ITW 2012 Posted December 6, 2011 Share Posted December 6, 2011 (edited) http://www.detnews.com/article/20111201/ENT04/112010320/Guns-N--Roses-frontman-Axl-Rose-keeps-fans-guessingGuns N' Roses frontman Axl Rose keeps fans guessingAdam Graham/ Detroit News Pop Music WriterGuns N' Roses frontman Axl Rose is still the most mysterious figure in rock. He does what he wants when he wants and makes no apologies, whether that means going on stage at 1 a.m. or refusing to promote an album he spent close to two decades making. Why does he do it? He's Axl Rose. 'Nuff said. Or at least that's what people who spend their time wondering about Axl Rose are forced to tell themselves. The man himself isn't offering any answers. He recently sat down with VH1's "That Metal Show" for his first interview in five years and offered very little in the way of insight, mainly managing to shift blame for his many eccentricities on shady business people, crew members and other unnamed forces of the universe. So what, exactly, is the deal with Axl Rose? We asked the very question to Tommy Stinson, Guns N' Roses bassist since 1998, who struggled for an answer to the admittedly open-ended question. "You're asking me to (expletive) write 'War and Peace,' dude," says Stinson, who performs with GNR at The Palace tonight, while on the phone from Chicago last month. Narrowing it down, Stinson says Rose isn't all that different from Paul Westerberg or Dave Pirner, singers in the Replacements and Soul Asylum, bands he played with before Guns. "I think they're hugely talented, a bit misunderstood in a lot of ways, and maybe I subconsciously think I can help them in some way," says Stinson, 45. "I guess I'm kind of used to that kind of personality; maybe I'm drawn to those kind of people and they work out good for me. Maybe I've got a yin and yang kind of thing about it." Is Rose difficult to deal with? "Not for me," Stinson says, in between bites of fruit salad a few hours before going on stage at Allstate Arena. "The rest of the free world? Sure." No denying talentFor all of Rose's difficulties and baggage, however, he still is hailed for his abilities as a performer. Guns' current outing, its first American trek in five years, has earned solid reviews, with critics praising the 49-year-old's still-robust vocals. Why the tour took so long to get rolling is another story. "Chinese Democracy," GNR's first album since 1993's "The Spaghetti Incident?" was released in 2008 after one of the most elongated delays in rock history. The album — which actually sounded like it had been tinkered with for close to 20 years — underperformed commercially and was barely promoted, with no proper single or video releases and no interviews. After earning mythic status during its creation, "Chinese Democracy" came and went in the blink of an eye. Stinson blames record company politics for its lack of promotion, "and I don't think Axl has gotten over that," the Minneapolis native says. He calls the debacle "dumbfounding," but says Axl may not be completely finished with the record. "I think in his head there's still some stuff left to be done," Stinson says. "If what he wants to do happens, it could drag it out for awhile. But we'll see what happens." Setlists decided on flyOn tour, Stinson says Guns has been going on stage around 10 or 10:30 p.m. — reports put them closer to 11 — which is rather timely for GNR. For them, "it's like noon!" he says. The band isn't working with regimented setlists but culling from a list of about 40 songs and calling them out on the fly by communicating on stage through in-ear monitors. Looking ahead, Stinson says the hope is to write new songs next year and move forward with GNR, which is nominated for entry into the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame Class of 2012. There are songs left over from the "Chinese Democracy" sessions that are almost ready to go, he says, and could be polished up for potential release. "Who knows, maybe there will be Chinese Democracy 2," Stinson says. "Who knows?" When it comes to Axl Rose, "who knows" is as close to an answer as you're likely to get. Guns N' Roses with D Generation8 tonight The Palace of Auburn Hills 6 Championship Drive, Auburn Hills Tickets $49.50-$75 Call (248) 377-0100 Ticketmaster.com Worth the wait?"Chinese Democracy" took nearly 17 years to complete. Here are some of music's other long-gestating opuses: Dr. Dre, "Detox": Dr. Dre has been working on his follow-up to "2001" (which was actually released in 1999) for more than a decade. A pair of singles trickled out in the last year, but the album still carries no official release date. No Doubt, untitled: The So-Cal pop rockers, with Gwen Stefani, have been working on the follow-up to 2001's "Rock Steady" since 2008. The band went on the road to find inspiration for the record back in 2009. That inspiration, apparently, still hasn't come, though there are rumors of a 2012 release. OutKast, untitled: The Atlanta rap duo's last studio set, 2003's "Speakerboxxx/The Love Below," won the Grammy for Album of the Year, but Andre 3000 and Big Boi's new album has been on-again, off-again for years. In the meantime, Big Boi released a well-received solo album, and Andre is hailed for his sporadic guest appearances on other artists' tracks. The Beach Boys, "Smile": The album was recorded in 1966 and 1967 but never completed. Brian Wilson released his own solo version in 2004 and a five-CD box set, "The Smile Sessions," was released last month, though a final, completed version of the album remains non-existent. Edited December 6, 2011 by ITW 2012 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyler Drama Posted December 6, 2011 Share Posted December 6, 2011 Interesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TiedHands Posted December 6, 2011 Share Posted December 6, 2011 He makes it sound like Axl has some sort of mad master plan or something. "Drag it out"? That's cool. I'll be very curious to see what happens after this round of touring, because I know I've said it before, but they cannot keep touring like this with no new material. I'm just as excited when they pull out 'Estranged' or 'Civil War', but the entire world has heard these songs and at least half of Chinese live, so unless they plan on playing the entire thing in the future, just move onto some newer stuff. It's gonna be interesting... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyler Drama Posted December 6, 2011 Share Posted December 6, 2011 I guess music videos? I mean, what else could be done with it now that hasn't already been done? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dalsh327 Posted December 6, 2011 Share Posted December 6, 2011 I guess music videos? I mean, what else could be done with it now that hasn't already been done?GNR should just have a contest, let the fans make music videos, and they get to pick the best ones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drtydane Posted December 6, 2011 Share Posted December 6, 2011 But there isnt a real vehicle for music videos these days other than Youtube for bands like GNR. GNR came up during the video era, and 20 years later, videos for real rock bands just arent as relavant as they once were. Stations like MTV and VH1 rarely air videos, so you have to seek them out, whether it be youtube or offical DVD releases. Theres no point in dumping millions of dollars into videos nobodies going to see, other than on mtv2 at 4 a.m. Its fucking redic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaneisKing1389 Posted December 6, 2011 Share Posted December 6, 2011 (edited) But there isnt a real vehicle for music videos these days other than Youtube for bands like GNR. GNR came up during the video era, and 20 years later, videos for real rock bands just arent as relavant as they once were. Stations like MTV and VH1 rarely air videos, so you have to seek them out, whether it be youtube or offical DVD releases. Theres no point in dumping millions of dollars into videos nobodies going to see, other than on mtv2 at 4 a.m. Its fucking redic.Agreed.If Axl wants to continue to tour Chinese Democracy for another 10 years, he'll probably have to re-release it, possibly with new tracks that can and will be performed live. Edited December 6, 2011 by DaneisKing1389 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gagarin Posted December 6, 2011 Share Posted December 6, 2011 But there isnt a real vehicle for music videos these days other than Youtube for bands like GNR. GNR came up during the video era, and 20 years later, videos for real rock bands just arent as relavant as they once were. Stations like MTV and VH1 rarely air videos, so you have to seek them out, whether it be youtube or offical DVD releases. Theres no point in dumping millions of dollars into videos nobodies going to see, other than on mtv2 at 4 a.m. Its fucking redic.You're missing the point.YouTube is the point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drtydane Posted December 6, 2011 Share Posted December 6, 2011 But there isnt a real vehicle for music videos these days other than Youtube for bands like GNR. GNR came up during the video era, and 20 years later, videos for real rock bands just arent as relavant as they once were. Stations like MTV and VH1 rarely air videos, so you have to seek them out, whether it be youtube or offical DVD releases. Theres no point in dumping millions of dollars into videos nobodies going to see, other than on mtv2 at 4 a.m. Its fucking redic.You're missing the point.YouTube is the point.Im not missing the point dude, it just doesnt make financial sense to promote a cd that was released 4 years ago with over the top, multi-million dollar videos. Enough money has been lost as it is with the whole CD venture. I just don't see any videos in that sense being released unless Axl funds them himself. (which I suppose could happen.) Don't get me wrong, other than new music being released, videos are the next thing I'd love to see from GNR. Hope it happens, really do. I just don't see it. Axl did mention wanting to let the fans have a chance to digest the music before releasing videos, then again, Axls said alot over the years. At this point I just think its too late for any sort of album promotion fundage coming from the record company. Theyre probably still pissed Axl didnt promote the thing in the first place, just can't see them handing over 5-8 million dollars because Axls finally ready. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AXL_N_DIZZY Posted December 6, 2011 Share Posted December 6, 2011 (edited) But there isnt a real vehicle for music videos these days other than Youtube for bands like GNR. GNR came up during the video era, and 20 years later, videos for real rock bands just arent as relavant as they once were. Stations like MTV and VH1 rarely air videos, so you have to seek them out, whether it be youtube or offical DVD releases. Theres no point in dumping millions of dollars into videos nobodies going to see, other than on mtv2 at 4 a.m. Its fucking redic.I agree with you. It's no longer an effective avenue... which hurts to say because I grew up on GN'R videos... I suppose a youtube video could get a kind of underground counter-culture pro-new-GN'R movement going... but that's pretty much how GN'R exists these days anyways IMHO. What Guns needs to do IMHO is somehow show (and it ain't going to be easy) that they're truly ready to "pick up where the old band left off" (to quote DJ Ashba). Hate to break out this tired old rumor/dream/etc... but to get massive attention back- IMHO Guns needs to do something MAJOR like KICK ASS at a Super Bowl Half-Time Show or at Euro 2012 (European Soccer Championships), or on Saturday Night Live, etc. and pair it up with professional promotion for either a CD re-release with new art-work and a quality bonus track (ideally a rocker for a blockbuster movie like YCBM back in the day), or a live blu-ray DVD, or... They've had a couple of these type of opportunities in the last decade or so- and they've always seemed to foul the pitch off. They need one more crack at it and to really step into it this time... Positively, Axl's finally got a band with not only the chops- but the right image the public expects for Guns N' Roses. The time could finally be right. Edited December 6, 2011 by AXL_N_DIZZY Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drtydane Posted December 6, 2011 Share Posted December 6, 2011 Completely agreed. Ha, were in sync tonite. Nice change from the usual bashing I see around here. Didnt post for the longest time because I was sick of defending myself to 16 year old internet tough guys, just gets so old. Especially when theres so much going on in the world of GNR atm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Young_Gun Posted December 6, 2011 Share Posted December 6, 2011 (edited) But there isnt a real vehicle for music videos these days other than Youtube for bands like GNR. GNR came up during the video era, and 20 years later, videos for real rock bands just arent as relavant as they once were. Stations like MTV and VH1 rarely air videos, so you have to seek them out, whether it be youtube or offical DVD releases. Theres no point in dumping millions of dollars into videos nobodies going to see, other than on mtv2 at 4 a.m. Its fucking redic.I agree with you. It's no longer an effective avenue... which hurts to say because I grew up on GN'R videos... I suppose a youtube video could get a kind of underground counter-culture pro-new-GN'R movement going... but that's pretty much how GN'R exists these days anyways IMHO. What Guns needs to do IMHO is somehow show (and it ain't going to be easy) that they're truly ready to "pick up where the old band left off" (to quote DJ Ashba). Hate to break out this tired old rumor/dream/etc... but to get massive attention back- IMHO Guns needs to do something MAJOR like KICK ASS at a Super Bowl Half-Time Show or at Euro 2012 (European Soccer Championships), or on Saturday Night Live, etc. and pair it up with professional promotion for either a CD re-release with new art-work and a quality bonus track (ideally a rocker for a blockbuster movie like YCBM back in the day), or a live blu-ray DVD, or... They've had a couple of these type of opportunities in the last decade or so- and they've always seemed to foul the pitch off. They need one more crack at it and to really step into it this time... Positively, Axl's finally got a band with not only the chops- but the right image the public expects for Guns N' Roses. The time could finally be right.Perhaps you haven't seen the videos of songs viewed by billions of people from the likes of Justin Bieber, Lady Gaga, Coldplay etc etc. Youtube in fact now has it's own top 100, similar to the Billboard 100 but based on views for the week. Youtube IS the MTV of now. Hell, artists probably get more revenue from the advertising per view on Youtube than they ever did back in the day. Guns would need big promotion to break through however, as they haven't been 'in' since the early 90's now unfortunately... Edited December 6, 2011 by Young_Gun Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AXL_N_DIZZY Posted December 6, 2011 Share Posted December 6, 2011 Completely agreed. Ha, were in sync tonite. Nice change from the usual bashing I see around here. Didnt post for the longest time because I was sick of defending myself to 16 year old internet tough guys, just gets so old. Especially when theres so much going on in the world of GNR atm.HAHA. I noticed that too. This IS an exciting time for GNR. Axl's closing in on 50 and he's still destroying arenas every week. He's in great spirits. Has a real hard rockin' band behind him that truly does the gig justice and brings a classic GN'R vibe to the table. The pressure of releasing Chinese Demoracy is off. RnR HOF is likely coming down the pike. Rumblings about CD II, new websites, etc. Just a great great time to kick back and enjoy it all. Been a fan since '88 and this is easily the most enjoyment I've had since 1993. rock2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AXL_N_DIZZY Posted December 6, 2011 Share Posted December 6, 2011 (edited) But there isnt a real vehicle for music videos these days other than Youtube for bands like GNR. GNR came up during the video era, and 20 years later, videos for real rock bands just arent as relavant as they once were. Stations like MTV and VH1 rarely air videos, so you have to seek them out, whether it be youtube or offical DVD releases. Theres no point in dumping millions of dollars into videos nobodies going to see, other than on mtv2 at 4 a.m. Its fucking redic.I agree with you. It's no longer an effective avenue... which hurts to say because I grew up on GN'R videos... I suppose a youtube video could get a kind of underground counter-culture pro-new-GN'R movement going... but that's pretty much how GN'R exists these days anyways IMHO. What Guns needs to do IMHO is somehow show (and it ain't going to be easy) that they're truly ready to "pick up where the old band left off" (to quote DJ Ashba). Hate to break out this tired old rumor/dream/etc... but to get massive attention back- IMHO Guns needs to do something MAJOR like KICK ASS at a Super Bowl Half-Time Show or at Euro 2012 (European Soccer Championships), or on Saturday Night Live, etc. and pair it up with professional promotion for either a CD re-release with new art-work and a quality bonus track (ideally a rocker for a blockbuster movie like YCBM back in the day), or a live blu-ray DVD, or... They've had a couple of these type of opportunities in the last decade or so- and they've always seemed to foul the pitch off. They need one more crack at it and to really step into it this time... Positively, Axl's finally got a band with not only the chops- but the right image the public expects for Guns N' Roses. The time could finally be right.Perhaps you haven't seen the videos of songs viewed by billions of people from the likes of Justin Bieber, Lady Gaga, Coldplay etc etc. Youtube in fact now has it's own top 100, similar to the Billboard 100 but based on views for the week. Youtube IS the MTV of now. Hell, artists probably get more revenue from the advertising per view on Youtube than they ever did back in the day. Guns would need big promotion to break through however, as they haven't been 'in' since the early 90's now unfortunately...Oh. Absolutely. You're definitely right about the possibilities of YouTube- especially for artists to hit the scene "out of the blue". I'm just not sure there's much evidence to support the notion that an already established act can revive itself via YouTube- especially an act like GN'R which very few people are going to regard as the "little engine that could" underdog or whatever IMHO. I could very well be wrong (and would LOVE to be wrong in this case) though...I just think Guns would get a lot more milage out of a high-profile kick ass live gig at the Super Bowl or something that rather unexpectedly knocks everyone on their asses and has people talking positively about GN'R/Axl for the first time in forever (of course GN'R would have to deliver)... Incidentally- said performance would also certainly make its way to YouTube- which would hopefully maximize the return in all the ways you're talking about too...In the end- I think the general public wants to see Axl Rose on a stage with their own eyes looking and sounding good, rocking hard and fronting a band that's worthy of the GN'R name (both in chops AND image)... Anything short of that- and I think they're likely to pay minimal attention IMHO... Edited December 6, 2011 by AXL_N_DIZZY Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Young_Gun Posted December 6, 2011 Share Posted December 6, 2011 But there isnt a real vehicle for music videos these days other than Youtube for bands like GNR. GNR came up during the video era, and 20 years later, videos for real rock bands just arent as relavant as they once were. Stations like MTV and VH1 rarely air videos, so you have to seek them out, whether it be youtube or offical DVD releases. Theres no point in dumping millions of dollars into videos nobodies going to see, other than on mtv2 at 4 a.m. Its fucking redic.I agree with you. It's no longer an effective avenue... which hurts to say because I grew up on GN'R videos... I suppose a youtube video could get a kind of underground counter-culture pro-new-GN'R movement going... but that's pretty much how GN'R exists these days anyways IMHO. What Guns needs to do IMHO is somehow show (and it ain't going to be easy) that they're truly ready to "pick up where the old band left off" (to quote DJ Ashba). Hate to break out this tired old rumor/dream/etc... but to get massive attention back- IMHO Guns needs to do something MAJOR like KICK ASS at a Super Bowl Half-Time Show or at Euro 2012 (European Soccer Championships), or on Saturday Night Live, etc. and pair it up with professional promotion for either a CD re-release with new art-work and a quality bonus track (ideally a rocker for a blockbuster movie like YCBM back in the day), or a live blu-ray DVD, or... They've had a couple of these type of opportunities in the last decade or so- and they've always seemed to foul the pitch off. They need one more crack at it and to really step into it this time... Positively, Axl's finally got a band with not only the chops- but the right image the public expects for Guns N' Roses. The time could finally be right.Perhaps you haven't seen the videos of songs viewed by billions of people from the likes of Justin Bieber, Lady Gaga, Coldplay etc etc. Youtube in fact now has it's own top 100, similar to the Billboard 100 but based on views for the week. Youtube IS the MTV of now. Hell, artists probably get more revenue from the advertising per view on Youtube than they ever did back in the day. Guns would need big promotion to break through however, as they haven't been 'in' since the early 90's now unfortunately...Oh. Absolutely. You're definitely right about the possibilities of YouTube- especially for artists to hit the scene "out of the blue". I'm just not sure there's much evidence to support the notion that an already established act can revive itself via YouTube- especially an act like GN'R which very few people are going to regard as the "little engine that could" underdog or whatever IMHO. I could very well be wrong (and would LOVE to be wrong in this case) though...I just think Guns would get a lot more milage out of a high-profile kick ass live gig at the Super Bowl or something that rather unexpectedly knocks everyone on their asses and has people talking positively about GN'R/Axl for the first time in forever (of course GN'R would have to deliver)... Incidentally- said performance would also certainly make its way to YouTube- which would hopefully maximize the return in all the ways you're talking about too...In the end- I think the general public wants to see Axl Rose on a stage with their own eyes looking and sounding good, rocking hard and fronting a band that's worthy of the GN'R name (both in chops AND image)... Anything short of that- and I think they're likely to pay minimal attention IMHO...Sadly I think the only way Guns would be asked to perform at the superbowl is if it was with the original line up Artist's KILL to be able to perform there... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest gunns5 Posted December 6, 2011 Share Posted December 6, 2011 Axl needs a great music video to make his "YouTube comeback" after the Rio incident but I have full belief that he still can Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drtydane Posted December 6, 2011 Share Posted December 6, 2011 (edited) And the fact of the matter is, Axls had several oppurtunities in the last ten years. They come, and go. And he doesn't take advantage. Had he capitalized on some of these occasions, who knows what could have come of GNR. Sadly, Axls just stubborn and insists on doing things the hard/nearly impossible way. Edited December 6, 2011 by drtydane Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest gunns5 Posted December 6, 2011 Share Posted December 6, 2011 And the fact of the matter is, Axls had several oppurtunities in the last ten years. They come, and go. And he doesn't take advantage. Had he capitalized on some of these occasions, who knows what could have come of GNR. Sadly, Axls just stubborn and insists on doing things the hard/nearly impossible way.that's assuming ther were no legal restriction in place that could have stopped him from doing certain things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amacfantasy Posted December 6, 2011 Share Posted December 6, 2011 (edited) And the fact of the matter is, Axls had several oppurtunities in the last ten years. They come, and go. And he doesn't take advantage. Had he capitalized on some of these occasions, who knows what could have come of GNR. Sadly, Axls just stubborn and insists on doing things the hard/nearly impossible way.thats what gets me aggravated with Axl as much as i love him he does some things even I have a hard time understanding. It's like ok stay reclusive and do nothing if you want to stay out of the limelight, or if your still working on your master plan(whatever that might be). But once you come out do do certain things (like finally release CD for Example), you have to come out and do it right and do it all or else your just really hurting your self in the present and future, it's almost like he cant decide if he wants to keep rocking or not. I remember once on the radio hearing Alice Cooper talk a little about this a couple years ago in regard to Axl sort of appearing indecisive about wanting to be a active rock star/create and put out music .and on a side note, i really hope Axl does not drag out thise CD1 stuff without committing to it fully, or releasing new music. Edited December 6, 2011 by amacfantasy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wasted Posted December 6, 2011 Share Posted December 6, 2011 everyone knows CD II is coming other than the band. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ITW 2012 Posted December 6, 2011 Author Share Posted December 6, 2011 I think Axl's just waiting for the big societal collapse before he releases CD II. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wasted Posted December 6, 2011 Share Posted December 6, 2011 basically next year is the end of the world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ITW 2012 Posted December 6, 2011 Author Share Posted December 6, 2011 (edited) Axl's coming back to occupy the rock world one more time. It just fitting that GNR would put out a new album in 2012. Edited December 6, 2011 by ITW 2012 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wasted Posted December 6, 2011 Share Posted December 6, 2011 Releasing CD II and III should do it.Baby boomers must die! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
axlsalinger Posted December 6, 2011 Share Posted December 6, 2011 The Legend of the Red Panda starts now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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