CD > AFD

[Nintari]

People go ape-shiit for Lady Gaga and Justin Bieber songs too.

Why? Because they are POP songs. Easy songs to sing-along and dance-to.

AFD is a POP ROCK album. So was all of Nirvana's album.

People like POP songs - because that's how the human mind is wired.

You have to be a musician to really go ape-shiit for CD. And that is what I am saying. CD is MUSICALLY on a higer level than anything GnR has done in the past. Musicians will respect the work on CD more than they do with AFD. But the average fan, will like AFD more because it is simpler music.

In regards to the AFD sessions, all you have to do is compare the solo projects of the ex-GnR members. None of their solo projects, including VRs work, resembles what was done on AFD or UYI.

CD surprisingly, has more in common with AFD (and UYI) than any stuff put out by the old-GnR members. So that should tell you who is the most important member of GnR is because he is the only one still left.

Fans do not go nearly as apeshit at a cd song than they do for the classic material. I may not have been to a concert, but I've talked to people that have been, on and offline, and the speakers from the youtube videos must be playing tricks on me. I've heard people tell me all the time the nu songs lack the enthusiam from the audience that they give for the old stuff. I'm 21, and the fact that that material speaks more of me than the "relevant" stuff does should say something. Not that I'm saying chinese democracy was god awful. But it didn't have nearly the same impact appetite did.

And again, I wasn't at the appetite sessions, but neither were you, sailaway. All of them have described appetite as equal input, which is why they booked after axl took everything over. Reading interviews, watching them play, they were a band. Can't really say the same for them now....

AFD is a pop record? You really have no idea what "pop" is do you?

Pop is short for popular. It's songs that are written using a "pop" or "popular" formula. Intro,verse,chorus,verse,chorus,bridge,solo,outro etc. That's what makes music "pop". People over the years have forgotten what the term "pop" really means. It's probably due to MJ being called the king of pop. Nevermind,AFD,Metallica's Black album...all of these are pop records. Any song written using the standard formula, loaded with hooks is a pop song.

[Guest siliconmessiah]

Pop is short for popular. It's songs that are written using a "pop" or "popular" formula. Intro,verse,chorus,verse,chorus,bridge,solo,outro etc. That's what makes music "pop". People over the years have forgotten what the term "pop" really means. It's probably due to MJ being called the king of pop. Nevermind,AFD,Metallica's Black album...all of these are pop records. Any song written using the standard formula, loaded with hooks is a pop song.

BIGGEST FAIL ON THIS BOARD TODAY.

CALLING AFD AND BLACK ALBUM POP-ALBUMS.

The caracteristics of pop music are:

an aim of appealing to a general audience, rather than to a particular sub-culture or ideology

an emphasis on craftsmanship rather than formal "artistic" qualities

an emphasis on recording, production, and technology, over live performance

a tendency to reflect existing trends rather than progressive developments

much pop music is intended to encourage dancing, or it uses dance-oriented beats or rhythms

[Kill Devil Hill]

Pop is short for popular. It's songs that are written using a "pop" or "popular" formula. Intro,verse,chorus,verse,chorus,bridge,solo,outro etc. That's what makes music "pop". People over the years have forgotten what the term "pop" really means. It's probably due to MJ being called the king of pop. Nevermind,AFD,Metallica's Black album...all of these are pop records. Any song written using the standard formula, loaded with hooks is a pop song.

BIGGEST FAIL ON THIS BOARD TODAY.

CALLING AFD AND BLACK ALBUM POP-ALBUMS.

The caracteristics of pop music are:

an aim of appealing to a general audience, rather than to a particular sub-culture or ideology

an emphasis on craftsmanship rather than formal "artistic" qualities

an emphasis on recording, production, and technology, over live performance

a tendency to reflect existing trends rather than progressive developments

much pop music is intended to encourage dancing, or it uses dance-oriented beats or rhythms

Well, AFD does have a dance-element. I've always seen it as hard rock meets dance. The definition of pop has completely changed over the years, so I don't see why we'd have to stick with the original definition...

[Guest siliconmessiah]

Pop is short for popular. It's songs that are written using a "pop" or "popular" formula. Intro,verse,chorus,verse,chorus,bridge,solo,outro etc. That's what makes music "pop". People over the years have forgotten what the term "pop" really means. It's probably due to MJ being called the king of pop. Nevermind,AFD,Metallica's Black album...all of these are pop records. Any song written using the standard formula, loaded with hooks is a pop song.

BIGGEST FAIL ON THIS BOARD TODAY.

CALLING AFD AND BLACK ALBUM POP-ALBUMS.

The caracteristics of pop music are:

an aim of appealing to a general audience, rather than to a particular sub-culture or ideology

an emphasis on craftsmanship rather than formal "artistic" qualities

an emphasis on recording, production, and technology, over live performance

a tendency to reflect existing trends rather than progressive developments

much pop music is intended to encourage dancing, or it uses dance-oriented beats or rhythms

Well, AFD does have a dance-element. I've always seen it as hard rock meets dance. The definition of pop has completely changed over the years, so I don't see why we'd have to stick with the original definition...

Come on.

I can find dance elements in this to.

But hell, I won´t call it pop-music. I won´t ever back down on this opinion. AFD and The Black Album is in no way pop-albums.

But in 1989, however, Madonna, Milli Vanilli was in the top of the charts bringing pop-music to the masses.

Edited September 4, 2011 by siliconmessiah

[Kill Devil Hill]

Wasn't arguing with you. I was trying to say that that was the only part of the definition it fit in and that we shouldn't have to follow the outdated definition Nintari provided.

[Guest siliconmessiah]

Wasn't arguing with you. I was trying to say that that was the only part of the definition it fit in and that we shouldn't have to follow the outdated definition Nintari provided.

Well sorry, and sorry to Nintari too.

(Guess I´m a little grumpy having ended my relationship a couple of days ago and battling todays hangover. =/)

Edited September 4, 2011 by siliconmessiah

[Kill Devil Hill]

Nah, I was unclear. Sorry to hear about your relationship.

[TiedHands]

I agree that AFD was a "pop"-ish album. But there are different contexts in which to use that word. It doesn't mean pop like Britney Spears or Bieber pop. Just like I've heard countless times 'Better' be described as pop-metal, and hell, back before Rock Band 2 came out and "Chicken Dinner" leaked, Harmonix were describing Shackler as a "poppy Guns song". That whole "Don't ever try to tell me..." section is pretty damn catchy and accessbile. Everyone just digs the hell out of that part...

[sailaway]

Pop is short for popular. It's songs that are written using a "pop" or "popular" formula. Intro,verse,chorus,verse,chorus,bridge,solo,outro etc. That's what makes music "pop". People over the years have forgotten what the term "pop" really means. It's probably due to MJ being called the king of pop. Nevermind,AFD,Metallica's Black album...all of these are pop records. Any song written using the standard formula, loaded with hooks is a pop song.

BIGGEST FAIL ON THIS BOARD TODAY.

CALLING AFD AND BLACK ALBUM POP-ALBUMS.

The caracteristics of pop music are:

an aim of appealing to a general audience, rather than to a particular sub-culture or ideology

an emphasis on craftsmanship rather than formal "artistic" qualities

an emphasis on recording, production, and technology, over live performance

a tendency to reflect existing trends rather than progressive developments

much pop music is intended to encourage dancing, or it uses dance-oriented beats or rhythms

This,right on Nintari !

There's always been a pretty decent balance of give and take. Don't act like everything's so one sided.

Why do u spend time here if u don't like what Axl has done, you don't like the new band and u don't like any of the music Axl has put out over the past 15 years?

When people criticize Slash or VR you tell them to leave and go support a band that they enjoy. You said that. So why don't u follow your own advise?

Why is it ok for you to constantly bash Axl and CD.....buy u get uptight if somebody criticizes Slash. A bit of a double standard?

We went over what I said ages ago, ages ago in PM. What I said was if you didn't like, there's other bands you can listen to. I don't tell people to leave. Trust me, even when Funral was at his worst, or Bacardimayne went into uber cupcake mode, they post, guys like Jim Bob, Warchild, Miser etc. I say let them. They eventually bury themselves.

As for posting here, AFD is one of my favorite albums of all time, as I assume it's yours and everyone else in this forum's. If someone wants to have a go at it. We're gonna discuss it.

Agreed !

[sailaway]

Calling Bobbo "BoBo" is one of the most childish things I've ever read. I don't agree with some of his points, but come on. We can have a good debate or we can have a lame Internet war.

Didn't realize you two were a couple

I think each progressive Guns Album shows different circumstances,situations,and Growth.

I'm not fond of TSI,but it did have a few good tracks.

[wasted]

It's all just pop music, that's all it is, pop music.

[Majestic Beast]

Laughing Out Loud.

[GN'R Lies]

This thread is ridiculous

[Montrealer]

This thread is ridiculous

Yeah it is. Makes me remember that I haven't suspend anyone in a long time

Guys, back on topic please. Get a room or something!

On topic :

I have to admit that I'm surprise that I've listened to CD more than AFD.

[Kill Devil Hill]

Calling Bobbo "BoBo" is one of the most childish things I've ever read. I don't agree with some of his points, but come on. We can have a good debate or we can have a lame Internet war.

Didn't realize you two were a couple

I think each progressive Guns Album shows different circumstances,situations,and Growth.

I'm not fond of TSI,but it did have a few good tracks.

Cool response!!!!

I agree with your second point. The UYI albums make a lot more sense, too, after you hear CD

[Lines&Noses]

With CD, Axl has fulfilled his promise to outdo AFD.

This is the conclusion I have come to.

Clearly, CD and AFD are different beasts created in different eras.

But musically, CD is much better than AFD. From a musician point of view, CD blows AFD away. Anybody could cover the songs on AFD with ease. CD is not so easy to cover.

The lyrics on CD are also much more matured than on AFD. Obviously, a more grown up, wiser, and mature Axl will give your more mature lyrics.

Of course CD is not going to outsell AFD. But that's because of timing and a different era. When AFD was released, it was simply the right album for the generation of young people at the time.

CD lyrically is not going to speak to the mass population of young people today, simply because Axl is from a different era.

More fans may be able to sing along to the songs on AFD than on CD. But musically, musicians will find CD to be much more influential.

For these reasons, I truly honestly believe that CD is much better than AFD.

What do you think and why?

Can you give examples?

I can give you examples why I think it is weaker at least lyrically.

The chorus on IRS is kind of cirnge-worthy, and the inane rhyming on this I love to name just two.

Overall I much rather the angry Axl rallying against the world rather the world weary axl feeling sorry for himself.

I find I can connect with the AFD lyrics much more.

Musically its down to taste I suppose, but overall I much prefer AFD and its genius pop-rock riffs rather than the ballad heavy CD.

Also your point about CD being influential? I can hear the influences on CD everything from elton john to NIN but what music do you think CD has influenced in the last 2.5 years?

Even setting aside which is better musically surely appetite will be more influential simply because more people have heard it?

There are bands which were obviously influences like Love/Hate and even Nirvana in so much as they were reacting against the glam rock thing.

[wasted]

AFD is the classic, CD is the masterpiece.

[auad]

AFD is the classic, CD is the masterpiece.

in my opinion...AFD is the definitive GNR masterpiece, CD is the evolution and upgrade.

[Guest siliconmessiah]

I think comparing these two is not possible in any way.

Different band - different times.

[wasted]

AFD is the classic, CD is the masterpiece.

in my opinion...AFD is the definitive GNR masterpiece, CD is the evolution and upgrade.

I feel like AFD is too derivative to be a masterpiece. the lyrics are a bit immature, not much originality going on. it's still a classic which might be better than being a masterpiece lol

even if you breakdown CD to classic rock meets nu metal. that hasn't been done before. you can argue it wasn't done well but I think it was. so I rate over AFD.

obviously GNR will always be remembered for those early songs, but CD might like the Exile on the Main Street type album. not well received but in end gained status.

I think comparing these two is not possible in any way.

Different band - different times.

same band, different members?

[Guest siliconmessiah]

same band, different members?

Well, at least the same name.

I wouldn´t say that it´s the same band at all.

But don´t get me wrong, I am a fan of both old and nu, well I was a bigger fan and had more hope until Bucket, Brain & Finck left.

Edited September 6, 2011 by siliconmessiah

[auad]

AFD is the classic, CD is the masterpiece.

in my opinion...AFD is the definitive GNR masterpiece, CD is the evolution and upgrade.

I feel like AFD is too derivative to be a masterpiece. the lyrics are a bit immature, not much originality going on. it's still a classic which might be better than being a masterpiece lol

even if you breakdown CD to classic rock meets nu metal. that hasn't been done before. you can argue it wasn't done well but I think it was. so I rate over AFD.

obviously GNR will always be remembered for those early songs, but CD might like the Exile on the Main Street type album. not well received but in end gained status.

I think comparing these two is not possible in any way.

Different band - different times.

same band, different members?

"that hasn't been done before".

i don't think so.

NIN made all that Axl wanted to, and much better.

[moreblack]

AFD is a masterpiece, kid yourself not about that.

[wasted]

I think they for example mixed NIN with more classic rock influences, classic GNR. that's why to me it's new. It's not just a copy of NIN obviously. only really Better sounds like NIN to me, only a little bit.

[auad]

I think they for example mixed NIN with more classic rock influences, classic GNR. that's why to me it's new. It's not just a copy of NIN obviously. only really Better sounds like NIN to me, only a little bit.

i'm a fan of both bands, but in my opinion, NIN sounds better to me, specially in mix industrial sound with classic rock, listen "the hand that feeds", for example.