Signed Drumhead to be Auctioned Off For Flint, MI Benefit

[Billsfan]

2 hours ago, PatrickS77 said:

Yes. Hope so too. If he has any sense, he will step back. As for Ferrer, with Slash and Duff actually being there when the music is rehearsed, maybe they give some pointers here and there to make it more like it should be, as some say.

Ferrer is fine. No pointers needed 

[Tom-Ass]

53 minutes ago, Billsfan said:

Ferrer is fine. No pointers needed 

Many disagree... 

I am sure he is a great drummer, but he really needs to stay true to the songs...

[Billsfan]

Just now, Tom-Ass said:

Many disagree... 

I am sure he is a great drummer, but he really needs to stay true to the songs...

And many disagree with you. I think he does fine and to me it's irrelevant that they don't need him just because he was in GNR for the last ten years and not from 1987-1993

 

[Tom-Ass]

11 minutes ago, Billsfan said:

 I think he does fine and to me it's irrelevant that they don't need him just because he was in GNR for the last ten years and not from 1987-1993

 

It nothing to do with that for me anyway.. I could care less about Sorum. I think Adler would be great and could do it but other than that I just want someone that plays the songs right.. 

I think Brent Fitz has a style that fits Gn'R great.. I'd take Brain over Ferrer.. Ferrer's drums stick out like a sore thumb on songs like Brownstone, You Could Be Mine and Rocket Queen to start.. I just hate the way he plays them..

 

[oachs83]

12 minutes ago, Billsfan said:

And many disagree with you. I think he does fine and to me it's irrelevant that they don't need him just because he was in GNR for the last ten years and not from 1987-1993

 

You could even say after Farm Aid 1990 not 93. It reminds when people like Jimi or Joplin die so young they are put on a higher pedestal than others because they didn't slowly die and come out with way to many records as they live out to be 80. Instead they die in their prime and are talked how great they are because that's all we have is prime music from them. It's like Adler he was cut early during their heightened fame so people get hung up on that. Would I like Adler back, yes but he might not be back and technically Ferrer has been in the band twice as long as Adler. 

[gunsfanoldie]

1 hour ago, oachs83 said:

You could even say after Farm Aid 1990 not 93. It reminds when people like Jimi or Joplin die so young they are put on a higher pedestal than others because they didn't slowly die and come out with way to many records as they live out to be 80. Instead they die in their prime and are talked how great they are because that's all we have is prime music from them. It's like Adler he was cut early during their heightened fame so people get hung up on that. Would I like Adler back, yes but he might not be back and technically Ferrer has been in the band twice as long as Adler. 

Its different with Adler mainly for the "feel" many people talk about.

I'll be flat out honest, I'm not a musician. I do not hear that. I didn't hear Slash's Baby Can't Drive song and know "OH, THERE'S STEVEN ON THE DRUMS!" I can't do that. I don't actually know when he's playing unless he's credited. Civil War drums do not sound different to me despite it being the only thing he played on that record. But again, thats me. MANY feel differently and talk about Adler's "swing" relatively. And I don't put those words into quotes to demean others, I do it to emphasis how important people hold those concerns. Talk to most musicians or hardcore fans about Steven and they will say no one plays like him. I don't hear that but many do.

On point with that, the whole drummer/rhythm guitar thing has always been a nonissue for me. Yes, I want the original band. Yes, if you you can't get that I want the Illusions guys. But the fact, for me of course, has remained that anyone can play these songs. No one can sing them like Axl and no one can play them like Slash, but the rest? It all sounds the same to me. I don't hear anything WRONG with Frank, I just don't like him as much. I like Matt more because he was on Illusions. I like Fitz more because I'm a Slash guy and I like Fitz's contributions to that. But I say that knowing full well they are all just plain professional drummers that, to me, sound very much alike. None of them are a Keith Moon or John Bonham that stands out. The same goes for rhythm guitar. Gilby and Fortus are the EXACT same qualifications to me. I like seeing one over the other but the music will sound NO different.

Its just a different thing for some people. Some people, I'm guessing musicians, REALLY hear the difference between a Sorum and a Ferrer even though in the end they are both replacements. So I do think its different than just that Adler was cut early at the height of their fame. Thats just a very roundabout way of saying it lol.

[Vissud]

Here is that Mates recording with Adler:

 

I do think the difference from Sorum is pretty noticeable.

[Black Sabbath]

They're actually going to be putting the drumhead up on an auction site soon. Will update when I get more info

[oachs83]

7 minutes ago, gunsfanoldie said:

Its different with Adler mainly for the "feel" many people talk about.

I'll be flat out honest, I'm not a musician. I do not hear that. I didn't hear Slash's Baby Can't Drive song and know "OH, THERE'S STEVEN ON THE DRUMS!" I can't do that. I don't actually know when he's playing unless he's credited. Civil War drums do not sound different to me despite it being the only thing he played on that record. But again, thats me. MANY feel differently and talk about Adler's "swing" relatively. And I don't put those words into quotes to demean others, I do it to emphasis how important people hold those concerns. Talk to most musicians or hardcore fans about Steven and they will say no one plays like him. I don't hear that but many do.

On point with that, the whole drummer/rhythm guitar thing has always been a nonissue for me. Yes, I want the original band. Yes, if you you can't get that I want the Illusions guys. But the fact, for me of course, has remained that anyone can play these songs. No one can sing them like Axl and no one can play them like Slash, but the rest? It all sounds the same to me. I don't hear anything WRONG with Frank, I just don't like him as much. I like Matt more because he was on Illusions. I like Fitz more because I'm a Slash guy and I like Fitz's contributions to that. But I say that knowing full well they are all just plain professional drummers that, to me, sound very much alike. None of them are a Keith Moon or John Bonham that stands out. The same goes for rhythm guitar. Gilby and Fortus are the EXACT same qualifications to me. I like seeing one over the other but the music will sound NO different.

Its just a different thing for some people. Some people, I'm guessing musicians, REALLY hear the difference between a Sorum and a Ferrer even though in the end they are both replacements. So I do think its different than just that Adler was cut early at the height of their fame. Thats just a very roundabout way of saying it lol.

You are right about that and yes drummers can and do make a difference but so does any other band member. When we have guest drummer/guitar/bass players come on stage for a couple I totally can tell that someone else is there without even having to look. It's almost like a fingerprint sometimes how one plays their instrument. With all that aside my main point was Steven basically was just on one album, a very very sweet album but it is not like he just quit last year. He has not been apart of this band for 26 years it comes to a point where it is what it is. Complaining that it is not Steven should not even be a factor at this stage. Again though yes I wish it was Steven at drums but reality is some people are just not able to control their demons and it can be life changing.

 

Side note here is an example of the "feel" or "groove" of a drummer. You totally can feel how Adler makes the song. Pay real close to the beginning of Adler's performance how he hits the hi hat and the rhythm he has with it. How he partially opens the hat at times to get that very small difference and the beat but it just jives. Now the second video is also a good drummer he even has much better recording tools and a better kit (it's not a cellphone recording like Adler's) and even though it is a great cover it's lacking the groove that Steven put in it. Again I want Adler as well but the reality is it probably won't happen. I hope this comparison helps you at all. 

 

 

[gunsfanoldie]

In all honesty, I just don't. Sure, the second one sounds a little more mechanic to me, but I really don't hear that much of a difference. I can TELL when Slash is playing. It actually happened when I listened to Adler's Back From The Dead album and one song blew me away, and I look at the credits and who was there playing guitar but Slash. I can usually tell lead guitar players and I can tell singers obviously. Just being brutally honest if I wasn't looking at them or doing a blind test that didn't have variables like age of the performance and sound quality and whatnot it would probably be very hard for me to tell. I hear a bit more of a "groove" with Stevens, but honestly not in the hi hats. I have a friend that would kill me, and has on many times screamed at me, for not being able to hear this difference. I just usually assume its the sound of the drums, the style at that time. Like I've always understood why Sorum didn't sound like Adler, because his drums or whatever effect he used on them during the Illusions albums and tour is totally difference. But I've never believed he couldn't play like Adler if he didn't want to, even though I know others feel very differently. I also genuinely can't tell how different Brent Fitz and Frank Ferrer play Rocket Queen.

The Mates rehearsal that @Vissud posted is a perfect example of how I clearly hear how Adler and Sorum sound different but I chalk it up to Alder not having that effect, its not a stadium, etc. Just that its a different atmosphere so its harder to compare.

Edited March 16, 2016 by gunsfanoldie

[oachs83]

14 minutes ago, gunsfanoldie said:

In all honesty, I just don't. Sure, the second one sounds a little more mechanic to me, but I really don't hear that much of a difference. 

Right there you just said it and you do hear it. The second one is mechanic because he is copying it and Adler created it and when he created it he "felt" it. It's like the tube amp/solid state amp debacle with guitarists. Just you saying that tells me you can hear it. You are right because to a lot of non musicians percussion is about the last thing people listen to. They notice the vocals, the screaming guitar solos all the flashy stuff but percussion is what makes the titties bounce. It's like a house you can build a mansion on black dirt and sure it will look nice but without a concrete foundation it's going to crumble. With the hi hat just listen how Steven gets about 2 more hits on that thing than the other guy but keeps it grooving, it fills more dead air. It's minor but it makes a difference.

 

I just upgraded a couple of real nice subwoofers for our band and after the first show with them got great compliments of how we sounded great that night. More people were dancing and ever since people who have seen us in the past and see us now do comment how we are sounding much better. They don't tell me why because they more than likely can't. They just know they are having a great time and it sounds better to them. All I did was upgrade subs but they re "feeling" the music more and feeling is just as important as listening. So yeah you might not think you can tell the difference with your ears but I am sure you can tell the difference between drummers but you just don't know why, haha.  

Edited March 16, 2016 by oachs83

[gunsfanoldie]

Lol fair enough. I guess it more goes to I have a certain amount of nostalgia always for original guys. I CAN hear when Alice Cooper is playing with his original band that thats how its supposed to be played. How much of that is just fantasy in my head, I don't know, but that is something I enjoy hearing. What appears to be genuine chemistry that you can't fake. I guess it then comes to its more harder for me to notice the differences between the OTHER guys (Sorum, Brain, Ferrer, Fitz) but its not really what this thread is about. Maybe I do and I can't put it into words. I just know I rank them based off what I feel is personal opinion/rightness or nostalgia, etc. Which is why its always Adler, Sorum, Fitz, Ferrer/Brain, mainly cause its original to first replacement to my general bias towards Slash to Axl's new guys, not that I necessarily hear differences between the other guys post Adler and believe they can all do it justice. But again, a conversation for another time probably. Not trying to hog the thread. I do love this quote though:

2 minutes ago, oachs83 said:

They notice the vocals, the screaming guitar solos all the flashy stuff but percussion is what makes the titties bounce.

[Russel Nash]

37 minutes ago, oachs83 said:

You are right about that and yes drummers can and do make a difference but so does any other band member. When we have guest drummer/guitar/bass players come on stage for a couple I totally can tell that someone else is there without even having to look. It's almost like a fingerprint sometimes how one plays their instrument. With all that aside my main point was Steven basically was just on one album, a very very sweet album but it is not like he just quit last year. He has not been apart of this band for 26 years it comes to a point where it is what it is. Complaining that it is not Steven should not even be a factor at this stage. Again though yes I wish it was Steven at drums but reality is some people are just not able to control their demons and it can be life changing.

 

Side note here is an example of the "feel" or "groove" of a drummer. You totally can feel how Adler makes the song. Pay real close to the beginning of Adler's performance how he hits the hi hat and the rhythm he has with it. How he partially opens the hat at times to get that very small difference and the beat but it just jives. Now the second video is also a good drummer he even has much better recording tools and a better kit (it's not a cellphone recording like Adler's) and even though it is a great cover it's lacking the groove that Steven put in it. Again I want Adler as well but the reality is it probably won't happen. I hope this comparison helps you at all. 

 

 

Nothing like Adler for the AFD songs.

 

Second drummer sucked, totally ruining the song.

[smoking guns]

38 minutes ago, oachs83 said:

You are right about that and yes drummers can and do make a difference but so does any other band member. When we have guest drummer/guitar/bass players come on stage for a couple I totally can tell that someone else is there without even having to look. It's almost like a fingerprint sometimes how one plays their instrument. With all that aside my main point was Steven basically was just on one album, a very very sweet album but it is not like he just quit last year. He has not been apart of this band for 26 years it comes to a point where it is what it is. Complaining that it is not Steven should not even be a factor at this stage. Again though yes I wish it was Steven at drums but reality is some people are just not able to control their demons and it can be life changing.

 

Side note here is an example of the "feel" or "groove" of a drummer. You totally can feel how Adler makes the song. Pay real close to the beginning of Adler's performance how he hits the hi hat and the rhythm he has with it. How he partially opens the hat at times to get that very small difference and the beat but it just jives. Now the second video is also a good drummer he even has much better recording tools and a better kit (it's not a cellphone recording like Adler's) and even though it is a great cover it's lacking the groove that Steven put in it. Again I want Adler as well but the reality is it probably won't happen. I hope this comparison helps you at all. 

 

 

Yes, Adler blows that guy away. Adler does all the little things right. Other guy has a shitty sounding snare. 

[smoking guns]

Sorum to me brought more power than Adler but Adler brought the beats that made the bitches shake their ass. You can dance to Appetite, not really to UYI and beyond. 

[Black Sabbath]

They're going to post it on an auction website soon. Reserve price is $7500.

[Nosaj Thing]

6 hours ago, PatrickS77 said:

Yes. Hope so too. If he has any sense, he will step back. As for Ferrer, with Slash and Duff actually being there when the music is rehearsed, maybe they give some pointers here and there to make it more like it should be, as some say.

 

Hopefully.  Ferrer is an awful drummer but maybe Slash and Duff can teach him how to properly play the songs.  Mr. Brownstone specially.

[oachs83]

24 minutes ago, Russel Nash said:

Second drummer sucked, totally ruining the song.

I wouldn't say sucks, he is just keeping a beat. That is why choose that demo to basically show what it is to have groove and feel and just keeping a beat. Saying he sucks however is not how I would put it. 

[6lake sa66ath]

Maybe change the title for the new auction forthcoming? :-D

[Philipm787]

58 minutes ago, Nosaj Thing said:

 

Hopefully.  Ferrer is an awful drummer but maybe Slash and Duff can teach him how to properly play the songs.  Mr. Brownstone specially.

Awful drummer? That's not fair

[systronic]

Although I hope the Izzy situation is a head fake on someone's part, I can live with this lineup if it's truly what we get. It's honestly not what I wanted and for the amount of money tied up in this trip, I was hoping for Izzy to guest either the 8th or 9th. As others have mentioned in the thread, anytime I bring up the concert, I'm always asked "so the real guns n roses is back together?" 

As far as Steven goes, I think that he would have a hard time maintaining his sobriety even for these few shows and personally I don't think it would be worth the risk on his part. For all we know it could have been his choice not to take part for those very reasons although I highly doubt it.  Guess we will all know for sure in about 22 days!

[6lake sa66ath]

I'm good with the lineup, it's always been for me anxiousness about Axl's appearance and by extension his performance

[Tom-Ass]

3 hours ago, smoking guns said:

Sorum to me brought more power than Adler but Adler brought the beats that made the bitches shake their ass. You can dance to Appetite, not really to UYI and beyond. 

The Illusions have some great songs.. I loved every song when they came out but I was a Guns N' Roses freak.. They could have farted into the microphone and I would have liked it.. Listening to them now, a lot of those songs didn't age so well and a big part was the drumming... It worked for some songs and others not so much. Didn't care for him on Contraband either.  

[SEPTEM]

Frank is a great drumer. He really is. ( i strungly disliked him back un 2007 i think, but once axl worked a few things with him to adapt his druming to gnr needs..  Ferrer becomes a great drumer)

Plus i think frank will get more freedom now. 

If u want to really get how good tercer is, well,  i recomend hearing and watching carefuly "sorry" from any good pro s. show .   just focus on ferrer .. 

I insist. For live performances this is the best arrengement (fortus and frank)

Plus if at some shows adler or izzy for a.couple of songs. ( and izzy helping with studio material, wich im sure he is)

This is close to perfection

 

[Silent Jay]

1 hour ago, SEPTEM said:

Frank is a great drumer. He really is. ( i strungly disliked him back un 2007 i think, but once axl worked a few things with him to adapt his druming to gnr needs..  Ferrer becomes a great drumer)

Plus i think frank will get more freedom now. 

If u want to really get how good tercer is, well,  i recomend hearing and watching carefuly "sorry" from any good pro s. show .   just focus on ferrer .. 

I insist. For live performances this is the best arrengement (fortus and frank)

Plus if at some shows adler or izzy for a.couple of songs. ( and izzy helping with studio material, wich im sure he is)

This is close to perfection

 

Fortus and Ferrer have been playing together for 20 years now it can't be better than that. Plus Slash asked Fortus to rejoin his band one time, so we could probably see the best line up to date.