Izzy Stradlin comments on reunion

[sjlgnr]

20 minutes ago, DieselDaisy said:

The Axlites were very pro-Izzy when Izzy appeared with Nugnr in 2006 and 2012, saying things like, ''I always saw Izzy as more important than Slash; Axl and Izzy are childhood buddies and have that connection''. It was the Axl fans who liked to point out the multiple Stradlin/Rose songwriting credits (to the detriment of Slash, then labelled a 'cancer').

Axl fans are sheep.

YES!!!!!! AXL FANS ARE SHEEP, UNCRITICAL, OBEDIENT, OBSEQUIOUS SHEEP!!!!   Axl fans are the "Yes" men who made him think he could get away with taking 13 years to put out Chinese Democracy   And they still tell him that Chinese Democracy is a masterpiece -- after it flopped.   Axl fans will say anything, from any angle, to support whatever Axl is saying now.

Can we just be honest about this band?   Boiled to its essence, the band was a songwriting triumvirate:   Izzy, Axl, and Slash.  More often than not, Izzy came up with the guts of the song, Axl added lyrics and pop smarts (e.g., whistling on Patiernce, synth line on Paradise City), and Slash added the riffs and solos.   That's the heart of what the band was in its 1986-91 heyday.  Departing from that formula makes the band much less than it was.   So let's get Izzy on board....

[BOSSY78]

16 minutes ago, sjlgnr said:

Truth is, stuff like this happens with so many reunions.   First, from an equity perspective, I agree with Izzy that he should get an equal split.  Izzy wrote as much or more of the Appetite, Lies and Illussions material than anyone else.  Izzy also is responsible for helping to craft the band's musical persona.  When you think about what gave the band it's identity, it's very much Izzy:  Punk, Stones & Hanoi Rocks influences.  Also, Izzy is the guy who started it all by leaving Indiana for L.A.  Axl followed Izzy!   There is also the de facto point that Guns n' Roses ended as a band that made new material when Izzy left.

Second, on the other hand, squabbling over money happens with many major bands, especially with reunions.  Zeppelin tried (and succeeded) to cut out Jon Paul Jones from one reunion.  The Eagles made original member Randy Meissner an employee.  Brian Jones was the original leader of the Rolling Stones, but ended up dead in a pool.  When you add to that the fact that Izzy freely walked away from the band, partially because he had to get sober due to an arrest -- albeit partially because of the same Axl power-play business we are seeing now.  Indeed, the reunion tour we just saw is pretty much the Illusions lineup from 92-93 -- minus Tracy & Roberta and the horns :)).   Having abdicated his role with the band, Izzy has given up some of the moral high ground.  

Finally, my vote is of course that I want more Izzy.   Any real fan of GnR knows that Izzy is a major part of the band and the band's history.  There is a strong argument that he is the most important member -- and he's at least top-3.  So it is a major loss not to have Izzy on board.    

As a fan I'd love to see Izzy there.

 

I however understand Izzy gave up his partnetship. Don't pin Izzy's drug issues and arrests on Axl like wtf. 

 

[DexAxl]

7 minutes ago, BOSSY78 said:

Why hate Axl? 

First off there's no proof it wad Axl alone who didn't want to share equally.

Second off why would Izzy get an equal share? Axl, Slash and Duff are business partners Izzy walked away. Axl pleaded with him not to. You can't walk away and 25 years later expect to be paid equally. 

No matter his reasons for walking away Izzy is no longer apart of that partnership. 

As a fan it sounds like Izzy is being greedy to me. He expects more then he's given.

I obviously don't hate Axl he is still my profile pic.  But this was supposed to be "reunion" tour and if anybody deserves to get paid it's Izzy, he is one of most important members who made this band famous and it's just insult to get him just as hired hand like Steven to play couple songs on 3-4 shows.

[sjlgnr]

2 minutes ago, BOSSY78 said:

As a fan I'd love to see Izzy there.

 

I however understand Izzy gave up his partnetship. Don't pin Izzy's drug issues and arrests on Axl like wtf. 

 

Not what I was saying.   Izzy claims that he left the band, in part, because Axl started saying Izzy should only get so much money because he did not travel with the band, and Axl also tried to restrict the area on the stage where Izzy could perform.   My point is it was (i) part Izzy getting sober because of his arrest for pissing on a plane; and (ii) part the Axl power play in trying to cut Izzy's pay and restrict his area on stage.

[ksks12]

3 hours ago, DieselDaisy said:

''Patience'' is more Stradlin - Rose's input is minimal

This is a very pro-Rosey forum I've always thought - especially with the reunion - but of the twelve songs listed, five of them are Stradlin, hardly 'not many' as you describe.  It does not really prove your point considering there were four songwriters in the 1985 - 1991 band. Or to put it another way, 25% (Izzy) of the songwriters is contributing to 41.6% of the songs.

Out of likes but I couldn't agree more.

Edited September 8, 2016 by ksks12

[G-Money]

Here's what's sad to me.

The fact that Izzy is mad about the pay and Steven has played as a guest means that Axl DID (at least in some capacity) try to get the original AFD lineup together, despite all odds. The only two members to consistently show interest in a reunion of the original group are the two with the least say in the matter (though I AM happy for Steven to reconnect with the band). Alan Niven has raised all sorts of concern about Izzy being left out. And Izzy quit 25 years ago, before anyone else quit.

So what more could Izzy possibly want? Yes, he may have been the heart and genius behind it all, but Axl is the commitment to GNR (even if I didn't approve of NuGNR), and Slash and Duff are the monetary value.

Marc Canter, Dizzy Reed, and Axl have all made comments in recent months that indicate Izzy can be really flaky, and I think this is ultimate proof. It's like he wanted a perfect, unrealistic picture, or no picture at all.

#WheresIzzy

[Kira]

1 hour ago, EvanG said:

Can't they all just get along like grown men and let the music be the focus, so that we internet nerds can finally be happy and not having to make another crazy ass thread filled with arguments and speculations? Pretty please with sugar on top?

When there are millions of dollars on the line? That's not realistic.

[ksks12]

1 hour ago, Heisenberg said:

Axl easily forgot that Izzy was the only guy from GnR who supported his new band with dozens of live appearances since 2006, that Izzy was the only guy who didn't want to attend the hall of fame because of Axl, that same Izzy supported Axl a week or so after Hall of fame with his attendance at Axl's show...'right from hall of shame' Axl.




Found a head and an arm in da garbage can
Don't know why I'm here
Livin' on the run for oh so long
I gotta go collect
Double talkin' jive
Get the money motherfucker
'Cause I got no more patience
Double talkin'
I got (Lies)
No more patience man
 

This!

[AxlCole]

This thread is crazy.

Look, anyone trying to downplay Izzy's importance to the success of GnR is being disingenuous and trying to re-write history.  Any really fan of the band should understand this.  It's not just his songwriting, but the way his raw, jagged rhythm playing so amazingly complimented Slash's smoother, more 'professional' rhythm. 

However, the past is the past, and are you _really_ going to let the fact that, whatever the reason is, he isn't involved in the current partial reunion spoil the amazing fact that 3 of the original members, two of whom pretty much no one, including themselves, ever thought would speak to each other again, let alone share a stage and _hug_, ruin your enjoyment of the awesomeness these shows and this tour has been? 

I'm certainly not.  Yeah.... my ultimate dream would be for all 5 to play together again.  Hell, at least 4 (though I still can't get over the fact I actually saw 4 of 5 in L.A.) even.  But I'll take Axl, Duff, and Slash, and I'll be fucking happy as fuck to have been given something that was _never supposed to fucking happen_!

 

Edited September 8, 2016 by AxlCole

[BOSSY78]

6 minutes ago, DexAxl said:

I obviously don't hate Axl he is still my profile pic.  But this was supposed to be "reunion" tour and if anybody deserves to get paid it's Izzy, he is one of most important members who made this band famous and it's just insult to get him just as hired hand like Steven to play couple songs on 3-4 shows.

Why would it be an insult? Izzy hasn't wanted any part in GnR really in 25 years. Why should Axl fire or let go a loyal band member who hasn't left him? As a fan of this band and of Izzy even I still don't think it's realistic. Izzy is very fickle and you never know if he's coming or going. Why should they let a guy go that shows up when he's supposed to?

First we know he would have gotten paid just not as much as the 3 who have worked hard and remained in the partnership. 

Izzy stated he wanted the same amount of money as them. That's not fair nor realistic. 

[G-Money]

Alright, Duff.

Get your mediator gloves on.  It's game time again.

[ksks12]

1 hour ago, Modano09 said:

And Axl was hurt to discover afterwards the only reason Izzy played with GNR in 2006 was because he demanded and received a large sum of money to do it.

Wow, poor Axl. I hope he recovered after the initial shock. 

[sjlgnr]

6 minutes ago, guitarpatch said:

The thing is Izzy had all of that. He was an equal partner and was rewarded for all of his songwriting, influences, and being there from the start. He then made the business decision and left. He didn't want the risk/liability that came with the reward. Now the other 3 stuck around, and have maintained the brand for nearly 20 years so that this scenario of a stadium sized reunion show is even possible. Izzy wasn't there making branding, merchandise, synch deals, and running the business side of the GNR catalogue during those times. Think about all the lawyers those guys had on retainer over the years, to help control their interests. Time spent thinking not only but the brand, but about the other parties involved.  By no means is he entitled to now just walk in and demand equal equity on this pay day. This is the other guys payoff for all that work.  I'm sure the other 2 could of sold their rights to Axl if they didn't want the headache. They were just smart enough to stick around. 

You're right.  Izzy has not been much of an ambassador for the GnR brand.   He did walk away and did not put in the work the other three did from mid-91 through 1994.  

That is the strongest argument against him -- and this is where the "flake" resonates.  Izzy's particular hubris is that he picks up and walks when he wants (a luxury he has due to the success of the early albums).  Izzy walked away from the Ju Ju Hounds.  And he walked away from promoting 117 Degrees.  So he's not without blame.   Fair point.

All that said, if -- as your tagline says -- you're "just waiting for the new Guns album to come out", then you want Izzy because he writes well.

[EvanG]

6 minutes ago, Kira said:

When there are millions of dollars on the line? That's not realistic.

I was really sorta joking, I thought ''pretty please with sugar on top'' made that obvious.

But it should be that simple, though.

[emybdc]

It's the whole "break up" thing all over again. Each one of them have their own version of what happened. Communication was never their strong suit.

I don't think Izzy is the underdog here though. We all know Axl can be difficult to deal with, but it looks like he's come a long way and there's Slash on the same side, and specially Duff, who seems to be a really fair guy.

[Modano09]

2 minutes ago, ksks12 said:

Wow, poor Axl. I hope he recovered after the initial shock. 

It wouldn't hurt your feelings if someone you considered a good friend only did something for you because he made financial demands that were met?

[ksks12]

8 minutes ago, BOSSY78 said:

Why would it be an insult? Izzy hasn't wanted any part in GnR really in 25 years. Why should Axl fire or let go a loyal band member who hasn't left him? As a fan of this band and of Izzy even I still don't think it's realistic. Izzy is very fickle and you never know if he's coming or going. Why should they let a guy go that shows up when he's supposed to?

First we know he would have gotten paid just not as much as the 3 who have worked hard and remained in the partnership. 

Izzy stated he wanted the same amount of money as them. That's not fair nor realistic. 

Really? Please enlighten us. The guy who wrote/cowrote 60%/70% of their material isn't supposed to be paid fairly? 

Ok than let them put out all of his songs out of the setlist. You know: brownstone, otgm, nightrain, dc, ycbm, patience, scom, dtj,...........

Edited September 8, 2016 by ksks12

[nevergotochurch]

lol, I don't get how his is even news. file this under "duh".

[DexAxl]

5 minutes ago, BOSSY78 said:

Why would it be an insult? Izzy hasn't wanted any part in GnR really in 25 years. Why should Axl fire or let go a loyal band member who hasn't left him? As a fan of this band and of Izzy even I still don't think it's realistic. Izzy is very fickle and you never know if he's coming or going. Why should they let a guy go that shows up when he's supposed to?

First we know he would have gotten paid just not as much as the 3 who have worked hard and remained in the partnership. 

Izzy stated he wanted the same amount of money as them. That's not fair nor realistic. 

Ok can you please explain me what Slash and Duff did for GNR over the past 20 years except taking royalties? Axl was the only guy working his ass off for this band.

[BOSSY78]

4 minutes ago, Modano09 said:

It wouldn't hurt your feelings if someone you considered a good friend only did something for you because he made financial demands that were met?

I remember that. Not long ago I guessed Izzy wasn't here because he wanted too much money. 

I brought up that time many seem to forget that. The amount was extravagant.

 

 

[Jane M.]

2 hours ago, Heisenberg said:

Axl easily forgot that Izzy was the only guy from GnR who supported his new band with dozens of live appearances since 2006, that Izzy was the only guy who didn't want to attend the hall of fame because of Axl, that same Izzy supported Axl a week or so after Hall of fame with his attendance at Axl's show...'right from hall of shame' Axl.




Found a head and an arm in da garbage can
Don't know why I'm here
Livin' on the run for oh so long
I gotta go collect
Double talkin' jive
Get the money motherfucker
'Cause I got no more patience
Double talkin'
I got (Lies)
No more patience man
 

AMEN.

[ksks12]

53 minutes ago, DieselDaisy said:

The Axlites were very pro-Izzy when Izzy appeared with Nugnr in 2006 and 2012, saying things like, ''I always saw Izzy as more important than Slash; Axl and Izzy are childhood buddies and have that connection''. It was the Axl fans who liked to point out the multiple Stradlin/Rose songwriting credits (to the detriment of Slash, then labelled a 'cancer').

Axl fans are sheep.

Diesel, so true and so sad at the same time. I'm glad some still get it.

[DieselDaisy]

4 minutes ago, sjlgnr said:

 Izzy walked away from the Ju Ju Hounds.  And he walked away from promoting 117 Degrees.

What? Out of all the bollocks being said about Izzy, this has to win the competition. It was called Izzy Stradlin and the Ju Ju Hounds. It was essentially his solo band. For unknown reasons (probably marketing) he decided to switch it to just 'Izzy Stradlin' when he did 117 Degrees. And what on earth do you mean about walking away from promoting 117 Degrees?

 

 

[AlterL]

48 minutes ago, DieselDaisy said:

The Axlites were very pro-Izzy when Izzy appeared with Nugnr in 2006 and 2012, saying things like, ''I always saw Izzy as more important than Slash; Axl and Izzy are childhood buddies and have that connection''. It was the Axl fans who liked to point out the multiple Stradline songwriting credits (to the detriment of Slash, then labelled a 'cancer').

Axl fans are sheep.

I still like both Axl & Izzy, I still think he was more important in the creation of the songs than Slash even if he is indeed more popular however that doesn't change the fact that from a marketing point of view it makes no sense to give him that much money when he doesn't bring nearly as much to the table. I'm not saying he's worthless just unnecessary from a marketing point of view, just like every tour post 1991 proved, so why exactly should he get more money than he already earns from the work that he actually did when he's obviousmy not worth it.

[Modano09]

Can someone look up the Axl interview (may have been an online chat) where he talked about Izzy's demands to play in 2006?