DieselDaisy Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 It is the same with Extinction Rebellion who all have televisions and so forth, and are gap year studenty types. We now live in an ''age of hypocritical hysteria''. It is an age where one can espouse an ethical cause and still have the temerity to practice the complete opposite of what they're espousing in their day-to-day living; and, further, get the airtime (social media, etc) for their cause, and seem to get offended at the slightest suggestion there exists a hypocrisy in the first place. It is an age of unconviction-conviction politics. Of schizophrenic ''Janus like'' protest. This is the age we live in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soon Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 1 minute ago, DieselDaisy said: It is the same with Extinction Rebellion who all have televisions and so forth, and are gap year studenty types. We now live in an ''age of hypocritical hysteria''. It is an age where one can espouse an ethical cause and still have the temerity to practice the complete opposite of what they're espousing in their day-to-day living; and, further, get the airtime (social media, etc) for their cause, and seem to get offended at the slightest suggestion there exists a hypocrisy in the first place. It is an age of unconviction-conviction politics. Of schizophrenic ''Janus like'' protest. This is the age we live in. You dont want people to have TV's and youd like to frame them as being hysterical? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselDaisy Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 1 minute ago, soon said: You dont want people to have TV's and youd like to frame them as being hysterical? You completely misunderstand me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soon Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 1 minute ago, DieselDaisy said: You completely misunderstand me. I dont think I do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselDaisy Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 Just now, soon said: I dont think I do. You forget, I am not of your order. I am not lecturing anyone on climate change. I couldn't give a monkeys about climate change to be honest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoulMonster Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 Science: "Insects are dying." Diesel: "WE SHOULD ALL DEVOTE ALL OUR TIME TO NURSING INSECT BABIES AND KILLING BIRDS OTHERWISE WE ARE ALL HYPOCRITES!!!" Science: "The water is rising." Diesel: "WE SHOULD ALL SPEND OUR TIMES REMOVING ROCKS AND PEBBLES FROM THE SEA FLOOR OTHERWISE WE ARE ALL HYPOCRITES!!" Science: "Changing global weather patterns results in an increase in desert areas." Diesel: "WE SHOULD FORM A LONG LINE TO BRING BUCKETS OF WATER FROM THE ATLANTIC OCEAN TO THE SAHARA, OTHERWISE WE ARE ALL HYPOCRITES!!" Science: "Increased carbon emissions cause global warming." Diesel: "WE SHOULD STOP FLYING, DRIVING, END ALL FOSSIL FUELS AND STOP USING PLASTICS, OTHERWISE WE ARE ALL HYPOCRITES!!" Well, moving away from fossilized fuel is one of the things recommended by actual experts... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soon Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 Just now, DieselDaisy said: You forget, I am not of your order. The 'believe in climate scientists findings?' That order? 2 minutes ago, DieselDaisy said: I am not lecturing anyone on climate change. But they cant have TVs. Okay. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselDaisy Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 Just now, soon said: The 'believe in climate scientists findings?' That order? But they cant have TVs. Okay. Not if they think Armageddon is imminent! For someone who believes we live in a ''climate emergency'', possessing a television or flying is the equivalent of an ethical vegetarian chomping on a quarter pounder. You cannot be that much of a conviction protester one minute (say, when you are gluing yourself to a train), only to dump your convictions in a bin the next (say, when flying between Indonesian islands during a gap year). (I am deliberately choosing extremities to simplify the argument incidentally). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soon Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 Just now, DieselDaisy said: Not if they think Armageddon is imminent! For someone who believes we live in a ''climate emergency'', possessing a television or flying is the equivalent of an ethical vegetarian chomping on a quarter pounder. You cannot be that much of a conviction protester one minute (say, when you are gluing yourself to a train), only to dump your convictions in a bin the next (say, when flying between Indonesian islands during a gap year). (I am deliberately choosing extremities to simplify the argument incidentally). Why cant they own TVs? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoulMonster Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 3 minutes ago, DieselDaisy said: You forget, I am not of your order. I am not lecturing anyone on climate change. Of course not, you wouldn't know head from tail of it. But fortunately real experts are lecturing us on climate change and its mitigating factors, like the IPCC, and their recommendations are quite far from the distorted picture you paint when you do your best to make environmentalists appear as hypocritical. Again, for the umpteenth time, these real experts are NOT urging a complete and immediate stop to travel, neither by car, boat or train. Nor do they urge individuals to immediately do their utmost to reduce their carbon emissions. What they are saying is that unless we cut carbon emissions by so-and-so, we risk facing a certain increase in temperature, and then they urge politicians to enact policies that will prevent this to happening. Politicians then have to enforce regulations that stimulate a shift from fossil fuels to green fuel, both among industry, but also among individuals. At the same time, we, as individuals, should make an effort to follow the guidelines and recommendations given, including travelling less, recycling and all that stuff, buying less products, etc, to the best of our abilities. Just now, soon said: Why cant they own TVs? Because they run on diesel? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soon Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 1 minute ago, SoulMonster said: Because they run on diesel? Wind and solar work fine too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselDaisy Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 (edited) 5 minutes ago, SoulMonster said: Of course not, you wouldn't know head from tail of it. But fortunately real experts are lecturing us on climate change and its mitigating factors, like the IPCC, and their recommendations are quite far from the distorted picture you paint when you do your best to make environmentalists appear as hypocritical. Again, for the umpteenth time, these real experts are NOT urging a complete and immediate stop to travel, neither by car, boat or train. Nor do they urge individuals to immediately do their utmost to reduce their carbon emissions. What they are saying is that unless we cut carbon emissions by so-and-so, we risk facing a certain increase in temperature, and then they urge politicians to enact policies that will prevent this to happening. Politicians then have to enforce regulations that stimulate a shift from fossil fuels to green fuel, both among industry, but also among individuals. At the same time, we, as individuals, should make an effort to follow the guidelines and recommendations given, including travelling less, recycling and all that stuff, buying less products, etc, to the best of our abilities. This thread is named after Greta Thurnberg in case you don't know. I was rather reacting to her and her ilk, the utterly hideous Extinction Rebellion movement, not scientists. - Oh, and Soul Monster of course haha. Edited December 17, 2019 by DieselDaisy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoulMonster Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 1 minute ago, soon said: Wind and solar work fine too. Not TVs in England of course. They run on coal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselDaisy Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 2 minutes ago, soon said: Why cant they own TVs? I would've though you'd be aware that electricity gives off a carbon footprint? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soon Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 1 minute ago, DieselDaisy said: This thread is named after Greta Thurnberg in case you don't know. I was rather reacting to her and her ilk, the utterly hideous Extinction Rebellion movement, not scientists. Her entire talking point is: "Listen to the climate scientists." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselDaisy Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 Just now, soon said: Her entire talking point is: "Listen to the climate scientists." Quoting from memory, ''you have destroyed my future''. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
action Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 24 minutes ago, SoulMonster said: What? I have never said I don't believe in "concrete individual action" This is getting hysterical. i'm just trying to follow your reasons for not changing your own lifestyle (I find those reasons hysterical too, but that's what I got to work with here), and now you make fun of it? you make no sense at all pffff, no wonder diesel always wins from you Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoulMonster Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 1 minute ago, DieselDaisy said: This thread is named after Greta Thurnberg in case you don't know. I was rather reacting to her and her ilk, the utterly hideous Extinction Rebellion movement, not scientists. And I was reacting to your reaction. Greta and "her ilk" aren't, as far as I am aware, saying the things you claim they are saying. They are not advocating an immediate end to travel, nor that everybody should immediately end their use of fossil fuels or plastics, or throw away their phones and TV sets. You have built yourself a nice straw man of what an environmentalist thinks and believes just so you can point to how ridiculous they are and how they are all hypocrites to reject the entire notion of environmentalism. Like when owning a phone or a TV means you cannot be an environmentalist without being a hypocrite. It is ridiculous. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soon Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 Just now, DieselDaisy said: I would've though you'd be aware that electricity gives off a carbon footprint? I would've thought that you'd be aware that we are after system change. No one has called for asceticism. We want system change. Where system changes takes place, electricity does not give off a carbon footprint. Like Georgetown Texas. What I wouldn't think you'd now since you follow 'alternative facts' is that Greta and XR have co-opted screens. All screens bring the message of the climate emergency. We own the screens. They are vital for sharing info and learning in todays world. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoulMonster Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 1 minute ago, action said: i'm just trying to follow your reasons for not changing your own lifestyle (I find those reasons hysterical too, but that's what I got to work with here), and now you make fun of it? Firstly, I have never said anything about changing my lifestyle, secondly I have never given any reason for not changing it You are just rambling on. If you really struggle this much to follow what I am saying, maybe read slower? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselDaisy Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 The urgency of the situation is set forth clearly, and reiterated, ] Panic, PANIC, A holistic approach is required, I agree completely Greta, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soon Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 5 minutes ago, SoulMonster said: Not TVs in England of course. They run on coal. What tv screens do is educate and spread the message. They spread the message to millions that we need clean energy. But his point makes no sense since he singled out XR who dont 'name and shame' on lifestyle and are clear in their manifesto that they believe that only system change will have the needed impact. Also, he doesnt know if any single person who opts-in to identifying as XR even has a TV or not! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoulMonster Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 1 minute ago, DieselDaisy said: The urgency of the situation is set forth clearly, and reiterated, Has anyone said the situation isn't urgent? But urgency doesn't mean that we need to become hysterical and do all kinds of overblown stuff. You do understand that, right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselDaisy Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 Everything Greta says seems to be against a gradualist, ''yes, we make small changes here, and have a few discussions - but we can still fly'', type approach, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoulMonster Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 3 minutes ago, soon said: What tv screens do is educate and spread the message. They spread the message to millions that we need clean energy. But his point makes no sense since he singled out XR who dont 'name and shame' on lifestyle and are clear in their manifesto that they believe that only system change will have the needed impact. Also, he doesnt know if any single person who opts-in to identifying as XR even has a TV or not! Oh, I was just having fun imagining a TV set with a coal engine and some miners shovelling coal into it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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