Why do the UYI albums seem to get bashed here?

[gunsfanoldie]

I always thought they were a bit bloated but with age I've actually grown to like almost every song off those albums. I just heard them both in sequence after going to the show last week and I can say there are only two songs off each album I really don't enjoy. Double Talkin' Jive has never been my cup of tea, Garden Of Eden has never interested me, although at times I've had fun singing it while blasting it in the car with friends. And the alternate Don't Cry and My World, which both just seemed pointless to me and one of those is just God awful.

Seems those albums get a bad rap around here and I honestly found them to be incredibly consistent with a recent listen. Some songs are a bit long and yes its a lot to handle at once, but theres hardly a bad song in there. A lot of great hard rocking material on there. I'm not saying Chinese Democracy isn't better than them, but it seems whenever anyone on here makes a list of their best albums, these two get placed towards the bottom, while Chinese Democracy is usually sitting comfortably under Appetite. Although GNR Lies always seems to be low on those lists as well and thats always been one of my favorites.

Can anyone explain? Have people not listened to them in awhile? Did people listen to them too much? IMO I find either one of those albums easier to get through than Chinese Democracy, which has its stretches of songs I don't enjoy even though I think the album is really good overall.

[Changes]

An interesting thing is that most people seem to agree that they should have only released one album because there was too many fillers/bad songs. But when listing what should have been on that one album, the songs differ A LOT between people. The conclusion is that the reason they should have released one album is because it was hard digesting so many "non hits" or fillers if you will, at once. If they released say, 12 songs at a time 6 months a part I think many of the less popular songs would have been better received since people would have time to get to know them.

[RJ88]

because people need something to bitch about

take for instance the current setlist. people that don't even go the any of the shows have a need to bitch about "not playing any new songs"

[alaskagunner]

Ive always koved the illusions albums.. hell anything gnr hss done for that matter. before chinese the bashing was always on those two albums as being overdone or not true gnr. Now 90% of the attentions on the later album and illusions are more widely accepted it seems by more users here. funny how that works isnt it? just cant please some people.

[gunsfanoldie]

I just seem to think its funny that they don't get rated very highly around here, yet those are the songs people want to see getting played the most.

And Oh My God of course .

I can see the argument about being one album. But again, as I've just gone back and listened to the whole thing for the first time in awhile, its hard to think what shouldn't be on there thats great. The different scenario's I've thought up all involve filling up one album and still having great songs not make the cut.

Edited December 5, 2011 by gunsfanoldie

[Aussiegun]

I like the bloated stuff the best on the UYI albums. The rocking songs apart from Bad Obsession, Double talkin Jive and Dont Damn Me arent anything special. Even YCBM isnt that great - just a bit overhyped because it was in an Arnold movie. None of the softer songs hold a candle to Patience. Dead Horse and Yesterdays the best of rest.

[wasted]

I like all the songs I just find the tracklisting weird. like You could be mine the back end end of uyi II? surely you open with that bad boy.

[Kill Devil Hill]

I like all the songs I just find the tracklisting weird. like You could be mine the back end end of uyi II? surely you open with that bad boy.

+1 Perfect Crime should also be an opener.

[saber_]

Matt Sorum

[Flayer]

They don't really get bashed much around here, I've always found that they get bashed more outside in the general media - inevitably described as having a few gems, but "bloated" or "overbearing" or something like that. Everyone around here seems to have a few personal favorites - Estranged, YCBM, Locomotive, Coma, KOHD, Live and Let Die, Civil War, and November Rain being most common, and then a few others unique to each person - my other favorites include Back Off Bitch, Dust N Bones, 14 Years, and Garden of Eden (and I also like Get in the Ring and My World).

[drtydane]

Def my favorite from Gnr. I just can't ever decide which one I like better. It often changes so I just consider them one album. Otherwise id never know

[trqster]

UYI albums were the ones that made GnR as huge as they were. As such they're classic masterpieces of Rock whether you like or not....

[dalsh327]

The only debate about it now is whether they should've spaced the releases under a year apart and paced things out more, took more breaks after each leg of the tour. There's not a hell of a lot of difference between how Physical Graffiti was put together and UYI. I don't think any of the long songs on Graffiti are bloated.

[Gagarin]

One thing they have going against them is that they were different. And they weren't AFD.

Personally, I've listened to songs from UYI II and spun the whole album more than I have AFD.

The Highs are High and the lows are...Low. "Get In The Ring".

I actually dug My World. Great parking lot crank-up-your-radio song.

[moreblack]

who says they have a bad rap here? they don't. UYIs are good albums.

Edited December 5, 2011 by moreblack

[RussTCB]

I always thought they were a bit bloated but with age I've actually grown to like almost every song off those albums. I just heard them both in sequence after going to the show last week and I can say there are only two songs off each album I really don't enjoy. Double Talkin' Jive has never been my cup of tea, Garden Of Eden has never interested me, although at times I've had fun singing it while blasting it in the car with friends. And the alternate Don't Cry and My World, which both just seemed pointless to me and one of those is just God awful.

Seems those albums get a bad rap around here and I honestly found them to be incredibly consistent with a recent listen. Some songs are a bit long and yes its a lot to handle at once, but theres hardly a bad song in there. A lot of great hard rocking material on there. I'm not saying Chinese Democracy isn't better than them, but it seems whenever anyone on here makes a list of their best albums, these two get placed towards the bottom, while Chinese Democracy is usually sitting comfortably under Appetite. Although GNR Lies always seems to be low on those lists as well and thats always been one of my favorites.

Can anyone explain? Have people not listened to them in awhile? Did people listen to them too much? IMO I find either one of those albums easier to get through than Chinese Democracy, which has its stretches of songs I don't enjoy even though I think the album is really good overall.

The only tunes I can think of off the top of my head that I truly don't like from UYI are My World and Shotgun Blues. There's some material that took longer than others to grow on me, but these days I like every thing on them except the two I just mentioned.

[AXL_N_DIZZY]

Not sure really. I just think some folks penalize the Illusions for not being as concise and focused as an "aggressive statement" as Appetite. Me personally- I love the diversity of Illusions (UYI II being my all-time favorite Guns album) and strongly believe that some of the very best moments on the Illusions (e.g. "Estranged", "Coma", "November Rain", "You Could Be Mine", etc.) are superior musically to much- if not all- of Appetite. That's just me obviously- but I do think the case can be reasonably made.

Also- I've never really put much stock in the "bloated but decent" crap from the media. To me that's really more a function of comparing Guns ca. 1991-93 to the rise of stripped down alterna-grunge during the same time period so it fits the little "narrative" they want to tell. Sure it is "bloated" in comparison to alterna-grunge- but so what? That in and of itself does not mean it was bad- just different. Ultimately, the music has more than stood the test of time- and in the meantime the idea of many (if not all) of those alterna-grunge bands even trying to come with a Use Your Illusion type album is patently absurd. Meanwhile Guns did both (stripped down aggreesive with Appetite, "big/dramatic" rock art with Illusions) very successfully and continued to push the envelope even further with Chinese... Nothing to apologize for.

Edited December 5, 2011 by AXL_N_DIZZY

[gunsfanoldie]

I guess my real question ends up being why does it get ranked lower than Chinese all the time around here. Or at least most of the times I've been seeing it. As much as I like Chinese, I think the only GNR album I'd put it above is Spaghetti Incident. I guess its all a matter of taste, but my thinking would be (and I have friends that feel pretty much the same) that the first 3 or 4 albums are closer to the GNR sound that we grew up on and as good as Chinese is, its very different. Not to say the difference is a bad thing, but that if that ends up being your favorite GNR album or second favorite, I'm confused as to what kept you a fan all these years.

I know it may sound like it but I'm really not trying to start any fights or anything. I just don't get how people place Chinese over either of the Illusions. It might be more cohesive, but there are certainly no highs as high as those on the Illusions and its not like either album only has one shining moment. Both have at least 3 highs that are truly outstanding musical achievements, while Chinese has 1 (maybe 2 if you really enjoy it) even though I know people that would say it has none but still enjoy it. Again, I guess its just taste.

[drtydane]

...and strongly believe that some of the very best moments on the Illusions (e.g. "Estranged", "Coma", "November Rain", "You Could Be Mine", etc.) are superior musically to much- if not all- of Appetite.

I couldnt agree more, and actually thought most people here were on the same boat. I mean Appetite is great when you wanna get hyped, drive fast etc. But musically and lyrically UYI is obviously superior. They were older, more muture. And also not surrounded by the sleaze they were while writing Appetite, so obviously the over-all outcomes going to be different.

If they had put out another album in the same vein as AFD, it would sound forced i think.

[Chris 55]

because people need something to bitch about

take for instance the current setlist. people that don't even go the any of the shows have a need to bitch about "not playing any new songs"

Yeah! People who want new songs are stupid! How dare they wish that the band would progress into new material!

[Kill Devil Hill]

I think the strong moments on the UYIs are the best moments of GN'R, period. As individual tracks, they're way better than any other album. But in terms of cohesiveness, I have to fault it. Tracklist ordering, etc, is important. AFD and CD are very cohesive albums with a focus. UYIs are all-over-the-place, and sometimes it sounds better on shuffle than how it was actually released. I don't think any album should sound better on shuffle, ever.

[CivilWar07]

I grew up with the UYI albums and my fondest GNR memories are of that era. I loved those albums, yes 1 or 2 weaker song and which I may not favour but all in all they are classics and to me beat and modern day rock shit hands down.

My list of favourites are AFD, CD, UYI 2, UYI1, SI

[drtydane]

Tracklist ordering, etc, is important. AFD and CD are very cohesive albums with a focus.

I agree with this statment as far as AFD is concerned, but other than CD being the opener, and Prostitute being the closer, I feel CD is kind of all over the place. I guess it would be like that with the other given 12 songs no matter what the order, but I always thought it was all over the place. Again, my opinion.

[AXL_N_DIZZY]

I guess my real question ends up being why does it get ranked lower than Chinese all the time around here. Or at least most of the times I've been seeing it. As much as I like Chinese, I think the only GNR album I'd put it above is Spaghetti Incident. I guess its all a matter of taste, but my thinking would be (and I have friends that feel pretty much the same) that the first 3 or 4 albums are closer to the GNR sound that we grew up on and as good as Chinese is, its very different. Not to say the difference is a bad thing, but that if that ends up being your favorite GNR album or second favorite, I'm confused as to what kept you a fan all these years.

It's a good question. My guess is that it's a question of "context". Appetite has the connotation of a young hungry band on the rise about to kick the world on its head. Meanwhile, those folks that love Chinese (and I'm definitely one of them- and in fact "Prostitute" is my all-time favorite Guns track along with "Estranged") proably view that album as the long tortured artist finally unleashing his magnum opus. Illusions meanwhile is probably considered more a period of time where the band was choking on success, less united, aloof to the coming alternative wave and headed towards break-up. Given that- it may be a period of time GN'R fans would prefer to de-emphasize- at least compared to the other two "eras". Who knows? Much of the music from the Illusions era was truly incredible however... and that's what I think will be increasingly more remembered as the years roll by...

FWIW- my rankings are (though I love 'em all and was spinning TSI in my car all week last week):

1. Use Your Illusion II

2. Chinese Democracy

3. Use Your Illusion I

4. Appetite For Destruction

5. GN'R Lies

6. The Spagehtti Incident?

[Use Your Delusion 1]

I've always found they have a very good response here, look at the love for Civil War, Coma and Estranged for example