DieselDaisy Posted January 24, 2015 Share Posted January 24, 2015 Yes but take a look at the fight. It is like watching those hilarious Joe Louis mismatches. Here you have this muscular guy at the peak of possible human physicality and he is wacking this little squat fat middle-aged guy around the ring. I do not think Moore should have been in the ring that day. My favourite Ali contestant is Coopman. He was so useless, the training partner assigned to him, who had never been in the ring for seven years, was destroying him in sparring sessions without even trying. Coopman spent the whole time drinking champagne and trying to kiss Ali; he was literally drinking champagne in his corner haha. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselDaisy Posted January 24, 2015 Share Posted January 24, 2015 Boxers just act like pricks when they do that. I did not really like it when Tyson did it but that is, bargain basement Tyson. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Len Cnut Posted January 24, 2015 Author Share Posted January 24, 2015 I love it personally, depending who its coming out of. And its not as new a phenomena as people think, fighters were always doing this kind of shit, it just didnt make the papers as much. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselDaisy Posted January 24, 2015 Share Posted January 24, 2015 Wouldn't it be refreshing if a boxer said, ''hello ole' boy. Let's fight like gentlemen, there's a good chap''? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Len Cnut Posted January 24, 2015 Author Share Posted January 24, 2015 (edited) There's been many gentleman boxers out there, look at Froch and Mikkel Kessler, enormous respect for each, even Mike Tyson if he liked the bloke, he got on real well with Bruno from the get-go.When was the last time you heard Manny Pacqiuao mouth off? Edited January 24, 2015 by Len B'stard Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Len Cnut Posted January 24, 2015 Author Share Posted January 24, 2015 Yes but take a look at the fight. It is like watching those hilarious Joe Louis mismatches. Here you have this muscular guy at the peak of possible human physicality and he is wacking this little squat fat middle-aged guy around the ring. I do not think Moore should have been in the ring that day. My favourite Ali contestant is Coopman. He was so useless, the training partner assigned to him, who had never been in the ring for seven years, was destroying him in sparring sessions without even trying. Coopman spent the whole time drinking champagne and trying to kiss Ali; he was literally drinking champagne in his corner haha.This is more indicative of the fact that Ali took on so many people that they just ran out and came up with these mismatches, sort of like Joe Louises bum of the month club. I agree with the Moore fight being a mismatch but at the same time you gotta remember this is Archie Moore we're talking about, some of the defining fights of his career were only a couple of years earlier, those classic fights with Yvon Durelle, look em up if you haven't seen em before, he had a lot of fuckin' mileage in him but a young Ali was just too much for him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselDaisy Posted January 24, 2015 Share Posted January 24, 2015 Moore did it for money. Neither guy wanted the fight but he had debts and some fight Clay was supposed to have fought in Canada had fallen through. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Len Cnut Posted January 24, 2015 Author Share Posted January 24, 2015 (edited) An Ali was always gonna panel him. Heavyweight weren't even his natural weight. Apparently he had a punch for the Louisville Lip called 'the lip buttoner' Edited January 24, 2015 by Len B'stard Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselDaisy Posted January 24, 2015 Share Posted January 24, 2015 At 30 seconds in that clip, Liston, looking dapper in a suit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Len Cnut Posted January 24, 2015 Author Share Posted January 24, 2015 At 30 seconds in that clip, Liston, looking dapper in a suit.He commented around that time that 'it's a shame for a young man like that to be beatin' up on an old man like Archie'. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T.wa.T Posted January 24, 2015 Share Posted January 24, 2015 (edited) I can't wait for the PBC to air. I hope they bring back some legends each fight night for pre and post fight analysis. Hell, even current fighters... Yeah, didn't see who the announcers will be for the Spike TV cards, but the Al Michaels/Sugar Ray Leonard sounds really good for NBC.Nothing new, except Arum reiterating that it's up to Mayweather:https://twitter.com/danrafaelespn/status/558753302653849600https://twitter.com/danrafaelespn/status/558753509491744769https://twitter.com/danrafaelespn/status/558754297471459328Al Michels & Sugar Ray is a great start. The UFC is the model I would follow, they have a great presentation for their pre/post fights. We'll see....I just read Canelo is fighting Kirkland. Two bangers going at it, I see Canelo winning but I think Kirkland will make it a good competitive fight..Cotto vs Mayweather????Makes financial sense for Cotto & It gives Freddie Roach a good look at Floyd for his 50th fight against Manny.I also read Amir Khan is a potential fight for Pacqiua... Edited January 24, 2015 by T.wa.T Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselDaisy Posted January 24, 2015 Share Posted January 24, 2015 At 30 seconds in that clip, Liston, looking dapper in a suit.He commented around that time that 'it's a shame for a young man like that to be beatin' up on an old man like Archie'.Ali does not go soft on him.I never knew Terrell died, just December. Good fighter Terrell. He beat, revenged in fact, Cleveland Williams before his accident and cleaned out most of the second tier fighters of that division, Chuvalo, Machen, Folley, Bob Foster. Ali was a sack of shit to him of course. He was the brother of one of the Supremes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Len Cnut Posted January 24, 2015 Author Share Posted January 24, 2015 At 30 seconds in that clip, Liston, looking dapper in a suit.He commented around that time that 'it's a shame for a young man like that to be beatin' up on an old man like Archie'.Ali does not go soft on him.I never knew Terrell died, just December. Good fighter Terrell. He beat, revenged in fact, Cleveland Williams before his accident and cleaned out most of the second tier fighters of that division, Chuvalo, Machen, Folley, Bob Foster. Ali was a sack of shit to him of course. He was the brother of one of the Supremes. Cleavland Williams never beat Liston too. And you must've been reasonably aware of his death Dies', you posted in a thread on here called 'Ernie Terrell dies' I can't wait for the PBC to air. I hope they bring back some legends each fight night for pre and post fight analysis. Hell, even current fighters... Yeah, didn't see who the announcers will be for the Spike TV cards, but the Al Michaels/Sugar Ray Leonard sounds really good for NBC.Nothing new, except Arum reiterating that it's up to Mayweather:https://twitter.com/danrafaelespn/status/558753302653849600https://twitter.com/danrafaelespn/status/558753509491744769https://twitter.com/danrafaelespn/status/558754297471459328I also read Amir Khan is a potential fight for Pacqiua...Well, that'll be either an interesting 5 round decapitation or Manny getting 'outboxed' (read grabbed, held, pushed off' all night except Khan don't get shit off all night so Pacman wins a points desicion, if Khans lucky that night. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselDaisy Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 Cannot remember about Terrell! I know Frazier and Dundee died at a similar time.Patrick Collins in today's Mail on Sunday - he is a grumpy old bastard like me - was on about sledging bringing the game of cricket into disrepute and he said this,As for professional boxing, it long ago abandoned any ambition to be treated as serious sport. The fighters themselves remain wonderful athletes and admirable people, but the sad old game is now a branch of show business with its ring-walks and its trash talk, its scripted threats and its phony feuds.The sport which once gave us Ali and Frazier now offers Stiverne and Deontay Wilder, not to mention Tyson Fury and Chisora. The well is dry, the end is a matter of time.He seems to predict the end of boxing, like you Len, predict the end of rock music? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snake-Pit Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Len Cnut Posted January 25, 2015 Author Share Posted January 25, 2015 Cannot remember about Terrell! I know Frazier and Dundee died at a similar time.Patrick Collins in today's Mail on Sunday - he is a grumpy old bastard like me - was on about sledging bringing the game of cricket into disrepute and he said this,As for professional boxing, it long ago abandoned any ambition to be treated as serious sport. The fighters themselves remain wonderful athletes and admirable people, but the sad old game is now a branch of show business with its ring-walks and its trash talk, its scripted threats and its phony feuds.The sport which once gave us Ali and Frazier now offers Stiverne and Deontay Wilder, not to mention Tyson Fury and Chisora. The well is dry, the end is a matter of time. He seems to predict the end of boxing, like you Len, predict the end of rock music?I dont predict the end of rock music, im telling you its done as a genre. As far as boxing, i dont remand legends, i just demand passion, i dont expect Ali's every generation, in fact i dont expect Ali's once a millenium. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselDaisy Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 Ali? Fuck me - Coopman or Dunn would suffice. Coopman could probably clean out the current HW division haha Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Len Cnut Posted January 25, 2015 Author Share Posted January 25, 2015 (edited) But like i say to you all the time Dies', there's fights out there, there's fighters out there...but it appears you just have your mind made up. You have good fighters around nowadays, Canelo Alvarez, Floyd Mayweather, Manny Pacqiauo, Keith Thurman, Danny Garcia, Nonito Donaire, that Jamaican kid Walters, all these people make for REALLY interesting fights. Even in the 90s people were saying everything is shit and acting as if Naz and Eubank were the only two boxers in the world but America was booming back then, you had Roy Jones, Bernard Hopkins, James Toney, Pernell Whittaker, Oscar De La Hoya, just an embarassment of riches. Then in the lighter weights Erik Morales, Marco Antonio Barrera, Juan Manuel Marquez, Azumah Nelson, i could reel em off...the fact is this country isn't really interested in the sport.It's been in the doldrums yes but there's signs of life, it's getting better, Deontay Wilder and Bermane Stiverne was just not a bad match, not by any stretch, it was good, it was entertaining, it weren't the best thing in the fuckin' world but it was good. But OK, example right, take Wilder, 32 fights, 31 knockouts...well what more do you want? He's basically wankered everybody thats stepped in the right with him. Alright so he doesn't have decent competition but it's a good fighter right, thats what we've been asking for and there's one there, is he Ali? Fuck no but how can you seriously sit there and say thats not good, 32 fights, 31 knockouts, thats fuckin' mustard as far as I'm concerned, i wanted a good entertaining fighter and i got one, i didn't think that in getting one that suddenly the poor heavyweight division would suddenly be full of top tier heavyweights. And also, thats how it begins, an interesting fighter comes and immediately you have interesting match ups...and so continues the upward swing, or thats the idea anyway To me it's like this, you can either have an interest in the sport and enjoy every era for what it is and what it's worth or you can sit in the sun all day dreaming about Muhammad Ali. Now don't get me wrong, i love Ali to bits...but i also love boxing, and i guess thats the difference, i don't...need to be convinced to sit down and watch boxing, i will always always always watch boxing and when you've been doing that for a while you get to realise that it goes up and down and sometimes it up for a while and sometimes its down for a while and sometimes thats quite a while but I've ALWAYS had something to watch, I've never found boxing to be devoid of action.I mean, you need to get your head round this idea, in a sport where, over the century plus its been around there's been millions of millions of men to lace up their gloves, there must've been right? Millions upon millions...now how many are there in that Ali tier that you know of? What, 20, 30? Out of millions. You need to keep your mind tuned into reality when assessing this stuff, those types of exceptional athletes are real rare. I mean Christ, at this point in time England has a young undefeated Olympic gold medalist heavyweight prospect whoose knocking people right the fuck out and he's got his eye on a world title shot in the near future and you're still saying there's nothing to watch out there, we're as good as in the heyday of Audley Harrison? (no thems was shit times ). I think you just want a superhero or something, quite honestly Shit, there was a decent fight on last night in Brandon Rios vs Mike Alvarado, did you catch it? Edited January 25, 2015 by Len B'stard 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iron MikeyJ Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 But like i say to you all the time Dies', there's fights out there, there's fighters out there...but it appears you just have your mind made up. You have good fighters around nowadays, Canelo Alvarez, Floyd Mayweather, Manny Pacqiauo, Keith Thurman, Danny Garcia, Nonito Donaire, that Jamaican kid Walters, all these people make for REALLY interesting fights. Even in the 90s people were saying everything is shit and acting as if Naz and Eubank were the only two boxers in the world but America was booming back then, you had Roy Jones, Bernard Hopkins, James Toney, Pernell Whittaker, Oscar De La Hoya, just an embarassment of riches. Then in the lighter weights Erik Morales, Marco Antonio Barrera, Juan Manuel Marquez, Azumah Nelson, i could reel em off...the fact is this country isn't really interested in the sport.It's been in the doldrums yes but there's signs of life, it's getting better, Deontay Wilder and Bermane Stiverne was just not a bad match, not by any stretch, it was good, it was entertaining, it weren't the best thing in the fuckin' world but it was good. But OK, example right, take Wilder, 32 fights, 31 knockouts...well what more do you want? He's basically wankered everybody thats stepped in the right with him. Alright so he doesn't have decent competition but it's a good fighter right, thats what we've been asking for and there's one there, is he Ali? Fuck no but how can you seriously sit there and say thats not good, 32 fights, 31 knockouts, thats fuckin' mustard as far as I'm concerned, i wanted a good entertaining fighter and i got one, i didn't think that in getting one that suddenly the poor heavyweight division would suddenly be full of top tier heavyweights. And also, thats how it begins, an interesting fighter comes and immediately you have interesting match ups...and so continues the upward swing, or thats the idea anyway To me it's like this, you can either have an interest in the sport and enjoy every era for what it is and what it's worth or you can sit in the sun all day dreaming about Muhammad Ali. Now don't get me wrong, i love Ali to bits...but i also love boxing, and i guess thats the difference, i don't...need to be convinced to sit down and watch boxing, i will always always always watch boxing and when you've been doing that for a while you get to realise that it goes up and down and sometimes it up for a while and sometimes its down for a while and sometimes thats quite a while but I've ALWAYS had something to watch, I've never found boxing to be devoid of action.I mean, you need to get your head round this idea, in a sport where, over the century plus its been around there's been millions of millions of men to lace up their gloves, there must've been right? Millions upon millions...now how many are there in that Ali tier that you know of? What, 20, 30? Out of millions. You need to keep your mind tuned into reality when assessing this stuff, those types of exceptional athletes are real rare. I mean Christ, at this point in time England has a young undefeated Olympic gold medalist heavyweight prospect whoose knocking people right the fuck out and he's got his eye on a world title shot in the near future and you're still saying there's nothing to watch out there, we're as good as in the heyday of Audley Harrison? (no thems was shit times ). I think you just want a superhero or something, quite honestly Shit, there was a decent fight on last night in Brandon Rios vs Mike Alvarado, did you catch it?Good pst Len, and I agree with you. Sure MY hayday will always be the late 80's and 90's. I lived through that era, I watched those guys fight, they made me love the sport, even more so than guys like Ali tbh. Yes it's been hard on me as boxing fan watching the Klitchko's basicallhy stalemate the heavyweight division (which is my favorite). But I always kept up hope that someday they will either retire, get beat, or some new American heavyweight would come along. Well as of right now, Wilder MIGHT be that guy. Sure it's too early to crown him the next anything. But I'd be lying if I didn't say he did in fact impress me in that last fight. He showed WAY more head movement and elusiveness than I ever thought he would have. He is not a KO man on the same level as Tyson or Foreman, I'll call that one now. But honestly he reminded me of a bigger, stronger Roy Jones Jr. Plus when I think about that fight with Stevirne, that for me, was the best heavyweight fight since Vitali fought Lennox. Why? Because I had no idea who was going to win that fight before it started. Let's be honest here, everyone of Wladimir's fights you know he is going to win because of who he is fighting (which I'm not blaming him for that, just calling it like I see it). Well for the Wilder vs Stevirne fight, it was literally a coin flip, which that's what made it exciting. Sure Stevirne could have done more, but he was eating jabs and straights all night, hard straights at that. Is Wilder ready for Wladimir right now? No. But I will say this, if he beats Tyson Fury, and a few other top tier guys, and gets some more experience, I do think he will beat Wlad. Why? Lets face it, the Klitchko's are on the way out for one, and for two Wilder is faster, more elusive, and has more natural poltential. He just needs some seasoning then he could be a the next great heavyweight, which would give the sport the jolt it needs. Plus lets be honest, more money, and control is available in boxing vs mma. Which I wish boxing was as organized as the UFC, but being that its not does favor fighters over the "league." Hence why guys like Mayweather can hand pick their fights and control everything in their careers. UFC fighters don't have near as much control. So my point is, if wilder does help reignite the heavyweight division, some guys might choose boxing over MMA, because of the control and bigger paydays. Which would help give the entire sport a boost. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T.wa.T Posted January 26, 2015 Share Posted January 26, 2015 (edited) Cannot remember about Terrell! I know Frazier and Dundee died at a similar time.Patrick Collins in today's Mail on Sunday - he is a grumpy old bastard like me - was on about sledging bringing the game of cricket into disrepute and he said this,As for professional boxing, it long ago abandoned any ambition to be treated as serious sport. The fighters themselves remain wonderful athletes and admirable people, but the sad old game is now a branch of show business with its ring-walks and its trash talk, its scripted threats and its phony feuds.The sport which once gave us Ali and Frazier now offers Stiverne and Deontay Wilder, not to mention Tyson Fury and Chisora. The well is dry, the end is a matter of time. He seems to predict the end of boxing, like you Len, predict the end of rock music?I dont predict the end of rock music, im telling you its done as a genre. As far as boxing, i dont remand legends, i just demand passion, i dont expect Ali's every generation, in fact i dont expect Ali's once a millenium.Floyd should have been this generations Sugar Ray but decided to be a heel. That dude should be in every other commercial broadcast around the globe marketing himself as the good guy/voice of a generation.To your other point about boxing in the States during the 90's, there was a good handful of heavyweights to (not that you didn't know), Bowe, Lewis, Holyfield, Tyson, Foreman being the main draws than we had the second tier guys like Tua, Morrison, Moore, Byrd, Ibeabuchi, Rahman etc... Alot of big punchers, with Lewis, Bowe and Holyfield being more boxer before puncher. There was alot of David vs Goliath with David not winning often enough. Exception, Rahman vs Lewis..Plus we never got to see a Tyson vs Tua or Bowe vs Lewis. So many awesome fights that should have been. Put any 2 of those guys in the ring together and you get a whopper of a fight. Some we saw, Byrd vs Ibeabuch an that was a blast. All the hype surrounding Byrd, only to be snuffed by Ike, courtesy by way of KO. An that's just a few names off the top of my head there's, probably 10 more we could put up there to make a fight.I still believe that the Heavyweight division suffered because of a lack of creating a Super Heavyweight division. Guys like Moore, Rahman, Tua and even Tyson only had a punchers chance against those other beasts. Holyfield being the exception. The 90's were a spectacular time for all the divisions. Shit, the Heavyweight division in the 90's, rivals any in the history of the sport, it might even the best....Honestly, Klitchko's reign is only a natural progression for the sport, there have been a few long reigns in its history, and each time following the sport evolved. The sport is just taking its time to catch up. Edited January 26, 2015 by T.wa.T Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselDaisy Posted January 26, 2015 Share Posted January 26, 2015 Shit, there was a decent fight on last night in Brandon Rios vs Mike Alvarado, did you catch it?How? How the fuck does one watch boxing these days? There is not a picking of it on tv or the radio (or even in the newspapers). It has been completely eradicated from public life. As you yourself said, I am too attached to the concept of sticking on ITV and watching Eubank and Benn. I did buy one or two of the Tyson PPVs. The last boxing match I bought was Tyson v Lewis. That was Sky - I do not know what all of this showtime/rank bollocks is. I did listen to the Froch fight on Talksport if that helps. I honestly do not even know how one goes about watching boxing these days. If it is merely, pay your PPV price every boxing match, then fuck that. I cannot even afford that. Even if I had the desire to do it. Listen Len, do this for me. Try and find a sport that is less accessible and prevalent (on screens, in our daily life). One - that is all I ask?Football- PL, you can go the free route with a MOTD highlights show or the Sky route with full coverage. CL games are free on ITV. The World Cup is all free. Basically, every top flight game is, at a minimum, covered with comprehensive highlights. Football is ubiquitous.Rugby6 Nations and world cup: all free, all on terrestrial. CricketThey went the Sky route unfortunately but I am yet to see a Cricket PPV. Also Five have an one hour highlight show of the summer tests and the IPL has full coverage on ITV4. Cricket has problems in this regard but it is still, more accessible than boxing. As a last resort, there is always Test Match Special (which I adore anyway - sometimes I used to mute sky and put Boycott on).Olympics/Commonwealth GamesFull free coverageSnookerAll free, on BBCTennisFrench open/Wimbledon: all free, on terrestrial. The French Open is on ITV4 I believe, free. The Oz open is on Eurosport but I am sure fivelive are covering it also. Those Nadal v Federer classics were not PPV. You merely stuck the beeb on. That is why Nadal and Fed are seen as sporting legends. That is why we know them. That is the difference. Froch or somebody could walk down a street and nobody would recognise him. Roger Federer would be mobbed by autograph hunters. He is like a Beatle. That is the difference, in how Tennis markets itself and boxing.Darts- FreeTen Pin BowlingRight I'll stop.You are saying, 'there are good fights'? Where?I do not see it in the papers also. The newspapers do not give a shit about boxing. They covered the Froch match and that was it. After that Wilder fight, I looked in the papers and there was barely a footnote. That was the WBC, right? That was an important match? Now there is just Vlad and we might see an undisputed champion? Nothing in the papers. Zilch.All the other sports have extensive coverage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Len Cnut Posted January 26, 2015 Author Share Posted January 26, 2015 (edited) Ive never had cable or sky TV, ive never had a PPV thing, i live ina country where you've got to be up at 4am to catch the fights ever yet I've never missed a fight since being like, 10 or 11 years old, i guess it boils down to how much you want it, id get people to tape em, go round peoples houses, just anything i could, its a doddle since the advent of the internet, you can pay and get em off of boxnation for something like a tenner a month or just ponce em for free off of streams, you cant seriously pull that excuse in 2015 man.Where are the good fights, well look, tell you what, hang with me and ill show you em, just cuz the British newspapers aint interested in boxing that aint their own dont mean it dont exist. Edited January 26, 2015 by Len B'stard Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselDaisy Posted January 26, 2015 Share Posted January 26, 2015 I do not even see the pubs carrying them. I remember one of the big fights, it might have been one of Lewis's, a pub bought the PPV and made a killing. With 24 hour drinking there is not even any legal obstacles now! Boxing is virtually non-existent in the British conscious. Yes, all those casuals watching Froch but how many of them had seen a boxing match before? How many of them will again? (it was the same for the Fight of the Century in fairness). It was boxing's 'prawn sandwich brigade' (to paraphrase a certain irate Man United hatchet man).Vlad, the heavyweight champion of the world, could walk down any British (and I would imagine American) high street and nobody would recognise him. At no time before would that happen. You knew who your champ was whether it was Lewis, Hollyfield, Tyson, Ali, Foreman, Frazier - pick any era before and find a boxer that unrecognizable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Len Cnut Posted January 26, 2015 Author Share Posted January 26, 2015 I do not even see the pubs carrying them. I remember one of the big fights, it might have been one of Lewis's, a pub bought the PPV and made a killing. With 24 hour drinking there is not even any legal obstacles now! Boxing is virtually non-existent in the British conscious. Yes, all those casuals watching Froch but how many of them had seen a boxing match before? How many of them will again? (it was the same for the Fight of the Century in fairness). It was boxing's 'prawn sandwich brigade' (to paraphrase a certain irate Man United hatchet man).Vlad, the heavyweight champion of the world, could walk down any British (and I would imagine American) high street and nobody would recognise him. At no time before would that happen. You knew who your champ was whether it was Lewis, Hollyfield, Tyson, Ali, Foreman, Frazier - pick any era before and find a boxer that unrecognizable. Stick him on a street in Germany or Khazakstan or Ukraine and see what happens. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselDaisy Posted January 26, 2015 Share Posted January 26, 2015 (edited) Yes but, a HW Champion is the greatest solo achievement in sport, in anything. If you are HW Champ you are King of the World. It is better than being the Queen of England or the President of the United States, or a religious figurehead like the Dali Lama, or a famous movie actor like Brando, or a rock star like Lennon or Elvis. You are 'heavyweight champion of the world' - 'of the world', not, ''Germany''. Just think of that accolade. Think of the people who have held it - especially when it is undisputed.Now the only places the Klitschko brothers are recognised is, places where they still wear mullets.PSI do not even think Mayweather would be that well recognised in Britain and he is the most famous boxer today. Certainly he would not be as well recognised as Federer, Messi, Ronnie O' Sullivan, Tiger Woods, et al. Edited January 26, 2015 by DieselDaisy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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