. He's done Steven Tyler, David Lee Roth, Morrison, Kurt Cobain, McCartney, Waters, Plant, Bowie, etc. He can be inconsistent, sure, but he gave VR the edge that they needed. His versatility combined with his stage presence made VR more than just "The Ex-GNR members".

The reason why any VR members havent done anything as great as Contraband is because Scott is the best singer he's worked with since Axl. Their other stuff is great, don't get me wrong, but his singers are what makes his material amazing.

I know all of that. Scott is one of my favorites. Still he doesn't have the vocal range needed imo to bring that something out of Slash. A big part of the reason Slash was so good in Guns is not just Axl's unique voice. It's the fact Axl can match Slash's guitar high energy with his vocal range. It's technical but not really. It's needed if you want to get Slash in full blast mode imo. That, or the singer could have something that brings that something out of Slash and inspires him to push himself and to reach VR's full potential.

Slash is the leader of the band much like Axl is the center of new Guns. So if he's inspired it's gonna affect the rest of the band.

[Tyler Drama]

I agree with Manets, Contraband is so much better than anything Slash has done since.

[DieselDaisy]

I prefer Libertad and Slash to Contraband. Contraband is a shitty album in my opinion; it is even worse than Chinese Democracy!

[Russel Nash]

Cos it has some of the songs of the next GNR album in case of reunion aka big guns. When they realized a reunion was never going to be in this lifetime they decided to release them.

Also Scott was really involved in the process, in Libertad not so much. Rubin was the producer right?

Nah, Brendan O'brien. He worked with Rubin though. Josh Abraham was the producer for Contraband. I agree with Slash: the guitars are not recorded properly. The whole production is muddy, but it's also part of the charm, idk.

Slash was not clean at the time or around that time. It was fitting in a weird way. Scott goes without saying.

As much as I totally love Contraband, I don't believe for a second that's the best they were capable of as a band without Scott. Not sure if there could be a VR without him, but who thought there could be an AC/DC without Bon Scott (lol)

No. VR's sound identity is rooted in dirty, heavy hard rock. If they managed to write Contraband with someone whos vocal range is limited and his music is not as hard, imagine what they could do with a Frontman that has a great vocal range, writes good lyrics, and pushes Slash, Duff, Dave, and Matt to write an album that borders on the verge of metal, but is still sleazy, bluesy, punky hard rock.

Slash is a riff monster. Duff and Matt are strong as a team in VR. Dave does it's thing. I can almost hear how they can make a better album then Contraband, which only hinted at the potential. But they never found the perfect singer for that group. How it sounds with Slash's guitar and the sound of the band is the most important thing for it to work imo. Similar taste is crucial as well.

You're kidding if you think that Weiland's vocal range is limited. The dude can sing any style, this live videos of him covering many of the greatest frontmen in rock history. He's done Steven Tyler, David Lee Roth, Morrison, Kurt Cobain, McCartney, Waters, Plant, Bowie, etc. He can be inconsistent, sure, but he gave VR the edge that they needed. His versatility combined with his stage presence made VR more than just "The Ex-GNR members".

The reason why any VR members havent done anything as great as Contraband is because Scott is the best singer he's worked with since Axl. Their other stuff is great, don't get me wrong, but his singers are what makes his material amazing.

I know all of that. Scott is one of my favorites. Still he doesn't have the vocal range needed imo to bring that something out of Slash. A big part of the reason Slash was so good in Guns is not just Axl's unique voice. It's the fact Axl can match Slash's guitar high energy with his vocal range. It's technical but not really. It's needed if you want to get Slash in full blast mode imo. That, or the singer could have something that brings that something out of Slash and inspires him to push himself and to reach VR's full potential.

Slash is the leader of the band much like Axl is the center of new Guns. So if he's inspired it's gonna affect the rest of the band.

I really liked the way the guitars sound on Contraband. Libertad on the other hand............. weak performances, weak lyrics, shit mixing, some awful shitty songs..

Never understood Slash words on those guitars not properly mixed/recorded on Contraband. Always sounds right to me.

[DieselDaisy]

Ballads aside, Contraband consists of awful numetal songs and there is no grease in the production whatsoever; Slash has been totally mixed out. Libertad actually has fun rock n' roll riffs and some fine Slash moments (such as the leads in American Man).

[TeeJay410]

Contraband doesn't sound like nu-metal in any shape or form 0_o.

The production is a little muddy overall. I can't tell if it was the guitars but Slash would know better than I would, he was there.

To Slash's credit, even if his albums aren't the best in quality post VR, the sound is fucking amazing. Apocalyptic Love thumps at any volume, amazing mix and master job, which Slash makes easy to do with his tone and stripped back songwriting.

[DieselDaisy]

Numetalish songs on Contraband:

- Big Machine

- Illegal

- spectacle

- Headspace

- Superhuman

[Rovim]

Numetalish songs on Contraband:

- Big Machine

- Illegal

- spectacle

- Headspace

- Superhuman

Big Machine, Headspace, and Superhuman are cool songs. I can hear some nu metal sounds, but it's nothing too distracting.

[bran]

didnt really care for either album they have moments, but i could never really get into them.

Edited June 5, 2014 by bran

[appetite4illusions]

Contraband doesn't sound like nu-metal in any shape or form 0_o.

The production is a little muddy overall. I can't tell if it was the guitars but Slash would know better than I would, he was there.

To Slash's credit, even if his albums aren't the best in quality post VR, the sound is fucking amazing. Apocalyptic Love thumps at any volume, amazing mix and master job, which Slash makes easy to do with his tone and stripped back songwriting.

My friend who does industry recording told me the reason Contraband sounds the way it does is because everything is "rendered" in the bass frequencies.

This is what gives it an altogether thicker and heavier production.

[combos]

I was listening to Contraband yesterday after a long time. And it's a fucking great album, really top notch. Yet, everything all those guys did after 2004 is absolutely lame compared to it. The first Slash album is good, even better than Libertad, but still shitty compared to Contraband. Why it's so much better, considering it's pretty much the same people in, for example, Libertad? Were they just overly excited to be back on the game or what?

It's probably a case of tapping the well. That and everyone started end fighting. It's hard to make good music when not everyone is enjoying themselves.

[Rovim]

I was listening to Contraband yesterday after a long time. And it's a fucking great album, really top notch. Yet, everything all those guys did after 2004 is absolutely lame compared to it. The first Slash album is good, even better than Libertad, but still shitty compared to Contraband. Why it's so much better, considering it's pretty much the same people in, for example, Libertad? Were they just overly excited to be back on the game or what?

It's probably a case of tapping the well. That and everyone started end fighting. It's hard to make good music when not everyone is enjoying themselves.

It's hatefucking if you don't express yourself in the studio with people you enjoy being in the room with and respect personally and musically.

[RichardNixon]

I really liked both Contraband and Libertad, the latter is sorely underrated, IMO. Slash's s/t album is probably my favorite CD that Slash (or any GN'R alumni) made out side of GN'R.

My list might go something like this (top 10)

1. Slash- s/t

2. Izzy Stradlin and the Ju Ju Hounds

3. Contraband

4. Pawnshop Guitars

5. Libertad

6. Ride On

7. River

8. It's Five O'Clock Somewhere

9. Matt Sorum's Fierce Joy

10. Apocalyptic love

[Nosaj Thing]

I disagree. All Slash's albums since he left Guns have been great, in my opinion. If I need to pick my least favorites, I would definitely say those are Contraband and Libertad.