Doug Goldstein Interview with Mitch Lafon

[dalsh327]

Was hoping for tales of Air Supply debauchery.

[wasted]

When I listened again it seemed interesting he mentions up front how he heard Axl let everyone go, then throws his hat into the ring. I love you I'm ready to manage you again!

But Axl doesn't seem to want a manager trying to push for reunion or anything else. He just needs someone to book tours and if the label agrees to put out CD II then great.

If they did a reunion though they might need Niven for the record and Dougie to run the tour.

[Rovim]

When I listened again it seemed interesting he mentions up front how he heard Axl let everyone go, then throws his hat into the ring. I love you I'm ready to manage you again!

But Axl doesn't seem to want a manager trying to push for reunion or anything else. He just needs someone to book tours and if the label agrees to put out CD II then great.

If they did a reunion though they might need Niven for the record and Dougie to run the tour.

Axl likes the idea of a manager, I mean he needs one. But he doesn't really trust them.

TB came after nothing worked. Axl needs to give the ok for CD ll, and TB is booking tours in the mean time and we get a few interviews every year. They can't do much more without Axl's consent.

They have to agree to whatever Axl demands while they try to protect him from whatever they think can potentially harm him. It's a real family/business thing. I don't think they're evil or outta get his gold.

[wasted]

Hopefully the label agrees to put out CD II and doesn't try to hold out for a reunion.

[Ragnar]

Niven is a bitter wanker Inb4 everyone is outta get Axl.

[axlsalinger]

When I listened again it seemed interesting he mentions up front how he heard Axl let everyone go, then throws his hat into the ring. I love you I'm ready to manage you again!

But Axl doesn't seem to want a manager trying to push for reunion or anything else. He just needs someone to book tours and if the label agrees to put out CD II then great.

If they did a reunion though they might need Niven for the record and Dougie to run the tour.

It's so funny, a pretty good case can be made for the "it's the label blocking CD" argument ... but at the same time, c'mon man. Many artists give the label a hard time, not just Axl. Why would a company in a cesspool like the music business (second only to the oil business in the art of money grubbing) turn down large sums of cash just to spite a delusional rock singer? Even Del said "it's done when Axl says it's done".

We need a Universal whistleblower with access to those files.

That's a question I wish he asked Doug. Why the hell did Axl go through all that shit, just to release one album in 20 years and tour a tribute to an album with no other original members?

[wasted]

Well I'm not saying they are blocking anything just that they just put out a blu ray in 2014 so by 2018 they might be ready. But they also might want to use that record left in the contract for a best of or reunion record. They aren't falling over themselves and offering promo budgets to get it out. I just hope someone at the label wakes up one day and sees the potential.

The thing is Guns only put out 2 studio albums in the 90s at the peak of their success. So I don't feel 1 since 2000 is that bad. 1 a decade seems about right.

Edited April 3, 2015 by wasted

[dalsh327]

When I listened again it seemed interesting he mentions up front how he heard Axl let everyone go, then throws his hat into the ring. I love you I'm ready to manage you again!

But Axl doesn't seem to want a manager trying to push for reunion or anything else. He just needs someone to book tours and if the label agrees to put out CD II then great.

If they did a reunion though they might need Niven for the record and Dougie to run the tour.

It's so funny, a pretty good case can be made for the "it's the label blocking CD" argument ... but at the same time, c'mon man. Many artists give the label a hard time, not just Axl. Why would a company in a cesspool like the music business (second only to the oil business in the art of money grubbing) turn down large sums of cash just to spite a delusional rock singer? Even Del said "it's done when Axl says it's done".

We need a Universal whistleblower with access to those files.

That's a question I wish he asked Doug. Why the hell did Axl go through all that shit, just to release one album in 20 years and tour a tribute to an album with no other original members?

It's Nicole Scherzinger's fault!

I wonder how much Doug can talk about what happened between the label(s) and Guns N' Roses during the time he was still working with them.

"We had [interscope Chairman] Jimmy Iovine intervening in a not-so-productive way, and we had other guys coming and going with nutty ideas. My summation of the whole thing is that Interscope, when they took over Geffen, really led Axl to believe that Jimmy Iovine would be involved, and would help get this record done and make it happen. But basically what he did was let it completely fall apart. Then he had this great idea to bring in [producer] Roy Thomas Baker to make it sound better. All he did was re-record everything three or four different times, trying to make it sound like something it didn’t need to sound like, and spend $10 million in the process. My two cents on the whole thing is that I really think Jimmy Iovine fucked the whole thing up.

It was a bummer. Most of the songs that are on the record now were done 10 fucking years ago. But all the talking heads in the mix were saying, “Make ’em sound better! Make ’em sound better!” So we kept redoing this and that. And it ended up coming back down to the same fucking songs that they were 10 years ago, except that now they were a super-dense mishmash of a bunch of instrumentation. That whole era pretty much sums up what happened to the record industry. Those kinds of people, making those kinds of decisions and not really helping the artist." - Tommy Stinson

"There aren’t too many issues of the hundreds [we ran into] that happened as quickly as anyone would have preferred, from building my studio; finding the right players; never did find a producer; still don’t have real record company involvement or support; to getting it out and mixed and mastered.

"In my opinion, without [interscope Geffen A&M chairman] Jimmy Iovine’s involvement, it doesn’t matter who anyone talks to or what they say — virtually nothing will happen from their end."

"Jimmy [iovine] and whoever would come down to the studio. Things would be good for a month. Then, according to whoever was involved at the time from their side, someone above Jimmy would start putting pressure regarding us on him, Jimmy would start pressuring others at his label [and they] would begin doing the same with us. We get that it’s just how business — and perhaps especially this business — tends to work, but after a month of this the whole thing would get ugly and extensively interfere with getting anything productive done, and near the middle of the third month we’d arrange for Jimmy to come down again. They’d go away happy and the entire process would repeat itself over and over and over.

[Former Interscope Geffen A&M president] Tom Whalley brought in Roy Thomas Baker to produce and [A&R executive] Mark Williams suggested Marco Beltrami, among others, to play strings on the album. And Jimmy had an idea for low guitar in a track and the EQ on a drum part. That’s it as far as I’m aware. They were all good things, but in all sincerity, that’s it. Now, what efforts were made to help keep Universal or Vivendi off us for as long as possible could very well have been extensive, and in that regard either would have been or would be most appreciated. I like Jimmy, but I’ve never understood him in regard to us or this album. Everything’s always been, “That’s easy,” or “We can fix that, no problem,” but unfortunately rarely added up to any kind of reality for us until [he found] Bob Ludwig for mastering.

We’d love to have their and Jimmy’s support after this. But to continue at this juncture feeling as we do, keeping things so behind the scenes, unfortunately feels like the same ‘ol same ‘ol for all of us and, at least momentarily, a bit much to digest. Jimmy did point us in the right direction for mastering, and I believe he’s sincere in his appreciation of our record but still for whatever reasons gave up pretty early in those areas.

We feel that, unfortunately, we’ve never been really anything all that much more other than a throw it at the wall, see if it sticks, no real ground work, something to take advantage of, last quarter, cook the books, write-off, fuck this headache, hoping to get lucky scam. And, unfortunately, for all their nice words and assurances, nothing that’s happened since the week or so before the release has shown us much of anything to the contrary. So at least in regard to the U.S., for the most part I don’t look at it like we have a record company — I look at it for the most part like we have friendly but otherwise cutthroat loan sharks, and we were lucky to get what we got but feel we could have done more if they were at least, especially with some of their backgrounds, a bit more involved creatively. So in light of pirating and the mess the major labels are in, I have no sympathy for the record companies, based on our experiences in the U.S." - Axl

"Nutty Decisions" example (and possibly ties into the ChiDem remix album..)

We were on [interscope]. And I have had Jimmy Iovine, the president of that label, come up to me on every record from With Teeth onwards saying I should do some sort of urban thing — it was Timbaland for a while, then it was Pharrell for a while — because ‘that’s how you sell records.’ The idea seemed so preposterous and insulting.

I turned that record in [With Teeth]and I would get back, ‘Hey you know, you might wanna… maybe we need to put some beats on this record’. I’m not making this up. ‘What do you mean, beats?’. ‘Well, this urban thing is really taking off. You’ll get it in the club. You know, what if we had Dre or somebody…’ And the part of me that wants to be the open-minded artist says, ‘I’ll consider that'” I even went so far as Timbaland doing a – trying to do a remix – at Interscope’s dime of ‘Hand That Feeds’, which was laughably terrible.

And when I turned in [2007 album, and Reznor’s final one for Interscope] ‘Year Zero’, which I thought had the coolest beats I’ve ever come up with, I hear ‘Yeah, we need some cool beats’. It’s like, ‘You know what? Suck me'”. - Trent Reznor

Perez Hilton, 2007 - Interscope lays off 60

About 60 people lost their jobs at Interscope and Geffen Records on Thursday when both labels merged into one, PerezHilton.com has learned. Many of those laid off had been there for years.

Yet another sign that the music industry is dead.

The biggest reason for the merger and cutbacks, we’re told, is the huge failures of the Will.I.Am, Nicole Scherzinger and Eve albums, the last two which aren’t even out yet.

“It cost $18 million to make and market those three albums - all bombs,” a music industry source tells us. “Jimmy Iovine [the head of Interscope responsible for the layoffs] is the most hated man in music today!”

Did his wife ever divorce him for his relationship with Nicole? What a fucking douchebag!

(Hmmm... Jimmy had no time for Axl because he was banging the singer of the Pussycat Dolls?)

Edited April 3, 2015 by dalsh327

[Silent Jay]

When I listened again it seemed interesting he mentions up front how he heard Axl let everyone go, then throws his hat into the ring. I love you I'm ready to manage you again!

But Axl doesn't seem to want a manager trying to push for reunion or anything else. He just needs someone to book tours and if the label agrees to put out CD II then great.

If they did a reunion though they might need Niven for the record and Dougie to run the tour.

It's so funny, a pretty good case can be made for the "it's the label blocking CD" argument ... but at the same time, c'mon man. Many artists give the label a hard time, not just Axl. Why would a company in a cesspool like the music business (second only to the oil business in the art of money grubbing) turn down large sums of cash just to spite a delusional rock singer? Even Del said "it's done when Axl says it's done".

We need a Universal whistleblower with access to those files.

That's a question I wish he asked Doug. Why the hell did Axl go through all that shit, just to release one album in 20 years and tour a tribute to an album with no other original members?

I

We were on [interscope]. And I have had Jimmy Iovine, the president of that label, come up to me on every record from With Teeth onwards saying I should do some sort of urban thing — it was Timbaland for a while, then it was Pharrell for a while — because ‘that’s how you sell records.’ The idea seemed so preposterous and insulting.

I turned that record in [With Teeth]and I would get back, ‘Hey you know, you might wanna… maybe we need to put some beats on this record’. I’m not making this up. ‘What do you mean, beats?’. ‘Well, this urban thing is really taking off. You’ll get it in the club. You know, what if we had Dre or somebody…’ And the part of me that wants to be the open-minded artist says, ‘I’ll consider that'” I even went so far as Timbaland doing a – trying to do a remix – at Interscope’s dime of ‘Hand That Feeds’, which was laughably terrible.

And when I turned in [2007 album, and Reznor’s final one for Interscope] ‘Year Zero’, which I thought had the coolest beats I’ve ever come up with, I hear ‘Yeah, we need some cool beats’. It’s like, ‘You know what? Suck me'”. - Trent Reznor

[Kira]

It is interesting. You basically have in Niven and Goldstein two stories there.

I don't know who I dislike the most of those two. The servile and sycophant Goldstein versus the malevolent and bitter Niven.

Niven annoys me, he is such a self-important blowhard. And yes, DG was the worst kind of enabler. Still interesting to hear him talk though, as he is one of the few that saw all the inner workings of GnR for a long period of time. If he's in the mood to talk, the interviewer should try and pull as much info out of him as possible. I can only imagine the stories he knows. Instead ML ended up asking stupid questions about Bob Ezrin! Truly, Axl really can't trust any of these guys, as they all (with the possible exception of the original band members) want something from the GnR machine.

[dalsh327]

Silent Jay - Yeah..I know *L* , he's the "curator" for Beats Music, whatever the hell that's supposed to be.

Kira - Lafon mentioned he had to get some KISS-related questions in there, but it was a 2 hour interview and that might have been 5 minutes, but Ezrin's the one that said Axl had 2 1/2 "good" songs when they talked about working together.

I don't think he's ever had Ezrin on the show, but this covered some of ChiDem. It's obvious who he's siding with....

http://www.hit-channel.com/bob-ezrin-pink-floydalice-cooperkisspeter-gabriel-producer/2508#sthash.U7c5Tpvy.dpuf

I’ve read that at some point during the Guns N” Roses lengthy “Chinese Democracy” recordings, Axl Rose called you to evaluate what he had already done. What really happened?

Ezrin: Hm.. Well.. (ed:pause) I’m not sure!! (laughs)

I’ve read that you told him he had about 2 ½ songs or 3 ½ songs. Something like that.

Ezrin: Yeah, I probably did. It started off when Jimmy Iovine (ed: producer, chairman of Interscope/ Geffen) asked me for a big favour. They were stuck, they were stuck in a studio in North Hollywood for years with Roy Thomas Baker (ed: Queen’s producer), and nothing was happening. They were paying enormous rental bills and they were paying people to sit around the studio waiting for Axl to show up and it was just a disaster. I agreed to go there immediately and listen to a bunch of stuff. What I heard was – I don’t know how to say this without be insulting, I don’t want to be insulting because he worked very hard on it – but what I heard was something that he had painted over too many times. So, by the time I heard it, the original content was lost and it was just a highly produced piece of something… Anyway, I agreed to help out if Axl would agree to work with me, which he did. He had the idea that the only person who could finish the album with him was me, based on what I don’t know. I came, I listened, I said to him I will listen and will give you notes we will see together. I spent a lot of time listening. I went to see Jimmy Iovine and I gave him my perception of the situation, including the fact that they had to get out of Rumbo Studios immediately – not because Rumbo is a bad studio, it’s a wonderful studio – but because they needed to be closer to the scrutiny of the record company and Jimmy’s team, so there could be at least some measure of control. And I recommended we move them to the Village Recorder in West Hollywood. So, they did that, and moved everybody there. I had to wait to talk to Axl because he avoided me. He was nervous about hearing what I had to say. We finally met, on a night when my wife – who was then my girlfriend – came down from Toronto to visit me and we were having a dinner with friends at my house. She was cooking when I got a phone call from Jimmy Iovine saying that I needed to come meet Axl and I said “I can’t tonight. I’m booked”. And Jimmy replied saying “ok” (laughs). No he didn’t. When he wants something, he really knows how to get it.

Anyway, he basically guilt-tripped me and I told him “Ok, I will be there at 8pm and I will leave there at 8.30, whether Axl shows up or not”, because that was Axl. Because last time we had an appointment at 10pm and Axl showed up at 2 in the morning. “So tell Axl that’s it”. I went to the restaurant at 8 and a team of Axl supporters and hangers-on showed up and joined me at the table – and no Axl. Axl finally came about 8:25 (laughs). Anyway, I told him basically what you’ve heard. I didn’t tell him “you have 2 ½ songs” and when he sat down, he started saying me that he has finished the record. And I said “Axl, we are not ready to mix this record. This record isn’t ready to be mixed”. I said “there are two great songs on it and I know that you’re capable of more, that’s the reason why I’m here. You’re such a great talent and I would do you a disservice if I didn’t tell you the truth, which is that most of the songs aren’t great. But I‘m very happy to help you get there and I believe that it’s possible, if you would like to continue to work on the record, to make it better”. He said “I don’t agree with that. We are ready to mix”. And I told him “you have my number, if you change your mind let me know, but I have a dinner party at home now and I had to go”. I left and I haven’t heard from him since. It was years later when it came out.

[Chris 55]

I basically 100% agree with Niven.

Basically?

You agree with trying to pass lyrics over for Axl to sing?

I was wondering, if Axl didn't care what people thought, why say in the Eddie Trunk interview that he kept up on rumors? Why the board chats?

[Kira]

Silent Jay - Yeah..I know *L* , he's the "curator" for Beats Music, whatever the hell that's supposed to be.

Kira - Lafon mentioned he had to get some KISS-related questions in there, but it was a 2 hour interview and that might have been 5 minutes, but Ezrin's the one that said Axl had 2 1/2 "good" songs when they talked about working together.

I don't think he's ever had Ezrin on the show, but this covered some of ChiDem. It's obvious who he's siding with....

http://www.hit-channel.com/bob-ezrin-pink-floydalice-cooperkisspeter-gabriel-producer/2508#sthash.U7c5Tpvy.dpuf

I’ve read that at some point during the Guns N” Roses lengthy “Chinese Democracy” recordings, Axl Rose called you to evaluate what he had already done. What really happened?

Ezrin: Hm.. Well.. (ed:pause) I’m not sure!! (laughs)

I’ve read that you told him he had about 2 ½ songs or 3 ½ songs. Something like that.

Ezrin: Yeah, I probably did. It started off when Jimmy Iovine (ed: producer, chairman of Interscope/ Geffen) asked me for a big favour. They were stuck, they were stuck in a studio in North Hollywood for years with Roy Thomas Baker (ed: Queen’s producer), and nothing was happening. They were paying enormous rental bills and they were paying people to sit around the studio waiting for Axl to show up and it was just a disaster. I agreed to go there immediately and listen to a bunch of stuff. What I heard was – I don’t know how to say this without be insulting, I don’t want to be insulting because he worked very hard on it – but what I heard was something that he had painted over too many times. So, by the time I heard it, the original content was lost and it was just a highly produced piece of something… Anyway, I agreed to help out if Axl would agree to work with me, which he did. He had the idea that the only person who could finish the album with him was me, based on what I don’t know. I came, I listened, I said to him I will listen and will give you notes we will see together. I spent a lot of time listening. I went to see Jimmy Iovine and I gave him my perception of the situation, including the fact that they had to get out of Rumbo Studios immediately – not because Rumbo is a bad studio, it’s a wonderful studio – but because they needed to be closer to the scrutiny of the record company and Jimmy’s team, so there could be at least some measure of control. And I recommended we move them to the Village Recorder in West Hollywood. So, they did that, and moved everybody there. I had to wait to talk to Axl because he avoided me. He was nervous about hearing what I had to say. We finally met, on a night when my wife – who was then my girlfriend – came down from Toronto to visit me and we were having a dinner with friends at my house. She was cooking when I got a phone call from Jimmy Iovine saying that I needed to come meet Axl and I said “I can’t tonight. I’m booked”. And Jimmy replied saying “ok” (laughs). No he didn’t. When he wants something, he really knows how to get it.

Anyway, he basically guilt-tripped me and I told him “Ok, I will be there at 8pm and I will leave there at 8.30, whether Axl shows up or not”, because that was Axl. Because last time we had an appointment at 10pm and Axl showed up at 2 in the morning. “So tell Axl that’s it”. I went to the restaurant at 8 and a team of Axl supporters and hangers-on showed up and joined me at the table – and no Axl. Axl finally came about 8:25 (laughs). Anyway, I told him basically what you’ve heard. I didn’t tell him “you have 2 ½ songs” and when he sat down, he started saying me that he has finished the record. And I said “Axl, we are not ready to mix this record. This record isn’t ready to be mixed”. I said “there are two great songs on it and I know that you’re capable of more, that’s the reason why I’m here. You’re such a great talent and I would do you a disservice if I didn’t tell you the truth, which is that most of the songs aren’t great. But I‘m very happy to help you get there and I believe that it’s possible, if you would like to continue to work on the record, to make it better”. He said “I don’t agree with that. We are ready to mix”. And I told him “you have my number, if you change your mind let me know, but I have a dinner party at home now and I had to go”. I left and I haven’t heard from him since. It was years later when it came out.

The Bob Ezrin thing was just an example, but to me ML spent too much time kind of passively aggressively bitching about Axl. There were more interesting things he could have delved into.

When DG brought up that his brother was manic depressive and how he had some history dealing with that; I think ML should have questioned DG more on what he thought the root of Axl's issues were.

[wasted]

Bob Ezrin is the Yoko Ono of CD.

[Dr. Who]

I don't know who I dislike the most of those two. The servile and sycophant Goldstein versus the malevolent and bitter Niven.

I hate Niven more because he bashes Axl even for stuff that was good, like Coma and November Rain.

Agreed. That 'Coma? You put me in one! LOL LOL' comment was horrible.

Especially when the fact is musically the song is Slash's. He hates Axl so much that he bashed a song that is more often thought of as an Axl epic, which was actually written by Slash. If he'd remembered Slash wrote Coma he'd have praised the song.

[dalsh327]

It was funny how he called Duswalt a "valet" but that's been a foot in the door for a lot of personal assistants and it would have been interesting to hear stories about the other people in the GNR camp and not just the band members. He should have gotten more into what was going on with the courtroom stuff, but it didn't come across that he was around Axl much during the late 90s.

He should have asked about the first time he met Stephanie Seymour.

[Dr. Who]

I didn't know Doug also managed (original) Blind Melon.

[Apollo]

Silent Jay - Yeah..I know *L* , he's the "curator" for Beats Music, whatever the hell that's supposed to be.

Kira - Lafon mentioned he had to get some KISS-related questions in there, but it was a 2 hour interview and that might have been 5 minutes, but Ezrin's the one that said Axl had 2 1/2 "good" songs when they talked about working together.

I don't think he's ever had Ezrin on the show, but this covered some of ChiDem. It's obvious who he's siding with....

http://www.hit-channel.com/bob-ezrin-pink-floydalice-cooperkisspeter-gabriel-producer/2508#sthash.U7c5Tpvy.dpuf

I’ve read that at some point during the Guns N” Roses lengthy “Chinese Democracy” recordings, Axl Rose called you to evaluate what he had already done. What really happened?

Ezrin: Hm.. Well.. (ed:pause) I’m not sure!! (laughs)

I’ve read that you told him he had about 2 ½ songs or 3 ½ songs. Something like that.

Ezrin: Yeah, I probably did. It started off when Jimmy Iovine (ed: producer, chairman of Interscope/ Geffen) asked me for a big favour. They were stuck, they were stuck in a studio in North Hollywood for years with Roy Thomas Baker (ed: Queen’s producer), and nothing was happening. They were paying enormous rental bills and they were paying people to sit around the studio waiting for Axl to show up and it was just a disaster. I agreed to go there immediately and listen to a bunch of stuff. What I heard was – I don’t know how to say this without be insulting, I don’t want to be insulting because he worked very hard on it – but what I heard was something that he had painted over too many times. So, by the time I heard it, the original content was lost and it was just a highly produced piece of something… Anyway, I agreed to help out if Axl would agree to work with me, which he did. He had the idea that the only person who could finish the album with him was me, based on what I don’t know. I came, I listened, I said to him I will listen and will give you notes we will see together. I spent a lot of time listening. I went to see Jimmy Iovine and I gave him my perception of the situation, including the fact that they had to get out of Rumbo Studios immediately – not because Rumbo is a bad studio, it’s a wonderful studio – but because they needed to be closer to the scrutiny of the record company and Jimmy’s team, so there could be at least some measure of control. And I recommended we move them to the Village Recorder in West Hollywood. So, they did that, and moved everybody there. I had to wait to talk to Axl because he avoided me. He was nervous about hearing what I had to say. We finally met, on a night when my wife – who was then my girlfriend – came down from Toronto to visit me and we were having a dinner with friends at my house. She was cooking when I got a phone call from Jimmy Iovine saying that I needed to come meet Axl and I said “I can’t tonight. I’m booked”. And Jimmy replied saying “ok” (laughs). No he didn’t. When he wants something, he really knows how to get it.

Anyway, he basically guilt-tripped me and I told him “Ok, I will be there at 8pm and I will leave there at 8.30, whether Axl shows up or not”, because that was Axl. Because last time we had an appointment at 10pm and Axl showed up at 2 in the morning. “So tell Axl that’s it”. I went to the restaurant at 8 and a team of Axl supporters and hangers-on showed up and joined me at the table – and no Axl. Axl finally came about 8:25 (laughs). Anyway, I told him basically what you’ve heard. I didn’t tell him “you have 2 ½ songs” and when he sat down, he started saying me that he has finished the record. And I said “Axl, we are not ready to mix this record. This record isn’t ready to be mixed”. I said “there are two great songs on it and I know that you’re capable of more, that’s the reason why I’m here. You’re such a great talent and I would do you a disservice if I didn’t tell you the truth, which is that most of the songs aren’t great. But I‘m very happy to help you get there and I believe that it’s possible, if you would like to continue to work on the record, to make it better”. He said “I don’t agree with that. We are ready to mix”. And I told him “you have my number, if you change your mind let me know, but I have a dinner party at home now and I had to go”. I left and I haven’t heard from him since. It was years later when it came out.

And that, my friends, is why we have one album in the last 20 years.

I would love for Axl to take 20 songs out of the vault and give them to DJ and let him produce an album.

[Silent Jay]

I think streaming services are ruining everything.

[dalsh327]

I think streaming services are ruining everything.

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/kendrick-lamar-pimp-a-butterfly-782802

A Spotify representative confirmed that the 9.6 million represents any stream from the record, meaning Lamar's new long-player brought in about $44,160 in a single day globally, according to Billboard estimates.

[Silent Jay]

I think streaming services are ruining everything.

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/kendrick-lamar-pimp-a-butterfly-782802

A Spotify representative confirmed that the 9.6 million represents any stream from the record, meaning Lamar's new long-player brought in about $44,160 in a single day globally, according to Billboard estimates.

Exactly.

Considering this as a streaming record, the numbers are ridiculous.

[wasted]

Silent Jay - Yeah..I know *L* , he's the "curator" for Beats Music, whatever the hell that's supposed to be.

Kira - Lafon mentioned he had to get some KISS-related questions in there, but it was a 2 hour interview and that might have been 5 minutes, but Ezrin's the one that said Axl had 2 1/2 "good" songs when they talked about working together.

I don't think he's ever had Ezrin on the show, but this covered some of ChiDem. It's obvious who he's siding with....

http://www.hit-channel.com/bob-ezrin-pink-floydalice-cooperkisspeter-gabriel-producer/2508#sthash.U7c5Tpvy.dpuf

Ive read that at some point during the Guns N Roses lengthy Chinese Democracy recordings, Axl Rose called you to evaluate what he had already done. What really happened?

Ezrin: Hm.. Well.. (ed:pause) Im not sure!! (laughs)

Ive read that you told him he had about 2 ½ songs or 3 ½ songs. Something like that.

Ezrin: Yeah, I probably did. It started off when Jimmy Iovine (ed: producer, chairman of Interscope/ Geffen) asked me for a big favour. They were stuck, they were stuck in a studio in North Hollywood for years with Roy Thomas Baker (ed: Queens producer), and nothing was happening. They were paying enormous rental bills and they were paying people to sit around the studio waiting for Axl to show up and it was just a disaster. I agreed to go there immediately and listen to a bunch of stuff. What I heard was I dont know how to say this without be insulting, I dont want to be insulting because he worked very hard on it but what I heard was something that he had painted over too many times. So, by the time I heard it, the original content was lost and it was just a highly produced piece of something Anyway, I agreed to help out if Axl would agree to work with me, which he did. He had the idea that the only person who could finish the album with him was me, based on what I dont know. I came, I listened, I said to him I will listen and will give you notes we will see together. I spent a lot of time listening. I went to see Jimmy Iovine and I gave him my perception of the situation, including the fact that they had to get out of Rumbo Studios immediately not because Rumbo is a bad studio, its a wonderful studio but because they needed to be closer to the scrutiny of the record company and Jimmys team, so there could be at least some measure of control. And I recommended we move them to the Village Recorder in West Hollywood. So, they did that, and moved everybody there. I had to wait to talk to Axl because he avoided me. He was nervous about hearing what I had to say. We finally met, on a night when my wife who was then my girlfriend came down from Toronto to visit me and we were having a dinner with friends at my house. She was cooking when I got a phone call from Jimmy Iovine saying that I needed to come meet Axl and I said I cant tonight. Im booked. And Jimmy replied saying ok (laughs). No he didnt. When he wants something, he really knows how to get it.

Anyway, he basically guilt-tripped me and I told him Ok, I will be there at 8pm and I will leave there at 8.30, whether Axl shows up or not, because that was Axl. Because last time we had an appointment at 10pm and Axl showed up at 2 in the morning. So tell Axl thats it. I went to the restaurant at 8 and a team of Axl supporters and hangers-on showed up and joined me at the table and no Axl. Axl finally came about 8:25 (laughs). Anyway, I told him basically what youve heard. I didnt tell him you have 2 ½ songs and when he sat down, he started saying me that he has finished the record. And I said Axl, we are not ready to mix this record. This record isnt ready to be mixed. I said there are two great songs on it and I know that youre capable of more, thats the reason why Im here. Youre such a great talent and I would do you a disservice if I didnt tell you the truth, which is that most of the songs arent great. But Im very happy to help you get there and I believe that its possible, if you would like to continue to work on the record, to make it better. He said I dont agree with that. We are ready to mix. And I told him you have my number, if you change your mind let me know, but I have a dinner party at home now and I had to go. I left and I havent heard from him since. It was years later when it came out.

And that, my friends, is why we have one album in the last 20 years.

I would love for Axl to take 20 songs out of the vault and give them to DJ and let him produce an album.

Which kind of suggests its not all Axls fault the delays. When Axl says its ready to mix, that's go time for the label in 2000.

Is the album we got any different than what they had in 2000? Maybe it's possible some songs weren't finished and others were swapped out.

Beavan says they had a record before RTB and Ezrin mess.

I think early track list maybe

The General

Oh My God

Silkworms

Chinese Democracy

The Blues

There was a Time

Catcher in the Rye

Riad n the Bedouins

IRS

Atlas Shrugged

Madagascar

Prostitute

Better, Shacklers, Scraped, Sorry, ITW all seem as they were finished in 2004. After Costanzo session in some cases. Speculation really. No This I Love, dusted off in 2007.

I think Ezrin just wanted a job helping Axl finish the record. 2/3 good songs in 2000 is good enough. Chi dem, The Blues, Catcher as singles lets go!

[Rovim]

^^^

The delays didn't just hurt the album. There were cases where songs got a chance to be more developed. There Was A Time without Bucket's outro in 1999 had no release to it. Major improvement imo.

Bucket's second I.R.S solo and how Axl still used Robin's solo but moved it to a more proper place in the song.

Riad had a horrid solo that was changed in the final version.

Better had shitty word play in the chorus and Axl took that out and also dropped the bpm a little and made it perfect.

Bumble's tapping outro in Shackler's is great. Another cool addition.

There are more examples.

[wasted]

Yes that is true, I'm happy CD is the way it is. Rons parts too add that prog metal element that brought those 90s elements into 2008.

So maybe Ezrin was right. But I have a feeling that there was a record and it might have smoothed Axls career out. This way is the record is great but people can't listen to it without thinking fuck you 17 years etc.

And label cutting Axl off in 2004, well they probably could have got it out if they had Ezrin killed in 2000.

[Rovim]

Yes that is true, I'm happy CD is the way it is. Rons parts too add that prog metal element that brought those 90s elements into 2008.

So maybe Ezrin was right. But I have a feeling that there was a record and it might have smoothed Axls career out. This way is the record is great but people can't listen to it without thinking fuck you 17 years etc.

And label cutting Axl off in 2004, well they probably could have got it out if they had Ezrin killed in 2000.

It's funny to think none of this shit is a factor for CD ll and it's release and probably haven't been for years. I'm just really curious to know exactly what is preventing Axl from releasing a finished album, the second half of his magnum opus.

Even if 2016 is the year, I'd imagine giving an album title and some more info about the album will really be harmless. Like I know it's coming, but we don't really know much about a finished product.

I'm ready for Axl's The Godfather ll now. My best guess is somewhere in 2016.

Edited April 6, 2015 by Rovim