Why do the UYI albums sound so dated?

[WFA]

So basically this thread is just another failed miser cupcake attempt that failed not because anybody was trying to take the piss out of it but because the tiniest amount of common sense exposed it for what it was.

Week 3 and the spazzout inches closer.

+1 I can't wait for the next Miser meltdown, the last one was hilarious I wonder if he can top it.

[Damn_Smooth]

So basically this thread is just another failed miser cupcake attempt that failed not because anybody was trying to take the piss out of it but because the tiniest amount of common sense exposed it for what it was.

Week 3 and the spazzout inches closer.

+1 I can't wait for the next Miser meltdown, the last one was hilarious I wonder if he can top it.

With his abysmal lack of originality, he'll probably just copy the last one.

[WFA]

So basically this thread is just another failed miser cupcake attempt that failed not because anybody was trying to take the piss out of it but because the tiniest amount of common sense exposed it for what it was.

Week 3 and the spazzout inches closer.

+1 I can't wait for the next Miser meltdown, the last one was hilarious I wonder if he can top it.

With his abysmal lack of originality, he'll probably just copy the last one.

I guess the real question is how many more times he will ask about TSI before the spazzout.

[Damn_Smooth]

So basically this thread is just another failed miser cupcake attempt that failed not because anybody was trying to take the piss out of it but because the tiniest amount of common sense exposed it for what it was.

Week 3 and the spazzout inches closer.

+1 I can't wait for the next Miser meltdown, the last one was hilarious I wonder if he can top it.

With his abysmal lack of originality, he'll probably just copy the last one.

I guess the real question is how many more times he will ask about TSI before the spazzout.

If we can count the amount ot questions about TSI that have been asked we can get a rough estimate. He'll be sure to copy as many as he can. Edited November 30, 2014 by Damn_Smooth

[ludurigan]

To me UYI sound over-produced and too "clean" as some of you mentioned.

Slash often mentions in interviews that he had a tape with some "raw" versions of the songs that he used to listen on his car back in the day;

I'd like to listen to that!

[nico_france]

I disagree. the sound of UYI 1 & 2 is very modern for me. The only problem is that the mix of the guitars is not as clear as in Appetite (basically, one guitar on the left, another one on the right and solos everywhere), maybe because there are too many layers of instruments (synths, etc.)

[WhazUp]

A lot of it has to do (IMO) with the drum sound being so reverb drenched, a lot of albums from that time has that same thing. Ten by Peal Jam is another example of that, I don't think it is bad though. Sure it sounds 90's but the 90's were awesome so I have no issue with it

Edited November 30, 2014 by WhazUp

[RandallFlagg]

It sounds fucking legendary to me, if that means dated to a time capsule when this band was not just firing on all cylinders but blasting cannonballs made of alien technology out at the wilting word then whatever, it's dated but that time was seething with creative energies.

[EvH]

BSSM and Ten don't sound dated?

I'd argue that the Black Album sounds more "corporate" and soulless than anything else on your list.

Typical Bob Rock work. Dr. Feelgood also sounds sterile as shit.

[AxlsMainMan]

The production on The Spaghetti Incident? definitely sounds fresher than that of the UYI albums. Ol' Lead Feet even has some discernible grooves to his drum playing on the former.

[TeeJay410]

Overproduction. Reverb. Spooky voices.

What I wouldn't give for a dry mix of some of the rocker songs on that album.

[Rovim]

Stop overreacting. It's production didn't kill all the energy the music had. What really stings for me is the lack of interplay between Izzy's and Slash's guitars. It was so cool when they did it on Appetite. Such a shame it was not repeated.

That guitar interplay should have been one of the MAIN elements in the classic Guns sound in every Guns album imo.

Edited November 30, 2014 by Rovim

[Estranged Coma]

Stop overreacting. It's production didn't kill all the energy the music had. What really stings for me is the lack of interplay between Izzy's and Slash's guitars. It was so cool when they did it on Appetite. Such a shame it was not repeated.

That guitar interplay should have been one of the MAIN elements in the classic Guns sound in every Guns album imo.

I wonder if izzy was pist off at this? I know it's always said he quit because he got clean and fed up working with junkies and the stage got to big for him or watever but wouldn't that piss you off the most that you couldn't even hear yourself on your own damn record?

[Rovim]

Stop overreacting. It's production didn't kill all the energy the music had. What really stings for me is the lack of interplay between Izzy's and Slash's guitars. It was so cool when they did it on Appetite. Such a shame it was not repeated.

That guitar interplay should have been one of the MAIN elements in the classic Guns sound in every Guns album imo.

I wonder if izzy was pist off at this? I know it's always said he quit because he got clean and fed up working with junkies and the stage got to big for him or watever but wouldn't that piss you off the most that you couldn't even hear yourself on your own damn record?

I don't know, but other bands would have killed to have that kind of a "secret" weapon.

For Alice In Chains for example, it was the way Layne and Jerry sang together, and the harmonies of their voices.

I can't believe how no one in the band or outside of it did anything to protect that. I think Slash didn't want to do it again, and Izzy is not the right person to fight others in that way. But where was Axl? Duff was not in a position of power maybe, but someone should have realized the music will lose so much of it's virility without that guitar interplay and it did.

Edited November 30, 2014 by Rovim

[wasted]

I think because dated is what GNR always did. Bringing a heavy 70s influence to the 80s really was their making. Same with CD but there's also a retro 90s alt rock influence.

Bit specifically UYI is more out of step with current rock wich seems to lean on 80s synth pop. UYI 80s rock and 90s metal combo just sounds so rock n roll to a bunch of synthed up Bruce Springsteen cover bands.

I think because dated is what GNR always did. Bringing a heavy 70s influence to the 80s really was their making. Same with CD but there's also a retro 90s alt rock influence.

Bit specifically UYI is more out of step with current rock wich seems to lean on 80s synth pop. UYI 80s rock and 90s metal combo just sounds so rock n roll to a bunch of synthed up Bruce Springsteen cover bands.

I think because dated is what GNR always did. Bringing a heavy 70s influence to the 80s really was their making. Same with CD but there's also a retro 90s alt rock influence.

Bit specifically UYI is more out of step with current rock wich seems to lean on 80s synth pop. UYI 80s rock and 90s metal combo just sounds so rock n roll to a bunch of synthed up Bruce Springsteen cover bands.

I guess the trick for GNR is to be timeless. Is it 90s or 00s or 70s? You can't place it so then it becomes about the music and the song.

Edited December 1, 2014 by wasted

[Rovim]

I think because dated is what GNR always did. Bringing a heavy 70s influence to the 80s really was their making. Same with CD but there's also a retro 90s alt rock influence.

Bit specifically UYI is more out of step with current rock wich seems to lean on 80s synth pop. UYI 80s rock and 90s metal combo just sounds so rock n roll to a bunch of synthed up Bruce Springsteen cover bands.

I think because dated is what GNR always did. Bringing a heavy 70s influence to the 80s really was their making. Same with CD but there's also a retro 90s alt rock influence.

Bit specifically UYI is more out of step with current rock wich seems to lean on 80s synth pop. UYI 80s rock and 90s metal combo just sounds so rock n roll to a bunch of synthed up Bruce Springsteen cover bands.

I think because dated is what GNR always did. Bringing a heavy 70s influence to the 80s really was their making. Same with CD but there's also a retro 90s alt rock influence.

Bit specifically UYI is more out of step with current rock wich seems to lean on 80s synth pop. UYI 80s rock and 90s metal combo just sounds so rock n roll to a bunch of synthed up Bruce Springsteen cover bands.

I think because dated is what GNR always did. Bringing a heavy 70s influence to the 80s really was their making. Same with CD but there's also a retro 90s alt rock influence.

Bit specifically UYI is more out of step with current rock wich seems to lean on 80s synth pop. UYI 80s rock and 90s metal combo just sounds so rock n roll to a bunch of synthed up Bruce Springsteen cover bands.

Can you be a bit more specific?

[wasted]

The perils of hooters wifi connection.

[Rovim]

I don't know if "dated" is the right word to describe UYI. The roots of their 70's influences still dictate much of the approach and sound, but not enough to take away from how fresh it sounds compared to what came before Guns. It sounds like Guns N' Roses just as much as it sounds 70's influenced if that makes sense.

It's the balance you strike or try to achieve between what is your musical lexicon and whatever new shit you're trying to say in your own way.

Old Guns were never a band that had the intention of bringing something totally new to the table. (or the ability some will say)

They were taking, like many other great bands did with blues, hard rock, metal, and other genres to a new level. The way they've combined it all on UYI was never really done before in that specific way.

Now the production and music sounds dated like any other classic rock band sounds dated, but I agree it has that distinct timeless feel many great songs have.

[wasted]

I don't see dated as a negative. It's a compliment. Slash has that 70s thing that really sets him apart. I think if now today people think it sounds old in comparison to Nickelback or Snow Patrol.,its because its legit classic rock up there with Stones and Zepp. Some stuff transcends like Round and Round by Ratt.

[EvH]

Thanks to the OP for opening this very interesting topic.

I think both Appetite and the Illusions sound dated, in very different ways though.

I think we can all agree that what dates Appetite the most are the drums. Such an amount of reverb immediately dates a recording.

The drum sound on the Illusions is a different beast. I think the massively compressed drums (and yes, there's still reverb applied to the tracks) work perfectly on some songs. Especially, the epics -November Rain and Estranged still sound fresh (apart from the weird ambience noises at the beginning of Nov Rain). Coma really sounds dated, but that has more to do with the stupid noise overdubs than specifically with the drums. Locomotive would've sounded great with or without the reverb. The UYI instrumentals that are out there are rough mixes, and the drums are nearly dry on it so we luckily can compare for ourselves. I think especially Estranged really benefited from a very slick ,very polished sound.

But this kind of production and mixing choices don't work all the time. Songs like Perfect Crime, Double Talkin' Jive and 14 Years (what have they done to you?) are really spoiled by that compressed drum sound. No punch whatsoever.

[DR DOOM]

Every album by every band is going to sound dated though, the shit you think is cutting edge now is going to be laughed at by your kids.

[WFA]

Every album by every band is going to sound dated though, the shit you think is cutting edge now is going to be laughed at by your kids.

Except for nine inch nails, am i right? #revolutionary

[nico_france]

Stop overreacting. It's production didn't kill all the energy the music had. What really stings for me is the lack of interplay between Izzy's and Slash's guitars. It was so cool when they did it on Appetite. Such a shame it was not repeated.

That guitar interplay should have been one of the MAIN elements in the classic Guns sound in every Guns album imo.

I couldn't more agree: the interplay Izzy-Slash is central in Gnr groove

one proof of that is if you look at some slash solo (or snakepit) albums you have good guitars but the work of the rhythm guitar is not interesting as the work of Izzy...

and believe me, the style of Izzy is not so "easy" to play : if you are guitarist, try the double-stops, palm-muting, slides... you got a lot of work to get into (the a nice example : WTTJ). It is not your basic rhythm guitar who double the other guitar (like frequently in metal)

Edited December 1, 2014 by nico_france

[wasted]

It's weird because its Axl that wanted to collaborate more on UYI like on AFD but everyone wanted to go solo. Izzy handed his songs in and left. Slash laid down the tracks and Axl sang. Then the next stage was for them to all go solo more or less. I guess they all had their own drive and vision but in different directions.

[combos]

If you listen to Lies, TSI, Sympathy...All these sound relatively 'fresh', what I mean is, despite their obvious age, they do not come off 'dated', their sound is still very fresh to listen to, very cutting, raw and exciting. Compare the UYIs sound (guitars, bass, drums, especially) to that of other 1991 albums such as Ten, Nevermind, The Black Album, Blood Sugar Sex Majik, and others, and the albums have a very corporate, very...inorganic and sterile feel to them. I don't know if it is the mixing or the arrangement of the songs or what. Appetite is dated in sound too, but in a different way--it's dated by those late '80s things like the bass sound and Adler's drumming, but the sound is otherwise very accessible, very new, very in your face. Compare the following:

Arguably the three most important rockers from the Illusion set, Nevermind and Ten. Even Flow and Smells sound fresh, cutting, like they could fit in today production wise...YCBM, despite it's menace, sounds slick, perfect, well timed, and not very raw. The UYI records seem to suffer from what I'll call "Steel Wheels-itis"...Good songs covered in a slick studio sheen that sounds very corporate and dated. And I don't get why that is in the UYIs case.

What is that dates the UYI records? The vocals, the way they're mixed? The way Slash's guitar work is mixed? The lack of Izzy in the mix? The way Duff's bass is mixed? The drum sound? The arrangement and performance of the songs themselves?

Nirvana is still popular with teenagers. It's still "cool" to be into them. That's because Kurt created a sound all his own. It can't be anything BUT timeless because there's nothing to compare it to. Nothing at that time sounds like Nirvana. After they came out, allot of bands tried to copy their style, but no one ultimately gave a shit.

GNR was 70's rock perfected to a science. It was a dated sound the day UYI came OUT. People were still listening to that music, so it sold. But that's why it sounds like it does now.

Every album by every band is going to sound dated though, the shit you think is cutting edge now is going to be laughed at by your kids.

Every teenager I talk to that's into rock thinks Nirvana is the second coming and freaks out when I tell them I saw them in 1993. So no, you're not entirely correct.