Is CD a nostalgic record?

[DieselDaisy]

I disagree. I think you are overemphasising his importance in order to justify his take over,

[Ragnar]

I disagree. I think you are overemphasising his importance in order to justify his take over,

I`m not justifying anything others quit on their own none held gun on their heads and forced them to sign over their rights contrary to anyone`s beliefs

[DieselDaisy]

There wasn't a gun to their head, true, but there was a riot threatened if we believe Duff: Axl threatened to not play live.

[Ragnar]

There wasn't a gun to their head, true, but there was a riot threatened if we believe Duff: Axl threatened to not play live.

I don`t believe it and if Slash owned rights to the name he would use it if anyone thinks that he would n`t out of respect to his former bandmates blah blah blah are dellusional to say the least

Edited November 29, 2012 by Son of a Guns

[Dean]

It definitely has the 90's vibe through most of the album, some more than others. The likes of Catcher and IRS are good examples, but it's not a bad thing by any means.

[DieselDaisy]

Slash signed the rights away, as did Duff, in September 1992.

[Ragnar]

Slash signed the rights away, as did Duff, in September 1992.

I know if they had n`t signed away and had somehow managed to kick Axl out they would be using Guns N`Roses name now

[DieselDaisy]

You cannot know that.

[Alt Lyrics]

it just brings back all the memories of when those first leaks happend, and downloading them and hearing new songs from gnr, it was a really weird time with lots of great memories mixed with memories of frustration

Agreed! When I heard Prostitute on CD I was relieved, that that time has come to an end (unfortunately can´t say this about Street of Dreams)

[wasted]

To me I think CD its like a child born from a raping.

Not what Axl wanted to, label didnt let him do.

Label never wanted it to happen.

Written n recorded by people not in the band at the

Releasing time.

All the good it could have been and never was.

Best word itd be frustrated.

A true and respected vision of Axl in 2001 it could

Have been a total blast

Oh My God-Silkworms-Chinese Democracy

Better - Madagascar - TWAT - Prostitute

Catcher - The Blues - Riad- This I Love

Sorry - If The World

That with Bucket n Robin would have make

A remarkable Album.

Shame.

As i understand it they didnt have Better, Iftheworld, Sorry in 2001?

Could be wrong. I THINK they might have some other material weve never heard. Which may have been a fresher record.

You cannot know that.

But look what they did to Scott they def wanted to at least a little bit.

You cannot know that.

But look what they did to Scott they def wanted to at least a little bit.

[Gordon Comstock]

I'm fairly sure, at least musically, Sorry dates back to 1999. Think about it. Brain had to re-record "7 minute songs with drum solos at the end". Actual quote, found here: http://www.musicradar.com/news/guitars/brain-talks-about-making-guns-n-roses-chinese-democracy-177777

Makes sense, doesn't it? Considering the line-up at the time, and that it's probably one of the most "stripped down" songs on the album.

[dalsh327]

Axl stopped writing in a "living in the moment, direct from personal experience" way. Stuff like "Get in the Ring" or "One in a Million" aren't in him anymore. He still has plenty of venom, but it's not as blatant, except with "Sorry", and even with that one, it's not just about Slash.

I do think the people he was pissed off at, he did put a line in the song letting them know it was about them.

There's more moments of reflection than waxing nostalgic for the old days. He even said back in '92 he hated looking back at his life when he was younger.

[wasted]

Everything points backwards though.

CD - it's about a dictatorship, but on a personal level Axl doesn't like the authorities, whether it's Slash or Riad trying to dictate things, or whether it's just the criticism levelled at Axl for him running Guns as a dictatorship. It's about late 90s issues. Past.

Shackler's - That high school shooting that Brownstone was blamed for. Axl acts out the parts of the shooter and his opinion. Past.

Better - Obviously about someone from his past that he doesn't trust now.

SOD - How you left yourself behind. Past. Mourning the loss of someone.

ITW - This one is it seems to be about the now. But it's about how this "now" isn't really real. So his past has destroyed his security in the present.

TWAT - Ultimate past. It's not nostalgic past though.

Catcher - it's about something that happened in 1980? Past. It's not really about it but it's inspired by it.

Scraped - Not so past. But it's really his mistrust of the present again. How he's built up walls to the media or whoever. He wants the future but he's being held back.

Riad - someone from his past who he had a problem with. Not like the stripper he's banging right now.

Sorry - Regret for someone in the past. Chose not choose to hurt those that love you. People have been left behind on most of the songs.

IRS - I think this is as "in the moment" as CD gets. This is where he vents about all his problems in the past.

Madagascar - This is Axl's rise out of the ashes of the past. The chains we held together. Past tense.

TIL - Reflections on the one that got away. Past. Actually lyrically nostalgic too. Very past, sepia tinged past.

Prostitute - Asking for understanding and empathy from someone who didn't understand or care.

I don't think the themes are nostalgic, it's not a record longing for the past. But the music sounds so late 90s it takes you back to those times and Axl is singing about people of GNR past. Like the ghost of halloween.

[gnrfan2007]

Music historians who have reviewed CD say it's brilliance is in how it was able to fuse just about every genre of modern music starting with the Beatles era to now.

In otherwords, if you wanted just one record that could give you a sense of what music has been like in the last century, CD would be that record.

Of course, for those still stuck in the late 1980s and only want 1980s hard-rock ... they will be obviously disappointed.

I'm gonna call shenanigans on that one

I'll call ... but I'll give you a chance to retract or re-affirm your hand ...

Still got shenanigans on this.

Like I said, I'm calling.

And like I said, from an artistic and music historical point of view, CD is brilliant. For a person who is only into one genre of music ... like those still stuck in 1987 POP ROCK ... they will overwelhmed by CD because there is so much there to digest.

Pay attention to words like:

"Axl's pulled it off"

"It's the most remarkable achievement"

"What he's [Axl] given us [Chinese Democracy] is a weird remnant of the the 20th century that somehow works for the first decay of the 21sth century"

"If you believe in the idea of Guns n Roses and Axl Rose ... this [Chinese Democracy] is the MASTERPIECE."

"[Chinese Democracy] is a bizarre masterpiece that comments on the entire history of rock music."

Edited November 30, 2012 by gnrfan2007

[Dan H.]

Music historians who have reviewed CD say it's brilliance is in how it was able to fuse just about every genre of modern music starting with the Beatles era to now.

In otherwords, if you wanted just one record that could give you a sense of what music has been like in the last century, CD would be that record.

Of course, for those still stuck in the late 1980s and only want 1980s hard-rock ... they will be obviously disappointed.

I'm gonna call shenanigans on that one

I'll call ... but I'll give you a chance to retract or re-affirm your hand ...

Still got shenanigans on this.

Like I said, I'm calling.

And like I said, from an artistic and music historical point of view, CD is brilliant. For a person who is only into one genre of music ... like those still stuck in 1987 POP ROCK ... they will overwelhmed by CD because there is so much there to digest.

Pay attention to words like:

"Axl's pulled it off"

"It's the most remarkable achievement"

"What he's [Axl] given us [Chinese Democracy] is a weird remnant of the the 20th century that somehow works for the first decay of the 21sth century"

"If you believe in the idea of Guns n Roses and Axl Rose ... this [Chinese Democracy] is the MASTERPIECE."

"[Chinese Democracy] is a bizarre masterpiece that comments on the entire history of rock music."

What credentials do these people have to be called 'historians' or even well received critics?

It looks like a handful of idiots with no idea what they're talking about babbling on about nothing.

[Dan H.]

"Chinese Democracy is clearly not the greatest rock album ever made, but nor is it an absolute and utter failure." - The Guaradian

"While the album can aptly be termed "good," it isn't the epic that many might expect, especially to those whose interests have long since shifted away from GN'R's aesthetic and the younger generation unable to emotionally connect with the sounds."

"Even if Chinese Democracy had dropped a decade previous, it would still sound dated."

"While the band's label, fans and a handful of rock journalists would like to hail this album as the Second Coming of Rock, the reality is that Chinese Democracy is neither a musical resurrection nor the audio equivalent of Ishtar."

"Even if it came out in 1996, it would still be self-absorbed, turgid, over-produced and soulless."

"The album fifteen years in the making that sounds like a slick but robotic imitation of what it might have been long ago."

"By throwing everything at the wall and nailing up the stuff that didn't stick, he's done himself--and more importantly what he clearly views as his masterpiece--a grand disservice."

I would say there are plenty out there who don't agree with the 'rock historians' of your imagination.

[gnrfan2007]

What credentials do these people have to be called 'historians' or even well received critics?

It looks like a handful of idiots with no idea what they're talking about babbling on about nothing.

Pay attention to what the critics were saying in that BBC review. In terms of *personal taste*, CD wasn't really their cup of tea (as they say in England).

But detaching their *personal taste* from the conversation and evaluating CD at a more objective artistic and music historical point of view, CD was indeed a masterpiece ... bizarre but brilliant.

"If you believe in the idea of Guns n Roses and Axl Rose ... this [Chinese Democracy] is the MASTERPIECE."

[D..]

No, it's just a really mediocre album. It's overproduced, has shitty vocals, no good guitars on most songs and is just generally crap. A few good songs, but mostly awful.

I never really cared for lyrics, but I find it amusing that people always say that the lyrics for this album are so great on this forum, because to me self pitying, self victimizing lyrics aren't great, they're just pathetic.

Each to their own, I suppose.

You are a fucking joke.

Chinese Democracy is hands down one of the best albums if not the best of the 2000's. Of course it's subjective but there are evident moments of genius that no other albums from the 2000's have.

The lyrics are incredible and extremely deep.

The guitar parts piss all over Slash's, even though I love what Slash has done in GN'R (right now he is wasting his talent doing meaningless music but that's another story).

Please open your eyes and stop posting shit on this forum, you are not credible to any serious music appreciator. Or just get a life of your own and go somewhere else if you hate the new band so much.

[Dan H.]

No, it's just a really mediocre album. It's overproduced, has shitty vocals, no good guitars on most songs and is just generally crap. A few good songs, but mostly awful.

I never really cared for lyrics, but I find it amusing that people always say that the lyrics for this album are so great on this forum, because to me self pitying, self victimizing lyrics aren't great, they're just pathetic.

Each to their own, I suppose.

You are a fucking joke.

Chinese Democracy is hands down one of the best albums if not the best of the 2000's. Of course it's subjective but there are evident moments of genius that no other albums from the 2000's have.

The lyrics are incredible and extremely deep.

The guitar parts piss all over Slash's, even though I love what Slash has done in GN'R (right now he is wasting his talent doing meaningless music but that's another story).

Please open your eyes and stop posting shit on this forum, you are not credible to any serious music appreciator. Or just get a life of your own and go somewhere else if you hate the new band so much.

Oh please dude.

The lyrics are extremely deep? GNR has never had deep lyrics.

[jekylhyde]

I don't know... after four years I still can't put my finger on that record. Sometimes I think it's the best record ever made, sometimes it feels like an awful mess of cut-&-paste songs. But it does have that "sad, yesterday's gone" -type of feeling attached to it.

[WhazUp]

What credentials do these people have to be called 'historians' or even well received critics?

It looks like a handful of idiots with no idea what they're talking about babbling on about nothing.

Pay attention to what the critics were saying in that BBC review. In terms of *personal taste*, CD wasn't really their cup of tea (as they say in England).

But detaching their *personal taste* from the conversation and evaluating CD at a more objective artistic and music historical point of view, CD was indeed a masterpiece ... bizarre but brilliant.

"If you believe in the idea of Guns n Roses and Axl Rose ... this [Chinese Democracy] is the MASTERPIECE."

You are giving critics in general a bit too much credit

[gnrfan2007]

What credentials do these people have to be called 'historians' or even well received critics?

It looks like a handful of idiots with no idea what they're talking about babbling on about nothing.

Pay attention to what the critics were saying in that BBC review. In terms of *personal taste*, CD wasn't really their cup of tea (as they say in England).

But detaching their *personal taste* from the conversation and evaluating CD at a more objective artistic and music historical point of view, CD was indeed a masterpiece ... bizarre but brilliant.

"If you believe in the idea of Guns n Roses and Axl Rose ... this [Chinese Democracy] is the MASTERPIECE."

You are giving critics in general a bit too much credit

How come you didn't quote LiveFromNormal's post with his critics bashing Axl and CD?!

Ah ... it's only when there are positive reviews of Guns n Roses that it upsets you. It makes you mad and sad when people agree that Guns n Roses is Axl Rose. That Axl Rose was indeed the genius behind GnR. Slash was and will always be just a *tool* (ie. Axl's biatch).

[Dan H.]

What credentials do these people have to be called 'historians' or even well received critics?

It looks like a handful of idiots with no idea what they're talking about babbling on about nothing.

Pay attention to what the critics were saying in that BBC review. In terms of *personal taste*, CD wasn't really their cup of tea (as they say in England).

But detaching their *personal taste* from the conversation and evaluating CD at a more objective artistic and music historical point of view, CD was indeed a masterpiece ... bizarre but brilliant.

"If you believe in the idea of Guns n Roses and Axl Rose ... this [Chinese Democracy] is the MASTERPIECE."

You are giving critics in general a bit too much credit

How come you didn't quote LiveFromNormal's post with his critics bashing Axl and CD?!

Ah ... it's only when there are positive reviews of Guns n Roses that it upsets you. It makes you mad and sad when people agree that Guns n Roses is Axl Rose. That Axl Rose was indeed the genius behind GnR. Slash was and will always be just a *tool* (ie. Axl's biatch).

Because my providing negative reviews was to be a foil to your claim that music 'historians' praise Chinese Democracy.

It intact was met with mostly average reviews. And that is because it is an average album.

[WhazUp]

What credentials do these people have to be called 'historians' or even well received critics?

It looks like a handful of idiots with no idea what they're talking about babbling on about nothing.

Pay attention to what the critics were saying in that BBC review. In terms of *personal taste*, CD wasn't really their cup of tea (as they say in England).

But detaching their *personal taste* from the conversation and evaluating CD at a more objective artistic and music historical point of view, CD was indeed a masterpiece ... bizarre but brilliant.

"If you believe in the idea of Guns n Roses and Axl Rose ... this [Chinese Democracy] is the MASTERPIECE."

You are giving critics in general a bit too much credit

How come you didn't quote LiveFromNormal's post with his critics bashing Axl and CD?!

Ah ... it's only when there are positive reviews of Guns n Roses that it upsets you. It makes you mad and sad when people agree that Guns n Roses is Axl Rose. That Axl Rose was indeed the genius behind GnR. Slash was and will always be just a *tool* (ie. Axl's biatch).

Lol well considering you were the one who initiated the critic conversation it was you I quoted. LiveFromNormal was posting stuff to rationally discredit your irrational praise of these critics

Nice try on that spin though

[Apollo]

What credentials do these people have to be called 'historians' or even well received critics?

It looks like a handful of idiots with no idea what they're talking about babbling on about nothing.

Pay attention to what the critics were saying in that BBC review. In terms of *personal taste*, CD wasn't really their cup of tea (as they say in England).

But detaching their *personal taste* from the conversation and evaluating CD at a more objective artistic and music historical point of view, CD was indeed a masterpiece ... bizarre but brilliant.

"If you believe in the idea of Guns n Roses and Axl Rose ... this [Chinese Democracy] is the MASTERPIECE."

How many times a day do you masturbate to posters of Axl, while listening to CD?